Deaf children and hearing parents...why don't the parents learn sl?

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Exactly... exposure to speech / oral is not forcing it.... ... Forcing sign on her would be...

Exactly how does one go about "forcing sign"? If exposure to speech/oral is the only mode one is exposed to, one is most certainly forced to communicate in the only mode made available. Exposure to both allows choice.
 
Cochlear Implants
The issue
Cochlear implant surgery on deaf infants and children is now widespread in Canada.
CAD's position
Cochlear implants do not lessen the need to provide every deaf child with the full range of options — including Sign language — for acquiring linguistic competence.T
The Canadian Association of the Deaf is not concerned with decisions made by autonomous deaf adults to have cochlear implant surgery; we recognize that the implants may be of assistance to some adults, particularly those who have been deafened later in life. Instead, we focus on the success rates and ethical dimensions of cochlear implants in young deaf children.
Since our first position paper was issued in 1994, empirical research has still not provided conclusive evidence for the efficacy of cochlear implants in supporting first-language acquisition in deaf children. Rigorously designed studies in this area are lacking, and the process of selecting participants for existing studies is questionable. In addition, current auditory-verbal research lacks measures of how deaf children with cochlear implants function across multiple domains, including social and emotional development.The difficulties faced by deaf and hard of hearing children in developing linguistic and social competence when exposed only to spoken language is well-documented. The language learning situation faced by a young deaf child is completely different from that of a deaf, hard of hearing or deafened adult who has already acquired language.For these reasons, the Canadian Association of the Deaf strongly asserts the right of all deaf children to acquire Sign language from infancy onward. The argument commonly made by proponents of auditory-verbal therapy and cochlear implants, that learning Sign language inhibits hearing and speech development in deaf children, is contrary to everything that is known about language acquisition and bilingual development. In addition, the presentation of Sign language and cochlear implants as being in opposition to each other by medical, audiological, and education professionals is a disservice to deaf children and their families. Children with cochlear implants, like other deaf children, will benefit from learning Sign language in early childhood.We advocate for the right of all deaf children with and without cochlear implants to grow up bilingual and bicultural. Access to Sign language and the Deaf community provides the child with opportunities for his or her optimum development and participation in education, recreation and social and family life. To support deaf children’s access to Sign language, we call for the full involvement of Sign-fluent Deaf professionals in early intervention and education services provided to families of deaf children.
In addition, the Canadian Association of the Deaf calls for greater scrutiny of the financial profits and marketing schemes of cochlear implant corporations in Canada. The relation-ship between these corporations, provincial health ministries, children’s hospitals, and auditory-verbal therapy organizations remains shrouded. It is in the public interest for full transparency to be exercised in all dealings by these parties. The deaths and injuries of some deaf children who have undergone cochlear implant surgery are a reminder of the real and serious risks involved.
Deaf children with cochlear implants are an important part of the Deaf community. Regardless of individual background and choices, every Deaf person’s participation strengthens and enriches the Deaf community. The Canadian Association of the Deaf continues to advocate for the language and education rights of deaf children, including those with cochlear implants.

» Deaf Issues » Canadian Association of the Deaf

And interesting statement from our neighbors to the North.
 
