Deaf infants getting cochlear implants younger than ever

faire_jour said:
Is this sarcasm?
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Like Botts said, it's not sarcasm.

You have the balls to say your opinion and I appreciate this.

As a parent you think of your daughter's education; Deaf or hearing.
 
Pinky said:
It's not sad. That's good for baby to hear with CI. You guys shouldn't judge on baby's parent's decide. It's their decide. We can't change them. That's stupid to be pissed off at them. :roll: You don't need to debate with me.
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So do you consider deaf people abnormal then?
 
faire_jour said:
Because research shows that less than 10% of profoundly deaf children and learn to listen and speak with hearing aids. The other 90% need visual language and can not get past "word level" with their aids.

The exact opposite is true for CI's. Close to 90% of young implanted children learn *language* through audition alone. They catch up, or never fall behind, with spoken language.

You are quite wrong. What people have been doing for hundreds of years DOES NOT WORK! Ask anyone here!!
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so ASL doesnt work is that what you are saying?
 
faire_jour said:
I am NOT normal, and I would be pissed if anyone thought I was. I am better than normal. I'm me. I'm a rock and roll, pierced, tattooed, amazing, insane person. I would never ever ever want to be "normal".

FUCK CONFORMITY!!
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That is because you chose to identify yourself as abnormal. As someone who grew up believing I was not normal like my hearing peers really did a number to my self-esteem. That's the difference...your definition of abnormal for yourself is a positive one because you want to be but many deaf children grew up with the underlying message that there is something abnormal about them that needs to be fixed.
 
shel90 said:
That is because you chose to identify yourself as abnormal. As someone who grew up believing I was not normal like my hearing peers really did a number to my self-esteem. That's the difference...your definition of abnormal for yourself is a positive one because you want to be but many deaf children grew up with the underlying message that there is something abnormal about them that needs to be fixed.
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Amen!
 
shel90 said:
So do you consider deaf people abnormal then?
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I must be misread and hurry up. I don't like to hear flame over parents implanted children. I went to Drew'sDad blog "Turn it on my ears". I read whole of blog about deaf culture, sign language, education and other. I do agree with his dad about parents' choice children to get implants. I do respect their choice. To be honest, I disagree with his mom about oral deaf education. They said Drew is normal hearing in peers at oral deaf education. His parents do not use sign language and only want Drew to be oral because of his family are hearing. Hearing and deaf people both are abnormal. Nobody are perfect. I'm not aware of normal is offensive.

IMO, some hearing parents know sign language nor ASL and have deaf babies and children with CI use sign language and spoken in same time. It will be easier than non-sign language and non-ASL as BI BI. The normal for ci babies and children to use ASL and speak language in same time. ASL and Oral both will be better for babies and children with CI instead oral alone. I don't want to deal with deaf culture controversy over hearing parents implanted children without ASL and even sign language. ASL & Oral need be equality. Can social with both deaf and hearing world.

You need to read Drew's dad's blog about deaf culture, sign language, education. Take it easy don't be piss off! Just let them choice it. We can't change it.
 
IMO, some hearing parents know sign language nor ASL and have deaf babies and children with CI use sign language and spoken in same time. It will be easier than non-sign language and non-ASL as BI BI. The normal for ci babies and children to use ASL and speak language in same time. ASL and Oral both will be better for babies and children with CI instead oral alone. I don't want to deal with deaf culture controversy over hearing parents implanted children without ASL and even sign language. ASL & Oral need be equality. Can social with both deaf and hearing world.
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Unfortunately MANY hearing parents of deaf children don't really adopt this philosophy. They either put ASL on the back burner. Or treat ASL as not important. Some, like my mother, think we can always learn ASL later but we MUST learn spoken language NOW. Other parent believe it will hinder their CI/hearing aid child's spoken language so they absolutely forbid it. My grandma came to visit me yesterday and I asked her if her deaf sister ever learned to speak (just to make sure it is true) . My grandma said yes, her deaf sister did know how to speak and communicate but rather use sign language (she never had hearing aids, they didn't have them in those days as her sister was a child of 1930's) . Then my grandma told me how her very own father would spank my grandma for signing with her sister. Her father wanted his deaf daughter to speak when she is in with the family. Not sign. So my grandma's sign language never did advance because of that.
 
Not being considered "normal" is hurtful. This true even when a person is gifted and that's why he/she is considered "abnormal" or "weird." Each person needs to be accepted--not judged according to some predetermined standard.

It's a hard decision for a parent and I can imagine that surgery is scary to parents. My eldest child had surgery at 7 months (not CI, but non-elective reconstructive) and I was a wreck!

My concern is that parents have realistic expectations. Imposing unrealistic expectations on a child would be devastating. Ron Jaxon's posts on realistic expectations are helpful. The same issue exists for hearing children, too. I've seen parents put too much pressure on a kid. Awareness of emotional development is very important. I wish that we did a better job of helping all children in this area.
 
Pinky, you need to reread my first post in this thread. I am not talking about Drew's dad at all.
 
faire_jour said:
Because research shows that less than 10% of profoundly deaf children and learn to listen and speak with hearing aids. The other 90% need visual language and can not get past "word level" with their aids.

