Hearing in a Deaf world

travisdoesmath

travisdoesmath

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It seems to me that in the deaf community, there are certain aspects that are off-limits to hearies, for example, it's not kosher for a hearing person to come up with new signs.

Now, I was born hearing, grew up in a hearing family and have no deaf/hoh relatives, I started taking ASL a little over a year ago and I'm starting to make friends in the deaf community. I'm not saying that I feel unwelcome, there have been many people who have received me warmly, however, it is obviously not "my" culture.

I'm not sure about crossover lines, but it seems to me that CODAs and perhaps siblings of Deaf can claim ownership of the culture, or at least moreso than a late-comer like myself.

But here's a scenario ..

Suppose that I become fluent in ASL and immerse myself in Deaf culture, always remaining a peripheral member .. but then I lose my hearing. Am I now allowed to lay claim to Deaf culture where I wasn't before?

if so, why?
 
Travis, it seems like you're seeking acceptance. There have been some threads that have dealt with this before. Many Deaf people believe that their culture is something to be shared with everyone. Some don't. But in coming to accept who you are, its important to realize who you are, and you can't change that. I know very much how you feel. Like an outsider looking in, wishing to participate as much as everyone else.
 
apathrev said:
Travis, it seems like you're seeking acceptance. There have been some threads that have dealt with this before. Many Deaf people believe that their culture is something to be shared with everyone. Some don't. But in coming to accept who you are, its important to realize who you are, and you can't change that. I know very much how you feel. Like an outsider looking in, wishing to participate as much as everyone else.
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Honestly, I'm not worried about acceptance, I think it's similar to when white people get accepted into black culture and the n-word is still off-limits. I understand that and I accept that. I understand why it's not cool for hearing people to invent new signs and such, but Deaf culture has an interesting hypothetical twist. If I get accepted into black culture, I can't suddenly wake up one day with black skin and a different genetic make-up. However, you CAN become deaf. So then what? Where do you fit into the community, and what's the difference?
 
travisdoesmath said:
Honestly, I'm not worried about acceptance, I think it's similar to when white people get accepted into black culture and the n-word is still off-limits. I understand that and I accept that. I understand why it's not cool for hearing people to invent new signs and such, but Deaf culture has an interesting hypothetical twist. If I get accepted into black culture, I can't suddenly wake up one day with black skin and a different genetic make-up. However, you CAN become deaf. So then what? Where do you fit into the community, and what's the difference?
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Although it's true you can become deaf, you can't become prelingually deaf. Even late deafened people who learn ASL and become involved with deaf culture aren't totally accepted as deaf, generally speaking. (I don't know, could IKJ be considered an exception?...I really don't know enough about the politics there.) At this point in time, you could get plastic surgery and otherwise be altered to become black, but you still wouldn't be, understand?
Also, in regards to being a hearie trying to enter deaf culture...hmm...I know the feeling. I have a lot of wonderful deaf friends, they have been totally cool with me being hearing. If I can sign, they don't care. Still, I know that I am not automatically accepted in deaf culture, and never will be. I think mainstreaming has changed that to a point, but hearing people are still hearing and deaf people are still deaf. There has just been so much oppression and discrimation by hearing culture that even though I may totally see deaf people as equals and deaf people totally accept me as a good person, I'm still "one of them." AHHHH...there is so much to say about this both positive and negative, but I am going to shut up now, let others post, and I'll add more later. Overall though Travis, I would say it is totally worth it to keep learning sign and getting involved with, as well as studying, deaf culture, I love it.
 
So then what? Where do you fit into the community, and what's the difference?
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Again I'm translating for LMM..
You become deaf late in life, In the community you will still be outside center core... the core is people born deaf/ deaf have deaf parnet's.... to be core live deaf way's.. Haven't live hearies ways! Aslo core is leaders who show deaf new sign's.. help w/ bridging their gaps... outside center you may not change Deaf Way's! You can't fool Deaf leaders... hearing people may learn ASL try fool Deaf but telling them they are born Deaf.. to try to be core of center... But Deaf people can tell who is who.... yes me [LMM] have meet outside center people. Think Wow, They are good.. But still know by their ways they are outside center...

