Do you feel that hearing teachers restrict Deaf children in learning?

flip said:
Ok, then I would not make a requirement based on NCLB, but violation of human rights or whatever laws you got in the US.
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Oh, you're not from the USA?
 
Buffalo said:
Deaf schools are the best places for the deaf kids as they need to be with other deaf kids. Who run the Deaf Education? The hearing people. They need to hand it back to the Deaf people.
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Is this really true at all schools? When and why did they take it from the deaf people?
 
flip said:
Ok. It seems I disagree with those who claim deaf schools are superior in quality. I think that stance can hurt deaf schools, as it prevents more quality control and demands for more system changes, as deaf schools are the BEST PLACE TO BE AFTER ALL. My viewpoint is no support for mainstreaming children. If a deaf school have a lousy teacher, I would ask the school to change teacher as it's a violation of the leave no child behind act to provide savior type teachers with crap ASL, or I would move to another school, most probably, the school where Shel90 works :)
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Then how would you respond to all of the deaf kids that were mainstreamed that have been successful. I have heard from many on this board that say the are glad they were mainstreamed. Why would you deprive them of choice?
 
rockdrummer said:
Then how would you respond to all of the deaf kids that were mainstreamed that have been successful. I have heard from many on this board that say the are glad they were mainstreamed. Why would you deprive them of choice?
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they have a deaf program in their mainstream.

My public school did not have a deaf program and I was mainstreamed from preschool (public school preschool) to 12th. you can tell my writing skills is horrible. I sometimes can't put my thoughts in writing because I don't know how to write.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
they have a deaf program in their mainstream.

My public school did not have a deaf program and I was mainstreamed from preschool (public school preschool) to 12th. you can tell my writing skills is horrible. I sometimes can't put my thoughts in writing because I don't know how to write.
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But we understand you just fine. :hug:
 
you don't know how many times I have to edit to get it right, I look and say, no this doesn't look right, nope this doesn't either.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
you don't know how many times I have to edit to get it right, I look and say, no this doesn't look right, nope this doesn't either.
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I feel you about it. I do have trouble writing on anything from simple to complex letters or reports. I know I have weak vocabulary that causes me to struggle how to write that sounds right to me. :( I am still working to improve on my vocabulary that will help me to write better with words that makes sense.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
you don't know how many times I have to edit to get it right, I look and say, no this doesn't look right, nope this doesn't either.
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That's ok; I admire you for your persistent effort. Its sad what the system has done to many of us. and now at a disadvantage because of age, etc...very sad, I don't know what the answer is. I have given up saying the NAD should do something or this idea or that. We are not politically powerful enough and it is frustrating.....
 
I admire those who don't give up on improving their writing. I am still working on improving mine as well. To a lot of peope, my writing is great but since reconnecting with several old classmates from elementary and high schools, I could see where I lack with my writing skills. They write on such an advanced level that I never knew until now (20 years later). Makes me wonder why my teachers never pushed my best friend (she is deaf) and I harder like they did with our hearing peers.
 
Lighthouse77 said:
they have a deaf program in their mainstream.

My public school did not have a deaf program and I was mainstreamed from preschool (public school preschool) to 12th. you can tell my writing skills is horrible. I sometimes can't put my thoughts in writing because I don't know how to write.
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None of my public school had any deaf programs either. I mainly got my writing skills from my father who was a German, English and Latin professor. He wrote books for a living and had me edit them and taught me that way. I know that if I did not have that from him, I would be in terrible shape.

Like you and others, I have to really edit everything I say and I just thought it was me. Thank you for making me feel like I am not alone. :ty:
 
rockdrummer said:
Is this really true at all schools? When and why did they take it from the deaf people?
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Read "When the Mind Hears" by Harlan Lane. It is really a mind-blowing book. Yes, Milan Conference was a big one where the teachers decided on oral philiosophy. AG Bell also pushed for oral methods for the deaf kids. Laurent Clerc along with Thomas Gallaudet founded the first american school for the deaf in Hartford, Conn. and many deaf students there went on to be deaf teachers in other deaf schools. AG Bell and the Milan Conference changed the whole thing. Read on, buddy.....
 
rockdrummer said:
Then how would you respond to all of the deaf kids that were mainstreamed that have been successful. I have heard from many on this board that say the are glad they were mainstreamed. Why would you deprive them of choice?
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You ask me why I would deprive them of choosing mainstream, and I ask you why you would deprive them of getting it all by putting them in a mainstream program.

