It happened again--deaf man shot by police

Reba

Retired Terp
Premium Member
. . . "The man, Magdiel Sanchez, 35, was Tasered and shot dead on a porch Tuesday night after officers saw him holding up a metal pipe. Oklahoma City police Capt. Bo Mathews told reporters Wednesday that the officers had ordered him to put down the pipe.

When Sanchez didn't do so, they opened fire — even as neighbors yelled to police, 'He can't hear you!'...."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...police-shooting-tragic-not-surprising-n803226
 

seb

Well-Known Member
. . . "The man, Magdiel Sanchez, 35, was Tasered and shot dead on a porch Tuesday night after officers saw him holding up a metal pipe. Oklahoma City police Capt. Bo Mathews told reporters Wednesday that the officers had ordered him to put down the pipe.

When Sanchez didn't do so, they opened fire — even as neighbors yelled to police, 'He can't hear you!'...."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...police-shooting-tragic-not-surprising-n803226
And it will probably be ruled a justified shooting. When it comes to police officers common sense is not really all that common. From my own personal experience I know that police hate to be told what to do or anything about what they are investigating.

Perhaps all people who are deaf in the US need to put a sign at their door or have a card printed that they can hand out stating that they are deaf or someone who is deaf lives inside to keep these types of shootings from happening. The sad part is until they take the investigation of police shootings out of the hands of the departments and put it in front of citizen review boards and start sending some of these cops to prison, it will continue to happen.
 

Lysander

Well-Known Member
And it will probably be ruled a justified shooting. When it comes to police officers common sense is not really all that common. From my own personal experience I know that police hate to be told what to do or anything about what they are investigating.

Perhaps all people who are deaf in the US need to put a sign at their door or have a card printed that they can hand out stating that they are deaf or someone who is deaf lives inside to keep these types of shootings from happening. The sad part is until they take the investigation of police shootings out of the hands of the departments and put it in front of citizen review boards and start sending some of these cops to prison, it will continue to happen.
I agree, it's sad, but this will probably be ruled justified. Nevermind the fact that the cop didn't exhaust other possibilities before assuming he was being maliciously noncompliant. It'll basically boil down to, he had a weapon and didn't follow commands. They won't care that he was deaf.
 

rockin'robin

Well-Known Member
Beg to differ somewhat....seems the deaf man was mentally challenged?...and what was he doing walking around with a metal pipe?....Seems he kept coming towards the Cops?...even after he was Tased at first, then shot next....Reminds me of the time the Indian was walking around with a large Knife that he used to carve things...and was shot because he wouldn't drop the knife....Very sad...but...feel they will rule this shooting as justified.
 

rockin'robin

Well-Known Member
I agree, it's sad, but this will probably be ruled justified. Nevermind the fact that the cop didn't exhaust other possibilities before assuming he was being maliciously noncompliant. It'll basically boil down to, he had a weapon and didn't follow commands. They won't care that he was deaf.
I don't feel the Cops "won't or don't care"...I believe the Cop that shot the guy, it will weigh on his conscience, but all in all, if someone was coming at me with a metal pipe, and I had never seen or knew him, I would do everything I could to protect myself.
 

rockin'robin

Well-Known Member
. . . "The man, Magdiel Sanchez, 35, was Tasered and shot dead on a porch Tuesday night after officers saw him holding up a metal pipe. Oklahoma City police Capt. Bo Mathews told reporters Wednesday that the officers had ordered him to put down the pipe.

When Sanchez didn't do so, they opened fire — even as neighbors yelled to police, 'He can't hear you!'...."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...police-shooting-tragic-not-surprising-n803226
Feel as if tho' people might have yelled "he can't hear you", the Cops were concentrating on the man coming towards them with a metal pipe and would not obey their commands. Should the Cops just back up?...and let the man attack them with a metal pipe?...what was the deaf man doing walking around with a metal pipe to begin with? It's a weapon and a deadly one at that.
 

Lysander

Well-Known Member
I don't feel the Cops "won't or don't care"...I believe the Cop that shot the guy, it will weigh on his conscience, but all in all, if someone was coming at me with a metal pipe, and I had never seen or knew him, I would do everything I could to protect myself.
True. I appreciate your perspective. I suppose I have a really bad taste in my mouth for police. I've had some really negative discriminatory interactions with police. So I tend to assume they're all bad with bad intentions.
 

Jane B.

Well-Known Member
Feel as if tho' people might have yelled "he can't hear you", the Cops were concentrating on the man coming towards them with a metal pipe and would not obey their commands. Should the Cops just back up?...and let the man attack them with a metal pipe?...what was the deaf man doing walking around with a metal pipe to begin with? It's a weapon and a deadly one at that.

