Declaration of Occupy Wall Street

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really? I mean really? You're going to take his words against a Nobel Prize economist with over 90 honorary degrees and professorship background in dozens of top colleges in the world??? I seriously doubt this man with abnormally high intelligence would give a cahoot if you're a liberal or conservative. If he sees any tiny fallaciousness in your argument, you bet your ass that he's going to drop a sledgehammer on you.

you funny man.... :lol:

Yeah, cause Thomas Sowell is an academic slouch... :lol:
 
Yeah, cause Thomas Sowell is an academic slouch... :lol:

yea he is. that's why all he does is write books since nobody can question him.

comparing Obama to Hitler..... lol wow...
 
yea he is. that's why all he does is write books since nobody can question him.

comparing Obama to Hitler..... lol wow...

All he does is write books? Really? :lol:
 
All he does is write books? Really? :lol:

that's the majority of his background. is there anything else you agree with him on? rather than quibbling around to find any insignificant error in my post.... if you have anything of intellectual value to defend him, then by all means, please do so.
 
that's the majority of his background. is there anything else you agree with him on? rather than quibbling around to find any insignificant error in my post.... if you have anything of intellectual value to defend him, then by all means, please do so.

Meh, I will leave you to your opinion.
 
yes, and part of that story is you strongly implied that LEO's are automatically guilty of breaking the law if they are put on administrative leave.

Another part of this story is quite a few posts back when you claimed you were calling me on a bluff? :dunno:

I felt it would be prudent to have an LEO in this discussion that actually has hands on experience to discuss items of contention you have brought to this fireside chat.

But go ahead - flame away - it's what you do.

You talked some security guard training to be a game warden that you have met one time at a restaurant into coming on here and trying to back you up. What happened to the sheriff? What happened to the State Highway Patrolman? You had to go to Missouri to find someone you met one time to get your back?:laugh2:

BTW, your "friend" has already sent me a friend request and a couple of PMs wanting to preach Jesus to me. He won't be around long.:cool2: As usual, Steiny...EPIC FAIL!
 
You talked some security guard training to be a game warden that you have met one time at a restaurant into coming on here and trying to back you up. What happened to the sheriff? What happened to the State Highway Patrolman? You had to go to Missouri to find someone you met one time to get your back?:laugh2:

BTW, your "friend" has already sent me a friend request and a couple of PMs wanting to preach Jesus to me. He won't be around long.:cool2: As usual, Steiny...EPIC FAIL!

I know who to block now. :P
 
Hate to say it but, California is a land of diversity. We have many citizens here who speak more than one language, and their native language might not have been english.

New York is a very diverse state (at least where I live :giggle:).
 
You talked some security guard training to be a game warden that you have met one time at a restaurant into coming on here and trying to back you up. What happened to the sheriff? What happened to the State Highway Patrolman? You had to go to Missouri to find someone you met one time to get your back?:laugh2:

BTW, your "friend" has already sent me a friend request and a couple of PMs wanting to preach Jesus to me. He won't be around long.:cool2: As usual, Steiny...EPIC FAIL!

He is a law enforcement officer - not a security guard. We have talked for years and yes, he came to Atlanta to visit with his wife and he got to meet my dad.

I recall you claiming that it was nuts that I should ask any law enforcement officer to join in this discussion - that I was "bluffing" - perhaps an attempt on your part to continue to distort the truth. Which, btw, has been an epic fail on your part. The only person(s) who are unable to see this are you, and your single groupie.

If he wants to preach about Jesus, it is his right to do so. It is your right to ignore him - it is both of your rights to think the other is being silly.

However, since that is completely beside the point of him even being invited here - it is at least clear that you distorted the truth when you implied an LEO is guilty when put on administrative leave.

Since it is Thanksgiving, I am sure the good Sheriff has more pressing matters than to quiblle with a flamer such as yourself hell bent on villifying men in blue.

Happy Thanksgiving :wave:
 
Pour me a root beer and hand me some chocolate! This conversation is definitely getting twisted!

Jillio, since you refuse to call me a cop I will respond on your level when I say I learned you are a shrink or social worker or guidance counselor. How does that feel girl? I am not acustomed to making slurs so I will stoop no lower than the gutter or basement that I have already entered here. So why don't we stop playing all of these childish games and discuss the real topic at hand?

