class question

[frankiesmom]

ok...i plan on enrolling my husband and myself/children in the sign language 1/2 classes taught by the local deaf community resource thing..but the "deaf education" lady says i should enroll in this class taught by the local community college..she said it was be a fully immersive class with no talking allowed.
which would be better? honestly, i think the latter sounds like it would be next to impossible to learn, even more so for my kids...but i dont want to cheat my little one...so many choices!!! *well, 2 but still!*

 

[dogmom]

for me, I am learning best through immersion, voice-off, taught by DODA - Deaf of Deaf. I took a class taught by hearing man and didn't find that very useful.
Maybe you could visit each one and actually see how is to help you decide?

 

[GrendelQ]

ok...i plan on enrolling my husband and myself/children in the sign language 1/2 classes taught by the local deaf community resource thing..but the "deaf education" lady says i should enroll in this class taught by the local community college..she said it was be a fully immersive class with no talking allowed.
which would be better? honestly, i think the latter sounds like it would be next to impossible to learn, even more so for my kids...but i dont want to cheat my little one...so many choices!!! *well, 2 but still!*

Both! If the local deaf resource thing is something your whole family can attend, exposing you all to an introduction and to the Deaf community, which is going to be very important. You can then try the local community college program, likely something only you and your husband can do, but which will move you more quickly along the learning curve. Full immersion is really the best way to learn a language. Not impossible at all, I started that way with no background in ASL. It was scary, but so much fun.

 

[frankiesmom]

really? hmm..maybe then. all of this is expensive so im trying to find the best solution here. i called our deaf resource place but they havent gotten back to me..ill try again today!

 

[Reba]

First of all, find out which classes the kids can attend. Some classes are adults only.

Secondly, the full immersion classes aren't usually as daunting as you fear. Just because they are voice-off doesn't mean you'll be left to sink or swim. Most teachers use other visual aids, including writing, in addition to signing. The amount of vocabulary is usually added gradually, within natural context.

If you could do both that would be great. Each one offers something unique.

I hope that helps.

 

[CSign]

really? hmm..maybe then. all of this is expensive so im trying to find the best solution here. i called our deaf resource place but they havent gotten back to me..ill try again today!

It can be written in your sons IFSP that the county will provide the family with sign language classes. Individualized Family Service Plan is supposed to be geared to the needs of the family, so that they can provide their children with the appropriate support. So, you don't need to come out of pocket for that.

I agree with the above statements though, going to both classes. One as a family, and the other just the parents so that way your skills can improve and you can be a good language model for your little guy.

 

[Cheetah]

It can be written in your sons IFSP that the county will provide the family with sign language classes. Individualized Family Service Plan is supposed to be geared to the needs of the family, so that they can provide their children with the appropriate support. So, you don't need to come out of pocket for that.

I agree with the above statements though, going to both classes. One as a family, and the other just the parents so that way your skills can improve and you can be a good language model for your little guy.

CSign, that is a really good idea. I hope the county/IFSP is willing to FULLY support the educational needs of the children including educating the family. Too often we forget that raising our children used to be a community responsibility. We need to get back to that philosophy somehow.

 

[AlleyCat]

I would have a concern about starting off with full-immersion classes. Do you have any sign background yet? I am with the others here in that the full-immersion classes are great, really gets you into it and all, but ... to be honest, I have too many friends who started with these at the colleges and they either dropped out or left classes crying. If you have a Deaf teacher who is inflexible (like I've seen!) they will not go out of their way to help much. I've seen it happen too many times. Maybe picking up basic signs at a community class would be an easier way to start, and THEN get yourself into a full-immersion class. Weird, I know, coming from a Deaf (me) person, but if your focus/intent is to just get started communicating with Frankie, it seems the more realistic approach. Sorry if I have offended anyone here, I'm just trying to be honest about what I've seen.

