Do you support suicide assistance?

Do you support suicide assistance?

  • Yes

    Votes: 21 44.7%

  • No

    Votes: 16 34.0%

  • Don´t know

    Votes: 8 17.0%

  • Other

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Total voters
    47
Jiro said:
no..... that is fundamentally flawed... Like I said - brain is a very complex organ. Brain has 4 major regions (plus Cerebellum and Brain Stem). I think you're confusing brain-dead patient with coma patient. I don't think you fully understand what a brain-dead person means. Brain is incredibly sensitive to damage due to lack of oxygen. If I'm correct - you have about 4-7 minutes to restore the oxygen otherwise.... you'll end up with possibly extensive brain damage which then can lead to severe retardation or inability to perform functions yourself (breathing, eating, etc.) or even death. more than 10 minutes.... well.... you're pretty much brain dead. Necrosis had already started - no miracle can save this poor man.

For your information, I do know the difference between brain-dead and coma. I wasn't born yesterday, dude. And, of course, I am not confused unless IF, I ask. Speakin' of a " miracle " - you don't know for certain, do you ?

It's exactly like this - when you're freezing for so long.... you developed frostbite. Further prolongation... your toes/fingers/whatever have already died - it's blackened and hardened. You have to cut it off before you die of infection and septic shock. Miracle? No... miracle will not get you back those toes.

Yeah, but you don't kill that person, do you when that person got frostbite and still alive ? I don't think you get it what I was tryin' to say in my earlier posts. Maybe, you don't get the picture of what I am seein' ? Hmm...
Never mind, if you still don't get it. It's okay that we don't agree on the same page. We don't think the same. :)


????? You're not brain dead... All of your brain regions are functioning properly. Headache doesn't mean you're brain damage or brain dead. In Terry's case, pretty much all of her regions are long dead. In fact - when the autopsy was performed, her brain was much smaller than normal. Her remaining size of the brain was limited to a very primitive function.... enough to perform autonomous tasks. And you're praying for a miracle that she'll come out of it as a normal person???? :eek3:

I understand the means of brain-dead, but Terri was still alive at that time. She wasn't dead. Her heart was STILL pumpin'. It wasn't very nice of someone to cut her life to die by starvin'.... by withheld food/water from her. I don't care if, someone says that she has no experience of feelin' pain or whatsoever. Twelve ( 12 ) days of starvation and without water while she was STILL ALIVE... what do you think of that ? That's murder as if, they were doin' it for the hell of it...ohhh, just because, she was a brain-dead and couldn't function anythin' at all.

Don't forget - Terry is not a coma patient like that firefighter. She's a brain-dead patient with no hope of recovery. not even 1%. not even 0.1%. not even 0.001% either. The only miracle is if Aslan breathed a life into her.
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Like I said I know the difference between brain-dead and coma, but STILL it doesn't matter as long as their heart still functions. Once the heart stops functionin', then a patient dies. That's all to it.
 
I don't have any much experience on suicide assistance, however my families have never use suicide assistance either, I couldn't give more detail about this issue.

I just support for patients who wish to have suicide assistance to end of uncontrolly pain or something like that, I only know that Oregon does legal with strict regulation, it's based on patient's request and require doctor to approve.
 
Foxrac said:
I don't have any much experience on suicide assistance, however my families have never use suicide assistance either, I couldn't give more detail about this issue.

I just support for patients who wish to have suicide assistance to end of uncontrolly pain or something like that, I only know that Oregon does legal with strict regulation, it's based on patient's request and require doctor to approve.
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Yes, Oregon serves as a perfect example. It has restrictions in place that insure that it is used properly.
 
Cheri said:
A person who has PVS is dead?

That's like saying "Let's kill her, let's torture her, she can't complain" :roll:
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:eek3: but by keeping her alive is torturing her and slowly killing her... robbing away her dignity. Her body and brain were atrophying. Look at "after" picture of Terry. It was completely unrecognizable to her former self! and that is not a torture?
 
Royale said:
I support assisted assistance; however, I want to bring something up to share with you.

Will the life insurance company issue a fat check to benefactors of a person who dies of assisted suicide? As matter of facts, they will NOT issue a check to them when their loved one commits suicide.

Why do we have to put our beloved and dying pets to sleep while we are not allowed to have loved and dying ones to do assisted suicide or euthanasia? Why cannot we do it while we can do it to our pets? We are living things and so are our pets.
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I have only read the first two pages on this thread at this time, and if I try to come back to this, I might forget.....to answer this one. Bear with me on this one.

