FBI Warrants against two VRS companies and other companies

Royale · 07-12-2009, 04:57 PM

Ed’s Telecom Alert FBI Warrants and Warning

FYI: it is interesting to see how those companies have operated in alleged illegal activities.

diehardbiker · 07-12-2009, 06:15 PM

Please do not confuse between VRS and TRS, this fraud is for TRS not VRS. TRS stands for Text Relay Service, while VRS stands for Video Relay Service.

Please remember, IPrelay falls under TRS not VRS. The IPrelay is the easiest tool for any scammers scam innocent hearing victims.

It does not hit VRS much because most scammers do not know sign language, resulting harder for them to use VRS than IPrelay. That is why I stick with VRS because of this.

DHB

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royale

Ed’s Telecom Alert FBI Warrants and Warning

FYI: it is interesting to see how those companies have operated in alleged illegal activities.

Dennis · 07-12-2009, 06:55 PM

Did you read the two links to ICSD and Hawkins? They are SPECIFICALLY alleging VRS abuse, not TRS/IP. I think the parts about "interpreters" "VI" and "privacy screen" make it quite apparent it's VRS.

diehardbiker · 07-12-2009, 07:04 PM

Gee! Your right, I overlooked these two links. Thanks for pointing out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis

Did you read the two links to ICSD and Hawkins? They are SPECIFICALLY alleging VRS abuse, not TRS/IP. I think the parts about "interpreters" "VI" and "privacy screen" make it quite apparent it's VRS.

TechBill · 07-13-2009, 12:27 AM

From reading the warrant ..

It seem to me that ...

It is VRS companies cheating FCC by abusing using "Run-calls" methods

The warrant claimed that VRS companies did was hire people to call their VRS and put them on hold using private screen or ask VRS to call recording phone numbers that have a long recording to run up minutes.

And people to call VRS to run up minutes get paid 12 or 20 dollar an hour by VRS companies so VRS can bill to FCC per minutes to make a profit.

They said VRS started billing FCC about 10 million dollar then suddenly the bills jumped to 51 million dollar so they became suspectous and start invesagating and found that they were running up minutes with worthless calls or hiring outside people to call their VRS and run up minutes to have it on log to turn in for billing.

.

qwerty123 · 07-13-2009, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diehardbiker

Please do not confuse between VRS and TRS, this fraud is for TRS not VRS. TRS stands for Text Relay Service, while VRS stands for Video Relay Service.

TRS telecommunicatiosn relay service mean any relay service like tty speech video ip etc not just text

Telecommunications Relay Services

Royale · 07-13-2009, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diehardbiker

Please do not confuse between VRS and TRS, this fraud is for TRS not VRS. TRS stands for Text Relay Service, while VRS stands for Video Relay Service.

Please remember, IPrelay falls under TRS not VRS. The IPrelay is the easiest tool for any scammers scam innocent hearing victims.

It does not hit VRS much because most scammers do not know sign language, resulting harder for them to use VRS than IPrelay. That is why I stick with VRS because of this.

DHB

I did not get confused. I read the criminal complaints which were linked with PDF so I know what I have done.

Royale · 07-13-2009, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis

Did you read the two links to ICSD and Hawkins? They are SPECIFICALLY alleging VRS abuse, not TRS/IP. I think the parts about "interpreters" "VI" and "privacy screen" make it quite apparent it's VRS.

Correct

Royale · 07-13-2009, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TechBill

From reading the warrant ..

It seem to me that ...

It is VRS companies cheating FCC by abusing using "Run-calls" methods

The warrant claimed that VRS companies did was hire people to call their VRS and put them on hold using private screen or ask VRS to call recording phone numbers that have a long recording to run up minutes.

And people to call VRS to run up minutes get paid 12 or 20 dollar an hour by VRS companies so VRS can bill to FCC per minutes to make a profit.

They said VRS started billing FCC about 10 million dollar then suddenly the bills jumped to 51 million dollar so they became suspectous and start invesagating and found that they were running up minutes with worthless calls or hiring outside people to call their VRS and run up minutes to have it on log to turn in for billing.