And by the way, Happy Thanksgiving to all!!! I am thankful to live in a country where we have freedom of speech like we do here. I am thankful to have deaf friends. Now can we all just get along???
 
He is a law enforcement officer - not a security guard. We have talked for years and yes, he came to Atlanta to visit with his wife and he got to meet my dad.

I recall you claiming that it was nuts that I should ask any law enforcement officer to join in this discussion - that I was "bluffing" - perhaps an attempt on your part to continue to distort the truth. Which, btw, has been an epic fail on your part. The only person(s) who are unable to see this are you, and your single groupie.

If he wants to preach about Jesus, it is his right to do so. It is your right to ignore him - it is both of your rights to think the other is being silly.

However, since that is completely beside the point of him even being invited here - it is at least clear that you distorted the truth when you implied an LEO is guilty when put on administrative leave.

Since it is Thanksgiving, I am sure the good Sheriff has more pressing matters than to quiblle with a flamer such as yourself hell bent on villifying men in blue.

Happy Thanksgiving :wave:

Yeah, and you have a 164 I.Q. :laugh2: Dude, your sheriff buddy and your Highway Patrol buddy had 4 days to respond to your email.

It is not his right to preach about Jesus on this forum, nor is it his right to PM members attempting to do just that.

Invited here? Begged is more like it.l :laugh2: Face it, Steiny, no one believes a word you have to say, and they certainly aren't going to see you as more credibile for going out and digging up some guy you met once in a restaurant to come in here and try to do your debating for you. With a 164 IQ, you shouldn't need any help with anything.:laugh2: Fact is, I feel sorry for you. You are pathetic.
 
Pour me a root beer and hand me some chocolate! This conversation is definitely getting twisted!

Jillio, since you refuse to call me a cop I will respond on your level when I say I learned you are a shrink or social worker or guidance counselor. How does that feel girl? I am not acustomed to making slurs so I will stoop no lower than the gutter or basement that I have already entered here. So why don't we stop playing all of these childish games and discuss the real topic at hand?

And by the way, Happy Thanksgiving to all!!! I am thankful to live in a country where we have freedom of speech like we do here. I am thankful to have deaf friends. Now can we all just get along???

Was that supposed to be an insult? Steiny really should have dug someone up that was better at this than he is!:laugh2:

Freedom of speech? Yeah, until the pepper spray chokes it off.:cool2:
 
Jillio,

You ought to try some pepper spray some time. Or maybe a good dose of the taser! It might lighten your mood!
You spend so much time dissing people it kind of gets off the subject and gets old. Maybe this is how you get your kicks? Take up a real profession and get a life!

Sorry for the negative rant but what is good for the goose is good for the gander too!

Since we can't seem to stay on topic I'll pose a related one. The city here just broke up a homeless tent city that was organized on private property by a local reverand but in violation of city code. Now with black Friday coming up people set up tents at Best Buy but were complained about and made to take them down by the police! I love it!
 
Today, the Associated Press (AP) has a story where it estimates the costs of police securing for the various ongoing protest occupations across the country. The AP roughly estimates that these occupations over two months in eighteen major cities cost taxpayers $13 million. Right-wing media outlets are already using this number to claim that the protests are too costly to maintain.

But the AP piece does not provide the necessary context to put this number into perspective. $13 million for policing of ongoing protests all over the country for two months is not a particularly large sum. For example, the 2004 Republican National Committee protests, which lasted for a single week and took place in a single location,cost $50 million to secure. A small tea party rally in November 2010 that attracted only a few dozen people cost $14,000, paid for by official congressional money.

The cost of securing these protests against economic inequality and political corruption also pales in comparison to one large figure: the wealth destroyed by Wall Street’s recession. The recession caused by Wall Street’s misdeeds destroyed $50 trillion of wealth globally by 2009, $20 trillion of that wealth in the United States alone. ThinkProgress has assembled the following chart to visualize these comparative costs:

Think 'Securing' OWS Protests is Expensive? Wall Street

Kind of puts it all in perspective, huh?
 
Jillio,

You ought to try some pepper spray some time. Or maybe a good dose of the taser! It might lighten your mood!
You spend so much time dissing people it kind of gets off the subject and gets old. Maybe this is how you get your kicks? Take up a real profession and get a life!

Sorry for the negative rant but what is good for the goose is good for the gander too!

