'Company Policy: We are not hiring until Obama is gone'

deafskeptic said:
I found it quite easily and I will attempt to read as much of it as I can.
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It is not difficult to locate at all. :dunno2: There are only 3 reasons for continuing to demand a link:

1. No intention of even bothering to read the document.
2. Complete inability to use the internet effectively.
3. Trolling.

The first one is probable, and no doubt a combined reason with #3.
I find #2 to be implausible, as the ones demanding the link seem to be able to find their way around all the right wing sites they want to find. If they can accomplish that, then surely they can locate the most recent version of the health care reform bill. Took me approximately 15 seconds.
 
jillio said:
It is not difficult to locate at all. :dunno2: There are only 3 reasons for continuing to demand a link:

1. No intention of even bothering to read the document.
2. Complete inability to use the internet effectively.
3. Trolling
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I'm afraid I have to agree. I decided to stick with the PDF format as I don't want to pay 70 dollars to replace my ink.
 
deafskeptic said:
Just realized I may not have enough paper tp print all of it :P
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I rarely print anything out. I just save and read from the computer or send it to my Kindle.:P

It is not such lengthy reading though, if you have been reading the document from the start. It is just a matter of locating and reading the changes made. Unfortunately for some, they have never bothered to read any of the versions. I know that you have read at least partially some of the past versions, because I remember sending you sections and subsections.
 
jillio said:
I rarely print anything out. I just save and read from the computer or send it to my Kindle.:P

It is not such lengthy reading though, if you have been reading the document from the start. It is just a matter of locating and reading the changes made. Unfortunately for some, they have never bothered to read any of the versions. I know that you have read at least partially some of the past versions, because I remember sending you sections and subsections.
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Yeah, true. I won't attempt to read a 1k page document in one sitting like I can with 1k page books. and Ill use the I've been known to finish 1k page books in one sitting but I will grant those books were lightweight reading instead of books like War and Peace or Decline and Fall of Rome.
I figure that to make it easier for me to digest this bill is to refer to the sections, titles and subtitles and take it slow and make plenty of notes.
 
deafskeptic said:
Yeah, true. I won't attempt to read a 1k page document in one sitting like I can with 1k page books. and Ill use the I've been known to finish 1k page books in one sitting but I will grant those books were lightweight reading instead of books like War and Peace or Decline and Fall of Rome.
I figure that to make it easier for me to digest this bill is to refer to the sections, titles and subtitles and take it slow and make plenty of notes.
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There you go. Reading for information is different than reading for pleasure. But it seems you have the skills and the technique down.
 
jillio said:
It is not difficult to locate at all. :dunno2: There are only 3 reasons for continuing to demand a link:

1. No intention of even bothering to read the document.
2. Complete inability to use the internet effectively.
3. Trolling
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Locating the document is easy. Determining what part of the document you are referring to, not so much. Providing sources is a matter of courtesy to fellow ADers and leads to a conversation rather than this silly game. But again, it is your choice whether you would like to be courteous to other ADers. Perhaps you don't want to have a conversation on this subject.

Even your claim is vague...

Because the health care reform bill has safeguards written into it that actually prevent it.
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Fact of the matter is, they are already cutting corners. As I mentioned before...

Citing cost concerns, the Obama administration said Friday it has halted a long-term care insurance program that was part of the massive health care law passed in 2010.

Called the CLASS Act (Community Living Assistance Services and Supports), the program was canceled by Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius after a 19-month effort to find a way to make it financially viable.

In a letter to Congress, Sebelius wrote, "Despite our best analytical efforts, I do not see a viable path forward for CLASS implementation at this time."
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Obama drops long-term health care program - CNN


The "safeguards" you claim didn't prevent this and most of the law hasn't even taken effect yet. And THIS was a pretty big corner.
 
TXgolfer said:
Locating the document is easy. Determining what part of the document you are referring to, not so much. Providing sources is a matter of courtesy to fellow ADers and leads to a conversation rather than this silly game. But again, it is your choice whether you would like to be courteous to other ADers. Perhaps you don't want to have a conversation on this subject.

Even your claim is vague...



Fact of the matter is, they are already cutting corners. As I mentioned before...