.

You are basically right.

Phillips · 07-13-2009, 08:14 AM

Wow *shake head*

diehardbiker · 07-13-2009, 10:04 AM

I overlooked two links, of course your right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royale

I did not get confused. I read the criminal complaints which were linked with PDF so I know what I have done.

diehardbiker · 07-13-2009, 10:04 AM

Correct

Quote:

Originally Posted by qwerty123

TRS telecommunicatiosn relay service mean any relay service like tty speech video ip etc not just text

Telecommunications Relay Services

diehardbiker · 07-13-2009, 10:09 AM

After re-read the whole document, diguesting...

What it means is that one of these scumbag VRS terp agreed to get a call from another country, then leave it as "Park" with privacy mode enabled which results generating the minutes on call from FCC.

This kind of abuse should never be tolerated.

darkage · 07-13-2009, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qwerty123

TRS telecommunicatiosn relay service mean any relay service like tty speech video ip etc not just text

I was going to say no matter what kind of equipment like TTY, TDD, VP, text message, IM but I found qwerty123's first message.
Telecommuncation Relay is use any devices. Just communcation between you and your relay service.

Yes, I agree with qwerty123.

I seem that Hawkins is fraud???? NO TIME FOR ME TO READ. I have to go to see doctor for my heart (not want happen like Billy Mays) at 11am.
Let you read this information....
http://www.edsalert.com/wp-content/u...lcomplaint.pdf

Mrs Bucket · 07-13-2009, 12:10 PM

This is where I do need to state my need to type instead of sign to Viable operators and other VRS operators when they won't sign for me. Some of them will disconnect & I have to call them back, explain to them I'm not able to view 3D being DeafBlind.

They will state FCC regulations and I tell them that there leaves a margin for human error.

Chevy57 · 07-16-2009, 09:18 AM

Story from Maryland newspaper is scary that FBI had visited Viable VRS Headquarters.

Feds probe Rockville video company

chazlcom · 07-16-2009, 10:51 AM

Viable is company 2 in the FBI warrant application. Company 1 is CAC out of Flint, Michigan.

Thanks for the article on Viable. Not much has been released on VRS fraud, but I hear a number of VIs (or CAs, or VRS interpreters, whatever you want to call them) have been served with subpoenas.

Just be certain that this whole situation will get much worse before it gets better.

Royale · 07-16-2009, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chazlcom

Viable is company 2 in the FBI warrant application. Company 1 is CAC out of Flint, Michigan.

Thanks for the article on Viable. Not much has been released on VRS fraud, but I hear a number of VIs (or CAs, or VRS interpreters, whatever you want to call them) have been served with subpoenas.

Just be certain that this whole situation will get much worse before it gets better.

What surprised me is Viable is not certified as a VRS company, but still they are able to operate. If the VRS company is not certified, then they should not operate as a VRS company. period. That is my opinion.

PowerON · 07-16-2009, 11:25 AM

I'm not familiar with both VRS companies. Wow, they're sure in trouble.

Chevy57 · 07-16-2009, 11:52 AM

Some rumor said FCC had found that Viable VRS minutes were over than limit. They may cut them. Not sure.

RedWolf · 07-16-2009, 06:36 PM

Also there was concerns about Swat calls using TRS as well...

FOXNews.com - Prank 911 Calls Send SWAT Teams to Unsuspecting Homes - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News

But good news they already caught the guy who did the Swat Prank calls for three years!

Local News | Mukilteo teen gets 3 years for prank SWAT call | Seattle Times Newspaper

I think those are another reason why TRS is being investigated, I am not sure what they are investigating but that's what I think they are doing right now...

TerpCoda · 07-20-2009, 10:38 AM

Diehardbiker - you said: "After re-read the whole document, diguesting...

What it means is that one of these scumbag VRS terp agreed to get a call from another country, then leave it as "Park" with privacy mode enabled which results generating the minutes on call from FCC.