Cochlear Implants
The issue
Cochlear implant surgery on deaf infants and children is now widespread in Canada.
CAD's position
Cochlear implants do not lessen the need to provide every deaf child with the full range of options — including Sign language — for acquiring linguistic competence.T
The Canadian Association of the Deaf is not concerned with decisions made by autonomous deaf adults to have cochlear implant surgery; we recognize that the implants may be of assistance to some adults, particularly those who have been deafened later in life. Instead, we focus on the success rates and ethical dimensions of cochlear implants in young deaf children.
Since our first position paper was issued in 1994, empirical research has still not provided conclusive evidence for the efficacy of cochlear implants in supporting first-language acquisition in deaf children. Rigorously designed studies in this area are lacking, and the process of selecting participants for existing studies is questionable. In addition, current auditory-verbal research lacks measures of how deaf children with cochlear implants function across multiple domains, including social and emotional development.The difficulties faced by deaf and hard of hearing children in developing linguistic and social competence when exposed only to spoken language is well-documented. The language learning situation faced by a young deaf child is completely different from that of a deaf, hard of hearing or deafened adult who has already acquired language.For these reasons, the Canadian Association of the Deaf strongly asserts the right of all deaf children to acquire Sign language from infancy onward. The argument commonly made by proponents of auditory-verbal therapy and cochlear implants, that learning Sign language inhibits hearing and speech development in deaf children, is contrary to everything that is known about language acquisition and bilingual development. In addition, the presentation of Sign language and cochlear implants as being in opposition to each other by medical, audiological, and education professionals is a disservice to deaf children and their families. Children with cochlear implants, like other deaf children, will benefit from learning Sign language in early childhood.We advocate for the right of all deaf children with and without cochlear implants to grow up bilingual and bicultural. Access to Sign language and the Deaf community provides the child with opportunities for his or her optimum development and participation in education, recreation and social and family life. To support deaf children’s access to Sign language, we call for the full involvement of Sign-fluent Deaf professionals in early intervention and education services provided to families of deaf children.
In addition, the Canadian Association of the Deaf calls for greater scrutiny of the financial profits and marketing schemes of cochlear implant corporations in Canada. The relation-ship between these corporations, provincial health ministries, children’s hospitals, and auditory-verbal therapy organizations remains shrouded. It is in the public interest for full transparency to be exercised in all dealings by these parties. The deaths and injuries of some deaf children who have undergone cochlear implant surgery are a reminder of the real and serious risks involved.
Deaf children with cochlear implants are an important part of the Deaf community. Regardless of individual background and choices, every Deaf person’s participation strengthens and enriches the Deaf community. The Canadian Association of the Deaf continues to advocate for the language and education rights of deaf children, including those with cochlear implants.

» Deaf Issues » Canadian Association of the Deaf

And interesting statement from our neighbors to the North.
Interesting....

I recall you would call an "article" like this not significant and biased....

but I guess it all depends on the statement given...
 
She was 4 when she left - nope..

I'm sorry, my situation was used as a general example. My daughter is not exceptional.
Let's keep it generic as you called it.

No problem cloggy, I know you didn't do it on purpose:)
 
originally posted by Holly
Of course, in the long run your child might never use sign, but hey, at least they'd know another language.

Holly - The more languages the better! Success with language is dependant on how accurate, fluent and consistent the modelling/delievery of the language provided is.
 
originally posted by Holly

Holly - The more languages the better! Success with language is dependant on how accurate, fluent and consistent the modelling/delievery of the language provided is.

Yes, finally we agree! According to correlative research, EARLY ASL is the major cause of higher literacy among deaf. No need to stick with a oral lanugage only. Parents should put in a minimum of effort to learn ASL, that not is hard at all and medium fluency is sufficent. Keep up the great work, Loml, you are getting it.
 
I don't believe that that is very likely. Why do you believe it's very likely?

The difference here is that you belive, while I know. Just ask any deaf adult person about their oral friends from childhood, and note the high number of friends who learned sign language later. They keep on stumbling into the deaf community everyday, some at an age of 10, other at an age of 40.

We are talking at an general level, but your child is already surrounded by a lot of deaf culture. Both her parents know some sign language, a language that is the native language of the deaf culture, and her father is very active in a deaf forum, that's not a good sign. :dunno2:
 
My parents took sign language classes after I became deaf. Professionals all told them to never use signs or gestures with me, as I would never speak again if I should ever pick up on the signs. Boy, were those professionals wrong! Yes, I did have to learn how to speak all over again after I lost my hearing to meningitis. But it took years. So for a while, we communicated with signs and gestures. But then, as I started speaking again, and started making more sense of speech and of listening/lipreading my parents and sister, we started signing less and less at home. But I used signs all the time at the deaf school. Although, while I was in elementary school, there have been plenty of moments when I'd speak and use signs at the same time at home without even realizing I was using signs. Now though, I hardly ever use signs. I can communicate very well with my family (although oftentimes I'll mishear what was said if I didn't lipread them), and if I'm around other deaf people, then I'll use signs. But my signing skills are slowly becoming rusty... err. I better just start signing to myself, just to keep my signs more flexible and understandable.
 
Living in Wyoming, I can see why the rust is forming, cdmeggers. Does this bother you? Wyoming is one of my favorite places, especially the western side before the edge of the Great Plains and it's constant wind.

Do any of the Jackalopes there know ASL? :giggle:
 
Interesting....

