The Ugly Truth of CI

[jackiesolorzano]

We will never work in the White house, why this is the same adminstration that also believes that students with disabilities and ELL should be 100% proficient on state testing. No Child Left Behind is the biggest mess and should be called All Child Left Behind. (my opinion)

The problem is there is no answer - we forget to take into account that every child and adult is different. We can't give a uniform policy. I'm oral and love it. Your ASL and love it. I am against being told I should have learned ASL to function. Your against being told you must be oral. I would never be able to put my child in a residental school. Also not all children are visual learners. Some are auditory(me) and Kinesthetic or even tactile. We have to take into account that not all children or adults will fit the in one group.

So what I see in this forum is instead of working together we isolate and form groups the anti and for. Instead of empowering parents and adults in choices and resources. We should never force people to pick sides. They should be able to have the best of both sides. If they make a choice for CIs then they should be able to be welcomed and encouraged. I kept seeing medical professionals bashed. My doctors and audiologicst have been the best. Even back to the ones I had in college.

Instead of celebrating our diversity, we encourage uniformity.

RIGHT ON, that was so well said. I agree with you 100%. We each have the right to believe in what we want to believe in. We have the right to make the choices we want to make. I am all for kids just being oral, or just being ASL, or being a combination approach. But it is my decision to make until my children are old enough to make their own decision, which can do now.

 

[Tousi]

The bottom line axiom of Deafhood says to embrace ALL deaf people, whether they be oral, hearing aid wearers, HoH, ASL cultural badge-carrying people....EVERYBODY. That said, the discussions for changes within the educaltional setting needs to lead to a result that the emphasis should be on adopting an ASL/English model that works for all. Those proponents need to be in line with everyone else from the moment of birth to assist the parents in making a choice.

Yelling, screaming, insulting parents by ASL, CI folks, etc only serves to send scare parents away from that choice.

 

[jillio]

Wrong. A deaf person who because of a cochlear implant has access to sound that they previously did not have is not "less" deaf but a deaf person who has access to sound that they previously did not have.

Nice try to use semantics, but it isn't working. By definition, a person who has more access to sound falls into a category of functionally less deaf. Go read an audiogram.

 

[jillio]

Once again, you have demonstrated your unhealthy obsession with my child and how she was raised. You have also lied, as is usual.

I have said many times that since she was first diagnosed, my daughter has been around deaf adults and deaf children. She has many deaf friends and enjoys being with them.

Please stop lying about a child whom you have never met.

Backpedaling again. You have already told everyone on this forum that you do not sign, you have never signed, and your daughter only learned some sign after high school. You have also admitted that your contact with deaf individuals has been largely limited to oral only deaf individuals, that you subscribe to the views of the A.G. Bell Assoc., that you accessed early intervention materials from John Tracy, and that you believe that the most important objective in raising a deaf child is to provide amplification through surgery and oral training.

The only person that consistently lies around here is you, and everyone is aware of that. So instead of trying to deflect the topic, address the fact that you raised your daughter as oral only. You are trying to sidestep that fact in order to regain the credibility you lost a long time ago. It isn't working.

 

[shel90]

I am not saying all deaf babies need to get an implant but what I am saying if a deaf baby is going to get an implant the earlier the better. The reason is that that purpose of an implant is to help develop oral language then a deaf baby needs to get implant as soon as possible so they do not lose any more time in being exposed to oral language. Maybe you are not aware but there are babies getting implant at 12 months.

Oh really? If that's so how was I and many other deaf people without implants were able to develop good oral skills? Be careful what you say. Just like before implants, some deaf people could develop oral skills while others do not as today even with implants, there are still some who are unable to develop oral skills. Implants do not guarantee success with oral language for all deaf children. The deaf children do not "need" to get implanted as deafness is not a life-threatening condition but people "want" them to get implanted. Big difference.

 

[jillio]

RIGHT ON Angel, No one is going to tell me the choices I need to make for my children. While I agree with many of you there are parents that make uninformed decisions. This is what needs to change. There needs to be one universal model that all implants center have to follow.

I made informed decisions for my children. I spoke to deaf children or Deaf adults. I spoke to Deaf adults. I spoke to oral deaf adults. And I read everything there was to know about implants. It was not an easy decision to make but I am so happy I did.

I am not trying to take my children's deafness away. Many people including Deaf adults have told my children that they are hard of hearing. I have always told my children they are deaf. That they are HH with their devices on but they are born deaf and they will die deaf.

Read on, jackie. Angel misunderstood what I was saying and we straightened that out and are actually in agreement. Obviously, you are still in a state of misunderstanding.

 

[shel90]

Once again, you have demonstrated your unhealthy obsession with my child and how she was raised. You have also lied, as is usual.

I have said many times that since she was first diagnosed, my daughter has been around deaf adults and deaf children. She has many deaf friends and enjoys being with them.

Please stop lying about a child whom you have never met.

Your daughter has been around both oral and signing deaf adults/children or just oral deaf adults/children only?

 

[jillio]

I am not saying all deaf babies need to get an implant but what I am saying if a deaf baby is going to get an implant the earlier the better. The reason is that that purpose of an implant is to help develop oral language then a deaf baby needs to get implant as soon as possible so they do not lose any more time in being exposed to oral language. Maybe you are not aware but there are babies getting implant at 12 months.

