Genetically creating deaf children

Interpretrator said:
Yeah, I think that's what is hard to get past, that you are intentionally creating barriers for your kids. But to play devil's advocate, suppose you were a Deaf person who had had a wonderful childhood full of ASL and Deaf culture, and you had a spouse who had the same experience, and you honestly didn't feel that there was anything wrong with being deaf, and you wanted your kid to be part of that?

I would never do anything like this myself, because as someone pointed out there's no telling yet what the long-term implications of genetic alteration might be, but I don't feel qualified to tell someone in my example that they're wrong, because I can never be in their shoes.

Just a thought. I don't mean to say you're wrong in how you feel.
Click to expand...

I understand, but the whole concept is just so wrong, whether it be creating deaf babies, blind babies or any kind of disability. Being a parent, you are always looking out for your childs best interest and i just can't see how doing that is.
 
As Interpritor has been doing, I'm playing devils advocate.

As far as intentionally making your child deaf, I do not think it will ever be acceptable. Beside the ethics involved. The way laws are written, O would bet you would be arrested as soon as the deafness was confirmed after birth. You would probably be arrested for assault. You would probably lose custody of your child.
As I said, ethics aside, you are causing permanent, damage to your child. If I lost my legs in an accident, as a young child, would it be ok, to surgically remove my childs legs so he could have a similar perspective on life as I do?
How about arms,sight, or anything else for that matter?
 
Lillys dad said:
As Interpritor has been doing, I'm playing devils advocate.

As far as intentionally making your child deaf, I do not think it will ever be acceptable. Beside the ethics involved. The way laws are written, O would bet you would be arrested as soon as the deafness was confirmed after birth. You would probably be arrested for assault. You would probably lose custody of your child.
As I said, ethics aside, you are causing permanent, damage to your child. If I lost my legs in an accident, as a young child, would it be ok, to surgically remove my childs legs so he could have a similar perspective on life as I do?
How about arms,sight, or anything else for that matter?
Click to expand...

:gpost:
 
Lillys dad said:
Beside the ethics involved. The way laws are written, O would bet you would be arrested as soon as the deafness was confirmed after birth. You would probably be arrested for assault. You would probably lose custody of your child.
Click to expand...

Actually, several clinics are already performing these procedures. I can't remember if it was in the article I linked or another one, but apparently it's not currently known if any children have been born yet with a disability as a result of the procedure. However, they perform the procedures when parents ask for them. So I don't believe the parents are in danger of being arrested and losing custody of their children unless the law changes, which it very well might depending on whether this situation makes it onto the legislative radar.

I agree with many of you that this is unlikely to become widely accepted or even understood by most people. It would be limited to those communities where things like deafness and dwarfism are not seen as disabilities, and even there it's surely controversial.
 
If you stop and thin k about it, Martha's Vineyard was a sort of genetically engineered Deaf community, because of all the genectically deaf residents,the chance of a couple producing a deaf child that was raised in, and continued to live in, the community were increased many fold. Many deaf found that an attractive possibility and were drawn to Martha's Vineyard as a result.
 
There are clinics that are genetically changing a hearing unborn baby into a deaf unborn baby? That is what I was referring to.
 
Lillys dad said:
There are clinics that are genetically changing a hearing unborn baby into a deaf unborn baby? That is what I was referring to.
Click to expand...

There are clinics that are acceding to parents' requests to change a hearing unborn baby, or an unborn baby without dwarfism, into a deaf unborn baby, or an unborn baby with dwarfism. Whether or not they have so far succeeded in producing the deaf or dwarf babies is unclear, but they are performing the procedures.

If you read the link I provided on the first page, this is what is said in the first paragraph.
 
Interpretrator said:
There are clinics that are acceding to parents' requests to change a hearing unborn baby, or an unborn baby without dwarfism, into a deaf unborn baby, or an unborn baby with dwarfism. Whether or not they have so far succeeded in producing the deaf or dwarf babies is unclear, but they are performing the procedures.

If you read the link I provided on the first page, this is what is said in the first paragraph.
Click to expand...

Thanks for pointing that statement out to me. When I first read it, I must havent absorbed that one particular sentence. Wow...that is interesting!
 
shel90 said:
Wow...that is interesting!
Click to expand...

Yeah, also interesting that the results of these procedures are so vague. I suppose medical confidentiality comes into play, but if it were a cure for cancer these clinics would want their names splashed all over the papers.
 
Deaf babies/children are generally more friendly, the world to day is too easy anyway. Give them a challenge I say. By the time they grow up doctors will be able to give them the ability to hear anyway!!

On a serious note: I do wish I could of been a designer baby, if only to remove my allergy to anaesthetics then atleast I would have a chance!!
 
kayla123 said:
I've been reading this thread and i can't believe some of what i am reading. A lot of people on this site have talked about the hard times they've had growing up being dhh, especially when they were in school and yet some still think that the concept of intentionally creating deaf babies is ok. Some people call the hearing parents selfish for implanting their children but we are trying to provide a tool that is going to make life easier not harder. I'm sorry but if someone thinks that making your baby deaf on purpose after knowing what you went through growing up is ok, then i think that is a very selfish act.
Click to expand...

Just to maybe provide a bit of a different perspective--perhaps because of what some of these adult deaf/hh people have gone through, they feel that they would be better able than most to provide exactly what a deaf/hh child needs to grow into a happy, healthy, high functioning adult. They actually have an advantage over the majority of parents of deaf/hh children, in that they thave already lived the situation, and are not blindly trying to find their way.
 
jillio said:
Just to maybe provide a bit of a different perspective--perhaps because of what some of these adult deaf/hh people have gone through, they feel that they would be better able than most to provide exactly what a deaf/hh child needs to grow into a happy, healthy, high functioning adult. They actually have an advantage over the majority of parents of deaf/hh children, in that they thave already lived the situation, and are not blindly trying to find their way.
Click to expand...