I recall you would call an "article" like this not significant and biased....

but I guess it all depends on the statement given...

This is not an "article" cloggy. It is a position statement. A very different thing from research. Position statements are not held to the standards of validity and reliabiltiy of research. Nor did I claim in my post that it was research.

Would you care to answer my question regarding how one goes about "forcing" sign?
 
Yes, finally we agree! According to correlative research, EARLY ASL is the major cause of higher literacy among deaf. No need to stick with a oral lanugage only. Parents should put in a minimum of effort to learn ASL, that not is hard at all and medium fluency is sufficent. Keep up the great work, Loml, you are getting it.

:gpost: You nailed it.
 
Living in Wyoming, I can see why the rust is forming, cdmeggers. Does this bother you? Wyoming is one of my favorite places, especially the western side before the edge of the Great Plains and it's constant wind.

Do any of the Jackalopes there know ASL? :giggle:


It does bother me. I just hate how very few deaf people there are in a single town. There have been efforts of the local deaf community to get together at least once a month to socialize with one another in signs, but as each month goes by, less and less people show up. I'm one of those who haven't been showing up lately, but only because my friend will tell me one night before the social that it's happening. If I had known sooner, then I would have attended if I didn't have other plans. It gets frustrating, wanting to socialize but not being able to do so.

There have been plenty of times when I've wished I live in another state, somewhere where there is more of a deaf community, more deaf people my age (I'm 22). I prefer being around deaf people than hearing people, I always have after I was mainstreamed into a public school.

And I just do not like it in Wyoming at all. Air is too dry, the wind drives me out of my mind, and I just absolutely hate the winters here.
 
Yes, finally we agree! According to correlative research, EARLY ASL is the major cause of higher literacy among deaf. No need to stick with a oral lanugage only. Parents should put in a minimum of effort to learn ASL, that not is hard at all and medium fluency is sufficent. Keep up the great work, Loml, you are getting it.

I agree with that..wish most parents werent so focused on oral language only.
 
Yes, finally we agree! According to correlative research, EARLY ASL is the major cause of higher literacy among deaf. No need to stick with a oral lanugage only. Parents should put in a minimum of effort to learn ASL, that not is hard at all and medium fluency is sufficent. Keep up the great work, Loml, you are getting it.

I think it important to define our words and clarify our statements. I wish to provide another clear example of how correlative research proves causality.

"According to the Pastafarian belief system, pirates are "absolute divine beings" and the original Pastafarians.[3] Their image as "thieves and outcasts" is misinformation spread by Christian theologians in the Middle Ages and Hare Krishnas. Pastafarianism says that they were in fact "peace-loving explorers and spreaders of good will" who distributed candy to small children, and adds that modern pirates are in no way similar to "the fun-loving buccaneers from history." Pastafarians celebrate International Talk Like a Pirate Day on September 19.

The inclusion of pirates in Pastafarianism was part of Henderson's original letter to the Kansas School Board. It illustrated that Correlation does not imply causation. Henderson put forth the argument that "global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters are a direct effect of the shrinking numbers of pirates since the 1800s."[3] A chart accompanying the letter shows that as the number of pirates decreased, global temperatures increased; the absurdity of this demonstrates how statistically significant correlations do not imply a causal relationship"

Source: Flying Spaghetti Monster - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To get a clearer view of how this can be graphically represented please see the following:

Image:FSM Pirates.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I wish to be adamant about this. I am desiring to make a point and am using humour to help accomplish it in a less depreciating manner. I am not setting about to prove you wrong Flip. Seriously. Just please, please, please, let us all be aware that we need to think about what we read and not accept it as generalizable or draw conclusions about causality that aren't there. Finally, I am starting to get sick of the attitude that it is ok to post broad, generalizable statements, and claim there is research to back them up without actually giving the research. I AM an academic. I WANT to learn. And I have never, not once in my 7 years of post-secondary schooling ran into someone else who is an academic who is not eager to share the research that lends credibility to their arguments. Only through that process can you truly hope to change someones position.
 
Auditory-Oral Education

While oral education is important in providing the child who is deaf or hard-of- hearing with strategies to listen to and identify as much auditory information as possible and use that for developing speech skills, it is important to realize that not all auditory information is accessible or clear. Learning or acquiring a language is a struggle when some information is missing as a result of insufficient auditory potential and ambiguous visual stimuli.