I'm not sure about crossover lines, but it seems to me that CODAs and perhaps siblings of Deaf can claim ownership of the culture, or at least moreso than a late-comer like myself.
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Please prove proof where Sibling's is Core of center ? for I [LMM] haven't meet a Sibling of Deaf who is Core! They still outside center! Unless they is Deaf themself but then again we have differnet abbreviation for them! {LMM}
have said E "Enough about my culture, you want to know more get your body involve w/ the Deaf Community... "

LMM
 
LMM said:
Again I'm translating for LMM..
You become deaf late in life, In the community you will still be outside center core... the core is people born deaf/ deaf have deaf parnet's.... to be core live deaf way's.. Haven't live hearies ways! Aslo core is leaders who show deaf new sign's.. help w/ bridging their gaps... outside center you may not change Deaf Way's! You can't fool Deaf leaders... hearing people may learn ASL try fool Deaf but telling them they are born Deaf.. to try to be core of center... But Deaf people can tell who is who.... yes me [LMM] have meet outside center people. Think Wow, They are good.. But still know by their ways they are outside center...



Please prove proof where Sibling's is Core of center ? for I [LMM] haven't meet a Sibling of Deaf who is Core! They still outside center! Unless they is Deaf themself but then again we have differnet abbreviation for them! {LMM}
have said E "Enough about my culture, you want to know more get your body involve w/ the Deaf Community... "

LMM
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Interesting. Like I said, I wasn't sure about crossover lines, I was just going off initial observations.

The way you have presented it makes more sense
 
Hi Travis, I am Deaf and was born that way. Here is what I think....and another Deaf people will notice it too.

Just be a real friend and do not allow Deaf people to do things that are wrong or illegal.

Be friends with Deaf people for the right reasons and not for the wrong reasons.

If you become Deaf, the Deaf community unconsiciously has to find a way to label you or anybody. I don't like labels either. Nobody does. Deaf people usually label out of protection for themselves. They do not mean to do it on purpose .... but there are some Deaf people THAT DO IT ON PURPOSE those are the ones I do not like and as soon I realize it is being done on purpose. I avoid them because Deaf people who label people on purpose have a need to cause so much trouble you will wish you never met them in the first place the same goes for Deaf and hearing people. There are people like that in the real world does not matter Deaf or hearing.

I can see you doing interpreting so you could interprete for the Deaf community. Please do interpreting for the right reasons and not the wrong reasons. Language carrys power, communication and sometimes life and death situations in ASL or PSE interpreting or whatever mode of communication the Deaf person has.

As for you going Deaf one day ... do not worry about being accepted or not... You will have the skills to communicate in ASL and be happy for yourself... of course you can always ask the Lord Jesus Christ to heal you of deafness because that is what I am doing for myself and Deaf people avoid that mainly because they do not understand what is going on so they don't want to be with that Deaf person who they think .... think that the person does not want to be Deaf but they forget the spiritual component and where at this point in their life they are with the healing process. ( FYI I do not believe Benny Hinn is for real because when Jesus Christ was ministering he never asked for money, not even tithlings !!!! He healed people and some he did not heal for good reasons some people not obey Jesus Christ or it simply was not their time to be ready to be healed yet ). As for ASL that some signs hearing people made for Deaf people, I am sure some made its way into ASL on good recommendation but probably no proper credit due to the hearing person WHICH IS NOT RIGHT but the Deaf community do not want to admit it so my say would be just be a real friend to Deaf people and there are some Deaf people that do seriously not know the difference between a good or a bad friend. Do not take advantage of them because another Deaf people are watching. Deaf people will help and develop the another Deaf ones into strong Deaf leaders... if they meet the right Deaf person who has a good concern for them, right now I don't see most Deaf people do that so that is very rare. That is what I think and what I have seen. God Bless, Heath
 
Heath
me do zero need me terp.. hope u listen good what me have say! Ppl same urself may stay in ur lil wrld.. We wld be happy have Travis our wrld he learn correct & proper ways! Ppl same ur self we call CRABS!
No it zero lable naming! May be IF u learn what center means U see zero lable!
U way off ! do zero know where u othrs get infm! But u give out wrong infm... We is not cult ! Cult & Culture two flick diff means! May be me need call hearies a cultQQ How u like itQq Pls do zero tell me hearies zero cult & Deaf is!