The purpose of an implant is to provide increased sound perception. You are assuming that oral language is a desired and natural consequence of that. Many Ci implantees never develop oral language, nor is it the primary goal of getting an implant. Again, from the ethnocentric hearing perspective.

 

[jillio]

You are making judgments about parents. Have you spoken to parents that have made the decision to implant their child.
I have. As for me I am not ashamed of my amazing, brilliant teenagers that are deaf and have implants. I am so proud of them.
I decided to implant my children to give them more choices in life. My children if they want can go into the hearing community. Or if they want into the Deaf community.

And I am proud of my amazing, Deaf brilliant son who doesn't have an implant. But that has nothing to do with the topic, nor does your pride in your children. Nor does greater choice automaticaly transfer to implantation. My son, as well, can live in hearing community or the Deaf community. His choice. He functions well in the hearing community on a daily basis. Inf act, he is better able to communicate in the hearing world than is his implanted roommate who, despite implantation at an early age, never developed oral language to the degree that he can speak intelliglbly. I don't see how implantation gave that kid more choices. Nor do I see how implantation would have given my son more choice. He can speak, he can use PSE, SEE, and ASL. He can read and write at a college level. And, get this...all without an implant. That "more choices with an implant" is an argument adopted by the medically based professionals to prey upon the fears of hearing parents. It sounds like a convincing argument, but only if you don't look at it very deeply.

 

[shel90]

And I am proud of my amazing, Deaf brilliant son who doesn't have an implant. But that has nothing to do with the topic, nor does your pride in your children. Nor does greater choice automaticaly transfer to implantation. My son, as well, can live in hearing community or the Deaf community. His choice. He functions well in the hearing community on a daily basis. Inf act, he is better able to communicate in the hearing world than is his implanted roommate who, despite implantation at an early age, never developed oral language to the degree that he can speak intelliglbly. I don't see how implantation gave that kid more choices. Nor do I see how implantation would have given my son more choice. He can speak, he can use PSE, SEE, and ASL. He can read and write at a college level. And, get this...all without an implant. That "more choices with an implant" is an argument adopted by the medically based professionals to prey upon the fears of hearing parents. It sounds like a convincing argument, but only if you don't look at it very deeply.

I agree...I am so sick and tired of this saying "If you want your deaf child to have more opportunities, get your child implanted" or "your child will have more opportunities if he or she gets implanted."

Geez...every person whether implanted or not make that choice to have more opportunities or not.

Funny, all the people at my work with impants dont hold college degrees and earn less money but the deaf people with the college degrees who earn more money are the ones without the implants. Go figure. Their choice..the implant has nothing to do with it. It depends on the individual.

 

[rick48]

Nice try to use semantics, but it isn't working. By definition, a person who has more access to sound falls into a category of functionally less deaf. Go read an audiogram.

Not semantics just a fact. A person with a ci is deaf regardless of how well they do with their ci. They just can hear a hell of a lot better!

 

[deafdyke]

I would be all for something like making sure that all parents thinking about getting an implant have to go through some classes to make sure they understand the benefits and the risks

Or maybe mandatory psychological counseling, just to filter out the parents who are obessed with the fact that their kids aren't "healthy" and normally hearing. I do see some parents like that, parents who just can't deal with the fact that their kid is "different."
It's a very real problem.
And sorry if you feel like we're ganging up on you, but Shel and jillo are right. An implant doesn't automaticly mean that a kid will be able to learn to hear and speak. There are a lot of severe and profounders who get quite a bit of benifit from HAs. Matter of fact, years ago there was an auditory-verbal trained kid who could speak about seven different languages. (and this was in the sixites) Even back in the days when HAs were first widely prescribed there were some kids who did well orally !

 

[rick48]

Backpedaling again. You have already told everyone on this forum that you do not sign, you have never signed, and your daughter only learned some sign after high school. You have also admitted that your contact with deaf individuals has been largely limited to oral only deaf individuals, that you subscribe to the views of the A.G. Bell Assoc., that you accessed early intervention materials from John Tracy, and that you believe that the most important objective in raising a deaf child is to provide amplification through surgery and oral training.

The only person that consistently lies around here is you, and everyone is aware of that. So instead of trying to deflect the topic, address the fact that you raised your daughter as oral only. You are trying to sidestep that fact in order to regain the credibility you lost a long time ago. It isn't working.

Backpedaling? I came right upfront and called you exactly what you are" aliar who is obsessed with a child she has never met. Where did I say that I "subscribe to the views of AG Bell"? Where have I said "that the most important objective in raising a deaf child is to provide amplification through surgery and oral training" please show me that post? If not, then you exactly what I called you--a liar.

Regain credibility? I have already raised a successfully mainstreamed oral deaf child (something you have not), that is my credibility. What your little sycophants on this forum, and especially you, think of me is of no concern to me.

Its the parents of deaf children that I post for.

 

[rick48]

Your daughter has been around both oral and signing deaf adults/children or just oral deaf adults/children only?

Why are you making that distinction?

 

[Bear]

Mod Note: Thread closed for further review. May reopen in a few days.