Doomsday Church: Still Open For Business

[Loghead]

I'm finished feeding the troll.

*Ahem*

I would think that the title of "troll" would go to whoever initiated the debate with the following controversial remark:

It's a good thing that you mock only the Christian God. We don't react violently to such mockery. If you did such things to Muslims they'd order a death sentence for you.

 

[jillio]

Personally, my sensibilities are offended by the exploitation engaged in by this so called religious group.

 

[Reba]

*Ahem*

I would think that the title of "troll" would go to whoever initiated the debate with the following controversial remark:

But the controversial cartoon wasn't trolling?

Let me get this straight. Mocking Christians is OK but criticizing the mocker is not.

 

[StSapphire]

It's a good thing that you mock only the Christian God. We don't react violently to such mockery. If you did such things to Muslims they'd order a death sentence for you.

I mock all sorts of religions. I didn't mock other ones in this thread because this is specifically about a group proclaiming Christian beliefs. If they were Muslims preaching the same thing, I'd be mocking the Muslims with silly cartoons, too.

Is there a post in this thread mocking Mohammad? If there is, then you're right, somehow I missed it.

Now there is!

And yeah, sorry, got my dates mixed up. Yesterday was the second annual "Draw Mohammed Day". I didn't draw this cause my drawing ability is crap, but close enough.

But the controversial cartoon wasn't trolling?

Let me get this straight. Mocking Christians is OK but criticizing the mocker is not.

I honestly didn't think any of that was all that controversial. Just poking some lighthearted fun at the people with the silly beliefs.

And mocking is okay on all sides. I have no problem with mocking anyone or with being mocked myself. There's plenty of humor to go around!

 

[jillio]

I mock all sorts of religions. I didn't mock other ones in this thread because this is specifically about a group proclaiming Christian beliefs. If they were Muslims preaching the same thing, I'd be mocking the Muslims with silly cartoons, too.

Now there is!

And yeah, sorry, got my dates mixed up. Yesterday was the second annual "Draw Mohammed Day". I didn't draw this cause my drawing ability is crap, but close enough.




I honestly didn't think any of that was all that controversial. Just poking some lighthearted fun at the people with the silly beliefs.

And mocking is okay on all sides. I have no problem with mocking anyone or with being mocked myself. There's plenty of humor to go around!

OMG! You are on a death list now!

 

[StSapphire]

OMG! You are on a death list now!

Quick, I need to find mocking cartoons for 3 others. That way I can get on the Universalist Unitarian, Atheist and Buddhist hit lists, too!

 

[jillio]

Quick, I need to find mocking cartoons for 3 others. That way I can get on the Universalist Unitarian, Atheist and Buddhist hit lists, too!

You are a risk taker!

 

[deafskeptic]

Quick, I need to find mocking cartoons for 3 others. That way I can get on the Universalist Unitarian, Atheist and Buddhist hit lists, too!

I guess you go on my hit list.

 

[StSapphire]

I guess you go on my hit list.

I think I have to put out a fatwa on myself, since I'm on my own list, too.

 

[flip]

I find it interesting that people are upset by Reba putting down Muslims, while the mocking done by StSapphire against christians goes unoticed.

Following this logic, that any mocking is okay, as long it's not christians who mock muslims, let's mock some deaf people with CI.

C'mon let's have FUN, magnets for everyone!

 

[StSapphire]

StSapphire, I am proud of you. That was one of the highest context ways to communicate I have seen on this board yet.

People who use that as their only source of communication were once called retarded, but are not called autistic.

Personally I think "retarded" means, "He doesn't think like I think he oughta think.

Hah, and here I thought I was just being funny. But thanks, since I'm pretty sure that was a compliment.

I find it interesting that people are upset by Reba putting down Muslims, while the mocking done by StSapphire against christians goes unnoticed.

A couple things.

1) Where are people getting upset about Reba "putting down" Muslims?
2) While I accept that I've been mocking, because that's a positive action to me, I'm honestly unsure of what it is that I've supposedly mocked. I made a joke involving a well-known internet meme (Raptor Jesus, see XKCD for the internet obsession with Raptors) and a play on words because "Raptor" and "Rapture" sound vaguely similar.

Following this logic, that any mocking is okay, as long it's not christians who mock muslims, let's mock some deaf people with CI.

C'mon let's have FUN, magnets for everyone!

You do understand there's a difference between "mocking" and "putting down" (to use your terms) or "insulting", right?

But even if not, keep in mind that the intent behind a message is something you should try to look for. In this case, I assumed it was plainly obvious that I was just making a joke, and not trying to make any sort of a serious effort at insulting or otherwise seriously make fun of them.

I'm not sure what the whole backlash against "you make fun of Christians but not Muslims!" is for, anyways. Fatwa envy, perhaps?

As a followup, to anyone interested in knowing why the rapture didn't happen - now we know:

 

[Daredevel7]

I find it interesting that people are upset by Reba putting down Muslims, while the mocking done by StSapphire against christians goes unoticed.

