So-called Terps- Sending Deaf PPL to Hell

shel90 said:
It could be transliteration if it is a Power Point Presentation of the sermon.
Click to expand...


shel90- Or simply reading the sermon instead of hearing it.
 
loml said:
shel90- Or simply reading the sermon instead of hearing it.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but that loses the essential -life- that interpreting provides- you're receiving a message from SOMEONE through an interpreter, not reading off some display screen in the background. Interpreting is also essential if the person wants to actively participate in events like Bible study, where everyone is involved in the conversations.

All that aside, some people cannot effectively access projected printed text- if English is not their first language (as is the case with most Deaf signers) they may not understand the entire message- of course, this isnt always the case, but it's certainly worth consideration. Also, people with even mild vision problems can have trouble seeing the screen, to say nothing of people like me who are deafblind.
 
Aleser said:
Yeah, but that loses the essential -life- that interpreting provides- you're receiving a message from SOMEONE through an interpreter, not reading off some display screen in the background. Interpreting is also essential if the person wants to actively participate in events like Bible study, where everyone is involved in the conversations.

All that aside, some people cannot effectively access projected printed text- if English is not their first language (as is the case with most Deaf signers) they may not understand the entire message- of course, this isnt always the case, but it's certainly worth consideration. Also, people with even mild vision problems can have trouble seeing the screen, to say nothing of people like me who are deafblind.
Click to expand...

Excellent points.
 
loml said:
Reba - I have seen PPT and proxima used for sermons. Is it used instead of interpreters? I honestly cannot answer that.
Click to expand...

Then why did you suggest it as an accommodation possibility intsead a qualified terp? The OP was asking about terps. And PPT is rarely word for word transcription but highlighted points that are elaborated on by the speaker. How, exactly do you propose that one access the ad lib speech that goes along with the PPT presentation without a terp? Or do you expect that one should just settle for being able to access some of the information? Same with proxima.
 
loml said:
Reba - I have seen PPT and proxima used for sermons. Is it used instead of interpreters? I honestly cannot answer that.
Click to expand...
I've never seen it used in a regular church service, so I don't know. :dunno:
 
Aleser said:
Yeah, but that loses the essential -life- that interpreting provides- you're receiving a message from SOMEONE through an interpreter, not reading off some display screen in the background. Interpreting is also essential if the person wants to actively participate in events like Bible study, where everyone is involved in the conversations.

All that aside, some people cannot effectively access projected printed text- if English is not their first language (as is the case with most Deaf signers) they may not understand the entire message- of course, this isnt always the case, but it's certainly worth consideration. Also, people with even mild vision problems can have trouble seeing the screen, to say nothing of people like me who are deafblind.
Click to expand...


All fine points Aleser.

PPT and Proxima can/is used and is a viable option. It comes down to what the individual needs are.
 
loml said:
Reba

reba - Why?
Click to expand...
Some Deaf individuals don't have the reading skills required for the speed and comprehension level in that kind of presentation. Church services also use a lot of specialized vocabulary that unchurched folks might not be familiar with and require expansion.

Besides, who really wants to read preaching and songs. There's no life to it. And what about the parts of a service that aren't on the screen? And how about personal introductions and fellowship? What about answering questions? Might as well stay home and watch captioned church services.
 
Reba said:
Some Deaf individuals don't have the reading skills required for the speed and comprehension level in that kind of presentation. Church services also use a lot of specialized vocabulary that unchurched folks might not be familiar with and require expansion.

Besides, who really wants to read preaching and songs. There's no life to it. And what about the parts of a service that aren't on the screen? And how about personal introductions and fellowship? What about answering questions? Might as well stay home and watch captioned church services.
Click to expand...

Reba - I underrstand what you are saying. Myself, I do not agree with this portion of your post: Besides, who really wants to read preaching and songs. There's no life to it

The words themselves can come alive for a proficient reader. Also, I believe that being part of the body of the congregation, in and of itself, is very powerful.

deafbajagal
Here's my problem...for the churches that have interpreted services - the interpreters are not really interpreters - they are people who "know some sign language." Now I'm talking about HUGE churches that should be financially able to provide certified interpreters. So far all of them said they will not provide one (when I asked). A few said, "Sorry - we don't have a deaf ministry" - as if they must have one to get an interpreter.
Click to expand...


