FCC threatens to destroy VRS by mismanagement

Eh?

Each post that each member made are very relevant to this topic.

Bandwidth, the cost of how much we individually pay per month does make a difference whether you think differently or not.

I encourage you to create your own thread that you can assert your own control over "on-topic" threads because we're adults here. No one likes a self-imposed moderator telling us to "stay on topic".

Have a nice day.
 
If I may add, the gap between hearing and deaf is closing rapidly.

More and more hearing people are opting to drop, or pressure their providers to drop, the voice plans in favour of VoIP (Voice-over IP) where phonecalls and such are made over the Internet.

There will be a day where hearing and deaf will be paying for the same service.
 
Banjo said:
It's not the monthly payment for VRS that I would have a problem with. I would pay for it. I'll be more than happy to pay for the services.

It's the internet providers that I have a problem with. It's an ongoing problem in Canada. We pay more on average in comparison to the Americans and we get much less in return.

To be more specific what the big problem is, bandwidth cap.

Cogeco

High Speed Internet Lite - 10GB/month - $29.95/month
High Speed Internet Lite Plus - 30GB/month - $34.95/month
High Speed Internet Standard - 60GB/month - $45.95/month
High Speed Internet Pro - 125GB/month - $76.95/month
High Speed Internet Ultimate 30 - 125GB/month - $64.95/month
High Speed Internet Ultimate 50 - 150GB/per month - $104.95/month

Bell

Essential Plus - 2GB/month - $31.95/month plus modem fee of $3.95/month
Performance - 25GB/month - $41.95/month plus modem fee of $3.95/month
Fibre 6 - 25GB/month - $41.95/month plus modem fee of $3.95/month
Fibre 12 - 50GB/month - $51.95/month plus modem fee of $3.95/month
Fibre 16 - 75GB/month - $61.95/month plus modem fee of $3.95/month
Fibre 25 - 75GB/month - $67.95/month plus modem fee of $6.95/month

Rogers
(P2P applications limited to 80kbps)

Ultra-Lite Internet - 2GB/month - $27.99/month plus modem fee of $3.00/month
Lite Internet - 25GB/month - $35.99/month plus modem fee of $3.00/month
Express Internet - 60GB/month - $46.99/month plus modem fee of $3.00/month
Extreme Internet - 95GB/month - $59.99/month plus modem fee of $3.00/month
Extreme Plus Internet - 125GB/month - $69.99/month plus modem fee of $7.00/month
Ultimate Internet - 175GB/month - $99.99/month plus modem fee of $7.00/month

Shaw
(modem included)

High-Speed Lite - 10GB/month - $33.00/month
High-Speed - 60GB/month - $45.00/month
High-Speed Extreme - 100GB/month - $55.00/month
High-Speed Warp - 150GB/month - $106.00/month

Don't forget the taxes aren't included.

Now, you may see why some deaf consumers may balk at the costs of paying for access to the internet they need in order to use the VRS. The basic package probably wouldn't be ideal since it's limited to 2GB per month, and 25GB isn't really that much if you download a lot. VRS and video chats can take up a good amount of bandwidth if it's regularly used. Also, the speed will vary by the package you subscribe to.

Why is bandwidth cap being used in Canada while it isn't being enforced by most internet providers in the USA? I know Comcast got some backlash after establishing a bandwidth cap.

It's a cash grab at its best and we need to put a stop to it.
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Oh, not surprised, that's more expensive than in US.

In my area, it is cost $30 per month for unlimited bandwidth and 3 mbps.
 
souggy said:
If I may add, the gap between hearing and deaf is closing rapidly.

More and more hearing people are opting to drop, or pressure their providers to drop, the voice plans in favour of VoIP (Voice-over IP) where phonecalls and such are made over the Internet.

There will be a day where hearing and deaf will be paying for the same service.
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I look forward to that day when both hearing and deaf pay and share the same service.

I will be at Mayfest and there is an exhibitor selling a videophone - ACN Toronto. I will be getting pamphlets of new gadgets & posting about them tonight in a thread.

I'll keep those up to tabs in Twitterverse too!
 
SouthFella said:
Since Sorenson pulled the " scare tactic" and many of you folks fell for it ...

Why not scare Sorenson and not use their service or one, two or three months...

Use another VRS company since there is over 30 to choose from.