Since we can't seem to stay on topic I'll pose a related one. The city here just broke up a homeless tent city that was organized on private property by a local reverand but in violation of city code. Now with black Friday coming up people set up tents at Best Buy but were complained about and made to take them down by the police! I love it!

:nana: Don't you have some security guarding to do, Barney?

This thread isn't about Black Friday. It is about OWS. What's the matter? You just upset because you didn't get the chance to spray those big bad shoppers? Want to rant about the shoppers, go start your own thread.
 
Today, the Associated Press (AP) has a story where it estimates the costs of police securing for the various ongoing protest occupations across the country. The AP roughly estimates that these occupations over two months in eighteen major cities cost taxpayers $13 million. Right-wing media outlets are already using this number to claim that the protests are too costly to maintain.

But the AP piece does not provide the necessary context to put this number into perspective. $13 million for policing of ongoing protests all over the country for two months is not a particularly large sum. For example, the 2004 Republican National Committee protests, which lasted for a single week and took place in a single location,cost $50 million to secure. A small tea party rally in November 2010 that attracted only a few dozen people cost $14,000, paid for by official congressional money.

The cost of securing these protests against economic inequality and political corruption also pales in comparison to one large figure: the wealth destroyed by Wall Street’s recession. The recession caused by Wall Street’s misdeeds destroyed $50 trillion of wealth globally by 2009, $20 trillion of that wealth in the United States alone. ThinkProgress has assembled the following chart to visualize these comparative costs:

Think 'Securing' OWS Protests is Expensive? Wall Street

Kind of puts it all in perspective, huh?

Some people have no perspective, :P
 
:nana: Don't you have some security guarding to do, Barney?

This thread isn't about Black Friday. It is about OWS. What's the matter? You just upset because you didn't get the chance to spray those big bad shoppers? Want to rant about the shoppers, go start your own thread.

Just as this thread isn't about whether or not I'm an LEO right? That is why you spend so much time dissing me? I came here to discuss legal issues involving the police. You won't scare me off with your tactics. And I am done stooping to your level. Now if we are ready to discuss things as adults I will continue.
 
Perhaps the single biggest factor that helped lead to the Occupy movement’s success in capturing the media and public’s attention has been its creativity. Novel protest strategies have served as OWS’s foundation since its first days. The very idea of occupying, and sleeping in, a park twenty-four hours a day was new and exciting.

Up until Occupy, most protests had become exercises in futility. Protesters would show up with their sad, limp carboard signs, march around for a little while—maybe press would show up, but most likely not—and then everyone would go home. Hardly effective stuff.

Even when the protests were massive, say during the lead-up to the Iraq invasion, media had learned to ignore protests as being the hallmark of a bygone era of granola-munching hippies. Whether consciously or unconsciously, the media helped hand protesters loss after loss, perhaps recognizing the fact that protest waged within the perimeters constructed by city officials is completely ineffective.

Demonstrators need a permit to march, and even then must remain on the sidewalk and never disrupt traffic; they need a permit to use a bullhorn, a permit to play music, etc. Protesters, in other words, can protest as long as they never disrupt the normalcy of everyday living, which of course defeats the concept of meaningful protest in the first place.

After a while, all protests began to look the same. Protesters show up, march around, chant X or Y slogan, and if it’s super-exciting, clash with the police and everyone goes to jail. Repeat chorus. It’s no wonder the corporately controlled media were so easily able to write off protest culture as being unimportant or ineffective. The horrible truth was, it had become futile.

That is, of course, until Occupy showed up and refused to play by the city-written rules. No, they wouldn’t be getting permits. No, they wouldn’t be going home at curfew. They would remain in camps as permanent monuments to the injustice and inequality of America’s society. There was no “normal” anymore. There was only what Occupy chose to do, and to not do.

Beyond the creativity of the camps themselves with their libraries, clinics, food tents, media centers and very own newspapers, Occupy chapters are full of young protesters who are extremely savvy to what captures the media’s attention.

Hero Vincent, a young man who is one of the more well-known Occupy protesters and who has been arrested four times since the beginning of the occupation, one day casually remarked, “We need a bat signal. The 99%.”

And that idea came to fruition as thousands of protesters marched across the Brooklyn Bridge Friday.

Business Insider reports that a single mother of three named Denise Vega volunteered her apartment in a subsidized housing building across the way to set up the projector. When Occupy tried to pay her for the use of her apartment, she refused the money. “This is for the people,” she said.