I am looking for a solution that fits the above situation. What is yours?
 
This reminds me of a guy I knew from middle and high school. He wanted to interpret at a church and they told him to come back after taking a sign language class. So he wanted to start sign language classes at the high school for that plus for getting foreign language credit.

He even did a petition and when I asked him how many signatures he wanted, he pointed to the sign in the middle school cafeteria that said max occ 1200. I don't think there were that many students in the middle and high schools combined.

He wanted to do this despite having some kind of condition with his hands that made it hard for him to write, much less sign. It would be a disaster if he tried to interpret for anything. He met with the school board to discuss this and they turned it down because they couldn't find anyone to teach those classes. He was even in the news with an article plus a letter to the editor by his mother, which included an unedited copy of his own letter full of spelling errors as an special exception from the usual spellchecking.

Some of my friends at university go to a church that had a lousy interpreter who didn't sign the right signs and looked behind her all the time at the projected screen to see what to sign. I thought that were what her ears were for. The church also provided free food for dinner that included lots of cooked foods and desserts. The interpreter would pig out by taking too much. One of my friends said she took one or two whole pizzas for herself. They got rid of her and replaced her with someone I knew who signed better.
 
RedFox said:
Some of my friends at university go to a church that had a lousy interpreter who didn't sign the right signs and looked behind her all the time at the projected screen to see what to sign. I thought that were what her ears were for.
Click to expand...
This is acceptable the first or second time you are there. Sometimes the arrangement of the room is not good and it is hard to hear the presenter. If the loudspeaker is in front of you, then it is projecting sound away from you which makes it hard to hear. Also, sometimes interpreters do miss things and they can get it from the screen without having to interrupt the person who is talking.

After the 1st or 2nd time though, the terp needs to talk to the presenter. The room should be rearranged so the terp can hear better (assuming the furniture is movable...I have seen some churches where it is very elaborate and bolted down!) and/or the terp should ask for the person's notes or a copy of the PPT so they can follow what is happening.

There used to be a product called the TerpMirror, it was two small mirrors on a special stand, you would put it next to you and set it up so it would reflect the screen for you. I used it once and didn't like it...I don't think anybody else did either because I haven't seen that product in a very long time.
 
Etoile said:
This is acceptable the first or second time you are there. Sometimes the arrangement of the room is not good and it is hard to hear the presenter. If the loudspeaker is in front of you, then it is projecting sound away from you which makes it hard to hear. Also, sometimes interpreters do miss things and they can get it from the screen without having to interrupt the person who is talking.

After the 1st or 2nd time though, the terp needs to talk to the presenter. The room should be rearranged so the terp can hear better (assuming the furniture is movable...I have seen some churches where it is very elaborate and bolted down!) and/or the terp should ask for the person's notes or a copy of the PPT so they can follow what is happening.

There used to be a product called the TerpMirror, it was two small mirrors on a special stand, you would put it next to you and set it up so it would reflect the screen for you. I used it once and didn't like it...I don't think anybody else did either because I haven't seen that product in a very long time.
Click to expand...
Good points. Where I sit as a terp in our church, the sound "skips" my position, like a dead zone. I have to really concentrate to catch everything. My church doesn't use a screen during regular services, and I don't get any "notes" so I depend on my own two ears or my terp team for understanding.

I've seen ads for the terp mirrors but they were too expensive for me to buy without a lot of justification. I like the concept but maybe the actual product needed some tweaking?

School settings are just as bad. If the instructor is behind me pointing to things on the board or screen, and says, "Then move this number from this column to this side of the ledger." Huh? Or how about, "It's normally this tall but can sometimes be this short and this wide, and curves like this." OK. :D
 
deafbajagal said:
So-called terps - stop risking sending Deaf people to Hell - because your interpreting skills just might not be as good as you think.
Click to expand...

