On lipreading and signing with bifocals, trifocals or progressive eyeglasses.

Jazzberry

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Hi all,

I know I haven't been around for awhile, been busy being stressed out. :eek3:

And the fun continues -- I just snapped my eyeglasses in half.

Fortunately I can get new eyeglasses with insurance but unfortunately I can't get the same kind -- progressive eyeglasses. I will have to replace them with either trifocals or bifocals.*

So ... I never wore those kind of eyeglasses and I really rely on my lipreading. Can anyone tell me what I can expect? It's not something that I would have attempted to do (lipread with bifocals or trifocals), but as the insurance company won't pay for the progressive kind and I can't pay out of pocket for them myself I will be finding out first hand soon. But I would like a heads up as what to expect.

I recall reading that a typical pair of progressive eyeglasses allows you to focus at about 20 different distances. Bifocals and trifocals allow you to focus at about 2 or 3 different distances respectively.

I'm also curious how it affects signing although I'm not anywhere near fluent in signing yet anyway.

And hey, perhaps I'm worrying about nothing.

Yes, this question is for the old folks over 40 :D, the rest of you can just sit back and think about the good things coming your way later in life. :D



* When things get better financially I plan on paying out of pocket and getting a new pair of progressive eyeglasses over the internet -- much more affordable that way.
 
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I'm not there yet myself but I imagine at 44, I soon will be...:D Like everything, you'll probably just need to give yourself time to adjust. BTW, I can relate with your bad luck. Back from the audi to lower the volume on my hearing aids, just got back from the doctor for my first post surgery visit (paid $4,600) - that's looking good. Now my Blackberry stopped working....it's always something, isn't it?
 
At the moment it sure seems like it.

This week it seems like everything I touch is breaking or needs to be replaced. I'm on edge waiting to see what happens next! I know that its just coincidence, but still -- the timing could not be worse.


But wow -- $4,600.00 and a new blackberry. That is a serious hit to the pocketbook!

I've been away for a while, I'm guessing that was your out of pocket expense for a cochlear implant?

I'm still annoyed at the health insurance and optician businesses though. Since progressives have been developed and are an established technology, I think bifocals and trifocals should be banned. It's important for people to be able to see as well as they can. All people, not just people with hearing loss. :lol: I suspect that it would reduce accidents and headaches. It REALLY annoys me when some medical issues are treated like cosmetic issues and not the important health issues that they are.

/* Going off fuming and back to work. Catch you all later. */


ETA: My father wore bifocals and later trifocals. I also recall that he had frequent headaches which got much worse after he switched to trifocals. Except for hearing (I'm very hard of hearing and my father was hearing) and gender (I'm female and my father was uh, yeah that's right, male :P) our health issues have been almost the same.

So, I'm concerned that after I get the bifocals or trifocals I will also start to get headaches. I'm really not a happy camper right now. :( :mad:
 
But wow -- $4,600.00 and a new blackberry. That is a serious hit to the pocketbook!/

No, thank Christ. The $4,600.00 was for the surgery. Just had a chin reduction on the 28th and paid for the whole thing thankfully in full since I knew the insurance wouldn't cover it. I had luck on my side because the initial reason for the surgery was to break the jaw and align the bite. I had a fixed palate expander that did the job beautifully (quite painful) so I didn't need to have the jaw done. I really dodged the bullet.

However, I got my hearing aids lowered and a clean bill of heath from the doctor and I thought "Great, now I can enjoy the fourth..." I was in the doctor's office when I realized the Blackberry wasn't working so now I'll have to go to Costco to see about getting that fixed. I hope it's nothing more serious than the outlet. On the financial end, I have the braces and surgery completely paid off, (that's rare) but my new Widex Fusion 440 that I'll need for work will cost me $6,150.00 so I'm back in debt again.

I hear you about the insurance - when I thought I needed the jaw done, they flat out refused to cover. Federal health insurance is awful - they just wouldn't cover it. Claimed it was cosmetic even with a jaw specialist in Boston (world renowned saying I needed the surgery). I had to get my doctor to submit paperwork twice, my dentist to write a letter, the orth, etc. I really think health insurance companies are as bad as the mafia, and they deny people services that they really need - such as services for vision and hearing. I hope you catch a break soon yourself. Having gone through serious head pain when I had the palate expander surgery (migraines for a week) I can empathize.

Laura
 
No, thank Christ. The $4,600.00 was for the surgery. Just had a chin reduction on the 28th and paid for the whole thing thankfully in full since I knew the insurance wouldn't cover it. I had luck on my side because the initial reason for the surgery was to break the jaw and align the bite. I had a fixed palate expander that did the job beautifully (quite painful) so I didn't need to have the jaw done. I really dodged the bullet.

