Cruel & Unusual Punishment

Jiro

If You Know What I Mean
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Judge Defies Prosecutors on Pornography Sentence
A man whose conviction on child pornography charges won him an unusual champion — the trial judge, Jack B. Weinstein — was sentenced on Thursday to five years in prison, the minimum sentence required by law.

Even then, Judge Weinstein, of Federal District Court in Brooklyn, was compassionate toward the defendant, allowing him to remain free for two more months, and dismissive of the government’s efforts to get a longer sentence.

In 2005, the defendant, Pietro Polizzi, 57, of Queens, signed up for a pornography Web site and began collecting thousands of explicit images involving children. Federal prosecutors said some images showed children as young as 3 years old.

But Judge Weinstein, who is known for strong opinions about the rights of defendants, has thrown out a conviction of Mr. Polizzi, and ruled that he did not need to wear an electronic ankle bracelet while awaiting a new trial.

Last year, in an interview with The New York Times, Judge Weinstein said he believed that mandatory sentences were misapplied to people who viewed child pornography, as opposed to those who produced the images.

“We’re destroying lives unnecessarily,” he said then. “At the most, they should be receiving treatment and supervision.”

In 2007, a jury found Mr. Polizzi guilty of receiving and possessing child pornography. Under federal sentencing guidelines, he was eligible for a term of 11 to 14 years in prison. That is what the government requested Thursday.

But the judge responded: “I find it grossly excessive. Therefore, a guideline sentence is not imposed.”

Instead, Judge Weinstein ordered that Mr. Polizzi serve the mandatory minimum of five years.

He also gave Mr. Polizzi eight weeks before beginning the sentence. Federal prosecutors had asked that Mr. Polizzi be taken into custody immediately, saying he was guilty of a crime of violence.

Again, the judge disagreed.

“Calling it a crime of violence for this purpose seems to me a strange treatment of language,” Judge Weinstein said, adding that he would not require the defendant to start serving his sentence right away. “It does seem to me to be a form of cruel and unusual punishment and punitive in nature.”

Robert Nardoza, a spokesman for the United States attorney’s office in Brooklyn, said, “An appeal is under consideration by this office.”

During his trial, in 2007, Mr. Polizzi used an insanity defense, saying he had been repeatedly raped as a child and had collected the pornographic pictures not for sexual gratification, but in hopes of finding evidence of his own abuse — claims the prosecution dismissed as implausible. When the first of the images were shown in court, Mr. Polizzi collapsed and was taken to a hospital.

He was eventually convicted of all 12 counts of receiving child pornography and 11 counts of possession.

Then, in a departure from custom, Judge Weinstein asked the jurors if knowing about the mandatory five-year sentence would have changed their views. Some said yes. The judge sentenced Mr. Polizzi to a year in prison for the possession count, then ordered a new trial on the other charges. The Court of Appeals later reversed that order.

On Thursday, Mr. Polizzi made a lengthy statement, sometimes emotional and sometimes rambling. He condemned those who create child pornography and maintained his own innocence. As a youth in Sicily, he said, he disclosed to a priest that he had been abused and was told only to avoid that behavior in the future.

“I cannot live as a normal person,” he said. “I’m not an abuser; I’m a victim.”

A federal prosecutor, Allen Bode, challenged that assertion and said the money that Mr. Polizzi had spent on pornography had subsidized abuse.

“The jury rejected Mr. Polizzi’s claim that his alleged abuse caused him to seek out child pornography,” Mr. Bode said. “He was simply interested in this material.”

I find this article extremely interesting. As much as I abhor child pornography... I have to agree with Judge Weinstein.

Do you agree with Judge Weinstein or not? why?
 
I have been doing some research with the laws here lately... and I have to agree with the Judge.

We've evolved as a society to want to be cruel to our offenders, but forget these cruel intentions never do us any good in general. All we need to do is take 1 peek at Norway. Noway won't extradite people to America because we're not complying with Human Rights movement. Think about that one you folks. *looks at dixie*
 
Dank dungeons, guillotines and torture chambers. Some people want those back. How depressing.
 
Dank dungeons, guillotines and torture chambers. Some people want those back. How depressing.

No, but I also don't want someone committing sexual abuse, or worse, to my children so that they can make a few $$ selling pictures and videos of it to people like this defendant. I don't care if he had a hard life or not, lots of people have hard lives and do not condone the abuse of children (which is what buying child porn is).

