I Refuse

deafbajagal

deafbajagal

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According to everyone I meet, I can speak like a hearing person. Occasionally my words have a hint of an accent. Other than that, it's "perfect."

Oh, good. Thanks, but no thanks.

Fourteen years of intense speech and aural-verbal training is in the toliet and I'm flushing it. Round and round the water goes down.

Speech never helped me. It made other people's lives easier. The more I learned how to speak, the more I became isolated from the world. I could tell people my feelings, thoughts, needs, and wants. But no one stopped to consider...I wanted to know their feelings, thoughts, needs, and wants, too. I learned to speak...but no one listened. I learned to listen...but no one would look at me. And I learned to cry...and no one heard me.

My childhood memories such as Thanksgiving and Christmas memories are so painful that I block myself from remembering. Those moments at the dinner table where I'm sitting there, laughing along (and wondering what was so funny?)...while inside I was hurting. I resented, and still resent, my family...especially my mother. I missed out. So who gives a damn that I can say the words out of my mouth? Especially when I could never really speak my mind.

People say if I learn to speak, then I'll be ready for the hearing world. How ironic is it that because I learned to speak that the hearing world became unreachable. It was not until I was able to use American Sign Language again that I was able to be fully part of the world. It was then I was able to really speak my mind.

Yeah, I can speak. Thanks, but no thanks.
 
when i talk to you someday, somehow, somewhere i would appreciate you speaking in whatever you chose sign or voice :)
 
For you - I would sing a verse from one of the Mastodon's songs...and then you can agree I have no business using my voice! LOL
 
I know how you feel.

I was born hearing and became deaf due to neglect.

I went to a deaf institute that was oral and no sign language.

I didn't use sign language until I was 5 years ago when I moved to another state and went to a mainstream school with a deaf program. However, it wasn't ASL... it was MMS.

I didn't know anything about ASL until I went to RIT 9 years ago. Even though my friends signed ASL and I had ASL interpreters, I never knew it was "ASL". I understood them anyways. I guess it was due to being with other deaf students who used ASL while growing up. :dunno:

Today, I speak like a hearing person... but it does make a lot of people assume that I'm hearing. However, many of them are very understanding when I point out that I'm deaf.

Yet, there are some who still aren't open to me as they should considering my deafness... especially my parents.

My parents want me to date a hearing religious woman. I told them that I want a deaf non-religious person. They get mad. :roll:
 
Fair enough. You have every right to decide whether to speak or not.

Your turn to have the spotlight at Thanksgiving and Christmas etc. :)
 
Deafbajagal, I'm totally in your shoes. Sucks sometimes that we can speak as well as we do. Because for as deaf as I am, being in a hearing world is not easy. Whether it's with family, talking to perfect strangers in a restaurant (waitstaff) or at the gas station (cashier), and a thousand other scenarios. Can't get a decent job (I currently freelance and do okay with that) but the moment that it comes out in an interview that I'd need interpreters for group meetings, etc. I see their eyes blank out. Interview over. Basically. I used to get that same stare when I would ask for a TTY at work, especially if I would be responsible for making calls to print vendors, etc. Now that one part isn't as big a deal because I can use my own cell phone and relay, even the internet, to make calls. We all know how that part goes. I'm feeling irritated with my family these days .. My parents have a deaf kid, and they don't seem to know it. My boyfriend's entire family, their girlfriends, wives, etc. all text me and email me all the time. They're great about it! On the other hand, my parents have a cell phone. They refuse to text me. They claim they can't remember how, even after I and my sister have shown them and written down the instructions. It is NOT that hard. They call my IP v/m number and leave me a message. The message is usually what? "Call us back, please". ??!!! They couldn't text me or leave me a detailed message? No, they have to wait until I can get on the Relay or get on my computer to call them. And they don't like to take my calls from the Relay if I'm doing it off my Blackberry "because it's too slow". So for as great as I can communicate, I'm still a deaf person lost in a hearing world.
 
im in your shoes too
i despite the why my family and freinds and acquintences have this really old attitude that I am good at lip reading (bullshit) and listens well, hell they dont even listen to me this well at all. they pretend tom for another thing that they piss me off about is they're right all the time.

Sorry , right now im not in the mood for getting good words out i have tinnitus it's driving me mad, and i have alot of stress on at the moment, cant hardly focus. All i want to do is have a rest, but i can't.

when a better time come along to reflect and thus write I will.

But yes I do refuse to appease hearing people too. I had a part time volunter job at old people's home my boss often used to say "I am my own worst enemy" you know what? he's so wrong, its just a cop out for the hearing people to pardon their own ignorance which made me mad. he doesnt grasp not one tiny bit of understanding of how hard it is for a Deaf person to struggle for independence and life. they all just pretends to know. I refuse to believe them too.
 
deafbajagal said:
Speech never helped me. It made other people's lives easier. The more I learned how to speak, the more I became isolated from the world. I could tell people my feelings, thoughts, needs, and wants. But no one stopped to consider...I wanted to know their feelings, thoughts, needs, and wants, too. I learned to speak...but no one listened. I learned to listen...but no one would look at me. And I learned to cry...and no one heard me.