However, I got my hearing aids lowered and a clean bill of heath from the doctor and I thought "Great, now I can enjoy the fourth..." I was in the doctor's office when I realized the Blackberry wasn't working so now I'll have to go to Costco to see about getting that fixed. I hope it's nothing more serious than the outlet. On the financial end, I have the braces and surgery completely paid off, (that's rare) but my new Widex Fusion 440 that I'll need for work will cost me $6,150.00 so I'm back in debt again.

I hear you about the insurance - when I thought I needed the jaw done, they flat out refused to cover. Federal health insurance is awful - they just wouldn't cover it. Claimed it was cosmetic even with a jaw specialist in Boston (world renowned saying I needed the surgery). I had to get my doctor to submit paperwork twice, my dentist to write a letter, the orth, etc. I really think health insurance companies are as bad as the mafia, and they deny people services that they really need - such as services for vision and hearing. I hope you catch a break soon yourself. Having gone through serious head pain when I had the palate expander surgery (migraines for a week) I can empathize.

Laura


That does sound painful! I had to look up palatal expander in Wiki as I've not heard of it before. Ouch! Just reading about it made me wince. So you had your expander in for a week? That's a long time to be in pain or even just uncomfortable. But having your teeth aligned does sound important! Helps with eating and talking right? But trust an insurance company to try to claim it's not.

I think insurance companies get away with a lot of nonsense mainly because they are mostly selected by employers and not directly by the people who are the insured. If employers were out of the process -- I think the insurance companies would suddenly become more reasonable. Its true that some people do self-insure, but they are a very small part of the market.

I spoke to the various insurance companies. There's more than one involved because my primary insurance company outsources the vision part of the policy to another company.

I'm going to try to see if I can change things for people with hearing loss in the future. I did get the names of the people to talk to about making future changes. Some people can get additional vision benefits if its "deemed medically necessary." Obviously I think its medically necc. for people who lip read to be able to see well at many points -- near, intermediate (like a computer screen), and far (like when driving or even walking on the street) and all the points in between. You never know who you will have to lipread and how far or near they will be to you. If they seem unresponsive then I'll at least try writing to an agency in NY State. I would like to appeal for myself personally -- but I can't wait. I need to get a pair of glasses ASAP. Hmm, but if the first appeal process takes very little time -- maybe I'll go through the motions of getting rejected so that I can also appeal the policy through NY State. NY State would get involved because the regulate the industry.

Anyway, I hope you find that the Blackberry is an easy fix. Any chance its still under warranty? Or are you still under contract? Maybe they will just give you a new one.

And I understand about debt for medical expenses re hearing loss. It can be almost impossible to stay ahead.
 
Hmm, I see that my post is not getting a lot of responses. Perhaps because its almost the 4th or perhaps its because I sound like a whiny oh-woe-is-me-spoiled brat.

The thing is, I got progressive lens for the first time about 11 years ago. My opthalmologist said "Congratulations -- your eyes finally turned 40", and gave me a prescription for a pair of bifocals. However, the optical store sales lady convinced me that progressives were the only way to go: "You'll be able to see not only near and far, but every point in between."

So after having worn and relied on those type of glasses for so long -- suddenly being told that they are some kind of frill that aren't medically necessary just doesn't make sense to me.

And I am really concerned about whether I'll be able to continue to be able to lipread.

I've been studying the health insurance benefits book and it seems like one possibility is to get two pair of bifocals.

One for reading, desk work and the computer (near and intermediate) and one for seeing people and things while walking around and driving (intermediate and far). I'm not crazy about getting two different pair of eyeglasses but it might be easier for me to lip read with bifocals instead of trifocals.

The vision insurance company said that they wouldn't pay for one pair of glasses with progressive lens but they would pay for two pair of glasses with different bifocal prescriptions. And yes, I think that is going to cost them more money but the policy is that progressives are not covered. Period.

I will discuss it with the opthamologist that I end up seeing this Thursday night (just got an appt. -- yeah!) and see what they think. But I'm curious if my hunch that I might be better off with two pairs of bifocals instead of one pair of trifocals is right. So I'm hoping that if the forum has people who are both hard of hearing and hard of seeing (hah!) -- that they will see this post and let me know what their experience has been.

Pretty please with sugar on top? :ty:
 
Why can't you ask the optician what the difference in cost is between the lined bifocals and the progressives, and pay the difference out of pocket? All the places I've ordered glasses from say I have a choice of progressive or bifocals, and the cost is the same....