I am really sorry you're having trouble finding access and I think it's great you're getting involved yourself trying to find it (as opposed to just sitting around complaining about it); however I find this statement very hateful.
 
I'm not too picky, I would eventually go to a church that provides interpreters even if the interpreters aren't certified interpreters. If I am being understood what's being said, then there's no reason for me to complain.
 
You are so right, every church should have and interpreter, if they dont, in my opinion, they are not showing or acting like Jesus, but whatever you do, dont give up, you might be the only one who can make a difference. I will pray that God will send his army of angels to help you fight this battle....God Bless You
 
I am so terribly sorry that happens to you, But can always fight for it by going to the ADA and work something out with your pastor. I used to go to church long time ago, sometimes I still do go, it denpend on my moods. But they always have interpreter there and they do pretty good. Some interpreters do make mistakes which they are not always 100% perfect. I don't expect interpreters to be 110% of the time to be perfect but they can improve their service a little better and work on it. :)
 
deafbajagal said:
I moved to a new big city a few months ago. So I've been looking for a chruch with interpreted services -or at least, a church who is willing to provide intepreters. I've called over 50 (at least) churches.

Here's my problem...for the churches that have interpreted services - the interpreters are not really interpreters - they are people who "know some sign language." Now I'm talking about HUGE churches that should be financially able to provide certified interpreters. So far all of them said they will not provide one (when I asked). A few said, "Sorry - we don't have a deaf ministry" - as if they must have one to get an interpreter.

Why is it that when it comes to medical situations and legal situations, it is generally agreed that the interpreter should be certified and qualified. However, for church situations- it seems that anyone can be "good enough." We're talking about people's SALVATION AND SOULS - preparing for the everlasting life and all that. How can the people who call themselves interpreters (when they are not) and the churches who let them do it sleep at night? If you are one of the people "who can sign some" and acting as an interpreter - it is possible you are helping to send Deaf people to Hell since they are not getting the full access to the message. Believe me - you're not doing us any favors. As long as there are people who will do "some signing," many churches are not going to invest the time and money to make sure good interpreters are being provided. I'm sorry if I sound ungrateful - but the bottom line is, I have the right to a FULL access to God's Word - and I have the right to make sure I'm getting the full message to ensure my salvation and ticket to Heaven. So-called terps - stop risking sending Deaf people to Hell - because your interpreting skills just might not be as good as you think.
Click to expand...


The only difference between some interpreters here and people who have just taken asl 1-6 is that the interpreters are certified. I met an interpreter once who was fully certified but on her transcript she only had asl 1-3. She told me she just did lots of practice.

I guess what i am saying, is it really depeneds on the person and their skill level. Granted, someone who has just taken asl is not an interpreter, but if their skill level is high enough I would not object to them informally signing for me.
 
If you lived here you could go to the lighthouse church. The church has like 3rid certified interpreters in the congregation and a couple of asl teachers. i am sorry you had to go through all this.
 
jasin said:
The only difference between some interpreters here and people who have just taken asl 1-6 is that the interpreters are certified. I met an interpreter once who was fully certified but on her transcript she only had asl 1-3. She told me she just did lots of practice.

I guess what i am saying, is it really depeneds on the person and their skill level. Granted, someone who has just taken asl is not an interpreter, but if their skill level is high enough I would not object to them informally signing for me.
Click to expand...

Agreed. It takes much, much more than just knowing ASL to be a terp.
 
Silentwolfdog said:
Have you tried to contact deaf people in that city? They might have some information on which churches have interpreters or deaf services.

But I find it strange for a big city to not have this type of services. Even my small town have interpreters volunteering to give their services and about 45 minutes from my town there's a deaf priest (or something) in one of church.

I am curious as of what is others' opinions on this info you have brought up.
Click to expand...

Yep, I called every chruch that some of the d/Deaf people I've met and now work with had recommended...no luck so far...
 
Back
Top