My childhood memories such as Thanksgiving and Christmas memories are so painful that I block myself from remembering. Those moments at the dinner table where I'm sitting there, laughing along (and wondering what was so funny?)...while inside I was hurting. I resented, and still resent, my family...especially my mother. I missed out. So who gives a damn that I can say the words out of my mouth? Especially when I could never really speak my mind.

People say if I learn to speak, then I'll be ready for the hearing world. How ironic is it that because I learned to speak that the hearing world became unreachable. It was not until I was able to use American Sign Language again that I was able to be fully part of the world. It was then I was able to really speak my mind.

Yeah, I can speak. Thanks, but no thanks.
Click to expand...

:gpost:, deafbajagal! It's perfectly understandable here.

Hmm... it's so irony that they expect you to speak/hear in order to fit in their hearing world yet you weren't "invited" or never feel like you belong there. But it doesn't work out like that as a part of ugly reality.

I'm deaf and use ASL but couldn't speak so it's always difficult being alone in the hearing world especially my hearing family at times like suppertime, holiday times, etc - same boat as yours. Many hearing parents' deaf kids experienced like that exactly what you and I did. Never enjoy any moments except few god ones... yep, it ain't so fair to you and us to be put in. It doesn't need to be like that... I know, I know. But we have no choice but accept as it is at most times. (yet it sucks lol)

So it's a very reason why deaf friends and deaf people stay close as much as possible because of this that. So those would never be alone and have to face any discrimination and such sorts that displease them.

We indeed have seen some oralism and/or mainstream graduates getting more involved in the deaf community wherever ASL exists or is being openly used. I really think it's great for them so it helps build their self-esteem and etc.
 
I felt that my speech skills were more for hearing people's benefit than mine.

Ironically, my mom was told that by developing oral skills and being mainstreamed, it will be providing me more opportunities.

Aha! I got it...more opportunities to be isolated completely.
 
web730 said:
:gpost:, deafbajagal! It's perfectly understandable here.

Hmm... it's so irony that they expect you to speak/hear in order to fit in their hearing world yet you weren't "invited" or never feel like you belong there. But it doesn't work out like that as a part of ugly reality.

I'm deaf and use ASL but couldn't speak so it's always difficult being alone in the hearing world especially my hearing family at times like suppertime, holiday times, etc - same boat as yours. Many hearing parents' deaf kids experienced like that exactly what you and I did. Never enjoy any moments except few god ones... yep, it ain't so fair to you and us to be put in. It doesn't need to be like that... I know, I know. But we have no choice but accept as it is at most times. (yet it sucks lol)

So it's a very reason why deaf friends and deaf people stay close as much as possible because of this that. So those would never be alone and have to face any discrimination and such sorts that displease them.

We indeed have seen some oralism and/or mainstream graduates getting more involved in the deaf community wherever ASL exists or is being openly used. I really think it's great for them so it helps build their self-esteem and etc.[/QUOTE]


I think it is great and not so great. Why do we, mainstreamed oral kids, have to grow up with low self-esteem issues and depression before finally having the opportunity to build self-esteem and feel good about ourselves? Where are our rights for that as children? Pretty pathetic, isnt it?
Click to expand...
 
Speech or not. It just another tool to build up skills to adapt. Don't you ever feel like adapting 1,000 times daily for hearing people. While they don't even try to adapt back to our level of communication.

My family while growing up, it was very difficult because I was the youngest and 5 years gap from the next sibling. My sister did pick up ASL to communicate and I am always grateful but she went to college and never returned home. Now when I see my sister, she no longer remember how to sign. More of gestures. My father had set the tone in the house that he demands me to learn speech and practice at home. I spent thousands of hours in speech therapy and my speech was improving a lot. I was fortunate to have deaf church to go on weekend or Wednesday to continue my ASL. They helped me to develop deaf identity but one day I had to move 2,000 miles away from everything to California. I spent 4 years of high school with no interaction with deaf community and was force to focus developing speech skills. At end of 4 years, my speech was very good but never perfect to get by. Playing on football team, they never allowed me to carry the new call play for game. That a proof why I wasn't a starter for a hearing football team.

If we had any hearing company come over for dinner, I am often lost because I am not familiar with their voices. When I ask my family member for updates, they say Its does not matter, or not important. Those are the words that furious me and drove me away from my family.

Senior year of high school, my hearing friends knew that something was wrong. They knew I was going to disappear forever. Which I kinda did... I disappeared and went to Gallaudet.