I don't know what you are paying for glasses, but I paid $180 for a pair of high-index progressives at BJ's Optical. Our crappy vision insurance will only give us $100 towards a pair of glasses at participating stores only...and the lowest quote I got was $480, so it was a no-brainer.

Walmart's glasses prices are on par with BJ's, so that is another option.

And, all of my optometrists have warned me that once you are used to progressives, you will not be able to tolerate the lined bifocals.
 
That does sound painful! I had to look up palatal expander in Wiki as I've not heard of it before. Ouch! Just reading about it made me wince. So you had your expander in for a week?

I had a fixed expander in my mouth - it's metal and it has a piece that hangs off the roof. You have someone insert a key and turn it two or three times a day for a one or so weeks. The oral surgeon determines how many times it needs to be cranked. It stays in until well after the surgery and it gets removed when the braces come off. I'm convinced it's left over from the Middle Ages when they tortured people.....:D I had it for nearly a year and when ever you eat, everything gets stuck in the middle of your mouth. Obviously I didn't eat out after getting it.

I should have only had it a month before the surgery, but three months in, I got a call from the doctor saying the insurance company refused to cover it. You could have heard me scream two departments down. In fact my boss called me into her office because she became concerned over how I was losing it. I couldn't afford $10-15k on my salary. Thankfully, the expander was all that was needed to correct the bite so I just did the chin reduction....I shouldn't have had to fight Blue Cross for something I was entitled to with the support of two specialists. Who the Hell does surgery for the fun of it?

The Blackberry started working after my father got off the phone with them. We may still send it back as there's no explanation for why it stopped working an entire day, and I rely on this, clearly. Thanks to dealing with AT&T over the phone, I'm going to look into a phone for the deaf where I can speak and get the replies captioned. I depend on my family a lot and perhaps too much. I'm buying the high end hearing aids because my new job requires that I work with the public. I don't think either person that interviewed me knew I was hearing impaired, so I'm keeping that secret. I dearly hope they're worth the amount I paid. For $6k, I expect David Copperfield to perform free at my parties....

I've noticed, that with me anyway - I need new glasses too - that insurance companies either don't pay for any significant hearing aid coverage - or at all...and the same also for eye glasses and vision care. I think it's wonderful what you're doing but it's like fighting city hall, backed by the mafia. You almost can't win. It disgusts me how many people need services - we pay them dearly for coverage, but when we need them - they refuse to pay for anything. How warped is that and why are they allowed to get away with it?

BTW, I would look at Walmart, Sears, Costco's or BJ's for eye care. You really need to save where you can and you have nothing to lose by checking them out. Good luck and Happy 4th....:cheers:
 
My husband has progressive lenses in his glasses, which we order from Zenni, due to the high prices out in the real world.

Just inputting his prescription from our real life doctor, and very good quality. You need to make sure your doctor writes your pupil distance down for you, as it's kind of crucial, but they are pretty reliable, and you could always get the lowest quality until you saved up enough to buy the best.
 
I also have heard very good things about zenni. I haven't used them personally but know know a bunch of people who have and were very pleased with their glasses. If you tend to have a smaller or larger face than average and are worried about fit, you can go into a glasses place like Pearl or Lens Crafters and try on frames. Find a few you like the fit of and write down the numbers on the arm of the frames. Find frames on the Zenni site with similar numbers and you'll be good to go.
 
Hi all,

I know I haven't been around for awhile, been busy being stressed out. :eek3:

And the fun continues -- I just snapped my eyeglasses in half
.

Fortunately I can get new eyeglasses with insurance but unfortunately I can't get the same kind -- progressive eyeglasses. I will have to replace them with either trifocals or bifocals.*

So ... I never wore those kind of eyeglasses and I really rely on my lipreading. Can anyone tell me what I can expect? It's not something that I would have attempted to do (lipread with bifocals or trifocals), but as the insurance company won't pay for the progressive kind and I can't pay out of pocket for them myself I will be finding out first hand soon. But I would like a heads up as what to expect.

I recall reading that a typical pair of progressive eyeglasses allows you to focus at about 20 different distances. Bifocals and trifocals allow you to focus at about 2 or 3 different distances respectively.

I'm also curious how it affects signing although I'm not anywhere near fluent in signing yet anyway.

And hey, perhaps I'm worrying about nothing.

Yes, this question is for the old folks over 40 :D, the rest of you can just sit back and think about the good things coming your way later in life. :D



* When things get better financially I plan on paying out of pocket and getting a new pair of progressive eyeglasses over the internet -- much more affordable that way.

