Gift-Givers and Bug-Chasers

Malfoyish

Malfoyish

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Hello, all...

I was watching something on Showtime a few nights ago while battling an episode of stomach upset...by the time it was over, I do have to cop to feeling a bit more agitated. I don't know the name of the program, but it was a documentary of some sort...dealing with Gift-Givers and Bug-Chasers.

For those of you who don't know what these are - it has nothing to do with little boys with butterfly nets or exchanging brightly colored, wrapped Christmas presents. NOTHING at all.

A bug-chaser is an HIV-negative individual, in most cases, a gay male. The bug-chaser will desire only to become infected with the HIV virus, and the male being interviewed was saying that his reason for it is - to eliminate the question as to whether he has it or does not have the HIV virus. It somehow gives the bug-chaser peace of mind - they do not fear death, or AIDS or other health complications that would result from becoming infected.

The bug-chaser usually throws a party, sends out advertisements asking for HIV+ gay males, who would be called "gift-givers," to show up - there is much "bareback" sex. The bug-chaser's goal is to be infected by the end of the evening by one of the gift-givers.

There was also an interview with another former bug-chaser, who is now infected...he regrets his actions, and wishes that he hadn't knowingly infected himself with the virus. They had contradicting viewpoints...and a lot was said about respect for one's partner, etc...how some gay men become abstinent for fear of infecting their loved ones...and some other HIV+ gay males become paranoid and isolate themselves so that they're not able to get emotionally or physically close to another.

What are your thoughts on this, everyone?

Personally, I think it's all crazy...but I don't know...who am I to judge another person's way of thinking, especially when they may believe themselves to be right in doing so? It just seems so suicidal and FOOLISH to do something of that nature...IMO, there are ways of protecting oneself from contracting the HIV virus - condoms, condoms, condoms...not to say they are 100 percent effective, but still...!!! Why take the risk? Such a permanent risk, too? There is much I do NOT understand about this...

Discuss!!! ;)
 
IMHO, this is incredibly appalling because I have several close GLBT friends. They all are either in monogamous relationships or civil union marriages. The fact that a bug chaser desires to go out and infect himself sickens me. To go as far to advertise for this, it really scares me because we do not really know what the bug chaser's state of mind really is like. What if the bug chaser has been abandonded by his family and thinks this "new" approach is his new family?

Will his "new" family be there for him when he is ill and dying, in need of help to hold his head when he is sweating buckets from pneumonia and will his new-found family be able to pay his medicine? Will the Gift-Givers be around long enough to hold the Bug-Chasers and soothe them with words and say "I'm sorry, I infected you with this but you wanted this gift."

My words may sound jugmental but I love my close gay friends like they are my brothers, this particular thread strikes a chord with me and I truly thank you Malfoyish for posting this. It's quite a heaven-sent, actually because AIDS and homophobia has always been a cause I speak with such passion.

People are human beings but to willingly go out and infect yourself with such a disease when one knows you will suffer a lot, I couldn't bear to see a person suffer so much. :tears:

Thank you so much, Malfoyish. :hug:
 
Whoa, I would have liked watching that show. I cannot fathom how nor why a HIV-negative person would want to become HIV-positive and go through a lifetime of health consequences. You are right, Malfoyish, it is not our place to judge anyone, but come on, it goes against logic. I cannot grasp this concept at all, and don't know why on earth would anyone want to become HIV-positive. It seems to me that some gay men like to go through different sexual partners and as a consequence, they end up worrying if they get HIV or not. I don't think it is a healthy approach to be HIV-positive in order to not worry about it anymore. I am in a wonderful relationship, and I think it is important to remain HIV-negative so that both of us can share a wonderful, rewarding life together.
 
Sorry to be off topic here for a sec; this sorta reminds me of some deaf couples who research, etc and procreate for the singular purpose of bearing a deaf child.
 
I'd be concerned about the state of mind of those who chase "bugs" and those who are too willing to "give" that more than one's sexual orientation and desire to procreate.
 
Liza said:
I'd be concerned about the state of mind of those who chase "bugs" and those who are too willing to "give" that more than one's sexual orientation and desire to procreate.
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:werd:

This is, by far, the craziest thing I've ever heard of. I can't fathom why anyone would want to do this.
 
Sadly, this has been happening for several years.

In many states (if not all) it is against the law to knowingly infect someone with HIV.

It is not just a "private" activity. The financial cost of this reckless behavior increases everyone's medical bills. HIV/AIDS treatment is very expensive and long term.
 
