Israel is Now in the Beginning of the End-Time Gog and Magog War

[ismi]

There's no comparison. If you have a Bible, read the Book of Revelation. If you don't have one, pm me and I'll get one mailed to you.

I have read it. Multiple translations. New Standard, KJV, Amplified ... my point is, what is it about this war that marks it as fulfilling the prophecy, other than, "it's a war in the Middle East"? Quote chapter and verse, if you like, but don't just point to all of Revelation and claim that supports your hypothesis.

 

[pek1]

Quote chapter and verse, if you like, but don't just point to all of Revelation and claim that supports your hypothesis.

If you don't know Christ as your Savior, ismi, you won't see all the connections. CyberRed and Reba see it, as do I. We all point right to the Bible, because we actually see what the Bible talks about coming true right in front of us.

 

[RedFox]

If you don't know Christ as your Savior, ismi, you won't see all the connections. CyberRed and Reba see it, as do I. We all point right to the Bible, because we actually see what the Bible talks about coming true right in front of us.

Requiring someone to believe in a book as a religious truth before understanding it does not consider the possibility that someone can know how believers think about the bible and see the connections. This can happen if they study how believers think or if they were believers before themselves.

Trying to understand a book only after thinking that it's totally true about everything it says in a religous manner introduces a religious bias. People who are not believers can still study how that bias influence how the believers think and see how the believers come to their conclusions.

Saying that one has to believe a religous text before being able to understand it is like saying that one has to believe Greek myths before understanding them. Saying that one has to be a Christian to understand how Christians operate is like saying that one has to be a computer to understand how they operate. It is possible to study groups of people and their ideas from the outside, which is what they do when they study cultures.

Saying that one has to believe before understanding can also be perceived as an encouragement to convert or conveying a sense of elitism.

There are people who see Revelation as apocalyptic literature written in the context of the first century CE with references to the Roman Empire. Some people say that the Beast was a reference to Nero Caesar.

 

[The Heretic]

He who consistently reads the bible literally is a fundamentalist

I don't understand why people continue to read allegories literally.

A bunch of ecstatic visions about heavenly beings, trip to heaven, monsters and cosmic battles are often read as a blueprint for the end of time, but this only betrays a misunderstanding of the Book of Revelations. The narrative rhetoric of the book demonstrates a concern with the nature of culture and politics, injustice, and the remaking of the world, and does so by showing the true color of Roman culture. Therefore, the final book of the bible is not a prediction of the future but the present of the time it was written.

 

[Dennis S.]

Oh, pffft at you ! Ha ha Yeah, right. Keep dreamin'. You are callin' yourself a looter and thief. This will give us an idea that you will steal them if, God rapture His people. tsk tsk

I wouldn't be a looter or a thief if you found it in the goodness of your heart to set your affairs in order and rid yourself of your worldly possessions before the rapture. After all, Jesus said that a rich man will have a harder time getting into heaven than a camel passing through the eye of a needle. Since Christians are so confident that this is the end times, maybe you and those other believers need to step up for what you believe in, or else, hey, since you'll be gone, you don't posess the stuff anymore and therefore it's finders keepers.

I'm not trolling. I'm pointing out that Christians are hypocrites who want to stir up trouble and doom yet claim to hide behind their bible by saying, "Well, look, we're going to be saved! I'm going to heaven soon! Ya'll are going to hell! But I'm gonna keep my stuff, you know, just in case I'm wrong again this time." It sure clears the air when the people who say they're righteous don't step in line with their professed beliefs.

You're SO SURE this is a sign of the end times. Like so many other signs before it. And you'll do it say it again for the next "sign." Keep your stuff, 'cause you'll need it until the next hysterical outbreak you believe in.

 

[christlovedeaf]

I understand how some of you view about the Bible. Did you know even the Bible has a culture purpose? For example, the letters Paul wrote to Philippians, Colossians, Galatians and etc. Notice same teaching but different topics. Why? Cultures. What these towns are like? What is their way of living? Revelation: 7 churches, each church in different town. Notice, different judgement on each town. Why? Culture way. Well, as a beast, my personal belief is not just Nero, can be someone else. Don't know who that be. Now, like what has happen in Israel, well, don't know if its begginning of it. But Jesus said, be ready and alert. So, I'm fond of the Bible. But how u described it, I'm not one of that, but rest assurance whatever the happening is. All I need to do is be ready for Lord's return. Now, about riches, don't misunderstand the Lord's meaning. He didn't say you can't be rich. The reason Jesus said that to the man is bec he thinks he's approve God by following all the laws and Jesus sees his lacking. Jesus point out people in different ways as people will noticed that not one person live perfect life, not one. Sin stains us and its removable, but only way to be covered and cleanse is the blood. That's why Jesus came to die for.

 

[pek1]

Book of Revelations.

We are not talking about the "Book of Revelations."

 

[The Heretic]

Christians lie as well as non-christians.

We are not talking about the "Book of Revelations."

Oh, really? Actually, this is false, due to your earlier post:

There's no comparison. If you have a Bible, read the Book of Revelation. If you don't have one, pm me and I'll get one mailed to you.

You could've fooled me. :roll:

You dodged imi's challenge, to cite chapter and verse, precisely because you had nothing behind your assertions that it's in the Book of Revelations.