This kind of abuse should never be tolerated. "

You are right, this kind of abuse should never be tolerated, but you are pointing your finger at the wrong person. You assume it is the "scumbag VRS interpreter" as you put it, who is to blame. As an employee, we have no choice in what kind of calls we interpret. We are not VRS Police, we cannot decide which calls we want to or don't want to interpret. We have NO IDEA what kind of call is coming in when our phone rings.
Your finger should be pointed at the Management of the VRS company, who organized and planned these fraudulent calls...these managers told their VRS interpreters to go ahead and process these FAKE calls. You should be angry with the Owners and Management who PAID deaf people to call in and INTENTIONALLY defraud the government. Your finger should be pointed at the Deaf people who accepted the offer to be paid to make multiple bogus VRS calls just to increase minutes for Viable. Shame on them! THEY make this look bad, not the VRS interpreters who finally stood up for what was right.

Viable and CAC have been doing this for at least 5 years. I was an employee at another company that worked with CAC for a brief period. We had the same calls there.
Yes, Viable/CAC PAID deaf people to call in and leave running calls for many hours at a time. Some of those deaf callers even had more than one VP in their home, and VIs could see several calls running at the same time. Yes, Viable/CAC told these deaf people to tell the VRS interpreters "you don't have to interpret, put on privacy screen and go get coffee or something..." And Viable/CAC told their interpreters to go ahead and process these bogus calls.

So who is the REAL scumbag?

diehardbiker · 07-20-2009, 10:47 AM

Im just saying in general, what it means I have no idea who this person have committed crime. Your right it is possible the management did, or the management ask terp to do them favor, can it happen? You can bet on it.

I consider everybody at this point not guilty, that is I rather wait until the judgement points to specific person or group then I would call em scumbags.

The only concern that I have is that FCC may increase scrutiny against all TRS providers which can decrease quality and increase the costs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TerpCoda

Diehardbiker - you said: "After re-read the whole document, diguesting...

What it means is that one of these scumbag VRS terp agreed to get a call from another country, then leave it as "Park" with privacy mode enabled which results generating the minutes on call from FCC.

This kind of abuse should never be tolerated. "

You are right, this kind of abuse should never be tolerated, but you are pointing your finger at the wrong person. You assume it is the "scumbag VRS interpreter" as you put it, who is to blame. As an employee, we have no choice in what kind of calls we interpret. We are not VRS Police, we cannot decide which calls we want to or don't want to interpret. We have NO IDEA what kind of call is coming in when our phone rings.
Your finger should be pointed at the Management of the VRS company, who organized and planned these fraudulent calls...these managers told their VRS interpreters to go ahead and process these FAKE calls. You should be angry with the Owners and Management who PAID deaf people to call in and INTENTIONALLY defraud the government. Your finger should be pointed at the Deaf people who accepted the offer to be paid to make multiple bogus VRS calls just to increase minutes for Viable. Shame on them! THEY make this look bad, not the VRS interpreters who finally stood up for what was right.

Viable and CAC have been doing this for at least 5 years. I was an employee at another company that worked with CAC for a brief period. We had the same calls there.
Yes, Viable/CAC PAID deaf people to call in and leave running calls for many hours at a time. Some of those deaf callers even had more than one VP in their home, and VIs could see several calls running at the same time. Yes, Viable/CAC told these deaf people to tell the VRS interpreters "you don't have to interpret, put on privacy screen and go get coffee or something..." And Viable/CAC told their interpreters to go ahead and process these bogus calls.

So who is the REAL scumbag?

yizuman · 07-20-2009, 12:40 PM

Is Sorenson VRS on the hit list in this warrant?

PowerON · 07-20-2009, 12:56 PM

From what I hear that Sorenson is also in trouble on something....

Kalista · 07-20-2009, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PowerON

From what I hear that Sorenson is also in trouble on something....

Like what ?

PowerON · 07-20-2009, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalista

Like what ?

there is no specs on what FBI been spy on Sorenson.

Chevy57 · 07-20-2009, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PowerON

there is no specs on what FBI been spy on Sorenson.

Mr White Spy as FBI vs Mr. Black Spy as Sorenson.

scottw · 07-20-2009, 05:56 PM

I tired to hear about FBI. Who fault. I don't think VRS company, or something. NO idea!