Talking about successful deaf kids in mainstream programs is similar to talking about successful people that grew up smoking pot. In both cases, it's common to hear "I didn't get hurt, I am okay and all fine!". That's a worrysome statement, that reveal risk.

I many cases, mainstream programs are choosed as not the best, but the best choice available, and that's a sucker's choice, IMHO.
 
shel90 said:
They have compassion and empathy but it is for the wrong reasons. I have seen too many teachers like that and they really do not help at all. They usually come across as seeing themselves as saviors of deaf children. Deaf children do not need people like that.
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True. It's an good example where they used to work at my old school. some of them were mothering us instead of teaching us. Hope they are not there anymore.
 
Buffalo said:
Read "When the Mind Hears" by Harlan Lane. It is really a mind-blowing book. Yes, Milan Conference was a big one where the teachers decided on oral philiosophy. AG Bell also pushed for oral methods for the deaf kids. Laurent Clerc along with Thomas Gallaudet founded the first american school for the deaf in Hartford, Conn. and many deaf students there went on to be deaf teachers in other deaf schools. AG Bell and the Milan Conference changed the whole thing. Read on, buddy.....
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Also the Milan Conference resulted in many deaf teachers getting pushed out of the teaching field because of the oppressive views that deaf people were incapable of teaching. I worry that those attitudes are returning. :roll:
 
flip said:
You ask me why I would deprive them of choosing mainstream, and I ask you why you would deprive them of getting it all by putting them in a mainstream program.

Talking about successful deaf kids in mainstream programs is similar to talking about successful people that grew up smoking pot. In both cases, it's common to hear "I didn't get hurt, I am okay and all fine!". That's a worrysome statement, that reveal risk.

I many cases, mainstream programs are choosed as not the best, but the best choice available, and that's a sucker's choice, IMHO.
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:gpost:
 
Frisky Feline said:
True. It's an good example where they used to work at my old school. some of them were mothering us instead of teaching us. :roll: I don't know if they are still there nowaday.
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I have had teachers growing up patting me on the head and telling me that I am so special even in 5th and 6th grades. Luckily it stopped 7th grade and beyond but I got the feeling that they saw me as someone to pity because of my deafness. I certainly didnt see them doing that to my hearing peers..they put a lot of expectations on them but as soon as they saw me, it was "Ohhh that poor deaf girl."
 
shel90 said:
I have had teachers growing up patting me on the head and telling me that I am so special even in 5th and 6th grades. Luckily it stopped 7th grade and beyond but I got the feeling that they saw me as someone to pity because of my deafness. I certainly didnt see them doing that to my hearing peers..they put a lot of expectations on them but as soon as they saw me, it was "Ohhh that poor deaf girl."
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I can see that hurts bad. At my school, they didn't let us have nad jr, didnt let some of us have the mock trail, close up events and more that relates with deaf events. That disappoints me many times, that lexington in NY has so much to offer for kids to get involve with, which why they have many good leaders. While my school, most of us didn't have good leaders but some of us did speak up a lot, though. A few teachers constantly say that some of us are not capable of anything. Sad to know that my deaf school are running by hearing people.
 
Buffalo said:
Read "When the Mind Hears" by Harlan Lane. It is really a mind-blowing book. Yes, Milan Conference was a big one where the teachers decided on oral philiosophy. AG Bell also pushed for oral methods for the deaf kids. Laurent Clerc along with Thomas Gallaudet founded the first american school for the deaf in Hartford, Conn. and many deaf students there went on to be deaf teachers in other deaf schools. AG Bell and the Milan Conference changed the whole thing. Read on, buddy.....
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the Milan conference was over two centuries ago. With all of the discussion in the profession about bi-bi being a better model why is it then that the deaf leaders are not able to invoke change if it is truly beneficial to the majority?
 
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