Signing songs

[Mrman]

I have to sign a song for ASL class. I have to pick by Friday and I don't know what to do. Most of the music I like has vocals that are hard to understand so I can't do them.

Also, do you like people to interpret the metaphors and such? I would think it takes your own power away to interpret what a song really means if someone does it for you.

 

[Island Rose]

Hi Mrman! First, I'd like to say that I'm hearing, but I'll give you my thoughts for whatever they're worth. I think you should choose a song that is meaningful to you - or one that you simply feel would be fun to sign!

If you are signing for the enjoyment of ASL speakers, I would interpret the metaphors as they may not cross over well in their literal form. (Again - I'm not a native ASL speaker, so please anyone reading this who is, feel free to chime in if this does not sound right to you). One of the things that I find so wonderful about songs interpreted in *true* ASL, is that they are each unique and paint such a powerful picture...they really sweep you away and you become lost in the world of the signer for those few minutes. So, on that note - don't be afraid to come up with your own personal interpretation.

Good Luck!

p.s. I think it would be great it you posted your video on youtube and shared the link here. You couldn't ask for a better group of people to provide feedback.

 

[Anij]

Wirelessly posted (Blackberry Bold )

I'm guessing this teacher's Hearing ?

 

[Reba]

I have to sign a song for ASL class. I have to pick by Friday and I don't know what to do. Most of the music I like has vocals that are hard to understand so I can't do them.

You can always go to one of the lyrics websites and print out the lyrics so you have something to work from.

Also, do you like people to interpret the metaphors and such? I would think it takes your own power away to interpret what a song really means if someone does it for you.

I'm hearing, so I can't answer that. I can say, if this is just a required class assignment and the song choice is up to you, don't pick a song that is difficult to interpret. Problem solved.

 

[Anij]

I've never understood why an ASL teacher would ask for a student to interpret a SONG (unless it's opera - which is a grammatically correct story) of all bizarre things????

Song lyrics - espeically pop/rock/contemporary - don't make sense half the time in English (poor grammar, lousy imagery, full of slang), let alone trying to pull manipulating them into having meaning in ASL.

I can understand being asked to pick a short poem (or section of poem) and give an "ASL interpretation" of the poem (which is about using classifiers, creating emotion, using expression etc ), but students being asked to make a song into ASL is - IMHO - the sign of a teacher who lacks the creatively to a more appropriate lesson.

My classes (way back when) consisted of a LOT of "tell a story in ASL" type lessons ... we either had to tell a required story (pick one of 3 options) or we had to make up a story about something that happened/could happen in our lives.

I really think students learn FAR more doing exercises like these than they ever could from songs.

 

[Reba]

I've never understood why an ASL teacher would ask for a student to interpret a SONG (unless it's opera - which is a grammatically correct story) of all bizarre things????

For teaching the language of ASL, I see no reason to do songs. At the level of interpreter training, then yes, there is some value. But not for simply learning the language.

Song lyrics - espeically pop/rock/contemporary - don't make sense half the time in English (poor grammar, lousy imagery, full of slang), let alone trying to pull manipulating them into having meaning in ASL.

For some reason, beginning hearing signers "love" signing songs. For interpreters (not the theater specialists), signing songs can be a nightmare experience (especially if done with no preparation time).

I can understand being asked to pick a short poem (or section of poem) and give an "ASL interpretation" of the poem (which is about using classifiers, creating emotion, using expression etc ), but students being asked to make a song into ASL is - IMHO - the sign of a teacher who lacks the creatively to a more appropriate lesson.

My classes (way back when) consisted of a LOT of "tell a story in ASL" type lessons ... we either had to tell a required story (pick one of 3 options) or we had to make up a story about something that happened/could happen in our lives.

I really think students learn FAR more doing exercises like these than they ever could from songs.

Yes, learning how to tell ASL stories is much more appropriate, linguistically and culturally. Recall past deaf social events and think about how many times you signed a song compared to how many times you signed a story. Yep.

 

[Mrman]

I'm not concern with why I have to sign it, I just do and I don't mind doing it.

The reason I can't do metal/hardcore is because the teacher won't be able to understand the words. He won't be able to hear the words and understand how I interpreted it in sign.

I think I can do a poem or short story instead. I'd rather do a poem especially since I've written a bunch and I won't have to interpret anything since it's mine.

 

[Reba]

I'm not concern with why I have to sign it, I just do and I don't mind doing it.

The reason I can't do metal/hardcore is because the teacher won't be able to understand the words. He won't be able to hear the words and understand how I interpreted it in sign.

Well, if you were signing a song to a deaf person, I assume that person wouldn't be able to hear the words either.

Regardless, as I posted, you can print out the lyrics for you to use, and for your teacher to follow along with. In fact, I would expect your teacher to want a copy of the lyrics for grading purposes, regardless of the music genre. Oh, well.

I think I can do a poem or short story instead. I'd rather do a poem especially since I've written a bunch and I won't have to interpret anything since it's mine.

If that satisfies your teacher, then there is nothing more I can say about it.

 

[Mrman]

He does want a copy for 1) see if it's appropriate 2) see how I translated but I don't think it's really to follow along since it's hard to read and watch someone sign at the same time.