Tousi said:
Sorry to be off topic here for a sec; this sorta reminds me of some deaf couples who research, etc and procreate for the singular purpose of bearing a deaf child.
Click to expand...

I cannot see the revelance between a Deaf couple researching and procreating for the purpose to bear a Deaf child with this issue of infecting oneself with a sad disease that robs you of your life in the long run, you do suffer first before you die. Can you please explain what does Deafness have to do with HIV/AIDS? :ugh:
 
Little more information - including that of the film itself - thought some of you might be interested.

Why do people participate in bug parties?

Many psychologists theorize that participation in bug parties is actually an anxiety disorder where the non-infected individuals fear getting HIV so greatly that they would rather contract it and free themselves of the anxiety of living in fear. These parties are also seen as a sort of club for those living with HIV. Infecting a HIV negative and willing participant initiates them into their world. Some people also engage in unprotected anal sex (or barebacking) as the fear for AIDS dangerously dwindles.

"The Gift" from filmmaker Louise Hogarth is a documentary about gay men who purposely contract HIV. According to Rolling Stone, one character in the film admits "I was relieved. I didn't have to worry. Do I need to be careful -- not any more." Yet another willing 21-year-old regrets his choice. "I've made a terrible mistake and there's no fixing that. There is no benefit in this and that's what needs to be said."
 
Malfoyish is quite correct about barebacking and bug parties.

It is because of her thread, I've spent most of the evening googling it up and I still cannot fathom the magnitude of the carelessness of one's choice. However I cannot judge a person because I am not walking in that person's shoes. I do not know the person's lifestyle and how they lived their life. I can only support that person and offer a shoulder or a hug.

Barebacking in the Gay Community

The term barebacking generally refers to gay men engaging in unprotected anal intercourse. Barebacking has both its benefits and its drawbacks:

The drawbacks of barebacking:

1. If you bareback with a person who is infected with HIV or another STD (even if they do not have any noticeable symptoms), you can become infected and get sick from these diseases. Getting sick from AIDS and other STDs is not a pleasant experience!

2. If you bareback with a person who is infected with HIV or another potentially fatal STD (such as hepatitis B), you can die from these diseases.

3. If you are infected with HIV or another STD, and you bareback, you can infect other people (including those you care the most about, such as your lover and your friends).

Why do gay men bareback, despite the possible risks? There are many reasons for this, including:

1. Some men no longer fear AIDS. Some men think that if you just take a few pills everyday (taking antiviral cocktails), AIDS is not a problem, it is fully manageable, and it is easy to live with. But talk to many people who have HIV/AIDS and they will tell you a very different story!

2. Some men live only for today, and don't think about the future. Some men think that they need to do everything they can in their life now, since they don't expect to live very long.

3. Some men are dealing with low self-esteem issues. They don't think that their health, or their life, is worth protecting. Low self-esteem is common in the gay community, and is often related to the way that society treats gay men.

4. For some men, they believe that "if it feels good, do it." Some men are willing to take their chances, and the consequences.

5. Some men who are already HIV positive think that they no longer need to use condoms, and are unaware of the health consequences of HIV reinfection and the risks of other STDs.

6. Some men are in denial that they will ever get infected.

7. Some men simply enjoy barebacking better, and think that barebacking is worth the risk. Some men prefer the "skin-to-skin contact," regardless of the risk.

8. Some men simply hate using condoms. Men complain about condoms giving them less sensation, and they also complain that they are more likely to lose their erections while using condoms. Some men also find putting on condoms to be a hassle. A common complaint is that condoms interfere with sex play.

9. Some men hear that "everyone else" is barebacking these days, so they are willing to do it too.

10. When someone is drunk or high on drugs, they are more likely to bareback. The overall rates of drug and alcohol use (and abuse) are high in the gay community.

11. Some men are totally unaware of the risks of STDs other than AIDS. Although a lot of effort had previously been taken to educate gay men about AIDS, almost no effort has been made to educate gay men about other STDs. Besides HIV, other STDs that can be transmitted through barebacking include gonorrhea, hepatitis B, hepatitis C, genital/anal warts, herpes, syphilis and others. Some of these STDs are incurable (like herpes and genital/anal warts), and some are potentially fatal (like hepatitis B and hepatitis C).