This is the explanation I have heard for deaf couples trying to adopt deaf babies. Apparently some agencies don't want to give deaf babies to deaf couples, I guess because they think it would be better for a hearing couple to raise the kid like a hearing person. But the argument you present makes the most sense to me in that context.

I'm not sure, though, it's a justification for *creating* a deaf baby. For sure, this couple would know best how to raise one, but I think the question of whether they should be altering their embryo to make their baby deaf isn't answered by this explanation.
 
Interpretrator said:
This is the explanation I have heard for deaf couples trying to adopt deaf babies. Apparently some agencies don't want to give deaf babies to deaf couples, I guess because they think it would be better for a hearing couple to raise the kid like a hearing person. But the argument you present makes the most sense to me in that context.

I'm not sure, though, it's a justification for *creating* a deaf baby. For sure, this couple would know best how to raise one, but I think the question of whether they should be altering their embryo to make their baby deaf isn't answered by this explanation.
Click to expand...

I am one of those people who is planning on adopting a deaf baby in a few years. Hope I wont have any discrimination problems. :pissed:
 
Interpretrator said:
This is the explanation I have heard for deaf couples trying to adopt deaf babies. Apparently some agencies don't want to give deaf babies to deaf couples, I guess because they think it would be better for a hearing couple to raise the kid like a hearing person. But the argument you present makes the most sense to me in that context.

I'm not sure, though, it's a justification for *creating* a deaf baby. For sure, this couple would know best how to raise one, but I think the question of whether they should be altering their embryo to make their baby deaf isn't answered by this explanation.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'm not certain there is valid justification for the intentional creation of a deaf baby, or for the intentional genetic alterations for insuring that a child born of deaf parents would not carry the genetic composition that creates deafness (and thus born hearing).

I often hear hearing parents justify choices for communication mode and education for their deaf children using parrallel arguments, though. "Our world is hearing and we want our child to experience what we experience." I've also heard some Deaf adults express joy over having a deaf child, and individuals undergoing artificial insemination often match the donor's physical characteristics to their own.

Frankly, I am in total opposition of not allowing Deaf couples to adopt, period--whether they wish to adopt deaf or hearing children. That Deaf parents cannot provide a safe environment, nor can they provide the skills that hearing parents can is an outdated viewpoint that somehow continues to hang on despite evidence to the contrary.

All of this does raise some interesting points, however. When exactly is invasive intervention appropriate, who decides what is appropriate, and where do we draw the line? Surgical intervention immediately after birth, during gestation, or at the point of gestation? If it is appropriate to alter following birth, why is it not appropriate to alter proactively? I don't have any answers--just thoughts and questions!
 
shel90 said:
I am one of those people who is planning on adopting a deaf baby in a few years. Hope I wont have any discrimination problems. :pissed:
Click to expand...

I hope not as well, shel. I have often wished I had the means to adopt a deaf child, having already raised my own deaf child, so I could provide another kid the benefits of what I learned by practicing on my son! But as I raised my own as a single parent, it just wasn't a practical option for me. I wish you luck.
 
jillio said:
I hope not as well, shel. I have often wished I had the means to adopt a deaf child, having already raised my own deaf child, so I could provide another kid the benefits of what I learned by practicing on my son! But as I raised my own as a single parent, it just wasn't a practical option for me. I wish you luck.
Click to expand...


Thanks!
That is my goal..hope I reach it. :)
 
Question:

Are the people who support the creation of Deaf babies the same people who argue against the implantation of CI's in very young children without their consent?

Deaf parents want Deaf babies, so they use medical technology to get what they want.

Hearing parents want hearing babies, so they use medical technology to get what they want.

No one asks the babies what they want.

What's the difference?

Just asking.
 
Reba said:
Question:

Are the people who support the creation of Deaf babies the same people who argue against the implantation of CI's in very young children without their consent?

Deaf parents want Deaf babies, so they use medical technology to get what they want.

Hearing parents want hearing babies, so they use medical technology to get what they want.

No one asks the babies what they want.

What's the difference?

Just asking.
Click to expand...

In terms of making their child to be like them, there is no difference.

However, after the babies' condition are medically alternated, there is one difference that can occur....

Hearing people use medical technology to make their deaf child hearing..if it works, great! If not, what happens? Lanugage and communication starts to become a barrier and the child become delayed in language development if no other intervention is provided.

Deaf people create deaf babies...deaf babies are exposed to ASL since birth and u got natural language and communication happening. Even if deaf people have hearing children, hearing children are able to learn ASL and still acquire a language.

Not saying that it is ok to create deaf babies but u asked what was the difference, in my point of view that is the difference.

That is where most of my concerns regarding to CIs and other medical techniques to make the children "hear" come in..I dont want their language development to be compromised due to focusing so much time on speech therapy rather than language acquistion if the child has difficulty picking up the cues of spoken language.

Call me wrong or whatever but that is what I see at my work. Kids coming to my school from public schools so language delayed because their ability to pick up on spoken language wasnt successful. I just think that is plain wrong...the child pays for the consequences having to suffer in trying to learn language and then having to learn how to read and write at such a late age.
 
shel90 said:
Deaf people create deaf babies...deaf babies are exposed to ASL since birth and u got natural language and communication happening. Even if deaf people have hearing children, hearing children are able to learn ASL and still acquire a language.
Click to expand...

Not all Deaf people know or choose to use ASL. Some Deaf people are raised orally (speechreading). If a Deaf baby were raised in an oral environment, there is just as much of a chance of language delay occurring as there is for a Deaf baby implanted with a CI that does not work as expected.
 
Back
Top