Chevy57 · 07-21-2009, 05:43 AM

The FCC has very strict rules regarding ASA. ASA means “Average Speed of Answer.” This is the amount of time it takes for our system to “answer” a call that comes in. VRS companies do not want to call VRS and have to wait, wait, and wait for the VI to come on the screen FCC put in rules that all calls have to be answered in certain amount of time. FCC fine any VRS company for being slow to answer calls within ASA established time limits.

If you can wait VI to answer call that comes in for five minutes or over, must hang up.

07-12-2009, 04:57 PM	#1 (permalink)
Royale Eek Doggah! Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: World's Second Coldest Capital City! Posts: 1,907	FBI Warrants against two VRS companies and other companies Ed’s Telecom Alert FBI Warrants and Warning FYI: it is interesting to see how those companies have operated in alleged illegal activities.

07-13-2009, 08:14 AM	#10 (permalink)
Phillips Lets ride horses! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Spaceship Posts: 9,158 Blog Entries: 3	Wow shake head __________________ *Enjoy life today, Yesterday has past and Tomorrow may never come.*

07-13-2009, 10:09 AM	#13 (permalink)
diehardbiker Stuck in New York! Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 7,165	After re-read the whole document, diguesting... What it means is that one of these scumbag VRS terp agreed to get a call from another country, then leave it as "Park" with privacy mode enabled which results generating the minutes on call from FCC. This kind of abuse should never be tolerated. __________________ Please do not follow unless your driving REAL 4x4 with LOW! FUN is standard...PAVEMENT is optional.... Plus Jeep Wrangler owner too.

07-13-2009, 12:10 PM	#15 (permalink)
Mrs Bucket has retired from AllDeaf. Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 2,348	This is where I do need to state my need to type instead of sign to Viable operators and other VRS operators when they won't sign for me. Some of them will disconnect & I have to call them back, explain to them I'm not able to view 3D being DeafBlind. They will state FCC regulations and I tell them that there leaves a margin for human error. __________________ My new nieces/nephews are arriving soon!

07-16-2009, 09:18 AM	#16 (permalink)
Chevy57 Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Buckeye State Posts: 5,406	Story from Maryland newspaper is scary that FBI had visited Viable VRS Headquarters. Feds probe Rockville video company __________________

Today
Deafness	Sponsored Links __________________ This advertising will not be shown in this way to registered members. Register your free account today and become a member on AllDeaf.com

07-12-2009, 06:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
Dennis \/ It's a computer patch. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Death Star HQ Posts: 1,804	Did you read the two links to ICSD and Hawkins? They are SPECIFICALLY alleging VRS abuse, not TRS/IP. I think the parts about "interpreters" "VI" and "privacy screen" make it quite apparent it's VRS.

07-13-2009, 12:27 AM	#5 (permalink)
TechBill Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 838	From reading the warrant .. It seem to me that ... It is VRS companies cheating FCC by abusing using "Run-calls" methods The warrant claimed that VRS companies did was hire people to call their VRS and put them on hold using private screen or ask VRS to call recording phone numbers that have a long recording to run up minutes. And people to call VRS to run up minutes get paid 12 or 20 dollar an hour by VRS companies so VRS can bill to FCC per minutes to make a profit. They said VRS started billing FCC about 10 million dollar then suddenly the bills jumped to 51 million dollar so they became suspectous and start invesagating and found that they were running up minutes with worthless calls or hiring outside people to call their VRS and run up minutes to have it on log to turn in for billing. .

07-16-2009, 10:51 AM	#17 (permalink)
chazlcom Registered User Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3	Viable Viable is company 2 in the FBI warrant application. Company 1 is CAC out of Flint, Michigan. Thanks for the article on Viable. Not much has been released on VRS fraud, but I hear a number of VIs (or CAs, or VRS interpreters, whatever you want to call them) have been served with subpoenas. Just be certain that this whole situation will get much worse before it gets better.