 

[Reba]

I would have a concern about starting off with full-immersion classes. Do you have any sign background yet? I am with the others here in that the full-immersion classes are great, really gets you into it and all, but ... to be honest, I have too many friends who started with these at the colleges and they either dropped out or left classes crying. If you have a Deaf teacher who is inflexible (like I've seen!) they will not go out of their way to help much. I've seen it happen too many times. Maybe picking up basic signs at a community class would be an easier way to start, and THEN get yourself into a full-immersion class. Weird, I know, coming from a Deaf (me) person, but if your focus/intent is to just get started communicating with Frankie, it seems the more realistic approach. Sorry if I have offended anyone here, I'm just trying to be honest about what I've seen.

I guess there's a wide range of kinds of immersion classes and instructors. The classes that I attended for myself, and as an observer, were set up for people who had zero signing experience (at least for the first level of classes). They taught them in a systematic, logical way, following a standard curriculum. The instructors were patient. They added personal anecdotes to make the class interesting.

 

[AlleyCat]

I guess there's a wide range of kinds of immersion classes and instructors. The classes that I attended for myself, and as an observer, were set up for people who had zero signing experience (at least for the first level of classes). They taught them in a systematic, logical way, following a standard curriculum. The instructors were patient. They added personal anecdotes to make the class interesting.

At the community colleges?

Seems like possibly some of the community colleges you are familiar with start off at a more basic level (but I think that isn't what we were talking about here with the full-immersion classes). All the community colleges in my metro area start off pretty hard - you need to have at least a basic level ALREADY before trying to come to the community colleges. That's why we've seen people leave crying (I've sat in on some of the classes because I was asked to) because they don't know even the basic signs so they have NO idea what the teacher is saying and the teachers are not helping. It has felt harsh. My SO is in his ASL classes now and he said if it were not for me having already taught him so much, he would be clueless as to what the teacher is teaching. That was what concerned me for Frankie's mom. Maybe it's different in this area.

 

[CSign]

I guess the most important think is that Frankiesmom finds a class or classes to learn how to sign. Her son is (14 months?) and the time for language is now. I would hope that the teacher would be sensitive to the needs of the class. That, I suppose is the difference between a decent teacher and a great teacher.

 

[Reba]

At the community colleges?

At a two-year technical college, and at Deaf-sponsored community classes. They use the same curriculum. The difference is location, and that the college class students are tested for grades, and are graded for their assignments. The instructors have either been Deaf or hearing CODA's.

Seems like possibly some of the community colleges you are familiar with start off at a more basic level (but I think that isn't what we were talking about here with the full-immersion classes).

Everyone has to start at the beginning. They use the Signing Naturally series.

The first four levels are not applicable to an ITP. Interpreter students can't take those classes for credit towards an ITP. They must already be beyond that level before they enter an ITP. The Signing Naturally classes are for people who major in special ed, have deaf family members, or just have an interest in sign language. Some students do go on to an ITP later.

The college also offers the same course as a continuing ed non-credit class, much the way the local Deaf community organization does. The main difference is a 200-mile round trip commute.

All the community colleges in my metro area (St.Paul/Mpls) start off pretty hard - you need to have at least a basic level ALREADY before trying to come to the community colleges. That's why we've seen people leave crying (I've sat in on some of the classes because I was asked to) because they don't know even the basic signs so they have NO idea what the teacher is saying and the teachers are not helping. It has felt harsh. My SO is in his ASL classes now and he said if it were not for me having already taught him so much, he would be clueless as to what the teacher is teaching. That was what concerned me for Frankie's mom. Maybe it's different in this area.

Well, then those classes shouldn't be advertised or in the catalog as Level I classes. If people are expected to already know sign language before entering those classes, then that should be listed as a pre-requisite in the course catalog. Something's wrong there.

 

[AlleyCat]

Well, then those classes shouldn't be advertised or in the catalog as Level I classes. If people are expected to already know sign language before entering those classes, then that should be listed as a pre-requisite in the course catalog. Something's wrong there.