Following this logic, that any mocking is okay, as long it's not christians who mock muslims, let's mock some deaf people with CI.

C'mon let's have FUN, magnets for everyone!

I have a theory about this. Christians are a majority and, in today's society, they are rarely (if ANY) bullied in a serious way. They may be made fun of, but it's always in a light hearted way. However, Muslims face real and life threatening bullying all the time.

It's simple. Do Christian REALLY fear their lives if they talked about their religion? Sure a quip here and there making fun of them, but no one really cares. Can you say the same about Muslims?

So I think people feel the need to defend Muslims more than Christians.

I'm sure when Christians were persecuted back in the day, people defended them too.

I also would like to mention that even though I do laugh at the jokes/quips about religion and enjoy them, I also do think it is unfair that people attack Christians whenever they say something about God/Bible/Jesus.

People always say "It's YOUR religion, it's YOUR belief." but what people don't realize what it is like to be in their shoes. I mean, some of them TRULY believe 100% what the Bible says, and... it can be a scary situation for them. They care about people and worry about what's going to happen to them. They worry what's going to happen to society and America, and their own impressionable kids who are exposed to society. Telling them to "back off and mind your own business. It's a free country, you do your own thing." is like asking them to not care about what happens around them even though they are 100% sure that society is doing something wrong.

Think about it this way, if you meet a Christian and you told them that you engage in homosexual behavior or have pre/extra marital affairs or whatever sin with NO regret. If they respond to you with "Eh, its okay. I don't care.". To some non-religious people, they probably would think, "Wow this guy is cool. He's religious but doesn't preach on other people." Me personally? I'd think "Either this guy isn't that religious as he says or he doesn't care about me at all."

 

[Reba]

I have a theory about this. Christians are a majority and, in today's society, they are rarely (if ANY) bullied in a serious way. They may be made fun of, but it's always in a light hearted way. However, Muslims face real and life threatening bullying all the time.

I assume you're talking about America, and parts of Europe, right? It's not the same in other countries.

It's simple. Do Christian REALLY fear their lives if they talked about their religion?

In other countries, yes.

... Can you say the same about Muslims?

Depends on the location.

I'm sure when Christians were persecuted back in the day, people defended them too.

Not often.

I also would like to mention that even though I do laugh at the jokes/quips about religion and enjoy them, I also do think it is unfair that people attack Christians whenever they say something about God/Bible/Jesus.

I appreciate that.

People always say "It's YOUR religion, it's YOUR belief." but what people don't realize what it is like to be in their shoes. I mean, some of them TRULY believe 100% what the Bible says, and... it can be a scary situation for them. They care about people and worry about what's going to happen to them. They worry what's going to happen to society and America, and their own impressionable kids who are exposed to society. Telling them to "back off and mind your own business. It's a free country, you do your own thing." is like asking them to not care about what happens around them even though they are 100% sure that society is doing something wrong.

Good points.

Think about it this way, if you meet a Christian and you told them that you engage in homosexual behavior or have pre/extra marital affairs or whatever sin with NO regret. If they respond to you with "Eh, its okay. I don't care.". To some non-religious people, they probably would think, "Wow this guy is cool. He's religious but doesn't preach on other people." Me personally? I'd think "Either this guy isn't that religious as he says or he doesn't care about me at all."

Exactly.

 

[Daredevel7]

I assume you're talking about America, and parts of Europe, right? It's not the same in other countries.

Yes. I was thinking about America, specifically.

 

[Reba]

Yes. I was thinking about America, specifically.

 

[StSapphire]

I also would like to mention that even though I do laugh at the jokes/quips about religion and enjoy them, I also do think it is unfair that people attack Christians whenever they say something about God/Bible/Jesus.

Not sure if this was directed towards me at all, but for the most part, when I'm not already directly engaging in a debate that's fueled in any part by religion, I usually try to keep it out of it.

Though, related to your later point (about religious people really really caring about what happens to people around them and that's why they proselytize), for some atheists (and maybe a few non-religious people, but I'm going more along the lines of the "militant atheists"), we view the world around us somewhat similarly, except that every time religion is mentioned, we fear for the future of our world, rather than every time religion isn't mentioned.

I assume you're talking about America, and parts of Europe, right? It's not the same in other countries.

I assume she's talking primarily about the parts of the world where everyone here are from. If someone's a Christian holed up in Iraq or Afghanistan, then the remarks about religion towards them would be far different than a Christian in South Carolina or Texas.

The latter is who almost all of the remarks around have been directed towards.

Depends on the location.

The same ones mentioned. Just invert "Christian" and "Muslim" if we're talking about someplace in the Middle East, which as far as I know, almost nobody here is from or in.

Not often.

I'd actually be inclined to agree with you. Christians were persecuted long before the concept of "equality for everyone" (rather than just "equality for everyone like me") gained much of any traction.

With the current times, there's a fine line for what receives "defense". For the most part, you have to be an actually established belief system (so Atheism and Mormonism are right on the cusp and comes down to personal taste, things like Scientology are out, while Islam and Buddhism are in), but something still marginalized enough in the society the people who are commenting on it are in (so, Islam for America, Christianity for Middle East, etc). It's very tricky on which sort of beliefs get backed and which get denigrated by the politically-correct.