It has pretty much been proven that people like him cannot be cured of their "interests" so why take a chance and leave them to roam society, possibly making more victims, ruining more lives? Between that and the dank dungeon, I think I would prefer the dungeon. Besides, jail isn't such a bad place for those convicted of these types of crimes - for the most part, they do not put them in with the general population, because that usually means certain death. Even rapists and murderers look down on pedophiles. No, they go into protected areas, probably with others just like them, where they can sit around and compare their collections of porn, stories, technique, what have you. That doesn't sound so bad, does it? Nah. Now if they really wanted to punish these guys, they would just throw them to the wolves, in with the rest of the prisoners, and let them deal with them. That may be even better than the dungeon, in my opinion.
 
No, but I also don't want someone committing sexual abuse, or worse, to my children so that they can make a few $$ selling pictures and videos of it to people like this defendant. I don't care if he had a hard life or not, lots of people have hard lives and do not condone the abuse of children (which is what buying child porn is).

It has pretty much been proven that people like him cannot be cured of their "interests" so why take a chance and leave them to roam society, possibly making more victims, ruining more lives? Between that and the dank dungeon, I think I would prefer the dungeon. Besides, jail isn't such a bad place for those convicted of these types of crimes - for the most part, they do not put them in with the general population, because that usually means certain death. Even rapists and murderers look down on pedophiles. No, they go into protected areas, probably with others just like them, where they can sit around and compare their collections of porn, stories, technique, what have you. That doesn't sound so bad, does it? Nah. Now if they really wanted to punish these guys, they would just throw them to the wolves, in with the rest of the prisoners, and let them deal with them. That may be even better than the dungeon, in my opinion.

Do you have first-hand knowledge of prison life? Get real.
 
Dank dungeons, guillotines and torture chambers. Some people want those back. How depressing.

Don't forget cheap and chippy choppers......nevermind, I see you included the guillotine. :lol:
 
Before sprouting about recidivism and stating they cannot be "cured," one has to look at the whole picture.

  • People with criminal records have harder time finding jobs
  • People who cannot find jobs are more likely to commit a crime twice
  • People who are unable to find a home are more likely to commit a crime to spend a night in the drunk tank or seek shelter in the penal system
  • Unstable people are likely to re-offend to gain stability in their life again
  • Pedophilia relies on being covert
  • People who are covert, the more often they get away with something, the more it solidify they can do it again, and again
  • We still have no idea why people commit pedophilia

So essentially, we are responsible for our own revolving door.
 
I have been doing some research with the laws here lately... and I have to agree with the Judge.

We've evolved as a society to want to be cruel to our offenders, but forget these cruel intentions never do us any good in general. All we need to do is take 1 peek at Norway. Noway won't extradite people to America because we're not complying with Human Rights movement. Think about that one you folks. *looks at dixie*

WTF? What do I have to with any human rights? Yeah I was a victim of sexual abuse as a child and I believe in tough sentencing coupled with proper counseling and rehabilitation in hopes that the offender does not offend again when he/she is released from incarceration. But at the same time we don't need to baby offenders around claiming we might do them 'harm'. Some aren't even sorry for what they did and they will find a way to go back and do it again. Some are sorry, but only because they got caught. Only a very very few are actually remorseful for what they have done through and through. Those are the ones that usually seek help in some form or way by either turning themselves in when they are caught by a family member or other person. They may have gotten into porn at a very young age and slowly ventured in to child pornography thinking 'one peek won't hurt' but then find themselves hopelessly mesmerized and can't stop.

Yes, I still remain steadfast in my belief in tough sentencing for those who commit crimes involving children as children are defenseless against perpetrators. Just because the guy only viewed the child porn doesn't make him any less innocent than the guy who actually had the child in their care and was forcing the child to perform sex acts and pose in sexual poses naked. When a person buys child porn from a supplier, they enable that supplier to go out and harm a child again and again. The child is still being harmed.

I have to disagree with the judge on this one. The pedo should have been immediately sentenced and jailed and while waiting for a bed at a prison he could be starting counseling and therapy to begin his path to not re-offending again. But because pornography is a weakness for many pedos that is why when they are released they are barred from owning or using a computer so that they cannot even gain access to it. It's like having a recovered alcoholic go to a bar and expect them not to drink when everyone else is drinking and having a good time. Because the computer is often in the privacy of one's home, there's no one there to watch them to make sure they don't go there so they just remove the temptation altogether.

My opinion is tough sentencing with counseling and rehabilitation is the best route to go. We can give these people the best chance possible to not reoffend.
 
I have been doing some research with the laws here lately... and I have to agree with the Judge.