My first night as football player at Gallaudet was tough. I understood everyone's ASL but couldn't interact with them because I did not have that skill. It took me another two years to develop interaction skill with other deaf peers. Then the final 2 years, I finally was able to become like deaf growing up deaf schools.

I was fortunate to marry deaf lady from Wisconsin. Her mother is RID interpreter, her dad can sign and carry conversation, and even her sister can sign completely. And her grandparents can finger spell. I was in shock when I met her family. My wife did not understand the impact of isolation in family until she met my family. Last Christmas was her first time away from her family. She saw the huge impact of isolation in my growing up with my family. Now my wife appreciate her family more.

Today, I have not used my speech as my primary skill of communication. At Gallaudet, I learned how to adapt into skills that force hearing people to meet your level. VRS, Interpreter at any appointment, or hand written notes. I refuse to use my speech because I knew if I use the speech skill, they immediately assume that I can understand them. I have to set the tone first before I communicate. If speech, the conversation is lost. If hand written, I can get the information I needed.

That my story in nut shell!
 
:gpost::gpost::gpost:

We can only hope that at least one hearing parent insistent on oral only environments for their deaf child will read your story and be enlightened as to the fallicies of true integration based on the ability to use voice.
 
Quite true. I certainly can relate to deafbajal's post. Although I've always had very good speech even before I got implanted and I'm told that ever since I got implanted my speech doesn't sound deaf at all; my speech just hides the extent of my deafness.

Being orally raised didn't keep me from self IDing as deaf; by the fourth grade, my id as a deaf person was already firmly in place. I didn't learn ASL till I was thirteen. It's isolating to be able to be understood by others but not able to understand others.
 
jillio said:
:gpost::gpost::gpost:

We can only hope that at least one hearing parent insistent on oral only environments for their deaf child will read your story and be enlightened as to the fallicies of true integration based on the ability to use voice.
Click to expand...

you beat me to it, i was going to say something like that.

id throw in some odd bits and pieces just for foods for thoughts, and i'd admit it now, what i write is not perfect, im just chucking down idea a mixture of from my own experiences and put in some form of pesudo-social-science which has yet been investigated for academic discourses. So here goes...

But yep, now we need to expand on much mor than just family-centred experiences, and yes we all have this 'what happened out in the world' stuff too, but the links dare i say, the links are not strong in two-fold ways.
That is, the linking from missing out on things (hearing culture even?!) information, the know-how to be 'on time' for your age-appropriate-naughtyness-curiousity, (i know this is wierd to say this but tell Deaf kids stay away from marijuana, is not the same thing as telling a hearing kid, also the curiousity is even more, more so its more dangerous just to say straight out no to it, like i think deaf kids NEEDS to be more savvy on how to deal with manipulative kids, so yes the families/parents should be far more supportive in giving ideas on how to be a 'tough nut', wise, strong, self-contented, but not neccessary a know-all or taught to be arrogant (often that is a result of mistaken identity-attachment with already-arrogant silbings- but again often the deaf dont know 'why', as the hearing siblig would (cus chances are the hearing sibling is being 'shaped' to maybe take over family business later in life, whereas the deaf person is not given the same importance , if at all)

Yes, all that above can not be shared orally, because it is almost impossible and higly straining on a deaf person to recieve it all in the oral manner. no two ways about it. it just surppresses the 'real deaf person's heart down more hidden behind the puppet's mouth. awful.(while I am intrigued at why some of those 'highly successful oralist' take places on the 'board' for the Deaf-based organisation and proclaim they are 'Deaf" , really gets up my nose...they are bloody liars, and probably criminals against the Deaf-dom'

No im not a hardened Deaf, I dont believe in Deaf philiosophy like a crazed fanatic, it has its place, but and Iam also truely firmly against oralism as well it done me no good, I am isolated now as an adult I just hate it, its a fate that come from all this ridiculous priority which hearing people has place on soley on oral communication environment. It has to change. The stuggle already begun, however it is getting more trickier to overcome and eradicate the 'germs' of oralist pretending to be Deaf, taking place as an Elitist in the Deaf Board of members (why the fucking hell is that? they are a 'good job' because of good money, ego, fun to take control of the lesser educated Deafs?' whatever... or on a different slant, they may rather "be confused" WHILE, there are some silly Deafs (from the DODA background) who thinks they should be kings/queens as well, when they are being cultural-bullies.

Maturity is something that we have to be mindful as well be wary of how "mental health" or "deaf mental health" could sometimes actually be inappropriate, as i sometimes thinks its a form of 'shutting them up' and ignore the real problem of social abuse they had faced as a child or as an adult 'as failure' in the eyes of 'then-hopeful' hearing family... I just can't help it, something's is not right. Almost like, 'lets control this angry deaf person, teach them management, talk to them ' find out what make them tick' and show them how to be calm, but all this doesnt fit the bigger picture on the what Jillio's said that the big picture is where "the fallicies of true integration based on the ability to use voice" has its real effects, which is far far more dangerous than what hearing people (and D/deaf people) has estimated its magnitude of its impact.