Then Sorenson will think twice of pulling the " scare tactic" next time ...
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I see "scare tactic" used alot. Not sure how to apply to this situation. So I compare to regular business concept. Imagine you are driving past big store in your neighborhood. Have posted bigs signs in front of store for all to see Everything 40% off! Maybe you think, Wow big sale! Many people want to go save money rush to get that sale stuff. Now go inside, many people with carts full lined up at cash register. Clerk says, what sale? no one told me! Ask to manager, we having big sale? 40% off? Customer say, signs outside say 40% off! Manager: "Who put that out there? Not me?" Then accounting man come out says Warehouse people just put everything on sale. They put up signs! Manager answer but we paid full price for everything on shelf! Take down signs! Too late everybody already here. Must obey signs!
Now you tell me: Who is using scare tactics?
Maybe when you drive by and see signs you don't care. Think: I don't shop there. I don't like their stuff. I don't use their stuff. Hope they close up go away. You aren't scared. You don't feel affect of sale good or bad. Now all customers of the big store have to find other place get their stuff. They are now coming to your favorite store. That store is much smaller, prices higher. Those people coming get in line for stuff. They don't care price. They get same thing same price: FREE.
Point is: In real situation Warehouse company don't set price of what store sells for. They just store stuff. VRS is different. Company puts open for business sign out. People come in look around decide if they want that stuff or not. Someone else sets the price and pays for some of the things at the price they set. They don't use the stuff either, just control the money. VRS company has no other income than interpreted minutes. So people who set the price aren't just cutting the profits. They are cutting entire company operating budget.
I ask again, who is using scare tactics?
 
Your analogy has NOTHING to do with VRS. You're SO far off base.

The FCC has already accounted for all VRS providers' cost averages for each tier, PLUS 11.25% return on investment and an small additional amount for operating expenses. So it's not like a 40% sale - it's saying "you can't take as much profit as you had before!"

If Sorenson's executives still want to get their $$$$ millions of dollars in profit, then they HAVE to cut people and features. If they want to get an equal amount of profit that everyone else is getting, then they cut NOTHING. Understand?!

With these new rates, everyone gets the same amount of profit. That encourages all companies to be more EFFICIENT to get more profit. The upside to that is that these companies will stop wasting money and instead improve every year. Those companies that can't improve and are only wasting money - will go away. We already have 20+ VRS companies - it is not necessary to have that many.
 
I believe it is like a fire sale. FCC didn't say 40% off your profits. Said we will pay you $3.89 for what we used to pay $6.30. That's 38% less. And that is only source of income. But still put out same quality of service. Do you get to do that with things that you pay for? FCC looks at costs that companies show, yes. Then they decide which of those things they want to continue to pay for. Did the list from companies get shorter? Do those things cost less money now? Or just FCC don't want to buy everything.
 
Mrs Bucket said:
I look forward to that day when both hearing and deaf pay and share the same service.

I will be at Mayfest and there is an exhibitor selling a videophone - ACN Toronto. I will be getting pamphlets of new gadgets & posting about them tonight in a thread.

I'll keep those up to tabs in Twitterverse too!
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Guess what?

ACN Toronto didn't even have an interpreter at their booth. Not a lot of people were interested in their product. I took their flyer and wow, they are charging a lot for their product.

For this product, you and another person need this same product to call each other. You'd have to have a high speed internet server and a land line in order to call out & receive calls.

Oh this product, it is a rip-off.

We already have Skype and ooVoo. Those two are just as good and free too!!
 
Mrs Bucket said:
Guess what?

ACN Toronto didn't even have an interpreter at their booth. Not a lot of people were interested in their product. I took their flyer and wow, they are charging a lot for their product.

For this product, you and another person need this same product to call each other. You'd have to have a high speed internet server and a land line in order to call out & receive calls.

Oh this product, it is a rip-off.

We already have Skype and ooVoo. Those two are just as good and free too!!
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So, basically, it's no different from a WorldGate Ojo, eh? Except at least you didn't need a landline.
 
You would think with the popularity of Ventrilo and Skype in Europe and the UK, you would think North American marketers would take a cue... to drop the landline proposition that is.
 
The landline proposition has to go because we're in the technology era, the TTY isn't going to be making a comeback.

The Deaf community consists of very visual people. ASL is 90% facial expression and 10% gestures.
 
If VRS is out for good, then USE e-mail, text, AIM or Y!Messenger, SprintIP, 711 relay. I still have a portable tty since 1995, it's still great. Hearing people are damn lazy to use e-mail or text to communicate with deaf people as if it concerns the making of an appointment for job interview.
 
Dennis said:
You make absolutely no sense at all.

Sorenson does not want any competition. They blocked everyone from using their VPs to make VRS calls to any other relay company for several years, until the FCC finally made a decision to require them to open it up. Sorenson laughed all the way to the bank. They protest anything that could threaten to make them any less profit - just like any other for profit company that doesn't care about their customers, they only care about the $$$. So you've got it all wrong.

The FCC is stopping the blatant abuse of profits here. Instead of keeping jobs for those deaf people working at Sorenson, Sorenson will lay them off so that the hearing people at the top can keep their bonuses and profit margins. That tells you just how much Sorenson cares about the community.
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You showing your bias again. State your source other than opinion. This is America and all business owners want competition. That is how market grows. That is only way to decide who is best. If there is no competion, there is no need to get better. You and other keep saying svrs has too much profit. Someone please define TOO MUCH PROFIT. When did we leave America? Profit comes from being the best, having most satisfied customers, and most efficient use of resources.
 