Our beloved pets are living things, but they do need our help in determining what to do about 'end of their lives'. They are not able to speak for themselves the way we can. I am for letting people and animals die naturally especially if people write a DNR or a living will. If animals are in extreme pain, or the quality of life is very poor for the animal even with managed pain/care management, I would let the animal go peacefully. I did absolutely everything for my dog Cleopatra two years ago, and that included starting on a second kidney dialysis but we all realized that her organs were failing during the preparations for the second dialysis. She was also very miserable that day. She was a very happy go lucky dog. Braves pain very well. A tough cookie but she needed help. So what we did for her the next morning was the final act of love. She came home with us for the night. Nothing mattered to me all night but this dog. I didn't even sleep. Oh yeah, I made sure my children were okay but I was able to do everything with Cleo. I did NOT want to see Cleo go but she needed to go home so I made sure she did. I don't take enthansia very lightly but if it needs to be done, I would do it. Before Cleopatra died in my arms, I asked her to please let me know she made it to the other side in anything yellow. I was thinking of a flower. We were home 45 minutes after she died. We didn't plan to be walking out in the backyard but a huge yellow butterfly came to us. I just knew it was Cleopatra. She is at home with all her new friends, and she knows I will look for her the first second I get up there.

One note about this dog though--my ex-boyfriend was willing to put her out of her misery many years before when she encountered a bad Bufo toad case. She was very close to dying but I made him rush us to the veterinary ER instead. The poor dog was in serious convulsions that you'd think killing her would be the best thing...? There are situations with solutions to be found. She recovered. She finally learned not to mess with bufos that much anymore.

I am not sure if there is a formal Living Will law in this country as Liebling stated in Germany or not but if there is such a document among the paperwork of the person wishing to "move on", then that person needs to be let go. Same with a DNR. It must be honored if the person wishes that by all medical personnel. Just saying so is not enough. It has to be documented and respected.

I am not for committing suicide and Assisted Suicide. PSA--I am on the fence on this one. Get all the facts, several opinions from different doctors and vertified. Having exhausted all the options. I think a person will die when it's TIME for the person to "go back home". Everything happens for a reason, and there is a reason for each living entity on the earth until it's time to go.

Just my .o2.
 
Oceanbreeze said:
The Living Will was in existence before we even heard of Terri Schiavo. If you go to the hospital for any reason, you are asked if you have one. If you don't, you're asked if you want to draw up one. The hospital is required by law to ask if a living will exists.
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GOOD POINT, OCEANBREEZE

I did not think to ask if my dad had a living will when I emergency-flew out to N.M. to see how I could help...I knew about the DNR. I didn't know if he had a living will or not BUT if the guy didn't want to "brought back to life" after a code hence the DNR in his chart. Two days was enough to see that my dad was ready to go when it's time. I just knew the facts I needed to know. When the Dr. called us into a meeting, he stated the obvious: that they've done everything they can. He asked each of us what we wanted. I told the Dr. to let him go. If he didn't want a DNR in the first place, then you gotta let him go if the quality life you stated would be extremely poor for him. This is not what Dad would have wanted. Never mind not having seen him in 20 years. I just knew he would not have wanted that. He died on his own two weeks later. He's in a much better place, believe me. When my mom and sister found out what I made clear on (Mom was the ex, and my sister was one of the two kids that chose not to go out west), they totally backed me up, saying I said the right things given the circumstances.

Bottom line--if people want to die with dignity or be let go. Gotta respect that.
 
Some seem to be ignoring the fact that a person in a persistent vegatative state would not fall under PAS law. According to PAS law, the patient must be able to take the medication by their own hand. A person in a persistent vegetative state cannot do that. A person in a PVS is covered under the DNR or a living will that states that no heroic measures are to be taken. Two very different situations, 2 very different legal concepts.
 
IslandBreeze07 said:
GOOD POINT, OCEANBREEZE

I did not think to ask if my dad had a living will when I emergency-flew out to N.M. to see how I could help...I knew about the DNR. I didn't know if he had a living will or not BUT if the guy didn't want to "brought back to life" after a code hence the DNR in his chart. Two days was enough to see that my dad was ready to go when it's time. I just knew the facts I needed to know. When the Dr. called us into a meeting, he stated the obvious: that they've done everything they can. He asked each of us what we wanted. I told the Dr. to let him go. If he didn't want a DNR in the first place, then you gotta let him go if the quality life you stated would be extremely poor for him. This is not what Dad would have wanted. Never mind not having seen him in 20 years. I just knew he would not have wanted that. He died on his own two weeks later. He's in a much better place, believe me. When my mom and sister found out what I made clear on (Mom was the ex, and my sister was one of the two kids that chose not to go out west), they totally backed me up, saying I said the right things given the circumstances.

Bottom line--if people want to die with dignity or be let go. Gotta respect that.
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:gpost: to you too, IB! You're absolutely right! :thumb:
 
jillio said:
Some seem to be ignoring the fact that a person in a persistent vegatative state would not fall under PAS law. According to PAS law, the patient must be able to take the medication by their own hand. A person in a persistent vegetative state cannot do that. A person in a PVS is covered under the DNR or a living will that states that no heroic measures are to be taken. Two very different situations, 2 very different legal concepts.
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Exactly. Which is why we, as individuals, we ALL need to have our wishes spelt out. If we don't, there could be one hell of a mess for the families to deal with. Something I want my loved ones to avoid. I do not want my family fighting over what should be done should I become incapacitated. My wishes have been verbalized as well written in down in all applicable documents, so there is no misunderstandings. I can hope that is true for other families as well.
 