Since it's for the class to watch also, I would be the only person that could understand the words. People tend to think that genre is "bad" because it sounds like they are mad and whatever.

 

[Reba]

He does want a copy for 1) see if it's appropriate 2) see how I translated but I don't think it's really to follow along since it's hard to read and watch someone sign at the same time.

Since it's for the class to watch also, I would be the only person that could understand the words. People tend to think that genre is "bad" because it sounds like they are mad and whatever.

Guess what? The hearing interpreter is often "the only person that could understand the words" because everyone else is deaf!

Why would they be listening to the words if they're supposed to be watching your signs? Isn't the whole point of signing songs so that people who can't hear the songs can follow along with what's being performed?

I assume your signing style and facial expression will match whatever genre and tone that the song conveys.

 

[Mrman]

Guess what? The hearing interpreter is often "the only person that could understand the words" because everyone else is deaf!

Why would they be listening to the words if they're supposed to be watching your signs? Isn't the whole point of signing songs so that people who can't hear the songs can follow along with what's being performed?

I assume your signing style and facial expression will match whatever genre and tone that the song conveys.

Well I feel like they won't pay attention if they hate the song. Eitherway, I'm probably going to do one of my poems. I've never seen a poem signed before though.

 

[Reba]

Well I feel like they won't pay attention if they hate the song. Eitherway, I'm probably going to do one of my poems. I've never seen a poem signed before though.

Is this a for-credit class? Aren't you all supposed to be paying attention to the signing as part of your ASL learning, not for music appreciation? Of course, if you want to focus on the signing you should pick a song with as little distraction as possible.

You've never seen a poem signed before? What exactly is your experience in signing? Outside of class that is.

Why are you taking this class?

 

[Anij]

Wirelessly posted (Blackberry Bold )

Mrman - surely you've seen ABC & 123 stories told in ASL? Right?

(We used to have a blast doing ABC stories!! Great fun)

 

[Mrman]

I've seen ABC stories and number stories but never a poem.

As far as signing experience and why I'm taking the class:

I don't talk very much so I thought I would try it out. I loved it so this is my 3rd year learning. I sign with my friends that can and I have a Deaf friend that I talk to everyday. There are only 6 Deaf at my school and I rarely seen them except my friend.

 

[shimo]

I was under the impression that ASL students are told to "interpret" songs because it forces the student to produce signs faster than they usually do.

I also read on this forum that many songs are a pidgin, like English grammar but ASL vocabulary.

 

[Reba]

I was under the impression that ASL students are told to "interpret" songs because it forces the student to produce signs faster than they usually do.

Wow, that's a new one on me! That sounds more like the old typing tests we had to do in high school. We would practice our typing to faster and faster music in order to speed up but still stay rhythmic.

I'm afraid that theory doesn't fit when the song is slow, and the concepts are such that signing them quickly would destroy the mood.

I also read on this forum that many songs are a pidgin, like English grammar but ASL vocabulary.

Some are done that way but that doesn't make it "right."

 

[Reba]

I've seen ABC stories and number stories but never a poem.

As far as signing experience and why I'm taking the class:

I don't talk very much so I thought I would try it out. I loved it so this is my 3rd year learning. I sign with my friends that can and I have a Deaf friend that I talk to everyday. There are only 6 Deaf at my school and I rarely seen them except my friend.

I'm impressed that you've continued for three years. Many people are gung-ho about taking an ASL class but don't stick with it.

Please don't take my criticisms personally. You can only work with what you're taught. You're doing the best you can with what you're given. I hope someday that another teacher or deaf mentor will be available to you.

 

[Anij]

I was under the impression that ASL students are told to "interpret" songs because it forces the student to produce signs faster than they usually do.

I've never heard the reasoning being "to make them sign faster" - speed isn't nearly as important as accuracy and fluidity so I'm not sure how "fast", when it likely means "fast and sloppy" would be a help to a student.

I also read on this forum that many songs are a pidgin, like English grammar but ASL vocabulary.

Yes - they are, because many songs are signed by students who aren't using ASL at all... they're signing word for word English

Proper ASL interpretation of songs is a challenging mix of blending ASL imagery, ASL grammar, and exchanging English slang/phrasing etc for parallel ASL concepts.

Think of it this way: Using ASL to sign an English (or any spoke word language) song is like taking the words on a page and using their imagery to paint a watercolour. It's not like using the watercolour paints to redraw the written words in various colours.

 

[Mrman]

I hope someday that another teacher or deaf mentor will be available to you.

It souds like you don't like hearing teachers. Anyway, at the college I'm looking at going to, all the ASL teachers are deaf.

 

[Reba]

It souds like you don't like hearing teachers. Anyway, at the college I'm looking at going to, all the ASL teachers are deaf.

It's not a matter of "liking." It's just that based on experience, deaf and CODA teachers have more real-life background in the Deaf perspective and culture. There are also excellent hearing teachers but too many of them experience the Deaf world from the outside looking in. I include myself in that category. I know that I will never be as qualified to teach ASL as either a Deaf person or a CODA. The difference is, some hearing teachers don't realize that about themselves. Also, most deaf ASL instructors wouldn't bother with teaching song signing.

I'm also not saying that just by being deaf a person would be a perfect ASL teacher. Some people just aren't cut out to be teachers, no matter how knowledgeable they are on a subject.