Hearing writer, Deaf character

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aglaeca

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Hi all,

I joined this forum because I'm currently working on my second novel, which includes a Deaf character and a number of hearing characters who have a wide range of fluency in ASL. I'll have a number of questions, I'm sure, but this is the biggest one so far and probably the most important to the project.

Most of the dialogue takes place between the main character, who is Deaf, and his girlfriend, who is hearing but is a teacher for the Deaf. Since the characters speak a mix of spoken English and ASL, my question is about how I should represent the ASL dialogue in a written form. My idea is to have the spoken dialogue in quotation marks and the ASL dialogue without quotation marks. I'd have the ASL dialogue translated into English but would also include descriptions of certain important signs, how the characters signed certain words or phrases based on their emotions, and so forth. Thoughts?
 
There are so many hearing people who want to write deaf stories on this forum, you should form your own group. ;)

My thought.
 
Bottesini said:
There are so many hearing people who want to write deaf stories on this forum, you should form your own group. ;)

My thought.
Click to expand...

I just did.

But I think everybody should be able to join, as I write, but have no plans to write about Deaf. I'm sure Deaf people can write about hearing and I believe HA is thinking about writing of her Deaf/Blind Beeper experiences.
 
Cool Berry! I put my name in to join even though I only write deaf stream of consciousness for AD.

You should start a thread to tell about it so the writers know it is here!:wave:


(I have not ambition to write a novel about hearing people.:P)
 
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Great idea, as usual, Bottesini.

Will do.
 
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I was real pleased to join the language group, Bottesini and Berry :ty:

I love to read and write and wrote little stories as a kid.
Now, as someone with LD, I could write about a character who has LD. I could write a story about someone with a husband hoh..........but as hearing person, I could not write about Deaf.........

:D
 
I am deaf writer and writes about deaf character

I am deaf writer and writes about a deaf character...

I have no trouble writing about a deaf character because I do know from my experince to be one... But...I am learning ASL and working on my ASL signs too. I am getting to nowhere, lol...I will tell you that.

But in my writing, I used SEE in my character's POV, not ASL...but another character knew ASL and, they did try work together how to communicate btwn SEE and ASL and the hearing characters were puzzled by their actions.
 
aglaeca said:
Hi all,

I joined this forum because I'm currently working on my second novel, which includes a Deaf character and a number of hearing characters who have a wide range of fluency in ASL. I'll have a number of questions, I'm sure, but this is the biggest one so far and probably the most important to the project.

Most of the dialogue takes place between the main character, who is Deaf, and his girlfriend, who is hearing but is a teacher for the Deaf. Since the characters speak a mix of spoken English and ASL, my question is about how I should represent the ASL dialogue in a written form. My idea is to have the spoken dialogue in quotation marks and the ASL dialogue without quotation marks. I'd have the ASL dialogue translated into English but would also include descriptions of certain important signs, how the characters signed certain words or phrases based on their emotions, and so forth. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

maybe you were referring to SEE, Sign with Excat English??? I don't think there was ever excat English in ASL.

It is pretty tough to write ASL in your writing, bec I had to be very, very careful not to mix with ASL and SEE between two characters...It is a very trick game, I warn ya!!!

There is no rule about how the character speaks or signs...I bet on that. You don't have to use excat English in character's speaking...or signs...

I do what a person signs or says in ASL, and leave at that...there is no rule about it...as long it is someone's voice...

And emotion, it is same as you normally write in everyday's life...I would make sure what a deaf character does like if he/she signs, I use the hand motion.
 
What I would like to see is a novel of a d/Deaf character, written by a d/Deaf person who was not afraid to hold a real mirror up to the hearing world showing how they look to d/Deaf people.

Don't know if it would sell though, that is the rub, but I think in the right hands it would be a great novel.
 
restless_heart said:
maybe you were referring to SEE, Sign with Excat English??? I don't think there was ever excat English in ASL.
Click to expand...

By "mix of spoken English and ASL" I meant that most of the secondary characters are hearing and speak English, but that through their contact with the Deaf character they've learned some signs, ranging from fingerspelling and a few signs for some characters to ASL fluency in his girlfriend's case.

restless_heart said:
There is no rule about how the character speaks or signs...I bet on that. You don't have to use excat English in character's speaking...or signs...
Click to expand...

This is the really tricky part for me. Since ASL syntax is different from spoken English I don't want the dialogue to be confusing to hearing readers, but at the same time it's very important to me that the "feeling" of the language comes across--that the written dialogue isn't just a stand-in for spoken dialogue, but that it actually conveys the feeling of signed dialogue, and I want to hit that mark to the degree that Deaf readers will see it as authentic to their culture and experience, as opposed to co-opting that culture.

I really appreciate your feedback, especially about describing the signs the characters make. I've been trying it and it's been really liberating--describing how a character makes a certain sign or series of signs makes it easier to reveal emotions than describing a facial expression or a tone of voice. It also gives me a lot of opportunities for metaphor and for poetic expressions that wouldn't be there otherwise.

Here's a question--how would you handle attributions for signed dialogue? "He signed" or "she signed" seem awkward in repetition. My idea is to go with "he said" or "she said" but to make it clear that they're signing the dialogue, and to eschew quotation marks for anything that's signed.
 
Here's a question--how would you handle attributions for signed dialogue? "He signed" or "she signed" seem awkward in repetition. My idea is to go with "he said" or "she said" but to make it clear that they're signing the dialogue, and to eschew quotation marks for anything that's signed
Click to expand...