The exact opposite is true for CI's. Close to 90% of young implanted children learn *language* through audition alone. They catch up, or never fall behind, with spoken language.

You are quite wrong. What people have been doing for hundreds of years DOES NOT WORK! Ask anyone here!!
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Ok, can you tell that to Deaf people with their CIs who are oral failures?
 
Oddball said:
Ok, can you tell that to Deaf people with their CIs who are oral failures?
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She'll just say they weren't implant early enough

We don't really know the outcome of CI implanted children as far as their emotional well being and how they deal with CI oral speech growing up. . I know as a (ex) hearing aid wearer, speech and communication was always my sole focus everyday (still is, now that I have a CI). Kind like a person who can't walk focus on how he is going to get up and take a shower everyday... something that we don't think about and just do it.
 
Oddball said:
Ok, can you tell that to Deaf people with their CIs who are oral failures?
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Absolutly it happens. It happens everyday, for various reasons. That is why I advocate ASL for all children with a hearing loss. But the truth is, it is a small percentage of children who don't get benefit from their CI's.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
She'll just say they weren't implant early enough

We don't really know the outcome of CI implanted children as far as their emotional well being and how they deal with CI oral speech growing up. . I know as a (ex) hearing aid wearer, speech and communication was always my sole focus everyday (still is, now that I have a CI). Kind like a person who can't walk focus on how he is going to get up and take a shower everyday... something that we don't think about and just do it.
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Actually, there has been research done on the emotional well being of kids with CI's.

They have even done studies compairing oral kids outlooks vs. ASL using kids. I heard about it at a Hands & Voices conference. It was interesting.
 
My comment regarding the father being an ass to think that his child should go to a normal school, is because the idea of his child being around other deaf children is not normal.

I had to go to a mainstream school and learn without an interpreter because the 'school' thought it was best for me.

In the end I was left behind, not included into group projects or conversations, I was isolated, because I was viewed as 'abnormal' or 'not normal'.

He needs to place his child in both worlds, and that child will grow to decide whether or not they wish to be in a Deaf Culture or Hearing Culture, based on the childs comfort.

Face it, in this world there are a lot of stereotypes regarding the Deaf Culture, and that child will face those stereotypes, even if she speaks orally, and goes to a Mainstream school.

If the CI should ever fail (God Forbid) that child will be thrown into the Deaf Culture with no way of knowing how to communicate with others like her and no way to communicate with Hearing People and deal with the fustrations of trying to communicate with them.

Fair_jour I agree with some of your views.

I agree that it does help with vocabulary skills and whatnot.

I just dont agree with the father thinking that his child will benefit just from the hearing world because it is normal, he needs to place the child in both worlds.

sallylou said it well:

My concern is that parents have realistic expectations. Imposing unrealistic expectations on a child would be devastating. Ron Jaxon's posts on realistic expectations are helpful. The same issue exists for hearing children, too. I've seen parents put too much pressure on a kid. Awareness of emotional development is very important. I wish that we did a better job of helping all children in this area.
 
I totally agree that parents must have realistic expectations, and some do but some don't. For example, on a parent's list I know of a mother who is about to implant her 6 year old, profoundly deaf since birth, son. Ok, that's fine, but realistically, he will NEVER become an oral language user, and chances are, he will become a non-user. They missed the window.

BUT, on the other hand, realistic view for a child implanted at 9 months would include being completely age appropriate with language before age 3, attending mainstream schools, hearing in the "normal range" and being able to learn and understand through listening only.

Oh, and if an implant fails, the vast majority of people are re-implanted in days. The child wouldn't be "thrust into" anything.
 
I agree with you on that point as well....it would help in the language learning development in the child.

However, I am more worried about the child being isolated, while they may have great language skills they will still be viewed as 'different'

I was born with profound sensorinueral Hearing loss. I did not learn language until I was 6 years old and the hearing aids I had were not that much help.

While I did know how to speak orally, I still was isolated. Because of the communication barrier, where I can hear speaking but comprehending what others were saying was even harder.

It was not til I reached middle school that I finally met with other deaf students and began learning ASL.....and I found my friends through that and had more fun in school than I did in elementary school.

In high school is was right back to mainstream....and isolation again because I got a CI. It did not matter whether I spoke well or not, knew sign or not, I still was isolated, all because I was 'different'.
 
I do not think mainstreaming is right for all or even most deaf (or really any child who has special needs, but that is another post!) But I think it needs done on a case by case basis. Educational placement is HARD, and most parents spend hours and tears trying to find the right place for their child. Sometimes a deaf school would be a good fit, other times it would be terrible. The same is true about any situation.
 
shel90 said:
"I'm sure he could live a happy life as a deaf person," Mr. Johnson said. "But, any advantage we can give him to hear and to go to normal schools, we wanted to take that opportunity.

That is an insult to those who go to deaf schools or are in deaf programs. Sure, they are abnormal. :roll:

Stupid asshole.
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You wanted me to re-read your first post. I got it now. I believe that he is following Alexander Graham Bell. He wanted his son to put in mainstream school as oral. I didn't see what he said about sign language. It obvious he rejected deaf school, deaf people and deaf culture. It's same as Drew's parent's view on deaf school and oral deaf education between. They don't want to learn sign language and ASL. It's not our problems.
 
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