We've evolved as a society to want to be cruel to our offenders, but forget these cruel intentions never do us any good in general. All we need to do is take 1 peek at Norway. Noway won't extradite people to America because we're not complying with Human Rights movement. Think about that one you folks. *looks at dixie*

Make that two of us. It is getting very tiresome the way that we put minor players in these things in jail and let the ones actually responsible for the problem get away scot free.

Same thing with imprisoning a drug user while the cartels keep pumping the drugs in and saying we are doing something to win the war on drugs. Sheer stupidity.
 
Do you have first-hand knowledge of prison life? Get real.

Sure I do. I have a good friend who did a good amount of time, my son's grandfather did 12 years for armed robbery, and an aunt (no blood relation, she was married to my mother's brother before she murdered him in 1980) who gets out on parole next month. Because of her mostly, I have made it my business to know what goes on. I also don't live under a log. What would you like to know?
 
Sure I do. I have a good friend who did a good amount of time, my son's grandfather did 12 years for armed robbery, and an aunt (no blood relation, she was married to my mother's brother before she murdered him in 1980) who gets out on parole next month. Because of her mostly, I have made it my business to know what goes on. I also don't live under a log. What would you like to know?


That's not first-hand knowledge. You haven't been in prison, so how would you really know? I know.
 
If someone is brave enough to fund a study into Pedophilia then we might be able to find an answer but only very few are willing to undertake or fund this sort of study.

As for the sentencing- I dunno if it's justified or not. Either way, he's ended up in jail.
 
WTF? What do I have to with any human rights? Yeah I was a victim of sexual abuse as a child and I believe in tough sentencing coupled with proper counseling and rehabilitation in hopes that the offender does not offend again when he/she is released from incarceration. But at the same time we don't need to baby offenders around claiming we might do them 'harm'. Some aren't even sorry for what they did and they will find a way to go back and do it again. Some are sorry, but only because they got caught. Only a very very few are actually remorseful for what they have done through and through. Those are the ones that usually seek help in some form or way by either turning themselves in when they are caught by a family member or other person. They may have gotten into porn at a very young age and slowly ventured in to child pornography thinking 'one peek won't hurt' but then find themselves hopelessly mesmerized and can't stop.

Yes, I still remain steadfast in my belief in tough sentencing for those who commit crimes involving children as children are defenseless against perpetrators. Just because the guy only viewed the child porn doesn't make him any less innocent than the guy who actually had the child in their care and was forcing the child to perform sex acts and pose in sexual poses naked. When a person buys child porn from a supplier, they enable that supplier to go out and harm a child again and again. The child is still being harmed.

I have to disagree with the judge on this one. The pedo should have been immediately sentenced and jailed and while waiting for a bed at a prison he could be starting counseling and therapy to begin his path to not re-offending again. But because pornography is a weakness for many pedos that is why when they are released they are barred from owning or using a computer so that they cannot even gain access to it. It's like having a recovered alcoholic go to a bar and expect them not to drink when everyone else is drinking and having a good time. Because the computer is often in the privacy of one's home, there's no one there to watch them to make sure they don't go there so they just remove the temptation altogether.

My opinion is tough sentencing with counseling and rehabilitation is the best route to go. We can give these people the best chance possible to not reoffend.

touch-stance approach has failed America for centuries but nobody cares because it's profitable. insanely profitable. our prison system is largely privatized. it's a multi-billion dollars business for corporations.... paid by taxpayers.
 
So how does the cycle end if we keep giving them breaks? He was molested and when and rest assured if he already hasn't done it he will molest a child, then they will repeat the same behavior and it keeps going. And we say oh but have a heart and treat them humanely, well where are the advocates for the kids that get hurt by this behavior? I am not saying throw them in a dungeon but allowing them to be free in society, umm no.

And people wonder why I am on the fence about bringing a child into this world.
 
I agree with the judge - there should be harsher sentences on those who produce child pornography as opposed to those who view it.
 
So how does the cycle end if we keep giving them breaks? He was molested and when and rest assured if he already hasn't done it he will molest a child, then they will repeat the same behavior and it keeps going. And we say oh but have a heart and treat them humanely, well where are the advocates for the kids that get hurt by this behavior? I am not saying throw them in a dungeon but allowing them to be free in society, umm no.

And people wonder why I am on the fence about bringing a child into this world.

It is not a guarantee that someone who was molested becomes the molester in adult life. It increases the risk of it happening, but it in no way is a definate.

There are plenty of advocates for kids that are being sexually abused. The problem is not the kids that have reported it and are getting help, it is the ones who never tell anyone. One cannot advocate for a victim until that victim comes forward.
 
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