World Comparison

[Jiro]

If the criminals are still obtaining illegal guns through the black market, how do you propose to solve this problem?

enable law-abiding citizens to have a protection for themselves! The deaths occurred because the innocent people cannot defend themselves. I cannot even use a pepper spray in NYC!!!!

 

[shel90]

That's the very basic highlight of it. I'll repost the summary of proposed changes -



in other word - a tricky balance between individual privacy and public safety. This is not just about gun crimes. This is about SCHOOL SHOOTINGS.

The information is available to the school authorities. They are the ones who need to ensure the safety of the schools. The public has no right to the information..what if something is in one child's file and the public uses it against the child in an irresponsible way? I can just see parents using other people's children's private information just to be nosey rather than for public safety. I see too many problems with this.

 

[shel90]

enable law-abiding citizens to have a protection for themselves! The deaths occurred because the innocent people cannot defend themselves. I cannot even use a pepper spray in NYC!!!!

Even if law abiding citizens have guns in their houses, there is no guarantee of protection cuz criminals have the advantage of having the element of surprise. The problem lies with nobody knowing when and where the criminals will attack.

Do u suggest law-abiding citizens pull out their firearms and start shooting at a criminal as soon as they see a crime being committed?

 

[Foxrac]

Jiro, I think I know why there is this argument in the first place. I think it is that guns are capable of killing many people just from one time use while other weapons, u cant. Yes, if we ban guns , murderers will still find a way to kill but if the gangs dont have guns, the number of innocent killings would probably go down as it would be harder to kill as many at once with a knife.

That's probably why there is this argument about guns being banned and etc.

If guns are banned then gangs still can get guns from black market, ban on guns are not effective and violation of 2nd Amendment.

If guns are banned then black market would become bigger, bigger businesses.

 

[Mrs Bucket]

Has anyone ever thought about socialism and capitalism being responsible for the role of guns in society?

 

[shel90]

If guns are banned then gangs still can get guns from black market, ban on guns are not effective and violation of 2nd Amendment.

If guns are banned then black market would become bigger, bigger businesses.

I understand that...I was stating to why people argue about gun restrictions/gun banning.

 

[Jiro]

The second paragraph tying it to post #38.

In other thread - Jillio posted a statement that the gun-related deaths are on the rise by a mile as compared to past. One cannot simply make a CONCLUSIVE CORRELATION that the gun regulation (tough or lax) contributed to low/high # of gun-related crimes - which I provided a source with substantial qualification and weight that disputed such statement.

It is just my logical thought that one of the reasons for low gun-related deaths in the past is because of compulsory military service. Switzerland has a compulsory military service and has a huge gun awareness program. That most likely contributed to its low gun-related crime statistic. Of course - there are several other factors.

 

[shel90]

Has anyone ever thought about socialism and capitalism being responsible for the role of guns in society?

Meaning that crime is rising due to decaying capitalism in which the top criminals feed drugs to the poor communities hence the need for illegal guns?

 

[shel90]

In other thread - Jillio posted a statement that the gun-related deaths are on the rise by a mile as compared to past. One cannot simply make a CONCLUSIVE CORRELATION that the gun regulation (tough or lax) contributed to low/high # of gun-related crimes - which I provided a source with substantial qualification and weight that disputed such statement.

It is just my logical thought that one of the reasons for low gun-related deaths in the past is because of compulsory military service. Switzerland has a compulsory military service and has a huge gun awareness program. That most likely contributed to its low gun-related crime statistic. Of course - there are several other factors.

Does Switzerland have a high unemployment rate? I think there is a correlation to high unemployment and gun-related crimes. I have noticed a rise in gun-related crimes in my area since the recession and what's ironic, half of the guns were owned legally by the people committing these crimes. These people had never had a record before but I think due to the economic crisis, they are resorting to using their legal firearms to commit crimes against other people. Just my opinion.

 

[jillio]

Isnt HIPAA related to Health Information Privacy? That's about the safety of patients. What does it have to do with the number of gun-related shootings/deaths in the USA?

FERPA is related to schools and education.

Exactly. These are two legislations by which I am professionally bound. They have absolutely nothing to do with gun deaths.

 

[jillio]

In other thread - Jillio posted a statement that the gun-related deaths are on the rise by a mile as compared to past. One cannot simply make a CONCLUSIVE CORRELATION that the gun regulation (tough or lax) contributed to low/high # of gun-related crimes - which I provided a source with substantial qualification and weight that disputed such statement.