LMM
 
stuck up

i can tell of what i have lived with.
i was born hearing..and then went deaf pretty fast starting around 7 years old. i did not learn a lot of sign until years 2 ago.
in the first week at gally i said hello (signed to) to just about about everyone. and more than a few people just shut me out..never said hi back...until they found out that build motorcycles and work on cars , draw and paint cool stuff,practice marshal arts and that i have a very cool boat on the bay....THEN they want to be pals with me... not for me..just for the stuff they want. like their car fixed or thier pic painted or a ride on the bay...
i asked all of them..why did you ignore me the first 5 times i said hello? they said becouse, i talk....my reply was what the hell does that matter? so what?
if that was a problem before it is still your problem now...oh so..you want a motorcycle ride? your house fixed ? a weekend tanning on my deck?
no thanks...i do not deal with close minded people. have a nice life...just not with me..

i was shocked by such moronic attitudes. there only a few of the 6 billion people on earth who know sign... and cutting them off makes your own world smaller.

and from what i see, football fans are more of a culture than the deaf comuity..the same goes for biker groups...both have their holidays,food, clothing,lanugage and customs.....the deaf commuity has lanuage.. but not the rest....
 
vfr said:
i can tell of what i have lived with.
i was born hearing..and then went deaf pretty fast starting around 7 years old. i did not learn a lot of sign until years 2 ago.
in the first week at gally i said hello (signed to) to just about about everyone. and more than a few people just shut me out..never said hi back...until they found out that build motorcycles and work on cars , draw and paint cool stuff,practice marshal arts and that i have a very cool boat on the bay....THEN they want to be pals with me... not for me..just for the stuff they want. like their car fixed or thier pic painted or a ride on the bay...
i asked all of them..why did you ignore me the first 5 times i said hello? they said becouse, i talk....my reply was what the hell does that matter? so what?
if that was a problem before it is still your problem now...oh so..you want a motorcycle ride? your house fixed ? a weekend tanning on my deck?
no thanks...i do not deal with close minded people. have a nice life...just not with me..

i was shocked by such moronic attitudes. there only a few of the 6 billion people on earth who know sign... and cutting them off makes your own world smaller.

and from what i see, football fans are more of a culture than the deaf comuity..the same goes for biker groups...both have their holidays,food, clothing,lanugage and customs.....the deaf commuity has lanuage.. but not the rest....
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vfr,

:gpost:
 
You become deaf late in life, In the community you will still be outside center core... the core is people born deaf/ deaf have deaf parnet's.... to be core live deaf way's.. Haven't live hearies ways!
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Precisely! Someone who WENT deaf relatively late will never be as comfortable being Deaf as someone born that way.

Actually hearing doesn't really have anything to do with being Deaf....Cookie Monster and our other hoh DODA who posts reguaraly here, are hoh (like mild hoh) and they ID as Deaf. I know of a little boy who only has unilateral hearing loss, but is attending a school for the Deaf! I actually know of at least five little hoh girls who are learning ASL or who go to schools for the Deaf! Plus, what about the people with other disabilties who use Sign as a first language due to things like tracheostomies or apraxia?

vfr.....Yes, there are snotty extremists....but hey....there are extremists in EVERY movement! They however don't reflect on the MAJORITY! Yes, it sucks there's snotty deafer then thou people out there, but to play devil's advocate....I think part of the reason why some Deafie extremists are that way, is b/c they may have had bad experiances with hardcore " Hearing World is the BEST and I don't need the crutch of Sign" AG Beller/hardcore Auditory Verbal types.
 