12. Some men are so sick of hearing about AIDS, that they just ignore the whole issue, and do not care about it anymore.

13. For some men, if their partner does not bring up the subject of HIV or other STDs, they will just assume that their partner is not infected, and that barebacking would be safe. Some men think that, "if he were positive, he would tell me." This is a dangerous assumption to make, since some men with HIV, or other STDs, will not tell their partner ahead of time that they are infected. This is often due to the fear of rejection, embarrassment, denial, and other reasons.

14. Some men are more likely to bareback with their lovers, or other guys they personally know. Barebacking is used as a way to show intimacy, sharing, and caring between men. The exchange of semen is seen as a way to emotionally bind two men together. Condoms are sometimes seen as a barrier to intimacy.

15. If a man is not worried about getting HIV, chances are very good he isn't worried about getting other STDs either.

16. Some men get caught up in the "heat of the moment" and end up having unprotected sex, even though they weren't planning to bareback. Sometimes once a mangets in the mood, his sexual desires overtake his rational thinking.

17. Some men will bareback as long as they are the top partner. There is a common myth that only the bottom partner can get infected during anal intercourse, and that it's safe to bareback as the top partner. This is not true. In reality, when having intercourse with a person who has HIV or another STD, the top partner is at high risk, and the bottom partner is at even higher risk. Note that neither partner is at low risk of infection.

18. In young gay men specifically, they have not experienced the loss, devastation, and death of their lovers and friends (caused by AIDS), that many older gay men have endured. Therefore, younger gay men are less scared of AIDS, and therefore, are less likely to protect themselves from infection.

19. Even among older gay men, safer sex rates are starting to decrease, and barebacking is on the increase. This is because, realistically, it's difficult for men to use condoms every time they have sex with every partner over a prolonged period of time (months, years, or even a lifetime). Telling a man to use condoms with every single partner, every single time he has sex, for the rest of his life, is a major challenge (and for some men, a very unrealistic goal). Unless there is ongoing education and intervention, it is not surprising if men use condoms less and less as time goes on.

20. It has been suggested that barebacking is a form of rebellion. Gay men hear over and over that they "have to" use condoms. For some men, barebacking is their way of rebelling against "the establishment" telling them what they can, and cannot do.

21. A guy may bareback if his partner tells him that he has tested negative for HIV. But this does not necessarily mean that barebacking is safe. First of all, since it can take up to six months to show positive on an HIV test, a negative test does not always mean that a person is not infected (if they got tested before six months). Also, if a guy who has tested HIV negative has put himself at risk again (even one time), his negative test result would no longer be valid, and he would need to be tested all over again. In addition, some men who have not been tested recently (or who have never been tested at all) will tell other men that they tested negative, as a way to get other guys to bareback with them (in other words, some men are claiming to be HIV negative as a "pick-up line"). Finally, even if a guy is not infected with HIV, he may still be infected with other STDs. Barebacking would only be safe if a man tests negative for both HIV and other STDs, six months or more after his last possible exposure to these diseases.

22. There are even a small number of men who are purposely going out to get themselves infected with HIV. These men are known as "bug chasers" (see below).

Although much less common, there are some HIV-negative men who willingly bareback with other men who they know are HIV positive (even when they know the risks). There are many reasons for this including:

1. Some men like to "live life on the edge," and get pleasure out of taking their chances. You can say that these men are "sexual daredevils."

2. If a guys boyfriend is HIV positive, he is sometimes willing to bareback with his boyfriend as a way of showing his love, even though he knows that he can become infected himself.

3. Some men do not mind getting infected, as long as they get infected only from their boyfriend. They see HIV as a special way to further bond their relationship with their lover.

4. Positive men often have their own social circles and friendships. Some men allow themselves to get infected in order to get into these social circles. Being positive can give some men a "sense of belonging." Some HIV negative men have also commented that "people with HIV get all the attention, so why am I missing out?"

5. Being positive sometimes brings with it an increase in social services and benefits (housing, food, public assistance, etc.). A person who is HIV positive sometimes qualifies for more social services than someone who is not infected.

6. Some men simply do not care whether they get infected or not.

7. Some men think that if they get infected, they will no longer need to use condoms (not knowing about the problems associated with HIV reinfection, or other STDs).

