Hearing Aid complaints

[TWA]

Question Alex, what do you think these hearing aids should cost? Think about that for a second.

I asked you several questions first, which you have ignored. Answer those questions, and I'll answer yours.

K.

I think I am done here folks. I did want to help and was willing to answer legitimate questions about your hearing aids but I am not going to get attacked like this every other post.

I'm not going to get in an argument with someone whether they can do my job ten times better than me. It's ridiculous.

LOL, you have not been helpful AT ALL, and you brought the "personal attack" on yourself. Your tone was abrasive even in your first post and has grown increasingly hostile. And referring to us as "hearing impaired"? You are obviously way out of touch with your Deaf customers (if you even have any). I wasn't going to post anything on this thread, but it became obvious to me that you're not interested in giving us information, just protecting your bruised ego as an audiologist.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

*turns away*

For the record, I am not anti-audiologist. Every audiologist I've had, with the exception of one, has been a very kind person and a competent audiologist, and much more tactful with their words than this dhgunit character. That doesn't change my opinion that if I had access to the tuning equipment I could do a better job of programming my aids, and I'm sure many people here feel the same way.

 

[Banjo]

Dhgunit is the one being hostile? Really? I don't think so. She is right to get a little defensive since people are personally attacking her just because they can.

People in here are being incredibly hostile and rude, yet say they aren't against the audiologists. Sorry, but I don't think some of you are being honest with yourself here.

Some of you people obviously have no clue how it works in the industry.

Why don't we ask Sony to lower the pricing of their high-end HDTV displays to say... $500 from $3,000 so we can afford it?

Sony will laugh right in your face.

Hearing aids are not cheap. That's a fact of life. You can buy one for $14.95 from a TV infomercial, but is it worth investing in?

You get what you pay for, whether you like it or not.

 

[TWA]

Dhgunit is the one being hostile? Really? I don't think so. She is right to get a little defensive since people are personally attacking her just because they can.

Even when her words fan the flames for more attacks? That's the only reason I stepped in. She invited it on herself.

People in here are being incredibly hostile and rude, yet say they aren't against the audiologists. Sorry, but I don't think some of you are being honest with yourself here.

Hey, I never said people in here weren't being hostile toward her as well, but look at the tone of all her posts, starting with the response to Yiz and escalating with Sallylou.

Look at all the smugness:

This is the why I am here, for the uninformed people like this that have no clue what they are talking about

The belittling rhetorical questions:

do you work for free?

The superior attitude:

LOL..... Can you tell me what question she asked?

The token gestures, thinly masking opportunism:

I charge $5 for a package of 20 wax guards.......what brand are your hearing aids, I may be able to help you out if you are spending too much.

So don't try and make this person look like a victim here. This is not a question of her being right or wrong, or if hearing aids are justified in their cost or not. It's a question of how this "professional" has come in here and gone tit for tat with the members of this community. Your judgment is usually impeccable, Banjo, but I'm surprised you are defending this person. And save your moral judgment for another time. Most people know when they are or aren't being honest with themselves. You, however, are in no position to gauge that.

 

[Bottesini]

Some of you people obviously have no clue how it works in the industry.

Why don't we ask Sony to lower the pricing of their high-end HDTV displays to say... $500 from $3,000 so we can afford it?

Sony will laugh right in your face.


You get what you pay for, whether you like it or not.

I have noticed the price of the HDTV going down, down , down.

I saw a 50 inch in Sears the other day for $750.

So the hearing aids have been developed and marketed much longer that the HDTV.

By your comparison in what happens with the televisions market, hearing aids should be very cheap by now.

 

[sallylou]

Some people are buying HAs on the internet now. The dealer can adjust the HAs by computer. Not sure exactly how that works. I haven't tried it yet. This will definitely bring prices down.

I'm surprised that the manufacturers haven't stopped this. For example, Brighton accessories have never been sold on the internet. The company prevented this by pressuring the boutique merchants who sold the brand. Now, the silver is made in China (lower quality) and I don't buy Brighton anymore. Too bad! I've got some great vintage pieces, though, including 2 pair of comfy shoes. I should post pics in the shoe thread.