I totally agree. Many of the students my SO was taking classes with were parents of deaf children, etc. They should've been forewarned that they needed more than knowing nothing. They're the ones that got up and left. I still remember the poor mom crying after she failed yet another quiz because she hadn't understood the teacher. (That one I didn't sit on in, but my SO told me about.) And a father, he must've been about 60 based on my SO's description -- he had a daughter about my age and their relationship had become so distant because they were not communicating -- he couldn't understand the teacher either. The teacher actually asked my SO, who is hearing, to relay to HIM (the dad) to either buck up or she'd fail him. So anyway, if knowing sign language was listed as a pre-requisite, maybe these specific people would not have enrolled.. Sorry -- I am not trying to share horror stories. I just don't want Frankie's mom to get underwater. Maybe a good lesson here is to carefully read the syllabus (if one is available) before enrolling in a class.

 

[Reba]

... Maybe a good lesson here is to carefully read the syllabus (if one is available) before enrolling in a class.

Yes, that and the catalog description, especially for pre- and co-requisites. It's a good idea to talk to the department head or instructor before registering, too.

 

[sallylou]

Wirelessly posted (droid)

I went the full immersion at the Deaf center. Classes taught by a Deaf person, events and socials. It's the fastest way to learn and the cheapest. You'll have no trouble doing it. The main requirement is a good sense of humor.
It's really important to socialize so that you can develop receptive skills. You don't get that from a class.
I'm around if you want to practice sometime.

 

[jillio]

I would have a concern about starting off with full-immersion classes. Do you have any sign background yet? I am with the others here in that the full-immersion classes are great, really gets you into it and all, but ... to be honest, I have too many friends who started with these at the colleges and they either dropped out or left classes crying. If you have a Deaf teacher who is inflexible (like I've seen!) they will not go out of their way to help much. I've seen it happen too many times. Maybe picking up basic signs at a community class would be an easier way to start, and THEN get yourself into a full-immersion class. Weird, I know, coming from a Deaf (me) person, but if your focus/intent is to just get started communicating with Frankie, it seems the more realistic approach. Sorry if I have offended anyone here, I'm just trying to be honest about what I've seen.

These are valid concerns, much more for the adults than for the children, actually. I have seen the case where adults can become overwhelmed with full immersion in the beginning, and as a consequence, become frustrated, say "This is just too hard" and drop out.

 

[jillio]

Yes, that and the catalog description, especially for pre- and co-requisites. It's a good idea to talk to the department head or instructor before registering, too.

And to meet with the professor prior to first class meeting so the prof will know what your specific needs are in learning ASL. They are quite often more willing to provide extra help for the hearing parent with a young deaf child.

 

[frankiesmom]

i personally feel that kids in general are really good at picking up stuff like that more so than adults..but early intervention sucks and they wont do a thing! honestly, after today, i am not so sure this school is going to work..she had a doctors note in her hand, stating that he CANNOT eat solids, and she was going on about how they are going to push him to be at his proper age, and its not going to happen that easy. we were explaining how he cant drink from a bottle sitting up and she rolled her eyes and said "cant or wont?" and then looked at him and said "little boy, you are going to face many new challenges here"...i guess shes not comprehending that he simply does not know how to do this stuff yet.

 

[frankiesmom]

and she also said that we can send his bottle but they are going to give him a sippy cup..he cant even feed himself, and she also had that in her hand too..i have just never met someone who glossed over medical records this much. i hope this isnt normal!

 

[deafskeptic]

i personally feel that kids in general are really good at picking up stuff like that more so than adults..but early intervention sucks and they wont do a thing! honestly, after today, i am not so sure this school is going to work..she had a doctors note in her hand, stating that he CANNOT eat solids, and she was going on about how they are going to push him to be at his proper age, and its not going to happen that easy. we were explaining how he cant drink from a bottle sitting up and she rolled her eyes and said "cant or wont?" and then looked at him and said "little boy, you are going to face many new challenges here"...i guess shes not comprehending that he simply does not know how to do this stuff yet.

All I can say is oi vey. I see problems down the road.