It is just my logical thought that one of the reasons for low gun-related deaths in the past is because of compulsory military service. Switzerland has a compulsory military service and has a huge gun awareness program. That most likely contributed to its low gun-related crime statistic. Of course - there are several other factors.

The numbers speak for themselves. You are attempting to produce cause and effect through correlation. It cannot be done. All that is shown through correlation is that two things are connected in some way, not a cause and effect relationship.

 

[jillio]

I have already pointed you to source. If you have a problem with it - tell that to U.S. Department of Education, Supreme Court or whoever.

Good Luck!


:facepalm:

Again - there are many causes for gun deaths. Mental Illness is one of them. Suicide, remember? Again - we are not merely talking about numbers. We are also talking about gun control law as stated in OP's post.

Do you have any suggestion? I have repeatedly asked you that and you have yet to offer any.

Then, please, apply your theoretical explanation for such.

In regard to the HIPAA and FERPA legislations, these are two of the legislations by which I am professionally bound. I have a full understanding of both their intent and their application.

 

[Jiro]

The information is available to the school authorities. They are the ones who need to ensure the safety of the schools. The public has no right to the information..what if something is in one child's file and the public uses it against the child in an irresponsible way? I can just see parents using other people's children's private information just to be nosey rather than for public safety. I see too many problems with this.

That's why I said this is a tricky balance between individual privacy and public safety. Mind you - this is not about sharing general private info to public.... just a potential confidential information to government that is the matter of public safety.

 

[shel90]

In other thread - Jillio posted a statement that the gun-related deaths are on the rise by a mile as compared to past. One cannot simply make a CONCLUSIVE CORRELATION that the gun regulation (tough or lax) contributed to low/high # of gun-related crimes - which I provided a source with substantial qualification and weight that disputed such statement.

It is just my logical thought that one of the reasons for low gun-related deaths in the past is because of compulsory military service. Switzerland has a compulsory military service and has a huge gun awareness program. That most likely contributed to its low gun-related crime statistic. Of course - there are several other factors.

So you are saying that if every U.S. male should be required to serve in the military, there would be less need for committing crimes therefore leading to less deaths by gunfire?

 

[jillio]

That's why I said this is a tricky balance between individual privacy and public safety. Mind you - this is not about sharing general private info to public.... just a potential confidential information to government that is the matter of public safety.

And that is already provided for under law, and is known as "The Duty to Warn."

How exactly would you apply one of the theories of criminology and sociology to find that balance?

 

[Jiro]

The numbers speak for themselves. You are attempting to produce cause and effect through correlation. It cannot be done. All that is shown through correlation is that two things are connected in some way, not a cause and effect relationship.

and 2 experts with substantial background & qualifications have already disproved such correlation. I've given you the link to their publication and you have said that you're not going to bother reading it.

This discussion on this issue is over because it's being repeated and repeated - which leads to locked thread. To continue this farce - I'll assume one's intention is to get this thread locked.

 

[jillio]

So you are saying that if every U.S. male should be required to serve in the military, there would be less need for committing crimes therefore leading to less deaths by gunfire?

Checked out some of the crimes being committed in the military? I don't think that is a viable solution.

 

[jillio]

and 2 experts with substantial background & qualifications have already disproved such correlation. I've given you the link to their publication and you have said that you're not going to bother reading it.

This discussion on this issue is over because it's being repeated and repeated - which leads to locked thread. To continue this farce - I'll assume one's intention is to get this thread locked.

Read again. They did not even address correlation.

 

[Jiro]

Does Switzerland have a high unemployment rate? I think there is a correlation to high unemployment and gun-related crimes. I have noticed a rise in gun-related crimes in my area since the recession and what's ironic, half of the guns were owned legally by the people committing these crimes. These people had never had a record before but I think due to the economic crisis, they are resorting to using their legal firearms to commit crimes against other people. Just my opinion.

if there's a conclusive correlation between high unemployment rate and gun-related crimes... then the statistic will be high in Switzerland, right? That's why it's inconclusive to make such statement.

but yes people will do desperate thing. in the time of recession, people with legal guns would rob a bank or whatever. But then - at least you have a gun for yourself to protect against them. At least you won't become a number in gun-related crime statistic.

 

[shel90]

I think there is no solution to the illegal gun black market.

However, I have seen that crimes are committed because people want something. Now, if we can address the root of the problems, then we could tackle the problem of gun-related deaths.