 

[Reba]

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ to St. John"

Revelation not Revelations

 

[ismi]

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ to St. John"

Revelation not Revelations

Pedantry is unbecoming, Reba. Point is, don't just say, "it's obvious", "it's in Revelation" (which, I will point out, is how *I* have been spelling it all along) or, "you won't understand until you've been saved". Show me a specific statement in Revelation that applies more to the current situation than past ones. Or, alternatively, you could admit that you're just being optimistic (or pessimistic, depending on how you define things).

 

[Teresh]

Or, alternatively, you could admit that you're just being optimistic (or pessimistic, depending on how you define things).

She's impatient for the rapture because she's sure she'll be raptured up into heaven and wants a good seat for the game.

 

[Reba]

Pedantry is unbecoming, Reba.

Sigh...I was just trying to clarify the mini "debate" between two other members about "Revelations" so they could get on with the real debate.

Point is, don't just say, "it's obvious", "it's in Revelation" (which, I will point out, is how *I* have been spelling it all along) or, "you won't understand until you've been saved". Show me a specific statement in Revelation that applies more to the current situation than past ones. Or, alternatively, you could admit that you're just being optimistic (or pessimistic, depending on how you define things).

Excuse me? I never said or posted that. Please review this thread carefully. You're confusing me with someone else.

Just FYI, I personally don't believe any of these current events are "proof" or "signs" that the end times are on the horizon.

 

[Reba]

She's impatient for the rapture because she's sure she'll be raptured up into heaven and wants a good seat for the game.

Obviously, you are not a mind reader.

I'm not "impatient" for the rapture. I trust God's timing, and I would never dare to second guess His schedule.

 

[Maria]

I wouldn't be a looter or a thief if you found it in the goodness of your heart to set your affairs in order and rid yourself of your worldly possessions before the rapture. After all, Jesus said that a rich man will have a harder time getting into heaven than a camel passing through the eye of a needle. Since Christians are so confident that this is the end times, maybe you and those other believers need to step up for what you believe in, or else, hey, since you'll be gone, you don't posess the stuff anymore and therefore it's finders keepers.

I know about the story of a rich man. What if, a person has his/her own will that will give away to his/her children, families and friends when that person dies ? Not to mention about strangers who will loot or steal. If, the rapture occurs, then, the children/families/friends will know what is needed to be done. It's none of stranger's business to loot or steal their property.

I'm not trolling. I'm pointing out that Christians are hypocrites who want to stir up trouble and doom yet claim to hide behind their bible by saying, "Well, look, we're going to be saved! I'm going to heaven soon! Ya'll are going to hell! But I'm gonna keep my stuff, you know, just in case I'm wrong again this time." It sure clears the air when the people who say they're righteous don't step in line with their professed beliefs.

FYI, I am not stirrin' up trouble. That's people's choice if, they want to be saved or not. It's their decision. When they die, their souls are not their business anymore. Their souls are God's business to judge and for Him to decide, if they go to hell or not. God is the Judge, not you or me or anyone else. But, for true believers/born-again Christians have the right to share the gospel with others about Jesus Christ and how He died for them.
Read John 3:16, it says :

" For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlastin' life. "

You're SO SURE this is a sign of the end times. Like so many other signs before it. And you'll do it say it again for the next "sign." Keep your stuff, 'cause you'll need it until the next hysterical outbreak you believe in.

Did you know that His disciples came to Him privately, askin' : " Tell us, when shall these things be ? and what shall be the sign of thy comin', and of the end of the world ? " Go and read in Matthew, chapters 24 and 25. Read the whole chapters yourself, if you have a bible of your own.

Jesus don't keep these things to Himself. He just told them when they asked. Remember, Jesus is God and He knows the future. It's Him who created this earth, universe, time and space ... EVERYTHING. So, I believe Him totally.

 

[The Heretic]

Persnicketiness, thou dost protest too much.

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ to St. John" Revelation not Revelations

Yes, and...? I am talking about the exact same book. Whether it is officially spelled in plural or not is rather besides the point.

 

[Reba]

Yes, and...? I am talking about the exact same book. Whether it is officially spelled in plural or not is rather besides the point.

Yes, I know it is the same book. I just thought my little post would settle that detail so you guys could move on to your more important points.

I didn't think it would cause such a stink. Good grief!

 

[pek1]

You dodged imi's challenge, to cite chapter and verse, precisely because you had nothing behind your assertions that it's in the Book of Revelations.

Do you proofread what you write, The Heretic? You said "Book of Revelations." I corrected you by saying it is called the "Book of Revelation." Note there is no 's' on the end? Reba caught it!

 

[pek1]

Yes, and...? I am talking about the exact same book. Whether it is officially spelled in plural or not is rather besides the point.

Nope. It is the point. The Book of Revelation is not in plural. If it is, it is incorrect and there is no such book name. Just like addressing me as pek1s . . . no, my name is pek1. BIG difference.

 

[Buckdodgers]

Well the END IS NEAR! Did anyone read the book of revelations and Gods Final words were if man does not improve himself I Will End the World By Fire! So in 2012 the comet will cross over jupiter and mars and hit the earth and our world will burn.

God will end our world by fire!

 

[Dennis S.]

Well the END IS NEAR! Did anyone read the book of revelations and Gods Final words were if man does not improve himself I Will End the World By Fire! So in 2012 the comet will cross over jupiter and mars and hit the earth and our world will burn.

God will end our world by fire!

*YAWN* *ROLLEYES*

Thanks for the FUD. The earth will not end in 2012. Go troll elsewhere.