I'm an ASL student and we are doing a debate in class on deaf issues can anyone help?

M

mandi17

New Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2005
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
I'm an ASL student and we are doing a debate on deaf issues and I'm against mainstreaming or inclusion education does anyone have any input for me?
 
Mainstreaming

Of course this is a controversial topic. But I'm going to tell you what I think. I was mainstreamed my whole life. The academic part of it was pretty good. I can read, I can write, I can do math, etc etc etc. But the social part was not so hot. I think it's cruel putting a Deaf child in an all-hearing environment. It doesn't matter if there's an interpreter. It doesn't matter if there's a few understanding teachers. It doesn't matter if the academics are good. Kids can be horrible and anything different about you singles you out for a great deal of ridicule. I didn't enjoy school. I hated it. Later on in my life, I was lucky to teach at a Deaf school. I finally saw what it was like and practically lived through the kids for the "deaf school experience." They were able to be involved in anything - any game, any discussion, anything.

So bottom line... I'm not for mainstreaming. It's a personal view. I don't have any statistics. I don't have any research. Just my plain ol' bias.
 
Last edited:
mandi17 said:
I'm an ASL student and we are doing a debate on deaf issues and I'm against mainstreaming or inclusion education does anyone have any input for me?
Click to expand...

Well, I need to know why you are against mainstreaming or inclusion education before I can offer my input since I was a mainstreamed student back in my youth.
 
Education debate

I don't know if there's another AD thread that discusses school days, but from what I've seen and read over the last ten years of college classes most deaf have only a 4-5 grade English and math comprehension. There are a number of reasons for this that I won't go into with this post. One knock against residential schools that I've heard is that the classes weren't as challenging as mainstream classes. Mainstream classes don't allow the Deaf to socialize. The two biggest debates seem to be residential VS mainstream and oral VS manual (ASL). These debates go back 150 years and they may not be resolved in our lifetimes. :confused:
 
Former Mainstreamed Student

I, too, was mainstreamed all of my school years. When I first started in elementary school, we had a pretty large Deaf education program with many Deaf students. At first, I was mainstreamed for math, science and social studies, but for reading and language arts I was in the Deaf resource classroom. Later, I was mainstreamed for every subject. Rarely was I in the Deaf resource classroom during the last two years at the elementary school and middle school. My high school didn't have the Deaf resource program, but another high school across town did.

My brothers are both Deaf and attended the same schools as I did, but they had a difficult time making hearing friends and participating in extracurricular activities. I think the main reason why this happened is because they were not able to speak well. They both ended up going to a residential school for their high school years and were able to participate in several sports. They both developed a bond with several other Deaf students and I was always jealous of them.

I, on the other hand, was able to speak very well, but I didn't have very many friends, only one close friend and several acquaintances. However, I was able to participate in just about anything because of the speaking ability.

I have to agree with zawadigube, that mainstreaming isn't always fun. I did feel isolated at times and left out. Whenever my parents and I went to a football game for my brothers at the residential school, I was always with my brothers' friends catching up on the social skills that I needed.

Later on, attending college, I attended a public college for my BA and had interpreters in every class, but I never really felt 100% included. Fortunately, I was able to experience a "residential setting" at Western Maryland College for my MA in Deaf Education. The professors were either Deaf or hearing and fluent in ASL. Everyone was required to sign at all times, and I felt myself grow during this time. I was able to participate in any conversation, discussion and so forth.
 
I too am a former mainstreamed student. I am glad that I was challenged academicly by being able to do the same curriculm as my hearing classmates. Less was not expected of me academicly simply b/c I could not hear normally. However, there were MANY downsides to being totally mainstreamed....I was the only hoh kid in my entire school system. As a result the teachers did not know how to educate me....not even the special ed teachers. Most special ed teachers concentrate on learning disabilties. They know NOTHING about teaching kids like me. So the attitude was that if I wasn't a super high powered Deafie I had to be a stupid dumbass " Who's President Bush?" apathetic slacker type of sped student. Of course I was faking it....and didn't need any accomondations to do well in school.
There was also the social aspect....I got teased about the way I talked, felt incredibily isolated because I didn't know any other DHH kids my age (matter of fact, I did not meet another dhh kid my age til I was a teenager!) and I really do believe that the concentration on remidation and constant therapy really played hell with my self esteem.
 