I have bolded the part I am referring to. This makes me think you snapped the bridge and did nothing the the lens. In that case how about just getting new frames? In the reverse, but needing the same thing done to them, I just changed my mind about getting new frames (was going to get the same frame in a different color to have a backup on hand). It was too late to stop them being put together but a gal in the optical department where I got them simply took the old lens out of my existing frame, took the new lens out of the new frame, and put the new lens in the old frame. The new frame was returned to their stock.

It is kinda a toss up whether I supplement my lipreading with the sound my hearing aid gives me or the other way around; but I need both to understand. I have worn bifocals for many years and then trifocals for a number of years and have noticed no problems from it. My reaction to progressives quite a number of years ago is the opposite of yours. I do not like them because of problems with peripheral vision. I just got new trifocal lenses yesterday and discussed the different kinds while there. Progressives have improved since I tried them but peripheral vision is still a problem — you need to turn your whole head to see to the sides when doing things like driving.
 
Why can't you ask the optician what the difference in cost is between the lined bifocals and the progressives, and pay the difference out of pocket? All the places I've ordered glasses from say I have a choice of progressive or bifocals, and the cost is the same....

I don't know what you are paying for glasses, but I paid $180 for a pair of high-index progressives at BJ's Optical. Our crappy vision insurance will only give us $100 towards a pair of glasses at participating stores only...and the lowest quote I got was $480, so it was a no-brainer.

Walmart's glasses prices are on par with BJ's, so that is another option.

And, all of my optometrists have warned me that once you are used to progressives, you will not be able to tolerate the lined bifocals.

Regrettably my plan doesn't allow me to pay for the difference. That would have been a nice option to have.

I've also noticed that the prices for eyeglasses are all over the place. Crazy isn't it? I walked into Lenscrafters just out of curiosity and they quoted me $760.00 for the lenses alone. That didn't include frames or an eye exam -- just lenses. Also out of curiosity I priced out a pair of eyeglasses at Zenni's the total with a 1.67 index and their higher priced protective spray $14.95 vs. $4.95) came out to just under $105.00. The difference in prices is mind-boggling. And thank goodness there are more affordable options.

To be honest, I don't remember how much I had paid for eyeglasses in the past. I think I averaged about $300 - $500.00. I also have a high index prescription (about -4.5, -4.75) and my guess is that I probably paid more than I had too, had I known my options.

My appt. is tonight, I'll find out what my options are though my insurance plan soon. I am writing down BJ Optical's as one of my other options though -- thanks. :)
 
What about buying online? I've heard good things from friends about Zenni Optical. Very inexpensive, and my friends say the glasses are good quality.

Zenni Optical - Eyeglasses, Prescription Glasses, Bifocal, Progressive Eyeglasses, Rimless Glasses

My husband has progressive lenses in his glasses, which we order from Zenni, due to the high prices out in the real world.

Just inputting his prescription from our real life doctor, and very good quality. You need to make sure your doctor writes your pupil distance down for you, as it's kind of crucial, but they are pretty reliable, and you could always get the lowest quality until you saved up enough to buy the best.

I also have heard very good things about zenni. I haven't used them personally but know know a bunch of people who have and were very pleased with their glasses. If you tend to have a smaller or larger face than average and are worried about fit, you can go into a glasses place like Pearl or Lens Crafters and try on frames. Find a few you like the fit of and write down the numbers on the arm of the frames. Find frames on the Zenni site with similar numbers and you'll be good to go.

Zenni, good to know. I was checking out some of the online places including Zenni and wondering if they were honest businesses. It's good to hear that you all either have had or know people who have had good experiences with them.
 
I was a *tad* taken back by the prices at Lens Crafters. I have to get new glasses before my license expires and I know there's no way I'll pass the eye exam without them. I thought this would be a small inconvenience but it's a major ha$$le finding anything affordable.....
 
I have bolded the part I am referring to. This makes me think you snapped the bridge and did nothing the the lens. In that case how about just getting new frames? In the reverse, but needing the same thing done to them, I just changed my mind about getting new frames (was going to get the same frame in a different color to have a backup on hand). It was too late to stop them being put together but a gal in the optical department where I got them simply took the old lens out of my existing frame, took the new lens out of the new frame, and put the new lens in the old frame. The new frame was returned to their stock.

Jane, that is exactly right. My cat managed to snap the bridge -- I don't know how she managed that, but she did. Fast operator too, I had only put them down and walked away for a moment. The one time I didn't put them into a case immediately ...