American Sign Language

American Sign Language (ASL) is a language with its own grammar, syntax and community; however, one must be exposed to native and/or fluent users of ASL to acquire it. Since the majority of children who are deaf or hard-of-hearing have hearing parents (90%), these children usually have limited access to appropriate ASL language models. It typically takes several years to become fluent in any new language. A family that chooses to learn how to sign and does not have ASL models consistently available may place their deaf child at risk for an additional several years of first-language delay from the time of diagnosis. Deaf children of Deaf parents or other fluent signers are not at risk for language delay and have access to a solid foundation for learning English as a second language

Signed English and Other Sign Systems

Signed English, Seeing Essential English (SEE 1), Signing Exact English (SEE 2), Conceptually Accurate Signed English (CASE), and Linguistics of Visual English (LOVE) are all types of Manually Coded English (MCE) systems. None of them are languages. They are all systems that were developed to try to show English through signs. However, they show English at the word-meaning level, not at the phonemic level. For example, the signs for cat do not show the phonemic properties of the word as /k, a, t/. The signs for the word book do not show the phonemes /b, oo, k/. Cued American English conveys the complete English language phonemically.

How Cueing Helps Solve Weaknesses in Deaf Education

Children who are deaf or hard-of-hearing and use either the oral or manual approach to communication and language typically struggle with decoding the phonemic information needed to process written English. Signing does not provide phonemic awareness for spoken languages. Students who use a sign system or ASL struggle with connecting the signs to printed words. Oral/aural communication does not provide complete information about the spoken language, with many of the phonemes looking identical on the mouth (such as /t, d, n, l/ or /i, e/). Cueing a language provides information at the phonemic level, so the process for cuers to connect spoken words to print is similar to the process used by hearing children. One interesting study showed that deaf cuers and hearing children make similar spelling mistakes. For example, they might write blue as “bloo” or done as “dun.” However, deaf signers’ spelling mistakes tend to be related to sequencing, such as “bule” instead of blue.2 Also, deaf or hard-of-hearing signers typically struggle with the idea of rhyming and don’t understand how words such as bird and word are rhymes, but here and where are not. A deaf signer’s interaction and understanding of English is largely based on the printed word. However, deaf cuers typically have the same understanding of rhyming as their hearing peers and can identify rhyme pairs as well as produce spontaneous rhymes.3 Rhyming is often used as a predictor of future reading success in hearing children. Without the ability to rhyme and manipulate the phonemes of the language, reading will plateau at the third- or fourth-grade level.4

Conclusion

Having access to a complete language from the earliest time possible allows a child who is deaf or hard-of-hearing to develop that language naturally and use it in school to develop reading and writing skills. Cueing enables children to establish this strong foundation needed for developing literacy skills.

1 Jeffers, J., & Barley, M. (1971). Speechreading (lipreading). Springfield, IL: Charles C. Thomas.
2 LaSasso, C., Crain, K. L., & Leybaert, J. (2003). Rhyme generation in deaf students: The effect of exposure to Cued
Speech. Journal of Deaf Studies & Deaf Education, 8(3), 250-270.
3 LaSasso, C., & Crain, K. L. (2003). Research and theory support Cued Speech. Odyssey. Fall, 30-36.
4 Lyon, G. Reid. 2003. What principals need to know about reading. Principal. 83(2), 14-18.
.

http://www.cuedspeech.org/PDF/CS_why_is_it_important.pdf
 
Correlative research, nor research of any design, proves nothing. It only supports a hypothesis. Your insistence on research as proof is indicative of your lack of understanding of the purpose of research. This is one if the first things a student learns of research.

The only research design that can imply causation is a design of the scientific method. Any researcher or intorductory test will plainly state that correlational research does not have the capability to support causation. Correlation simply supports the hypohtesis that two separate events occur in a postive or a negative relationship.
 
originally posted by jillio

Additionally, the text you have posted contains many false assumptions.

jillio - It was humour.
 
jillio - you have changed your post to owen06.
 
originally posted by jillio



jillio - It was humour.

How so? It is indicative of your numerous other posts regarding CS. Are we to assume that they were all humorous as well? I fail to see the humor in purposely posting innacurracies.
 
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