 

[flip]

A couple things.

1) Where are people getting upset about Reba "putting down" Muslims?
2) While I accept that I've been mocking, because that's a positive action to me, I'm honestly unsure of what it is that I've supposedly mocked. I made a joke involving a well-known internet meme (Raptor Jesus, see XKCD for the internet obsession with Raptors) and a play on words because "Raptor" and "Rapture" sound vaguely similar.



You do understand there's a difference between "mocking" and "putting down" (to use your terms) or "insulting", right?

But even if not, keep in mind that the intent behind a message is something you should try to look for. In this case, I assumed it was plainly obvious that I was just making a joke, and not trying to make any sort of a serious effort at insulting or otherwise seriously make fun of them.

I'm not sure what the whole backlash against "you make fun of Christians but not Muslims!" is for, anyways. Fatwa envy, perhaps?

As a followup, to anyone interested in knowing why the rapture didn't happen - now we know:

Ok, guess you just are a bit unsensitive then.

 

[flip]

I have a theory about this. Christians are a majority and, in today's society, they are rarely (if ANY) bullied in a serious way. They may be made fun of, but it's always in a light hearted way. However, Muslims face real and life threatening bullying all the time.

It's simple. Do Christian REALLY fear their lives if they talked about their religion? Sure a quip here and there making fun of them, but no one really cares. Can you say the same about Muslims?

So I think people feel the need to defend Muslims more than Christians.

I'm sure when Christians were persecuted back in the day, people defended them too.

I also would like to mention that even though I do laugh at the jokes/quips about religion and enjoy them, I also do think it is unfair that people attack Christians whenever they say something about God/Bible/Jesus.

People always say "It's YOUR religion, it's YOUR belief." but what people don't realize what it is like to be in their shoes. I mean, some of them TRULY believe 100% what the Bible says, and... it can be a scary situation for them. They care about people and worry about what's going to happen to them. They worry what's going to happen to society and America, and their own impressionable kids who are exposed to society. Telling them to "back off and mind your own business. It's a free country, you do your own thing." is like asking them to not care about what happens around them even though they are 100% sure that society is doing something wrong.

Think about it this way, if you meet a Christian and you told them that you engage in homosexual behavior or have pre/extra marital affairs or whatever sin with NO regret. If they respond to you with "Eh, its okay. I don't care.". To some non-religious people, they probably would think, "Wow this guy is cool. He's religious but doesn't preach on other people." Me personally? I'd think "Either this guy isn't that religious as he says or he doesn't care about me at all."

Yes, that's important to remember. The problem you describe here, how some secular people fail to understand the feelings involved when something is perceived as holy by other people, and not just important, is a reason religious discussions are banned here, as I see it. The point is, it's not necessary the religious people that are to blame for the ban, but secular people as well.

The mocking of christians reminds me of kids that hate their parents. It's a bit immature. Parents are frustrated, but the kids just appears cute and a bit stupid That said, I enjoyed "Life of Brian" a lot, and still belive I respect the faith any person got, though I can disagree with their morale.

 

[Daredevel7]

Not sure if this was directed towards me at all, but for the most part, when I'm not already directly engaging in a debate that's fueled in any part by religion, I usually try to keep it out of it.

Nah. To me, there is a big difference in making fun of religion in general for the sake of comedy (Although it wont be funny to some people, but hey I'm all about freedom of speech) and personally attacking one's views to put them down, to make them feel stupid, to change their mind, and so on. Yes, the line between the two CAN be blurred, especially by the context.

Questioning someone about their beliefs is perfectly okay with me, as long the questioner is civil about it.

Though, related to your later point (about religious people really really caring about what happens to people around them and that's why they proselytize), for some atheists (and maybe a few non-religious people, but I'm going more along the lines of the "militant atheists"), we view the world around us somewhat similarly, except that every time religion is mentioned, we fear for the future of our world, rather than every time religion isn't mentioned.

Exactly. The extremes (hardcore Christians and militant atheists) aren't that different from each other. I, personally, am not a fan of extremes, but I understand where they are coming from and why they have a hard time accepting the "If it doesn't directly affect you, then mind your business" view.

I assume she's talking primarily about the parts of the world where everyone here are from. If someone's a Christian holed up in Iraq or Afghanistan, then the remarks about religion towards them would be far different than a Christian in South Carolina or Texas.

Yep.

 

[flip]

Not sure if this was directed towards me at all, but for the most part, when I'm not already directly engaging in a debate that's fueled in any part by religion, I usually try to keep it out of it.

Though, related to your later point (about religious people really really caring about what happens to people around them and that's why they proselytize), for some atheists (and maybe a few non-religious people, but I'm going more along the lines of the "militant atheists"), we view the world around us somewhat similarly, except that every time religion is mentioned, we fear for the future of our world, rather than every time religion isn't mentioned.

Sounds like a lot of work to be afraid of religion?