Saudi Arabia wants the US involved in the war

[Buckdodgers]

WASHINGTON - Saudi Arabia asked
President Bush on Sunday to intervene in
Israel's military campaign against Hezbollah in Lebanon to stop the mounting deaths, but administration officials said they remain convinced that an immediate cease-fire is not the answer.

Saudi Foreign Minister Prince Saud al-Faisal said that during an Oval Office meeting with Bush, he gave the president a letter from Saudi King Abdullah asking that Bush help seek an immediate cease-fire in the Middle East conflict. The meeting came on the 12th day of fighting in which Israel has bombed south Beirut and other targets while Hezbollah has rained hundreds of rockets on northern Israel.

"We requested a cease-fire to allow for a cessation of hostilities," Saud told reporters after the meeting.

"I have brought a letter from the Saudi King to stop the bleeding in Lebanon, and there has been an agreement to save Lebanese lives, Lebanese properties and what the Lebanese have built, and to save this country from the ordeal it is facing," Saud said. Saud's comment reflected Bush's past statements that all want the violence to stop, although he has refused to press for an immediate cease-fire.

Saud and four other Saudi officials met with Bush for more than an hour Sunday.

Secretary of State
Condoleezza Rice also participated in the meeting before departing for Israel in the first U.S. diplomatic effort on the ground since Israel began bombing Lebanon on July 12. The fighting has killed hundreds in Lebanon and dozens in Israel.

Officials from the U.N., Europe and other Arab countries have already urged an end to the fighting. Rice and Bush have rejected calls for an immediate cease-fire, saying it does not make sense if the terrorist threat from Hezbollah is not addressed. They have said Israel has a right to defend itself from terrorism and that Hezbollah must return two captured Israeli soldiers and stop firing missiles and rockets into Israel if they want the fighting to stop.

Saudis ask Bush to intervene in Mideast

Saudis want george bush to bring the American military into it.I said NEGOTIATE WITH THEM MR BUSH!! They want us to do something for them YOU DO SOMETHING FOR US!! Like Lower the Price of OIL to $45 a barrel and then you can have our military involved.

 

[sr171soars]

Well, I think the Arab world can be hoisted in their own petard. They brought about extemists and they can figure a way to get rid of them. Why is everybody else doing their dirty work? If it weren't the oil, these societies would have disintegrated years ago...

No, I disagree with you about us being involved. We have enough on our plates right now and any involvement by US would be the straw that broke the camel's back. Furthermore, we need to be reducing our dependency on oil pure and simple. Having the Saudis sell it to us cheap for a "pro quid pro" doesn't help us there at all.

Don't worry, the whole conflict will sputter to a halt over time probably in the next week or two.

 

[ismi]

They brought about extemists and they can figure a way to get rid of them. Why is everybody else doing their dirty work? If it weren't the oil, these societies would have disintegrated years ago...

Oil is part of it. The other part is thinking: "I'd rather not have nukes flying around randomly. Let's see if we can keep the Israel-Lebanon conflict [or India-Pakistan, etc, etc.] from growing."

 

[sr171soars]

Oil is part of it. The other part is thinking: "I'd rather not have nukes flying around randomly. Let's see if we can keep the Israel-Lebanon conflict [or India-Pakistan, etc, etc.] from growing."

I hear you and that is a valid observation. I thought about that as well but you know as well as I do that nobody really wants to see that. I can't see Iran getting away with that no matter what. This is a proxy fight between the Shiites and the Sunnites and unfortunately, it can drag everybody else into it as well...for many reasons of which oil is one.

What we need to do is weigh where this conflict is going and reign in the Israelis sooner than later and that should ease up the concerns.

 

[ismi]

I hear you and that is a valid observation. I thought about that as well but you know as well as I do that nobody really wants to see that. I can't see Iran getting away with that no matter what. This is a proxy fight between the Shiites and the Sunnites and unfortunately, it can drag everybody else into it as well...for many reasons of which oil is one.

What we need to do is weigh where this conflict is going and reign in the Israelis sooner than later and that should ease up the concerns.

I agree. It's almost true that "nobody wants to see [nuclear war]". The problem is, you have crazies (like Kim Jong Il), you have wannabe-martyrs (Hizbollah, Hamas, Al Qaeda), and you have theocrats who believe that God will protect them, because they are on His side, or vice versa (Khameini and the Iranian government, for instance). I believe that the odds of nuclear warfare are still pretty low; but that'd create a world so screwed up, we have an obligation to do what we can to prevent it - for our own sake, to say nothing of basic human decency.