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Just out of curiousity. If I wanted to write a will specifically stating that in an accident where I could no longer communicate with the world, I specifically WANT to be kept alive at all costs. Would that be possible too?
 
dreama said:
Just out of curiousity. If I wanted to write a will specifically stating that in an accident where I could no longer communicate with the world, I specifically WANT to be kept alive at all costs. Would that be possible too?
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Absolutely. You'd just need to abide by the laws in your country, but yes, you could do that.
 
dreama said:
Just out of curiousity. If I wanted to write a will specifically stating that in an accident where I could no longer communicate with the world, I specifically WANT to be kept alive at all costs. Would that be possible too?
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Hey, if your estate is large enough to support the costs of being kept alive by life support for an untold number of years, go for it.

In the United States, unless a person has a living will or a DNR in place when they go into cardiac/repiratory distress, or show no brain activity, physicians are legally and ethically mandated to take heroic measures. So such an order would be redundant.
 
jillio said:
Hey, if your estate is large enough to support the costs of being kept alive by life support for an untold number of years, go for it.

In the United States, unless a person has a living will or a DNR in place when they go into cardiac/repiratory distress, or show no brain activity, physicians are legally and ethically mandated to take heroic measures. So such an order would be redundant.
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Good point. :gpost:

Believe it or not, there are people in this country who use the living will and other documents (power of Attorney, ect) to ensure heroic measures happen. I support this as well. One should NOT assume that their wishes will be carried out, especially in the age of managed care. This is why I support the living will so much. It's always best to have one's desires written down!
 
It PASSED! :shock:

Washington will become the second state in the union to allow doctors to prescribe lethal doses of medication for terminally ill patients seeking to hasten their deaths.

Initiative 1000 — referred to by supporters as a "death-with-dignity" act and by opponents as an "assisted-suicide" measure — was leading in most counties across the state Tuesday.

"I'm elated," said former Washington Gov. Booth Gardner, who filed the initiative and was one of its biggest campaign contributors. Gardner is battling Parkinson's disease, though Parkinson's is not considered a terminal disease that would qualify under the initiative.

Barbara Coombs Lee, president of Compassion & Choices, a national right-to-die organization based in Denver that has provided financial backing for I-1000, said her group hopes to pass similar initiatives in other states in the future, though it hasn't selected any specific states yet.

"We think the citizens of all 50 states deserve death with dignity," she said.

Eileen Geller, campaign coordinator for the Coalition Against Assisted Suicide which opposed I-1000, said her group would look at various options to continue the fight against the measure.

"Clearly we know it's a bad law," she said. "We spoke out against I-1000 because we think it's dangerous. It puts low-income and vulnerable people at risk."

Still, the hard-fought campaign was "a wake-up call for the state of Washington" that there needs to be improved access and support for end-of-life care, Geller said.

I-1000, modeled on a decade-old Oregon law, permits terminally ill, competent adult residents of Washington, who are medically predicted to have six months or less to live, to request and self-administer lethal medication prescribed by a physician.

The measure protects doctors from being prosecuted under a state law forbidding anyone from aiding in a suicide attempt.

Much of the campaign was deeply personal, with those on each side relaying stories of the last days of loved ones.

Initiative supporters said terminally ill patients who are suffering great pain should have the choice to hasten their deaths in a "humane and dignified" manner. They said the measure includes many safeguards, and that no abuses have been found in Oregon in the 10 years the law has been in effect there.

Opponents said end-of-life care has advanced to the point where pain can be controlled. They also said there would be no way of really knowing if safeguards are working because very little information about specific cases would be public and there wouldn't be an independent review of possible abuses.

The I-1000 campaign was the costliest of this year's statewide initiatives, with more than $6.5 million raised from individuals and organizations inside and outside Washington state on both sides.

Initiative supporters raised about $4.9 million. The biggest backers included Compassion & Choices and Death with Dignity, another national right-to-die organization, along with Gardner.

Initiative opponents raised about $1.6 million. The biggest donors included Catholic groups such as the Knights of Columbus, the Seattle Archdiocese and other dioceses.

This is the second time Washington residents have voted on a physician-assistance-in-dying measure.

In 1991, Washington voters rejected Initiative 119, which would have allowed doctors to write prescriptions to hasten death, but unlike I-1000, would have also allowed them to administer lethal injections to terminally ill patients who weren't able to take the medications on their own.
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Assisted Suicide | "Death with dignity" act passes | Seattle Times Newspaper
 
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