I guess I'm just feeling frustration because I really love using sign language, when I'm lucky enough to go for extended periods of time just signing and I eventually have to switch over to speaking again, I feel like I'm downshifting gears. I feel like a person hasn't really met me until they've seen me sign, because that's when I'm the most "me". I'm not pretending to be deaf, and I'm positive that it's fairly obvious to native signers that I'm hearing. I just love the language

maybe it's rude or a poor way to percieve things, but when I see people in the deaf community, I don't see "can't hear", I see "can sign" .. so why is it a big deal that I can hear? Why does my difference make me a second class citizen in the deaf community? Isn't that the same complaint against the hearing world?
 
Travis, I understand now alittle better. You get a natural rush out of communicating with ASL. I can see why. That is good and very positive. God Bless, Heath
 
QUOTE]aybe it's rude or a poor way to percieve things, but when I see people in the deaf community, I don't see "can't hear", I see "can sign" .. so why is it a big deal that I can hear? Why does my difference make me a second class citizen in the deaf community? Isn't that the same complaint against the hearing world?[/QUOTE]

When anyone learns & accept's the vaule of our Deaf Commuinty.. they are accept! No matter who they are.. When they are accepted. It is differnet, Then your English world accepted! The Deaf world is not the same as your Hearing world! Even frist time people is weclome with hands.. we don't see new people come in our world, and not accept them as part of us! Untill they prove they want to change us or other things. which LMM won't let me type!
Travis why don't you go to your Deaf Commuinty, see what it's like ! You say " you love to sign" they be happy have new family member join!

LMM
 
LMM said:
When anyone learns & accept's the vaule of our Deaf Commuinty.. they are accept! No matter who they are.. When they are accepted. It is differnet, Then your English world accepted! The Deaf world is not the same as your Hearing world! Even frist time people is weclome with hands.. we don't see new people come in our world, and not accept them as part of us! Untill they prove they want to change us or other things. which LMM won't let me type!
Travis why don't you go to your Deaf Commuinty, see what it's like ! You say " you love to sign" they be happy have new family member join!

LMM
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I do, and the majority of the time I've felt welcomed, but a few times I've gotten the feeling that I was discriminated against because I was hearing. I don't like that.
 
the crutch

after not having any deaf freinds for 30 years,having them now makes me wish my dad had sent me to mssd at gally when i was a kid.
if that happened ,i would have missed out on traveling to lots of different counteries...but i would have more fun.
 
LMM said:
Heath
me do zero need me terp.. hope u listen good what me have say! Ppl same urself may stay in ur lil wrld.. We wld be happy have Travis our wrld he learn correct & proper ways! Ppl same ur self we call CRABS!
No it zero lable naming! May be IF u learn what center means U see zero lable!
U way off ! do zero know where u othrs get infm! But u give out wrong infm... We is not cult ! Cult & Culture two flick diff means! May be me need call hearies a cultQQ How u like itQq Pls do zero tell me hearies zero cult & Deaf is!

LMM
Click to expand...

Please type more clearly... I tried to figure out what you say????? Thanks Heath
 
Heath said:
Please type more clearly... I tried to figure out what you say????? Thanks Heath
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If you can't understand what LMN is saying, you're not trying hard enough to comprehend.
 
I did try !!!!! Why am I here asking after 3 days I tried to figure out what LMM is saying. It is clear to me that in another of LMM's posting that LMM can use English properly. Now something clicked in my mind that it reminds me of a good advice a wise and old librarian once told me, if you can't read illegible writing ( or in this case , illegible typing ) then don't bother reading. That person is not interested. That person wants to be grumpy and does not want to learn anything good.
 
Please type more clearly... I tried to figure out what you say????? Thanks Heath
Click to expand...
me best try do me!!!... me terp no office here me... She terp type me...
U TTD no UQQ U ASL no UQQ

LMM
 
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