The FCC outlined that 11.25% return on investment is enough profit. That's why they took the costs of VRS for the past year, extrapolated it out for future growth projections, then added 11.25% on top of that. That's "ENOUGH PROFIT" for a GOVERNMENT SUBSIDIZED service.

If you were paying for your VRS service, then the VRS companies can make as much profit as they'd like. That's private enterprise.

VRS is not a charity. VRS is not a pay-for service. It is a GOVERNMENT SUPPORTED service. Thus the companies get the "GOVERNMENT APPROVED" profit margin.
 
Dennis said:
The FCC outlined that 11.25% return on investment is enough profit. That's why they took the costs of VRS for the past year, extrapolated it out for future growth projections, then added 11.25% on top of that. That's "ENOUGH PROFIT" for a GOVERNMENT SUBSIDIZED service.

If you were paying for your VRS service, then the VRS companies can make as much profit as they'd like. That's private enterprise.

VRS is not a charity. VRS is not a pay-for service. It is a GOVERNMENT SUPPORTED service. Thus the companies get the "GOVERNMENT APPROVED" profit margin.
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That's correct. If it is being subsidized by the government, then it is perfectly reasonable and expected of the government to put a cap on the profitability.
 
Dennis,
I do see your point on the profitability, however ALL business that provides service are expected to see some ROI in their books for the future developments to keep their customers happy. All VRS that are both non-certified and certified by FCC are "FOR PROFIT” Can you name one VRS that declares as non-profit business? Before you fire your memory synapses... there is none ;)
I will agree with ASLROCKS58 on your opinion which is clearly biased.... Just because that Sorenson is greedy... have you noticed that Sorenson have contributed greatly into the interpreting programs sponsoring wide range of events that promote interpreting. What the heck that we already have expressed our concerns of lack of interpreters available... I'm more concern of "highly qualified" status than the numbers because the higher the interpreter is qualified; she or he is able to empower the communication to the Deaf consumers. I have my experience having so-so and awesome interpreters... I get better results with awesome interpreters.
I do believe the VRS are trying to push the level of skills that interpreters should have... and there is none better than Sorenson, the quality they believe in should be raising the bar above by providing all necessary support to the workshops, interpreter events, VRSII, and many more, to develop more future interpreters. I have seen some so-so interpreters became very good interpreters through those resources, because I have been there and done that.
Technology changes... demand and supply rise or fall, rendition is a must and how do we do that... it requires funds to maintain that’s where ROI comes in. cutting 45% in rate will not help at all.
Dennis, again if you wish to bash Sorenson, feel free to do so and without any source and your bashing is easily a moot, why can't you go ahead bash ZVRS for trying to fool the consumers switching to their services by confusing them with porting, or bash on Purple for using lots of minutes running conference calls. Everyone have its own flaws especially you Dennis. I rest my case.
 
It is Sorenson pulling this biggest scare tactics. Since Sorenson have more to lose than all the other VRS companies combined. Don't forget, Sorenson have about 85 % of the market.

So, it is not the FCC pulling the scare tactic. It is FCC trying to level the playing field and save taxpayer's money.

So with that said, deafmedicalpoet think more carefully before firing off comments.



deafmedicalpoet said:
SouthFella its not just sorenson but all VP companies that use VRS. its FCC doing the "scare tactic". and many deaf feel we need to voice out and make it known in america and elsewhere. so dont say its just 1 company when its multiple...think 2xs.
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Douglas said:
If VRS is out for good, then USE e-mail, text, AIM or Y!Messenger, SprintIP, 711 relay. I still have a portable tty since 1995, it's still great. Hearing people are damn lazy to use e-mail or text to communicate with deaf people as if it concerns the making of an appointment for job interview.
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How many of us got in trouble on the internet because of lack of expression? Text is not the way to go. Beside, I'm not even sure I'm confident enough to write well enough to relay my message properly. I am not confident with using my voice either because it is just as bad as my writing. I haven't used a phone or tty for YEARS (I don't use VRS either.. I usually just walk up if I need something) I can imagine other deaf people feeling the same way.

Yep, Most businesses will not do email. I never understood why they feel more comfortable over the phone than emails. DemandForce are helping businesses as far as emailing and confirming appointments. People should look into that.
There are other issues with TTY especially if you live with hearing people. No one want to pay double money just to have a second phoneline in case the school call (worst, most school don't really want to deal with relay and tell them what number to call..or don't understand how it works)

I don't think VRS is going to go, ever. They might be in lower number, but they will be back up.
 
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