As Einstein said, "I do not know what weapons World War III will be fought with, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones".

As a final note: Israel needs to be reined in. I see where they're coming from, but they're not improving the situation any.

 

[Buckdodgers]

No, I disagree with you about us being involved. We have enough on our plates right now and any involvement by US would be the straw that broke the camel's back. Furthermore, we need to be reducing our dependency on oil pure and simple. Having the Saudis sell it to us cheap for a "pro quid pro" doesn't help us there at all.

Well the Arabs need our help! and Tell em put price of oil down to $45 a barrell and were be more than gladly to help.

 

[sr171soars]

Well the Arabs need our help! and Tell em put price of oil down to $45 a barrell and were be more than gladly to help.

:roll: If it were a simple transaction with no complications, then by all means. Unfortunately, it isn't a simple transaction. There are too many variables that can easily backfire big time! We need to get off as much of oil as possible and high prices promote that goal. Cheap oil does not. Then there is the geopolitical mess called the Middle East. As we already know (Iraq and Afghanistan), nothing is easy over there. We are rightly leery of getting anymore involved in the that kettle which is usually boiling no matter what. As for the Arabs needing help...well they can't even figure what they want and fighting amongst themselves is a national/regional pasttime. Remember until the Shiites and Sunnites come to an understanding, this powderkeg will rumble on for a while...

 

[sr171soars]

I agree. It's almost true that "nobody wants to see [nuclear war]". The problem is, you have crazies (like Kim Jong Il), you have wannabe-martyrs (Hizbollah, Hamas, Al Qaeda), and you have theocrats who believe that God will protect them, because they are on His side, or vice versa (Khameini and the Iranian government, for instance). I believe that the odds of nuclear warfare are still pretty low; but that'd create a world so screwed up, we have an obligation to do what we can to prevent it - for our own sake, to say nothing of basic human decency.

As Einstein said, "I do not know what weapons World War III will be fought with, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones".

As a final note: Israel needs to be reined in. I see where they're coming from, but they're not improving the situation any.

Yeah, Kim Jong II isn't the most reliable idiot around and if anybody would start WWIII, it would be him. I'm glad the Japanese are the main bulwark against them plus the Chinese aren't stupid either with a crazy neighbor next door. South Korea is interesting while being schizophrenic about it...they will "push come shove" they will stand up against them too! We been smart to start pulling out of the place...

Human decency is a noble idea but that hadn't stopped many of the really sad episodes in history like Cambodia after the Vietnam war, the Rwanda mess and many others simply because nobody wanted to be involved.

My question to you on Israel is this..."What would do if you have manics next door determined to destroy you?" They have proved it time and time again that they can't be trusted. I agree that Israel needs to be reigned in but they also need to be sure the "other side" gets it!

 

[ismi]

Yeah, Kim Jong II

That's IL, FYI. His father was Kim Il Sung, IIRC. Pronounced like "ill".

Human decency is a noble idea but that hadn't stopped many of the really sad episodes in history like Cambodia after the Vietnam war, the Rwanda mess and many others simply because nobody wanted to be involved.

Which is why we are involved there, whether we like it or not, as I said above.

My question to you on Israel is this..."What would do if you have manics next door determined to destroy you?" They have proved it time and time again that they can't be trusted. I agree that Israel needs to be reigned in but they also need to be sure the "other side" gets it!

Absolutely. But the current bombings are doing nothing but creating more potential martyrs who hate Israel. Surgical strikes would be better. Israel is in a tough place, I get that. But they're attacking citizen targets as well, and that's not a good thing for anyone.

 

[Oceanbreeze]

I don't know that much about the Saudi involvement in the Israeli conflict, but I will say this much.

We shouldn't trust the Saudi's at all. They are hinky people at best, and will only do what is in their best interest. They may temporarily side with Israel, or even the US, if it suited them. But, you can also place a safe bet that they would just as easily cut our throats as look at us.

I'd watch my back when dealing with Saudi Arabia.

Just my semi educated two cents on the matter.

 

[Buckdodgers]

I agree. It's almost true that "nobody wants to see [nuclear war]". The problem is, you have crazies (like Kim Jong Il), you have wannabe-martyrs (Hizbollah, Hamas, Al Qaeda), and you have theocrats who believe that God will protect them, because they are on His side, or vice versa (Khameini and the Iranian government, for instance). I believe that the odds of nuclear warfare are still pretty low; but that'd create a world so screwed up, we have an obligation to do what we can to prevent it - for our own sake, to say nothing of basic human decency.