JessHercules, I understand how you feel about deaf education. I was in deaf education programs in 1999 and that was when I was in 5th grade. They never let me take real English and reading in 5th through 10th. When I entered high school, they still gave me extra work so I got tired of the program so I set up meeting regarding deaf education services last year. my family members came to support me that I requested the school to terminate deaf education program since I am only the deaf student at high school. When the deaf education was slowing down, I became more independent and I decided to take challenging courses to prove the school that I am able to do this and I did it. I have a good special education teacher who is young and he understands my disabilities and I overcame many obstacles this year. I am doing very well in main subjects including reading and I am proud to receive equal education just like all hearing students.
 
Speaking as a deaf individual with experience in the mainstream setting and speaking as a teacher for the deaf! If you want a good academic structure then go with the mainstream. If you want the much needed social skills and emotional support via other deaf peers then you deafinitely want a residential school for the deaf. I grew up in the mainstream and got a great education. However, I did not get the emotional and self esteem development, social skills, or my inner needs met as a young person. I wish everyone signed in the world. Then this would not even be an issue. I know from teaching at a residential school for the deaf....we HAVE to water down the curriculum so much. How sad!! But the students are able to have the fellowship and emotional/mental growth they need.
 
deafinitely said:
Speaking as a deaf individual with experience in the mainstream setting and speaking as a teacher for the deaf! If you want a good academic structure then go with the mainstream. If you want the much needed social skills and emotional support via other deaf peers then you deafinitely want a residential school for the deaf. I grew up in the mainstream and got a great education. However, I did not get the emotional and self esteem development, social skills, or my inner needs met as a young person. I wish everyone signed in the world. Then this would not even be an issue. I know from teaching at a residential school for the deaf....we HAVE to water down the curriculum so much. How sad!! But the students are able to have the fellowship and emotional/mental growth they need.
Click to expand...

Your comment does make sense to me. However I believe it only depend on how much education background the child possessed such as iq level and how they learn. Sometimes they could learn better in deaf environment, some others may want more challenges. For one thing, I am former and graduated from mainstream school and it much easier to attend there and live with family. There are lot of bad things on both side of deaf school and mainstreaming school such as gossiping, backstabbing (deaf school) but for mainstreaming may wont make lot friends (depend which school). Now you get the idea.
 
I agree, and it is not very easy to make hearing friends in mainstreamed schools, but I only have a very few friends that are hearing and they are learning more ASL since they respect my deafness. He even interpreted what other people were trying to tell me. I had to do the right thing about deaf education and there are always good staff at my high school and they are willing to help me succeed.
 
deafinitely said:
Speaking as a deaf individual with experience in the mainstream setting and speaking as a teacher for the deaf! If you want a good academic structure then go with the mainstream. If you want the much needed social skills and emotional support via other deaf peers then you deafinitely want a residential school for the deaf. I grew up in the mainstream and got a great education. However, I did not get the emotional and self esteem development, social skills, or my inner needs met as a young person. I wish everyone signed in the world. Then this would not even be an issue. I know from teaching at a residential school for the deaf....we HAVE to water down the curriculum so much. How sad!! But the students are able to have the fellowship and emotional/mental growth they need.
Click to expand...


I believe that deaf students at deaf schools should earn equal education just like mainstreamed schools while teaching them social skills. Education is very important for the deaf, because if they go straight to NTID/RIT from deaf schools, they would not be happy with good English skills, and they also have problems grasping English structure and use it as second language.
 
I strongly believe that a person who has tasted both worlds: mainstreaming and deaf schools should be qualified to commend on this thread. I understand those who went "mainstreaming" all their lives, defend their stand so do all the residental students.

I have been in both schools half of my school years. Let me tell you exactly as I experienced.

I went to mainstreaming from 1st to 6th grade. then 7th to 12 at NCSD.