I suspect that this audi expected a greeting from a grateful, "impaired" community, desperate for healing and hearing. Maybe this was market research?

 

[Banjo]

I have noticed the price of the HDTV going down, down , down.

I saw a 50 inch in Sears the other day for $750.

So the hearing aids have been developed and marketed much longer that the HDTV.

By your comparison in what happens with the televisions market, hearing aids should be very cheap by now.

Not true. LCD/Plasma HDTV prices are going down because of the 3DTVs. OLED HDTVs aren't cheap though, but they are coming down.

They do have cheap, moderate and expensive hearing aids.

 

[Banjo]

Alex, I'm not going to condone either sides for resorting to what they did. Yes, she should had been careful with her words. Some I didn't certainly agree with. However, a couple posters here were pretty hostile and rude. It's hardly a surprise why she responded the way she did.

I just don't think it's necessary to get personal and hostile with her in this case. The people here are turning her into the victim without realizing it. We shouldn't resort to making assumptions and asking rhetoric questions. Let's put a stop to it here, there is no need for any tension and hostility from both sides.

I'm not going to discuss this any further. The moderators should take care of this.

Back to the topic,

Audiology is a profession and it's a science. People are required to attend colleges/universities if they wish to work in the field of audiology.

I can see why it's easy for people to assume that it's easy to use the software, but that's only if they know what they are doing. They need to be familiar with the science of audiology. If they don't know what you are doing, they are putting their ears at risk of further damages. Being improperly fitted and having the wrong settings on can damage their ears. To say that one would do a job ten times better than an audiologist is being delusional, and not only that, it'll be taken as an insult, and rightfully so.

For example, I am a professional in the field of graphic design, I understand what it's like to have someone assuming they can do my job when they don't even have a clue to start with. For instance, most people aren't even familiar with the concept of typography and colour wheel. If they had it their way, they would be using comic sans and papyrus for everything along with using green and cyan as the main colour scheme. Oh imagine the horrors.

So imagine what they could do with a hearing aid, making themselves go deaf even faster than one could possibly imagine. You'll be surprised how clueless a lot of people are when it comes to hearing aids, some even put one in the wrong ear, and I don't know how that's possible, but it is.

What I can tell you is this, what you see on your receipt is the price the audiologist ordered the hearing aids at. The dispensing fee on the receipt is what the audiologist (and the office) receives.

 

[dhgunit]

OK Alex, you want to know what it costs? I will answer your question even though I shouldn't but I want you to understand that there is more in the cost of the hearing aid than the wholesale price for the dispenser.


Average monthly revenue: $34,000 (Been a bad year because of economy, this has been the highest monthly revenue in 2010)

Costs
Hearing Aids: $18,000
Rent: $2,500
Utilities: $500
Advertising: $3,000
Employee Salaries: $5,000
Financing Fees: $1,000
Payroll Taxes: $1,000

Total: $31,000



That isn't even taking into account the $100,000 or so in equipment purchased to open the business.

 

[Banjo]

I suspect that this audi expected a greeting from a grateful, "impaired" community, desperate for healing and hearing. Maybe this was market research?

Perhaps, but we cannot condone the hostility. We have to preserve our image as a positive force, not a negative force.

By resorting to it, we aren't any better than them.

 

[Banjo]

OK Alex, you want to know what it costs? I will answer your question even though I shouldn't but I want you to understand that there is more in the cost of the hearing aid than the wholesale price for the dispenser.

Average monthly revenue: $34,000 (Been a bad year because of economy, this has been the highest monthly revenue in 2010)

Costs
Hearing Aids: $18,000
Rent: $2,500
Utilities: $500
Advertising: $3,000
Employee Salaries: $5,000
Financing Fees: $1,000
Payroll Taxes: $1,000

Total: $31,000

That isn't even taking into account the $100,000 or so in equipment purchased to open the business.