As Einstein said, "I do not know what weapons World War III will be fought with, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones".

As a final note: Israel needs to be reined in. I see where they're coming from, but they're not improving the situation any.

Oh i do wanna see Nukes Flying.It scared the hell outta the japanese did it? It taught them not to mess with the USA Ever again! Those people are scared to mess with america ever since august 6th 1945.Thats what the arabs need to learn a lesson you dont ever attack the united states.Thats the only thing the arabs will ever understand is a nuclear bomb.

 

[EDGE]

What if it's trap as they send more solider to death?

 

[ismi]

Oh i do wanna see Nukes Flying.It scared the hell outta the japanese did it? It taught them not to mess with the USA Ever again! Those people are scared to mess with america ever since august 6th 1945.Thats what the arabs need to learn a lesson you dont ever attack the united states.Thats the only thing the arabs will ever understand is a nuclear bomb.

That worked out when we were the only ones with nuclear weapons. Now ... not so much. Mutually assured destruction means that if we attack, we will also lose.

 

[sr171soars]

I don't know that much about the Saudi involvement in the Israeli conflict, but I will say this much.

We shouldn't trust the Saudi's at all. They are hinky people at best, and will only do what is in their best interest. They may temporarily side with Israel, or even the US, if it suited them. But, you can also place a safe bet that they would just as easily cut our throats as look at us.

I'd watch my back when dealing with Saudi Arabia.

Just my semi educated two cents on the matter.

Indeed! They have an agenda just like anybody else and it doesn't always dovetail with ours...

 

[Oceanbreeze]

Indeed! They have an agenda just like anybody else and it doesn't always dovetail with ours...

Most of these crackpots do. That's why you there's not a simple solution to any of this.

 

[sr171soars]

That's IL, FYI. His father was Kim Il Sung, IIRC. Pronounced like "ill".

Thanks for clarifying that one. I thought it was a mistake in spelling...

Which is why we are involved there, whether we like it or not, as I said above.

Geopolitical realities are always in play. That is why these things happen (I'm not justifying it). Each country counts the cost and decides whether to pay or not. Most don't want to...and I can't blame them.

Absolutely. But the current bombings are doing nothing but creating more potential martyrs who hate Israel. Surgical strikes would be better. Israel is in a tough place, I get that. But they're attacking citizen targets as well, and that's not a good thing for anyone.

So, the Israelis are judged by another's standards...ones that we set with our so-called surgical strikes!!! Oh, I well agree it would be better to craft the strikes to necessity but not everybody has that luxury (and neither does your enemy always comply). Remember, it is very difficult at times to determine who the real enemy is especially when they are quite adept in using civilians as cover (and could care less about 'em too!). Just remember, Israel has nowhere to turn on it flanks and is totally fixated on survival. We have a nice cushion of a friendly neighbor to the north, a questionable one to the south (but nothing really threatening), and two oceans on each side.

 

[Buckdodgers]

That worked out when we were the only ones with nuclear weapons. Now ... not so much. Mutually assured destruction means that if we attack, we will also lose.

Whos gonna attack us? IRAN cant Nuke Us Yet.Pakistan Cant Nuke Us Yet cause not enough range.Saudi Arabia has No Nukes and Whos gonna nuke us if we use em on IRAN or In Pakistan? So what are the arabs gonna do about it?

 

[sr171soars]

...That's why you there's not a simple solution to any of this.

No there aren't any simple solutions...That has been true for thousands of years in that part of the world. The Romans hated the place...and they probably ruled it better than anybody before or since excepting the Ottomans (at least until the end).

 

[sr171soars]

Whos gonna attack us? IRAN cant Nuke Us Yet.Pakistan Cant Nuke Us Yet cause not enough range.Saudi Arabia has No Nukes and Whos gonna nuke us if we use em on IRAN or In Pakistan? So what are the arabs gonna do about it?

You're not thinking too clearly here. Being the nine hundred pound gorilla on the block doesn't solve all your problems. What goes around comes around...it is true for people and it also true for countries as well. You forget about Russia, and China. They may or may not sit on the sidelines. Is that something you gamble on?...I most certainly don't. You need a reason to nuke somebody and what is going now doesn't count. It is just a sideshow...lets keep this in perspective.

You remind of court jesters for some reason...

 

[Buckdodgers]

9-11 is a reason to Nuke Pakistan besides Osama Bin Laden is hiding there.The Nuke from the raditation would kill bin laden about a week or so.