8. Some gay men are fatalistic. Some of them think that getting HIV is inevitable, so they do not try to avoid it. Some men feel that trying to stay HIV negative is too stressful, and ultimately allow themselves to get infected in order to "just get it over with." There are even some men who think that AIDS is "just part of being gay."
Click to expand...

http://www.thebody.com/sowadsky/barebacking.html
 
*shakes head* This is just so DUMB.....some gay guys are just mindless hedonists....anyone who knowingly willingly spreads HIV should be locked up in a mental insistuion for LIFE!
 
deafdyke said:
*shakes head* This is just so DUMB.....some gay guys are just mindless hedonists....anyone who knowingly willingly spreads HIV should be locked up in a mental insistuion for LIFE!
Click to expand...

Before you judge some gay men and label them as mindless hedonists, how would you appreciate the label that some of the gay men label you as mindless hedonists based on your sexual orientation as a lesbian? Like I mentioned in my previous post in this thread, I cannot judge a person because I'd have to walk a mile in that person's shoes. We do not know that person's state of mind.
 
Cookie Monster said:
Malfoyish is quite correct about barebacking and bug parties.

It is because of her thread, I've spent most of the evening googling it up and I still cannot fathom the magnitude of the carelessness of one's choice. However I cannot judge a person because I am not walking in that person's shoes. I do not know the person's lifestyle and how they lived their life. I can only support that person and offer a shoulder or a hug.



http://www.thebody.com/sowadsky/barebacking.html
Click to expand...

I'm not attacking you Cookie Monster, but why be so concerned about the idiot who goes out and knowingly gets themselves infected with HIV? The person who does this is just plain nuts, and if the rest of us thinks that about that person, so be it. They deserve what may be coming to them and I have absolutely no desire to hold back my judgment of it.

This kind of behavior is just unfathomable, and the people who do this need to log some long hours with a therapist to figure out what drives them to want to destroy themselves way!
 
Cookie Monster said:
Before you judge some gay men and label them as mindless hedonists, how would you appreciate the label that some of the gay men label you as mindless hedonists based on your sexual orientation as a lesbian? Like I mentioned in my previous post in this thread, I cannot judge a person because I'd have to walk a mile in that person's shoes. We do not know that person's state of mind.
Click to expand...

This is true, but you have to admit, CM. A person who does this must be out of their mind.

No?
 
Malfoyish said:
Little more information - including that of the film itself - thought some of you might be interested.

Why do people participate in bug parties?

Many psychologists theorize that participation in bug parties is actually an anxiety disorder where the non-infected individuals fear getting HIV so greatly that they would rather contract it and free themselves of the anxiety of living in fear. These parties are also seen as a sort of club for those living with HIV. Infecting a HIV negative and willing participant initiates them into their world. Some people also engage in unprotected anal sex (or barebacking) as the fear for AIDS dangerously dwindles.

"The Gift" from filmmaker Louise Hogarth is a documentary about gay men who purposely contract HIV. According to Rolling Stone, one character in the film admits "I was relieved. I didn't have to worry. Do I need to be careful -- not any more." Yet another willing 21-year-old regrets his choice. "I've made a terrible mistake and there's no fixing that. There is no benefit in this and that's what needs to be said."
Click to expand...

Thanks for the additional info, Malfy. You helped to solidify for me my position on this. People who engage in this behavior are just plain out nuts!
 
OB, maybe it is because I care for humanity so much, I feel the need to speak out about such issues like this. Humanity does need a voice and a heart. We cannot always be jaded about such issues and like I mentioned, we do not know the frame of minds of those people.
 
Cookie Monster said:
OB, maybe it is because I care for humanity so much, I feel the need to speak out about such issues like this. Humanity does need a voice and a heart. We cannot always be jaded about such issues and like I mentioned, we do not know the frame of minds of those people.
Click to expand...

Touche'. But, I admit to being jaded towards society, and I guess, life in general. Very jaded. I just can't fathom a rational scenerio for something like this. It boggles my mind.
 
I don't have sympathy for people who want to spread disease, any kind of disease. That increases the chance that innocent people will catch the disease. That increases the strain on medical resources. That increases the costs of medical care. That increases the suffering of the sick person's family and friends.

I care more about innocent "people" than self-destructive and self-centered "humanity".

If that is "judging", well, so be it.
 
The LA-Jacks are full of bug chasers. One of my fundraisers whos a member gave me a tour of the place where they do the parties. Its really a place to spread the bugs around. And they meet 2 times a month and interestingly the neighbors never complain even there's like 50-90 guys going at it with each other.

Richard
 
To answer someone's reply to my off-topic comment....a lukewarm quip, actually: the commonality between the two groups that I can think of at the moment is their stupidity.
 
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