Obama drops long-term health care program - CNN


The "safeguards" you claim didn't prevent this and most of the law hasn't even taken effect yet. And THIS was a pretty big corner.
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And again, I have provided the sources. Given that we were discussing one particular facet of health care reform, it is a simple matter of matching the section to the topic being discussed.:dunno2: See, you have even referred to the safeguards I referred to, so obviously you know what the topic was. Just match it to the section covering such. Pretty simple stuff, really.
 
jillio said:
And again, I have provided the sources. Given that we were discussing one particular facet of health care reform, it is a simple matter of matching the section to the topic being discussed.:dunno2: See, you have even referred to the safeguards I referred to, so obviously you know what the topic was. Just match it to the section covering such. Pretty simple stuff, really.
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Nah I said "safeguards" And the fact is either there are none or they are completely ineffective because they have already started cutting major chunks of the law. And this chunk was cut by HHS.....can't blame Republicans. :)
 
TXgolfer said:
Nah I said "safeguards" And the fact is either there are none or they are completely ineffective because they have already started cutting major chunks of the law. And this chunk was cut by HHS.....can't blame Republicans. :)
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Nope. There are safeguards in place to prevent what was suggested could happen with government sponsored insurance plans as is happening currently with private carriers.
 
jillio said:
Nope. There are safeguards in place to prevent what was suggested could happen with government sponsored insurance plans as is happening currently with private carriers.
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*shrug* I haven't seen any safeguards in my research. And really if they can cut such a large portion so early in the game, nothing is safe. The CLASS act was a major component of the bill.

And.... The Dems on the super committee just offered $400 billion in Medicare and Medicaid cuts.... That is government sponsored insurance.

Supercommittee Dems offer $350 billion in Medicare cuts - Matt DoBias and Seung Min Kim - POLITICO.com

If you would like to present specific safeguards that prevent government from cutting corners on health care I would love to have a conversation about them. But until then it is quite apparent that government can make big cuts in the health care plan. In fact they have already started.
 
TXgolfer said:
Meh, people are attempting to engage in discussion. Personally, I see making claims and refusing to back them up as an adolescent game. In my experience people who are on "up and up" and seeking intelligent conversation are willing to support their claims.

As I said early if you don't want to support your claims that is your choice. No reason to go on and on about it.
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so... do you have anything to back your rebuttal or not?
 
Reba said:
Personally, any posts that I read about public current events that aren't backed up with a reliable source, I dismiss. I'm sure that I'm not the only one.

When I make my posts about such events, I try to include at least a link to the source so no one has to search for the information (unless they want to do additional research).

I consider it perfectly reasonable to request supporting information to statements that purport to be factual. If someone says, "This is my opinion," that's a different matter.
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and when making rebuttal, one should be posting a reliable source as well.
 
TXgolfer said:
Locating the document is easy. Determining what part of the document you are referring to, not so much. Providing sources is a matter of courtesy to fellow ADers and leads to a conversation rather than this silly game. But again, it is your choice whether you would like to be courteous to other ADers. Perhaps you don't want to have a conversation on this subject.

Even your claim is vague...



Fact of the matter is, they are already cutting corners. As I mentioned before...



Obama drops long-term health care program - CNN


The "safeguards" you claim didn't prevent this and most of the law hasn't even taken effect yet. And THIS was a pretty big corner.
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see my Post #389

The insurance mandate does not take effect until 2014. But many new regulations are already operating, like requirements that insurers cover children with pre-existing health conditions and eliminate lifetime caps on benefits. States are also preparing for a major expansion of Medicaid eligibility and the introduction of health insurance exchanges in 2014.
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Jiro said:
see my Post #389
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Yup, some of the law has taken effect and some has not....Like I said


BTW congrats on reading the entire bill, I was not aware that you had done that. :h5:
 
Jiro said:
and when making rebuttal, one should be posting a reliable source as well.
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As long as the original claim is clearly stated and not just made up out of thin air. There have been some claims in past threads that were so off the wall they were impossible to figure out.
 
TXgolfer said:
Yup, some of the law has taken effect and some has not....Like I said
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Like I said? no you said MOST of the law.... but not gonna quibble on it.

TXgolfer said:
BTW congrats on reading the entire bill, I was not aware that you had done that. :h5:
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wot? no congratulation is needed.

maybe this cliff's note might help - Fact Sheet: The Affordable Care Act?s New Patient?s Bill of Rights

and this - Health Care Bill - H.R.3590: Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act - U.S. Congress - OpenCongress
 
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