Sorry if this is bad english I will refine this later in a future post but for now, time is pressing and i just want to contribute to this thread by throwing in a differenet light. but yeah Oralism sux big time.
 
VamPyroX said:
I know how you feel.

I was born hearing and became deaf due to neglect.

I went to a deaf institute that was oral and no sign language.

I didn't use sign language until I was 5 years ago when I moved to another state and went to a mainstream school with a deaf program. However, it wasn't ASL... it was MMS.

I didn't know anything about ASL until I went to RIT 9 years ago. Even though my friends signed ASL and I had ASL interpreters, I never knew it was "ASL". I understood them anyways. I guess it was due to being with other deaf students who used ASL while growing up. :dunno:

Today, I speak like a hearing person... but it does make a lot of people assume that I'm hearing. However, many of them are very understanding when I point out that I'm deaf.

Yet, there are some who still aren't open to me as they should considering my deafness... especially my parents.

My parents want me to date a hearing religious woman. I told them that I want a deaf non-religious person. They get mad. :roll:
Click to expand...

Why do they want the girl to be hearing?
 
deafskeptic said:
Quite true. I certainly can relate to deafbajal's post. Although I've always had very good speech even before I got implanted and I'm told that ever since I got implanted my speech doesn't sound deaf at all; my speech just hides the extent of my deafness.

Being orally raised didn't keep me from self IDing as deaf; by the fourth grade, my id as a deaf person was already firmly in place. I didn't learn ASL till I was thirteen. It's isolating to be able to be understood by others but not able to understand others.
Click to expand...

When speech hides your deafness, do you consider that a good thing or a bad thing?

Thanks for replying. :)
 
Deaf Mortgage said:
Speech or not. It just another tool to build up skills to adapt. Don't you ever feel like adapting 1,000 times daily for hearing people. While they don't even try to adapt back to our level of communication.

My family while growing up, it was very difficult because I was the youngest and 5 years gap from the next sibling. My sister did pick up ASL to communicate and I am always grateful but she went to college and never returned home. Now when I see my sister, she no longer remember how to sign. More of gestures. My father had set the tone in the house that he demands me to learn speech and practice at home. I spent thousands of hours in speech therapy and my speech was improving a lot. I was fortunate to have deaf church to go on weekend or Wednesday to continue my ASL. They helped me to develop deaf identity but one day I had to move 2,000 miles away from everything to California. I spent 4 years of high school with no interaction with deaf community and was force to focus developing speech skills. At end of 4 years, my speech was very good but never perfect to get by. Playing on football team, they never allowed me to carry the new call play for game. That a proof why I wasn't a starter for a hearing football team.

If we had any hearing company come over for dinner, I am often lost because I am not familiar with their voices. When I ask my family member for updates, they say Its does not matter, or not important. Those are the words that furious me and drove me away from my family.

Senior year of high school, my hearing friends knew that something was wrong. They knew I was going to disappear forever. Which I kinda did... I disappeared and went to Gallaudet.

My first night as football player at Gallaudet was tough. I understood everyone's ASL but couldn't interact with them because I did not have that skill. It took me another two years to develop interaction skill with other deaf peers. Then the final 2 years, I finally was able to become like deaf growing up deaf schools.

I was fortunate to marry deaf lady from Wisconsin. Her mother is RID interpreter, her dad can sign and carry conversation, and even her sister can sign completely. And her grandparents can finger spell. I was in shock when I met her family. My wife did not understand the impact of isolation in family until she met my family. Last Christmas was her first time away from her family. She saw the huge impact of isolation in my growing up with my family. Now my wife appreciate her family more.

Today, I have not used my speech as my primary skill of communication. At Gallaudet, I learned how to adapt into skills that force hearing people to meet your level. VRS, Interpreter at any appointment, or hand written notes. I refuse to use my speech because I knew if I use the speech skill, they immediately assume that I can understand them. I have to set the tone first before I communicate. If speech, the conversation is lost. If hand written, I can get the information I needed.

That my story in nut shell!
Click to expand...

Thank you for sharing. You're right...I agree that if I use my speech, people assume I'm not completely deaf - and will have a harder time accommodating. I find that if I start out using a paper and pen, then they will write back and forth - thus I get ALL of the information.

And how many times have we deafies ask for clarification or information and we get the dreaded words: "Oh, it's not important." or "Never mind." or "I'll tell you later." It infuriates me! Who are they to determine what is important or unimportant?! That's MY right to decide if that information is important to me or not.
 
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