Sounds around right. Of the costs would vary among the cities and such. Regardless, it's not cheap.

Business owners are in it to serve the people, but also to make a living out of it.

People should always remember that.

 

[TWA]

I just don't think it's necessary to get personal and hostile with her in this case. The people here are turning her into the victim without realizing it. We shouldn't resort to making assumptions and asking rhetoric questions. Let's put a stop to it here, there is no need for any tension and hostility from both sides.

Agreed. But, my loyalty is first and foremost to this entire community, and when an outsider starts to attack the members, regardless of who started it, it's not hard to guess how I'm going to react. Nevertheless. I'm ready to drop that aspect of the debate. I think I made the points I wanted, and you've made yours. They are all good points.

I can see why it's easy for people to assume that it's easy to use the software, but that's only if they know what they are doing. They need to be familiar with the science of audiology. If they don't know what you are doing, they are putting their ears at risk of further damages. Being improperly fitted and having the wrong settings on can damage their ears. To say that one would do a job ten times better than an audiologist is being delusional, and not only that, it'll be taken as an insult, and rightfully so.

Hyperbole, yes. Delusional? Hardly. There are many who have already done it. Though I admit I was consciously trying to insult the OP at that point, but only after reading her insults to our members. I apologize to the OP for that. I suppose it was cheap, though not unwarranted.

For example, I am a professional in the field of graphic design, I understand what it's like to have someone assuming they can do my job when they don't even have a clue to start with. For instance, most people aren't even familiar with the concept of typography and colour wheel. If they had it their way, they would be using comic sans and papyrus for everything along with using green and cyan as the main colour scheme. Oh imagine the horrors.

LOL, horrific indeed. I actually have training in GD and typography, and my brother is a professional in the field. I understand the point you are making, and certainly there are many bastard clients out there who don't understand the finer details of design, but audiology and graphic design are vastly different. One is an art form requiring creative talent and vision. The other is a science requiring factual knowledge. Facts can be acquired from books and the internet; creativity cannot. This is why it would be possible, with a little bit of studying up, to perform your own hearing aid adjustments. I doubt many people could do their own professional quality graphic design, even after training.

 

[TWA]

OK Alex, you want to know what it costs? I will answer your question even though I shouldn't but I want you to understand that there is more in the cost of the hearing aid than the wholesale price for the dispenser.

Still haven't answered the questions I've asked. I'm not interested in your operational costs. We're well aware you need to make a living.


What I really wanted to know was how much you pay for a single hearing aid, wholesale. Then, I want to know how much it costs the manufacturer to create that hearing aid. And, though I'm sure the information is not available, I'm interested in knowing the actual costs of R&D. Until manufacturers provide concrete numbers for that, they have no basis to claim it as a reason for the high costs of hearing aids.

 

[dhgunit]

Still haven't answered the questions I've asked. I'm not interested in your operational costs. We're well aware you need to make a living.


What I really wanted to know was how much you pay for a single hearing aid, wholesale. Then, I want to know how much it costs the manufacturer to create that hearing aid. And, though I'm sure the information is not available, I'm interested in knowing the actual costs of R&D. Until manufacturers provide concrete numbers for that, they have no basis to claim it as a reason for the high costs of hearing aids.

Do you worry about what a retailer pays wholesale everywhere you go?

Why does it matter?

Next time you need to purchase a hearing aid are you going to demand it at wholesale price?

BTW, I am not telling you wholesale prices in case you hadn't figure it out. You can take my previous post though and figure it out pretty close though.

 

[dhgunit]

And why does everyone assume I am a female?

 

[Banjo]

Agreed. But, my loyalty is first and foremost to this entire community, and when an outsider starts to attack the members, regardless of who started it, it's not hard to guess how I'm going to react. Nevertheless. I'm ready to drop that aspect of the debate. I think I made the points I wanted, and you've made yours. They are all good points.

Thank you, I really appreciate that.

Hyperbole, yes. Delusional? Hardly. There are many who have already done it.