Have an illustrator and put graphic depiction of the signs.

Plus if it is many people who know only little sign, I think they would be using PSE.
 
Bottesini said:
Have an illustrator and put graphic depiction of the signs.
Click to expand...

I would love it if I could find a publisher who would be willing to include the number of illustrations necessary for that, but it would be very difficult to talk them into anything more than illustrations of the title and the chapter headings. Maybe if I sold a lot of books first...
 
Berry said:
What I would like to see is a novel of a d/Deaf character, written by a d/Deaf person who was not afraid to hold a real mirror up to the hearing world showing how they look to d/Deaf people.

Don't know if it would sell though, that is the rub, but I think in the right hands it would be a great novel.
Click to expand...

:D We will see what happens.

aglaeca said:
By "mix of spoken English and ASL" I meant that most of the secondary characters are hearing and speak English, but that through their contact with the Deaf character they've learned some signs, ranging from fingerspelling and a few signs for some characters to ASL fluency in his girlfriend's case.



This is the really tricky part for me. Since ASL syntax is different from spoken English I don't want the dialogue to be confusing to hearing readers, but at the same time it's very important to me that the "feeling" of the language comes across--that the written dialogue isn't just a stand-in for spoken dialogue, but that it actually conveys the feeling of signed dialogue, and I want to hit that mark to the degree that Deaf readers will see it as authentic to their culture and experience, as opposed to co-opting that culture.

I really appreciate your feedback, especially about describing the signs the characters make. I've been trying it and it's been really liberating--describing how a character makes a certain sign or series of signs makes it easier to reveal emotions than describing a facial expression or a tone of voice. It also gives me a lot of opportunities for metaphor and for poetic expressions that wouldn't be there otherwise.

Here's a question--how would you handle attributions for signed dialogue? "He signed" or "she signed" seem awkward in repetition. My idea is to go with "he said" or "she said" but to make it clear that they're signing the dialogue, and to eschew quotation marks for anything that's signed.
Click to expand...

Well, in the beginning I would make the reader know that there is a deaf character involve so we don't have to use impression or hand motion too much, but I would make sure that the character was using hand motion with spoken words. And also for a chacater's voice, in my writing I do let the reader know what his/her voice sounds like, even their hand motions. But if a deaf character is silence while he/she signs, I make sure I let the reader know. And for that hearing chacarter, I did add what the deaf character was saying to other hearing character(s) that doesn't know any signs so that way they will know what the two people were talking about instead of being left out. But I did even made those other characters left out, just like the real out world today like some hearing people normally do--leaving deaf person left out, or even backwards.

With hearing people communicating with a deaf person, I would make sure this deaf character doesn't understand every single word he/she was saying, unless that hearing person do know signs. I would be careful about that. Not every deaf person do understand hearing person, not always...trust me, not always, even I am hard-of-hearing...it is a fact...

About sounds that deaf people normally hears everyday is not like what hearing people hears...you can ask your deaf friends or hard of hearing what those sounds sound like...it may sound odd to you if you were a hearing person, trust me... For a good example, not every deaf person knows what cricket even sounds like...I have to describe what the deaf person think the cricket sounds like or he/she ever knew what it sounds like.

So my writing may be odd to some hearing readers but, I am writing facts what the deaf world is like, and how it feels to be one, etc... So the hearing will come to an understanding what a deaf culture really like in the real world. It is not make-believe, or any guessing facts...

I have written two complete novels with deaf character in the story. I tell ya, it is a lot of work, and it is not easy but I made it through alright...I love it...My friends were surprised by my writing, and asking for more...so that is why I decide to write in series instead, to divide those into four novellas, more like Goosebumps series since I don't ever see any teenager books for boys nowadays...so I will make that happen, boys do read too, not just girls...
 
aglaeca said:
Here's a question--how would you handle attributions for signed dialogue? "He signed" or "she signed" seem awkward in repetition. My idea is to go with "he said" or "she said" but to make it clear that they're signing the dialogue, and to eschew quotation marks for anything that's signed.
Click to expand...

What I would do is just do what writers normally do, there is always quotation marks, even in signs. But make sure you describe their hand motions when a character signs even if he/she doesn't speak out loud. (Always make sure if he/she is speaking out loud or not) You don't want to confuse a reader, or you are telling the reader that this character became hearing person from a deaf person--how it is possible, haha...

Maybe a sign language book would help you understand hand motions...or you describe it yourself from a picture or a deaf person you know.

It is never easy, trust me...
 
I never know what I'm going to do or how I'm going to do it until I do it. Often I don't even know what I'm doing when I'm doing it. And many times after I have done it I can't figure out what I've done.

But it usually works so I don't care.

And if it doesn't work I just redo it.
 
Berry said:
I never know what I'm going to do or how I'm going to do it until I do it. Often I don't even know what I'm doing when I'm doing it. And many times after I have done it I can't figure out what I've done.

But it usually works so I don't care.

And if it doesn't work I just redo it.
Click to expand...

Haha same here. Sometimes we surprise ourselves, did we? Whoa, did we do this???
 
Supposedly you could it in ASL-text and then include an indented and italicized translation underneath it. such as

"You-#J-E-N-Drive-Car-New-Red?"
§Did you and Jennifer drive in your new red car?

I don't know ASL though so whatsie.
 
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