07-16-2009, 11:25 AM	#19 (permalink)
PowerON Click me 12 time Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Suddenly, I'm cowboy. Posts: 6,863 Blog Entries: 4	I'm not familiar with both VRS companies. Wow, they're sure in trouble. __________________ • [Illustrator.Blog-alloon.com] • Don't shoot me! I'm only blogger!

07-16-2009, 11:52 AM	#20 (permalink)
Chevy57 Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Buckeye State Posts: 5,406	Some rumor said FCC had found that Viable VRS minutes were over than limit. They may cut them. Not sure. __________________

07-16-2009, 06:36 PM	#21 (permalink)
RedWolf I'm Very Hungry! Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Port Richey, FL Posts: 1,704	Also there was concerns about Swat calls using TRS as well... FOXNews.com - Prank 911 Calls Send SWAT Teams to Unsuspecting Homes - Local News \| News Articles \| National News \| US News But good news they already caught the guy who did the Swat Prank calls for three years! Local News \| Mukilteo teen gets 3 years for prank SWAT call \| Seattle Times Newspaper I think those are another reason why TRS is being investigated, I am not sure what they are investigating but that's what I think they are doing right now... __________________

07-20-2009, 10:38 AM	#22 (permalink)
TerpCoda Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 2	Diehardbiker - you said: "After re-read the whole document, diguesting... What it means is that one of these scumbag VRS terp agreed to get a call from another country, then leave it as "Park" with privacy mode enabled which results generating the minutes on call from FCC. This kind of abuse should never be tolerated. " You are right, this kind of abuse should never be tolerated, but you are pointing your finger at the wrong person. You assume it is the "scumbag VRS interpreter" as you put it, who is to blame. As an employee, we have no choice in what kind of calls we interpret. We are not VRS Police, we cannot decide which calls we want to or don't want to interpret. We have NO IDEA what kind of call is coming in when our phone rings. Your finger should be pointed at the Management of the VRS company, who organized and planned these fraudulent calls...these managers told their VRS interpreters to go ahead and process these FAKE calls. You should be angry with the Owners and Management who PAID deaf people to call in and INTENTIONALLY defraud the government. Your finger should be pointed at the Deaf people who accepted the offer to be paid to make multiple bogus VRS calls just to increase minutes for Viable. Shame on them! THEY make this look bad, not the VRS interpreters who finally stood up for what was right. Viable and CAC have been doing this for at least 5 years. I was an employee at another company that worked with CAC for a brief period. We had the same calls there. Yes, Viable/CAC PAID deaf people to call in and leave running calls for many hours at a time. Some of those deaf callers even had more than one VP in their home, and VIs could see several calls running at the same time. Yes, Viable/CAC told these deaf people to tell the VRS interpreters "you don't have to interpret, put on privacy screen and go get coffee or something..." And Viable/CAC told their interpreters to go ahead and process these bogus calls. So who is the REAL scumbag?

07-20-2009, 12:40 PM	#24 (permalink)
yizuman Sci Fi Fan Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Indiana Posts: 725	Is Sorenson VRS on the hit list in this warrant? __________________

07-20-2009, 12:56 PM	#25 (permalink)
PowerON Click me 12 time Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Suddenly, I'm cowboy. Posts: 6,863 Blog Entries: 4	From what I hear that Sorenson is also in trouble on something.... __________________ • [Illustrator.Blog-alloon.com] • Don't shoot me! I'm only blogger!

07-20-2009, 05:56 PM	#29 (permalink)
scottw Registered User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Crestview, Florida Posts: 848	I tired to hear about FBI. Who fault. I don't think VRS company, or something. NO idea!

07-21-2009, 05:43 AM	#30 (permalink)
Chevy57 Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Buckeye State Posts: 5,406	The FCC has very strict rules regarding ASA. ASA means “Average Speed of Answer.” This is the amount of time it takes for our system to “answer” a call that comes in. VRS companies do not want to call VRS and have to wait, wait, and wait for the VI to come on the screen FCC put in rules that all calls have to be answered in certain amount of time. FCC fine any VRS company for being slow to answer calls within ASA established time limits. If you can wait VI to answer call that comes in for five minutes or over, must hang up. __________________

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode