Ag Bell: Public Enemy #1

ha ha there are many failure deafies with SEE in deaf oral school and mainstream that you havent met them yet.. I have done it.. Mind you loml. SEE has been guttering in many ways that deaf people are using it. It s so sad that is not a real language from SEE.. SEE is the purpose for hearing people to learn Sign language as far as I KNOW it so.
 
Sweetmind,

You think every deaf person is a failure, Just like how Marlee Matlin used to sign language, then she used her own voice at the award, I saw those Deaf people reaction to it, got into a bitter debate over the use of sign language versus spoken speech. Marlee still uses voices and sign language method today, that hasn't change, Why does ASL has to be the only one that Deaf people should be taught? What's wrong with using both? Spoken speech and ASL, and SEE?
 
Cheri said:
Sweetmind,

You think every deaf person is a failure, Just like how Marlee Matlin used to sign language, then she used her own voice at the award, I saw those Deaf people reaction to it, got into a bitter debate over the use of sign language versus spoken speech. Marlee still uses voices and sign language method today, that hasn't change, Why does ASL has to be the only one that Deaf people should be taught? What's wrong with using both? Spoken speech and ASL, and SEE?
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I admire you :) :thumb:

*off topic*
I have twin sisters, fraternal. (I wished they are identical so both will be married at same time LOL but one is married and one hasn't married for long time... ) You both fraternal too?
 
there are many failure deafies with SEE in deaf oral school and mainstream that you havent met them yet.
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read it carefully that I said many not every if you mind.. Stop twisting around and put it into my mouth if you mind.

So why cant we have a chance to learn ASL while we can learn all kind of forgien deaf language that I like to learn. So I can communicate with deaf people out the country if you mind. It s so impossible for me to understand with oral method and learn their foreign languages as is. I m deaf if you mind and have my right to have ASL as one language that equals Signed English that hearing people use. Dont expect me to hear or speak like gibberish..

No wonder most deafies in usa do not have a chancce to learn any kind of foreign Deaf langauages lately unless they met someone who taught them.. Like i did learn BSL from uk person.. Why cant we have an equal as hearing people who take the foreign language courses?? HUH! Thats very unnecessary to have too many aritifical langauges that it s not gonna to work..

Too many aritifical languages that is not gonna to make any difference since hearing teacher doesnt sign right most of time.. They get all mixed up as usual that is when deaf people like you get all mixed up in your head as well.

Sighs NOT AGAIN.. I have said ASL with or without orally speaking few times that u have been ignored too much which is your huge problem for not reading correctly. Boult knew it but love to put me down as he thinks he knows everything.. SCOFFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thats simple for you to deny yourself as well. ASL is a true language if you mind.

Thank you! ;)

Sweetmind

Whats more we never had a chance to take the foreign languages courses cuz it s for orally speaking as well as hearing people can hear while we cannot pick up from HA or CI.. duh!

Sheesh thats the purpose to have ASL because many deaf languages in other countries do have asl in it if you mind. Thanks!
 
Sweetmind said:
read it carefully that I said many not every if you mind.. Stop twisting around and put it into my mouth if you mind.

So why cant we have a chance to learn ASL while we can learn all kind of forgien deaf language that I like to learn. So I can communicate with deaf people out the country if you mind. It s so impossible for me to understand with oral method and learn their foreign languages as is. I m deaf if you mind and have my right to have ASL as one language that equals Signed English that hearing people use. Dont expect me to hear or speak like gibberish..

No wonder most deafies in usa do not have a chancce to learn any kind of foreign Deaf langauages lately unless they met someone who taught them.. Like i did learn BSL from uk person.. Why cant we have an equal as hearing people who take the foreign language courses?? HUH! Thats very unnecessary to have too many aritifical langauges that it s not gonna to work..

Too many aritifical languages that is not gonna to make any difference since hearing teacher doesnt sign right most of time.. They get all mixed up as usual that is when deaf people like you get all mixed up in your head as well.

Sighs NOT AGAIN.. I have said ASL with or without orally speaking few times that u have been ignored too much which is your huge problem for not reading correctly. Boult knew it but love to put me down as he thinks he knows everything.. SCOFFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thats simple for you to deny yourself as well. ASL is a true language if you mind.

Thank you! ;)

Sweetmind

Whats more we never had a chance to take the foreign languages courses cuz it s for orally speaking as well as hearing people can hear while we cannot pick up from HA or CI.. duh!

Sheesh thats the purpose to have ASL because many deaf languages in other countries do have asl in it if you mind. Thanks!
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She has a point here. Many deaf people are assumed to be incapable of learning multiple languages. I don't see any reason why deaf people would be less capable of it than a hearing person. (However, I will consider someone fluent in other oral languages if they can read and write them without help because it still indicates an understanding of the language.)
 
Cheri said:
Sweetmind,

You think every deaf person is a failure, Just like how Marlee Matlin used to sign language, then she used her own voice at the award, I saw those Deaf people reaction to it, got into a bitter debate over the use of sign language versus spoken speech. Marlee still uses voices and sign language method today, that hasn't change, Why does ASL has to be the only one that Deaf people should be taught? What's wrong with using both? Spoken speech and ASL, and SEE?
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That is not what Sweetmind said. She is against FORCING one method or the other, and she genuinely believes signing is the best way to build a language foundation. I use both and she's glad I do. My deaf fiancee also uses signing and jaw-flapping. She doesn't call my fiancee a failure. Sweetmind HERSELF is bilingual (can sign and jaw-flap too).

That said, I do agree with your opinion on using both. I don't think it should be required to use one or the other, but these discussions turn into signing vs. jaw-flapping ego conflicts. Why not both? Multilingualism is good!
 
I know a certain person who is always supporting oralism. My grandmother told me when that person visited my home. She said to me, "Oh my goodness! Did you hear his voice?" I told her no as I could not hear at all. She said that his voice sounded like two sandpapers rubbing together.
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I know it seems like a lot of pro-oralists don't adquatly reconize the disadvantages associated with oralism. Not every hearing person can undy us well. It's a great tool to be able to talk.....BUT, it doesn't work well all of the time!!!!! I'm still incredibily self conscious about the way I talk.....Oral only does NOT equalize the pediatric dhh population!
 
Sweetmind said:
ha ha there are many failure deafies with SEE in deaf oral school and mainstream that you havent met them yet.. I have done it.. Mind you loml. SEE has been guttering in many ways that deaf people are using it. It s so sad that is not a real language from SEE.. SEE is the purpose for hearing people to learn Sign language as far as I KNOW it so.
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Wow, you sure amazing me how you can easy sit here and assume these many deaf people as a failure when there are many positive sides that show these deaf children who are implanted with CI or hear so well with the use of their hearing aids has successful in mainstream classes and it helps many deaf or hard of hearing child with social and language skills along with other hearing children and it's gives them each an opportunity to learn to communicate with each others with spoken english, it also helps children who are hearing , deaf or hard of hearing work side by side together... Parents play the main role in the deaf and hard of hearing children's education and they can choose any language methods they want to teach their own children..We have learned that whatever is needed, God provides for it. He has placed people in our lives to help meet our needs, that why there are many language methods parents can choose from, and there are also serveral devices to help deaf and hard of hearing children to hear..

Obviously, now I really do understand why some hearing parents feel about their CI children being involved in the deaf world when people like you have to rub things in the wrong way by pushing them away cause you see them as a failure, how sad, it such a shame to see how some of you deaf people act soo cruel toward these many deaf people just because they're not you, or they're not learning your language, or just because they're implanted with CI, well I'm sorry to tell you this, they're not your children and you have no right to make such a judgement on HOW they raise their deaf and hard of hearing children..


I feel really sad for you because you can not keep an open mind on both sides and understand where many parents are coming from, but no, you just are too busy seeing all the negitives than the positive sides... :(
 
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????? angel

hearing people thinks that we cannot capable to do anything since we have our hands to communicate that they are the one who did barrier us.. After all we did learn how to speak and they expected us to hear everything What a joke!!

Believe or not I made a lot of hearing friends on the internet. Also I have met some of them who are latened deaf with a great attitude.. So what are you talking about"??

Too much judgemental from you......JEEZ! I can see there are too much narrowmind that shows me alot.
 
there are many failure deafies with SEE in deaf oral school and mainstream
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Define failure.....Yes, total failure is very rare, but ditto with sucess! I mean I bet it's hard to find a signifent number of dhh kids who would do well on the Verbal section of the SAT or who have high verbal IQs.
 
Thank you so much deafdyke..PAH!!!! I agreed with you.. No difference from what I have said it all along for a long time.

So there angel!
 
deafdyke said:
I know it seems like a lot of pro-oralists don't adquatly reconize the disadvantages associated with oralism. Not every hearing person can undy us well. It's a great tool to be able to talk.....BUT, it doesn't work well all of the time!!!!! I'm still incredibily self conscious about the way I talk.....Oral only does NOT equalize the pediatric dhh population!
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AMEN!!! I'm SO glad I'm seeing other people explaining this. This is the point Sweetmind and I have been trying to get across.
 
^Angel^ said:
Wow, you sure amazing me how you can easy sit here and assume these many deaf people as a failure when there are many positive sides that show these deaf children who are implanted with CI or hear so well with the use of their hearing aids has successful in mainstream classes and it helps many deaf or hard of hearing child with social and language skills along with other hearing children and it's gives them each an opportunity to learn to communicate with each others with spoken english, it also helps children who are hearing , deaf or hard of hearing work side by side together... Parents play the main role in the deaf and hard of hearing children's education and they can choose any language methods they want to teach their own children..We have learned that whatever is needed, God provides for it. He has placed people in our lives to help meet our needs, that why there are many language methods parents can choose from, and there are also serveral devices to help deaf and hard of hearing children to hear..

Obviously, now I really do understand why some hearing parents feel about their CI children being involved in the deaf world when people like you have to rub things in the wrong way by pushing them away cause you see them as a failure, how sad, it such a shame to see how some of you deaf people act soo cruel toward these many deaf people just because they're not you, or they're not learning your language, or just because they're implanted with CI, well I'm sorry to tell you this, they're not your children and you have no right to make such a judgement on HOW they raise their deaf and hard of hearing children..


I feel really sad for you because you can not keep an open mind on both sides and understand where many parents are coming from, but no, you just are too busy seeing all the negitives than the positive sides... :(
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We, those of us who like ASL and are actually part of the Deaf world (you don't need to be physically deaf to be part of it) are sick of these parents saying the Deaf world is bad. We are just frustrated with you putting us down all the time. Yes, as a hearing person, I do see where these parents are coming from, but they are not thinking critically. They aren't doing the research required before they decide to put the kid in the hearing world.

The reality is that nerve implants that close to the brain is very risky. The cochlear implant isn't even 100% successful. Sure, it works for some, and I am glad it does. The thing is that there is always a chance of failure. When something as important as an accessible first language is denied in the name of "mainstreaming", the consequences can be pretty severe. Please think about this.
 
deafdyke said:
Define failure.....Yes, total failure is very rare, but ditto with sucess! I mean I bet it's hard to find a signifent number of dhh kids who would do well on the Verbal section of the SAT or who have high verbal IQs.
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I am deaf and have a high Verbal IQ

thank you
 
true and agreed

gnulinuxman said:
We, those of us who like ASL and are actually part of the Deaf world (you don't need to be physically deaf to be part of it) are sick of these parents saying the Deaf world is bad. We are just frustrated with you putting us down all the time. Yes, as a hearing person, I do see where these parents are coming from, but they are not thinking critically. They aren't doing the research required before they decide to put the kid in the hearing world.

The reality is that nerve implants that close to the brain is very risky. The cochlear implant isn't even 100% successful. Sure, it works for some, and I am glad it does. The thing is that there is always a chance of failure. When something as important as an accessible first language is denied in the name of "mainstreaming", the consequences can be pretty severe. Please think about this.
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I agree and Truly its true about parents not researching and being in critical thinking for their child(ren) that are deaf. I may be deaf myself but my parents (abusive mom and lazy ass Dad) didn't do anything for me. I think many should rethink "mainstreaming" be4 doing anything without researching.

Deaflinuxgeek
 
gnulinuxman said:
If you don't know what question marks mean, how the heck can you comprehend English?
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Oh sheesh, grow up!
 
Sweetmind said:
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????? angel

hearing people thinks that we cannot capable to do anything since we have our hands to communicate that they are the one who did barrier us.. After all we did learn how to speak and they expected us to hear everything What a joke!!

Believe or not I made a lot of hearing friends on the internet. Also I have met some of them who are latened deaf with a great attitude.. So what are you talking about"??

Too much judgemental from you......JEEZ! I can see there are too much narrowmind that shows me alot.
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I think the problem is that you haven't acknowledged a lot of stuff like what I put in bold, until after people push you. If you had said up front that you knew not all hearing people are bad, and that not all who fall into other general groups you criticize are bad, you might've found people having different attitudes towards you. As it is, a lot of people may have already formed their judgments from the generalizations you've made.

It might help if, when you make statements about large groups of people, you said, "SOME people think or act like this" instead of saying "THIS GROUP thinks or acts like this." The second way just makes people defensive and after they see that, they won't really think about any points you're trying to make, just about what looks like stereotyping. Even if you don't mean to come across that way, it can give that appearance.

I'm not trying to attack you with this--I'm just trying to help make this a more productive debate.
 
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