Hyperbole is a better choice of word. Although we have to keep in mind that we don't do it on a daily basis while the audiologists and specialists do.

LOL, horrific indeed. I actually have training in GD and typography, and my brother is a professional in the field. I understand the point you are making, and certainly there are many bastard clients out there who don't understand the finer details of design, but audiology and graphic design are vastly different. One is an art form requiring creative talent and vision. The other is a science requiring factual knowledge. Facts can be acquired from books and the internet; creativity cannot. This is why it would be possible, with a little bit of studying up, to perform your own hearing aid adjustments. I doubt many people could do their own professional quality graphic design, even after training.[/QUOTE]

True, they are different. Although I'm sure you know what I meant by that. Science requiring factual knowledge which is true, but they need to be understood. Both of us are more than likely to understand it, but some people aren't able to.

Off topic, I should mention that both art and design are actually two different concepts. Many can be artists while many can be designers, but they often don't use both skills at once. Many try to combine both with disastrous results while few succeed. Thankfully, I succeeded at it. When I was in college, I met so many talented artists, but they had absolutely no grasp on the concept of design. It's the same the other way around, I met a lot of these people.

Back to the topic, in order to do that, it will need to be understood first.

 

[Banjo]

What I really wanted to know was how much you pay for a single hearing aid, wholesale. Then, I want to know how much it costs the manufacturer to create that hearing aid. And, though I'm sure the information is not available, I'm interested in knowing the actual costs of R&D. Until manufacturers provide concrete numbers for that, they have no basis to claim it as a reason for the high costs of hearing aids.

The dealers wouldn't know anything about the costs of R&D. They don't disclose these kind of information to the dealers.

The "wholesale" pricing is pretty much what you see on the receipt. The dispensing fee is what the office gets.

 

[TWA]

Do you worry about what a retailer pays wholesale everywhere you go?

Why does it matter?

Next time you need to purchase a hearing aid are you going to demand it at wholesale price?

BTW, I am not telling you wholesale prices in case you hadn't figure it out. You can take my previous post though and figure it out pretty close though.

LOL. Based on this response, I am done talking to you.

 

[dhgunit]

LOL. Based on this response, I am done talking to you.

Why? You are just being ridiculous. Why does it matter what the wholesale price is?

If I walk into Best Buy and say, "I know the wholesale price on that $1,000 LCD TV is actually $450 so that is what I should pay". They will say I'm sorry sir and walk away.

The wholesale price is just part of the big picture and I am clueless as to why you have such an obsession about it. Didn't I post about $18,000 for $34,000 in revenue? Simple math will tell you the mark-up.

 

[yizuman]

This is the why I am here, for the uninformed people like this that have no clue what they are talking about.

It is bull to charge more based on deafness.....luckily I have never seen it happen. Where do you get your misinformation?

I have a hearing aid, it has a function, and it has a price. If you want it you have the option to purchase it. If you don't want it, you don't have to buy it. I cannot give away stuff for free Yiz.

Do you work for free Yiz?

Strawman attack, I got my hearing aids for free from the goodwill of a Samaritan program, if it was indeed expensive, the program would not have existed in the first place. So this says alot, imho. From what I was told, the hearing aids provided to me was slightly above cost, but not at full retail.

And to answer your question, no I would not work for free. But in these days, labor is not what it used to be unfortunately when it comes to wages. Most people have to work 2-3 jobs to make ends meet which leaves very little time for family. In this case, that's a stresser for the children as well as marriage.

 

[dhgunit]

Strawman attack, I got my hearing aids for free from the goodwill of a Samaritan program, if it was indeed expensive, the program would not have existed in the first place. So this says alot, imho. From what I was told, the hearing aids provided to me was slightly above cost, but not at full retail.

I was just mainly wondering who you knew that was charged more because they had more hearing loss.

What do you mean "if it was indeed expensive". If it is a good hearing aid you bet it was expensive. The program exists because there are charitable people out there realizing there is little financial help for hearing aids. Not because the hearing aids are cheap.