Both experiences are vastly different! at the public school I had to be the best in any physical events in order to be accepted. I was rarely picked 3rd for any sporting events. I was usually invited in their parties. I spoke pretty well and could lipread very well.

I had to go to residental school due to my father being transferred to another job. I went in NCSD for the first time and loved it. I was constantly being challenged in education daily. My class was the best ever in the school history. We recite poems, jokes and riddles first thing in the morning and took advanced classes. We had the best teachers who took time to teach us.

I was good in football in both the hearing and deaf worlds. I would have never been picked as captain of any sports if I was in mainstreaming... but been captain in football and wrestling at NCSD. I dont think I would have been voted as president of student government at public school but have been one for two years at NCSD.

I have very healthy self image due to enrolling in NCSD. My education level is very high due to high competition at NCSD. I am not sure if I would have been challenged due to lack of interpreters or teachers trained to teach deaf.

None of you can tell me that I am wrong because that had already happened.

I firmly believe that mainstreaming should cease and pour funds in deaf schools for better quality education and teachers. It is up to each superintendent of residental schools to make it a successful one.
 
I really think it all depends on the school district.

In my local school district, the public school system has a mainstream program and boast about it to all the parents. They tell deaf parents about the benefits of mainstreaming and how their children will be living at home. What they don't tell them is that the mainstreamed kids in grades 1 - 6 are usually mixed 50/50 with hearing kids and deaf only classes. By the time they reach high school, the deaf kids are totally segregated from the hearing classes except for perhaps gym and study hall.

A very good friends of mine was an interpreter for the public school. Her mom is deaf so she's very skilled in ASL. I asked her about the quality of the terps and she rolled her eyes. She said out of all the terps, there were probably only 2 others besides herself who were ASL.

And when the kids leave the mainstream school, they became extremely isolated. Som of the main problems I have seen from mainstreaming:

1) They don't fully understand ASL
2) their hearing friends had all gone
3) their signs are so grabled with SEE/PSE/SEE that terps outside the school
system and deaf adults often have trouble understanding them.
4) their english skills were still poor.
 
I grew up around hearing people; raise by hard of hearing father and hearing step mother, father wanted me to attend California school for the deaf but real mother said hell no; went into public school and speech therapy for years, finished high school at age 16 but stayed for another year. I almost beat my mothers record by one year, whatta ya know!! now days I have more hearing friends then those who are hard of hearing or deaf, whatever you pick anyway having to be growing up around hearing people all my life ive learn to adapt around them; since i can read lips pretty good and use speech; Im pretty good at speech that people would think i dont have a mix hearing loss. The down side is that i never learned to sign, (wish i had) i got books but never took the time to pratice; When i was a kid i met a girl from California School for the Deaf but was not use to dealing with a non hearing person so that relationship sure didnt last. I have deaf friends now that know more about deaf culture then i do. sometimes they would have to explain some things to me so there wont be a missunderstanding. So like in everthing there is a up and down side to mainstream
 
another thing

i forget to mention is one of the main down sides to putting a deaf child around hearing people is that often there can be a missunderstanding which can lead to serious problems. Ive had been haul away by police because of fights with hearing kids when i was very young. A few years before speech theropy One time a group of students blame me for breaking a classroom window which was false, i couldnt defend myself because i didnt know what the hell was going on til the end of the day. i thought the teacher was being mean for no reason ( grab me by the arm n yellin at the top of her lungs) so i rebel by gettin myself loose then threw a chair at her but still in the end i was the one who gets haul away by police. Ive learned from this experince that people who have hearing loss can be a victem to cruel behaviors of hearing people, and i was only what six years old.
 
Evolution Of Deaf Society

Evolution Of Deaf Society is great debate material. Deaf society will be different in the year 2020 as the old deaf society will be replaced with a new deaf society devoid of many aspects of deaf culture.

Richard
 
I agree with Richard

I agree with Richard, the deaf socialty is always changing,and it will keep changing even in 2020.
As for mainstreaming, its depends if the parents want their deaf child in a maindstream school.
Margie
 
Back
Top