I am not sure which of the links it was in but one of them said he made it because of a loose dog problem when he would walk in the neighborhood. And my understanding is he already had it in his hand when the cops showed up.

I am in the middle of trying to solve a problem with something I needed to get out yesterday and may find the exact reference to this later.
 

Barbaro

Well-Known Member
I heard about it. In OK, they said the local news mentioned he used a walking stick, not a metal pipe. He used a stick to keep stray dogs away. His daughter was there and yelled at police that he's deaf.

I suspect this guy has limited education, which make it more difficult to communicate with police.
 

rockin'robin

Well-Known Member
True. I appreciate your perspective. I suppose I have a really bad taste in my mouth for police. I've had some really negative discriminatory interactions with police. So I tend to assume they're all bad with bad intentions.
Me too!...Cops here in Jacksonville seem to be ones of the worst. But I've also dealt with some good ones.
 

Tetracyclone

Active Member
Good cops, bad cops, some good today bad yesterday. The bottom line is this world is unsafe, including your home, and survivors keep their wits about them at all times. If you see a cop looking at you make yourself as non-threatening as possible- empty hands in the air. This might not save you but it is more likely to.

Police work is deadly dangerous and civilians should assume they are dealing with dangerous people whenever confronted by a police officer. It is a bad time for a rant.

My brother was schizophrenic and had endless encounters with our local police. He drank and was verbally abusing to them. Several times they tried beating him to make him more respectful but it did not work so eventually word got round our police department that they guy was mentally ill but basically harmless. Lock him up when necessary, but it's all routine safe for them. It worked.

With my town, at that time, drug gangs and gun play were uncommon so police were not traumatized. The department succeeded in screening out guys who wanted the power of being a policeman. Larger cities have more difficulty maintaining service-oriented police forces.
 

seb

Well-Known Member
A good friend of mine who is a retired CHP has told me repeatedly that today's cops are taught to shoot first and ask questions later and they have all but forgotten about the baton(night stick) they carry. He can't believe the cops who have shot these people who are carrying knives, pipes, etc. don't use their baton to disarm these people, he and his fellow recruits back in the 1950's were taught to use the baton first and only use their gun as a last resort if their life was in immanent danger. Somewhere along the way cops have now been trained to basically take on the role of basically being an executioner.
 

Beowulf

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
A good friend of mine who is a retired CHP has told me repeatedly that today's cops are taught to shoot first and ask questions later and they have all but forgotten about the baton(night stick) they carry. He can't believe the cops who have shot these people who are carrying knives, pipes, etc. don't use their baton to disarm these people, he and his fellow recruits back in the 1950's were taught to use the baton first and only use their gun as a last resort if their life was in immanent danger. Somewhere along the way cops have now been trained to basically take on the role of basically being an executioner.

As well as judge and jury. Militarism is running amok.
 

Lysander

Well-Known Member
A good friend of mine who is a retired CHP has told me repeatedly that today's cops are taught to shoot first and ask questions later and they have all but forgotten about the baton(night stick) they carry. He can't believe the cops who have shot these people who are carrying knives, pipes, etc. don't use their baton to disarm these people, he and his fellow recruits back in the 1950's were taught to use the baton first and only use their gun as a last resort if their life was in immanent danger. Somewhere along the way cops have now been trained to basically take on the role of basically being an executioner.
My sister's ex husband works for our local juvenile probation office. When he was in training for his job he kept remarking that he didn't understand why there wasn't a step between pepper spray and shoot to kill. So his training of resistance management was: Talk, Pepper Spray, Shoot to Kill. No shoot to maim. Or shoot to stop, but not kill. Pepper spray and if that doesn't work, kill them.
 

Beowulf

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
My sister's ex husband works for our local juvenile probation office. When he was in training for his job he kept remarking that he didn't understand why there wasn't a step between pepper spray and shoot to kill. So his training of resistance management was: Talk, Pepper Spray, Shoot to Kill. No shoot to maim. Or shoot to stop, but not kill. Pepper spray and if that doesn't work, kill them.

Don't forget about emptying your gun into the victim.
 

Reba

Retired Terp
Premium Member
The guy couldn't hear the cops but he could see them. Had no one taught him that if he was approached by uniformed officers he should put down whatever was in his hands, show his empty hands, keep them out of his pockets, and don't approach the officers or make any sudden moves?

I don't know what level of understanding he had. Someone dropped the ball in his life skills training.

Someone also dropped the ball in the training of the police officers. Why did one cop use a Tazer but the other used a gun?

It's not that American police are trained to kill; they aren't trained enough in techniques other that lethal force.

When it does come down to shooting, police officers get a lot less training and practice than you would expect necessary. They are not sharpshooters.
 
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