Anyway, I decided not to kill the cat -- but it was a close call.

My eyeglasses are about 4 yrs old. They aren't scratched but the AR coating is messed up. I'll ask the doc or optician folks if there is a way to rescue them and if it makes sense to do that. Then, if I can find the same size frame, use that. Great idea! :)

It is kinda a toss up whether I supplement my lipreading with the sound my hearing aid gives me or the other way around; but I need both to understand. I have worn bifocals for many years and then trifocals for a number of years and have noticed no problems from it. My reaction to progressives quite a number of years ago is the opposite of yours. I do not like them because of problems with peripheral vision. I just got new trifocal lenses yesterday and discussed the different kinds while there. Progressives have improved since I tried them but peripheral vision is still a problem — you need to turn your whole head to see to the sides when doing things like driving.

I think I avoided that problem because I was always encouraged to get the narrowest lenses that I could. That combined with going with a higher priced manufacturer (IIRC, I bought Varilux) may be the reason that I ended up with lenses that were almost completely usable, fortunately. There is a little less clarity on the sides right next to the nose, but it is a very narrow area and I guess I got use to it. That is also only an issue with the newer pair that have 50 mm wide lenses, not on the older pair that have 47 mm wide lenses. Or perhaps it has to do with the fact that the older pair is a less powerful prescription, or, more likely, it's the combination of the lens being both less powerful and narrower.

From browsing the web sites and brick and mortar stores I can see that most eyeglasses have lenses that are wider than 47 mm so that could be why its more of an issue for most people. That's just my guess anyway.

Anyway, maybe that's why the insurance company doesn't cover them? Because of the peripheral vision issue for most people?

Going back to bifocals and trifocals though -- with either pair, have you experienced any dead spots where you couldn't lip read someone? Like perhaps you could lipread someone 4 feet away or 10 feet away, but not in between? And would you miss some words in the beginning until you had moved your head or eyes into just the right spot? And are the lenses blurry right near the lines, or is it just a matter of experiencing a sudden change of focus as you move your eyes?
 
I was a *tad* taken back by the prices at Lens Crafters. I have to get new glasses before my license expires and I know there's no way I'll pass the eye exam without them. I thought this would be a small inconvenience but it's a major ha$$le finding anything affordable.....

LoL Laura! Call me if you are going to be driving anywhere near my neighborhood, so I can watch out for you! It helps to see well to stay out of accidents too ... :lol:

Re Lenscrafter, yeah -- I was completely taken aback by my experience there. Not only were the prices astronomically high -- but the sales person I spoke to seemed so ignorant about the topic. He dressed well and knew how to put one foot in front of the other. That was it. As far as I could tell, that is all he knew anything about.

For those prices I would expect all the sales people to be experts. If that was a typical Lenscrafter store, I don't know why the chain is still in business.

You mentioned that you don't need bifocals yet. Then you could probably do well with an online retailer. Some of them had software where you can upload your picture and get an idea of what the eyeglasses would look like on you that way. Pretty snazzy.

I was also impressed by the picture uploading capability and database browsing software at not only Zenni (mentioned above) but also eyebuydirect and justeyewear. Justeyewear also has a lens thickness calculator where you can input your prescription a lens type (1.5, 1.67, etc) and then see how thick your lenses will be. I would use that to decide how expensive an index lens to purchase.

I happened to find an opticians forum also and saw that when getting a pair of multifocal lenses, whether bifocal, trifocal or progressive, its recommended to get the seg height and not just the PD. Seg height is apparently the distance between the bottom of the lens and the spot where your eye meets your lower eyelid. Apparently online retailers are going by averages to select the seg height instead of your actual measurement. For most people it works and for the others, well they have the option to return the eyeglasses.

I measured my PD and guess what? AFAICT, its the average PD -- 63! That's the beauty of averages I guess. :) So despite not having the seg information, when my finances improve I will probably try to order a pair of eyeglasses on line.

I do feel sorry for some of the brick and mortar opticians though. There is no way that they can compete with an online retailer, their overhead costs are so much higher.

I don't feel sorry for Lenscrafter, but for some of the independents who have a good business ethic and try to do right by their customers without gouging them -- yeah, I feel sorry for them. I bet most of them end up getting squeezed out of business.
 
You mentioned that you don't need bifocals yet.

Actually I do think I'm going to need those but right now I'm looking at saving where I can. I might get a cheap pair just to pass that test and deal with getting what I really need later when I have my money....than I can drive to New York and take you for a ride around the city....:D

Laura
 
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