From Denise’s windowsill, the projector shone the massive “99%” image across the side of the Verizon building. Not only was the image perfect media bait, it served as a profound statement. Verizon, famous for tax dodging and mistreating union members, has been an Occupy target for a long time. Here was the protesters’ chance to not only defiantly march by an archetype of corporate greed but also physically leave a mark, albeit temporary, on Verizon’s face.

The symbolic moment: the candlelight march, the projector’s alternating messages, including, “We are winning,” every element expressed awesome power. You could see it in the faces of the marchers that they had never experienced a profoundly empowering feeling like this before.

And it wasn’t just happening in New York. It was happening everywhere. The projector’s shutter closed and reopened, presenting a new message, “Occupy Earth.”

The Occupy protesters talk about Tahrir and Egypt’s youth not like they’re some foreign, abstract concept, but rather comrades in a common struggle. They express genuine love and solidarity for people who live 5,000 miles away from them, whom they’ll never meet, but with whom they recognize they have more in common with than Bank of America’s CEO.

Perhaps one of the eeriest and most powerful recent Occupy moments occurred when UC Davis chancellor Linda Katehi left a press conference in which she was responding to the horrible images and video of UC Davis police officer Lt. John Pike nonchalantly pepper-spraying peaceful protesters.


Students must have been overwhelmingly tempted to shout at the chancellor, or chant “shame,” but such scenes have unfolded a thousand times before, and would have run the risk of being drowned out by similar displays in Oakland, New York City and elsewhere.

Katehi, who hadn’t leaved the press conference for three hours because “the crowd outside was perceived to be hostile,” finally exited the building and was not greeted with lobbed insults or slogans.

Rather, she was greeted with deafening, crushing silence.

Katehi cannot conceal the emotion from her face as she walks past the hundreds of stoic students, the chancellor’s heels clicking upon the pavement serving as the moment’s soundtrack.

When a reporter asks her if she still fears her students, she turns and softly says, “No…no…” But the look in her eyes is unmistakable. She has just attended the funeral of her legacy.

Where Occupy has flourished and other movements have perished is in the group’s refusal to be swept under the rug. Part of this resistance is displayed in moments of pure grit where protesters simply don’t give up when confronted with snow, rain, derision or the unyielding brutality of the police state.

But resistance also occurs when activists adopt guerilla tactics, including non-traditional protest. Much like Anonymous, OWS is a new wave of protest, a direct and significant challenge to the elite who are unaccustomed to such confrontation.

And the one percent find such evolved protest—this kind of global awakening—absolutely bone-chillingly terrifying. If the elites can no longer exploit xenophobia, red state–blue state civil war, racism, sexism or homophobia, how will they keep the underclass bickering while they run off with the country’s wealth?

This is why a well-known Washington lobbying firm with links to the financial industry proposed a $850,000 plan to smear the activists, or as they put it, “opposition research” in order to construct “negative narratives.”

This is also why Mayor Bloomberg had the NYPD raid Liberty Park’s encampment in the dead of night, and perhaps offers a clue as to why he chose yesterday to parade around yet another alleged bad guy, whom the NYPD had been tailing for two years, yet chose Sunday night as a good time for the Big Bust.

As Bloomberg’s popularity wanes, and the public cries out about vanishing First Amendment rights and police brutality, what better time to simulate a terrorist attack on television and remind everyone to remain terrified and compliant to the billionaire mayor and his army?

I’ve seen countless speculations about “What’s next?” for Occupy, but such theorizing is made in vain. No one knows what’s next for Occupy because the group isn’t like any protest movement that came before it. Yes, OWS borrows from concepts like Hooverville and the global justice movement, but in other ways it’s completely new, so speculating about what they’re going to do a month from now is pointless.

However, there has been some indications that in the coming cold winter months, the occupations will move indoors to condemned buildings and foreclosed homes. Such a maneuver would again place Occupy at the forefront of creative protest.

Ever since the wave of foreclosures began, there have always been rogue sheriffs who refused to kick people out of their homes, and community organizers who help move homeless people into abandoned houses, but there has never been a serious, organized national movement to reclaim the homes.

If ever there was a protest group equipped to attempt such a feat, it’s Occupy.

Occupy Wall Street and the Importance of Creative Protest | The Nation
 
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