Declaration of Occupy Wall Street - Page 3

**TXgolfer** · 10-10-2011, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saywhatkid

Would that include the college grads that gave up looking for work? That is the kind of comment usually reserved for Obama supporters that point to lower unemployment figures as proof the stimulus is working. (Personally, I think it failed miserably) The real number of unemployed college grads could be something like 7 or 8%. Who really knows, but certainly it is possible. BTW, I find that figure a ghastly number for those that spent $100k+ for an education, making them go deeply into debt, only to find they are squeezed out by selfish CEOs that want to ship work overseas to increase profits; avoiding anti-pollution and labor laws in the process. Greed is really the bottom line here.

My guess is the second figure is 6 maybe 7. That chart show participation and college grads are the highest number.

If they can't find a job perhaps they should start their own business. Surely with a $100k education they are smart enough to do that. But then again they weren't smart enough to avoid going $100k in debt for college in the first place so who knows.

no one forced them to take the loans though and if anyone promised them a job they should sue that person/company.

**TXgolfer** · 10-10-2011, 12:17 AM

More lovely people

http://oregonlive.com/advorg/pm_3233...tguid=3CKG6bub

**Reba** · 10-10-2011, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

More lovely people

http://oregonlive.com/advorg/pm_3233...tguid=3CKG6bub

Link was to site map only. Please check.

**saywhatkid** · 10-10-2011, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

My guess is the second figure is 6 maybe 7. That chart show participation and college grads are the highest number.

If they can't find a job perhaps they should start their own business. Surely with a $100k education they are smart enough to do that. But then again they weren't smart enough to avoid going $100k in debt for college in the first place so who knows.

no one forced them to take the loans though and if anyone promised them a job they should sue that person/company.

Not everyone is a business tycoon that can weave through red tape. Being smart does not equal smart in everything. Some of the lowest IQ scoring folks I have met in my life can tear apart a car engine and reassemble it, something I could never do, but they would have no chance in the world of finance. We all have talents for certain things. Start their own business? Who pays for the failed business loans that float around? How many new companies stick in these difficult economic times?

**Cheetah** · 10-10-2011, 01:36 PM

The global financial picture is so incredibly complex it's probably impossible for any one person fully understand. Every time I think about it I realize there are more pressure points than I previously considered. Heck, we are still analyzing the financial picture from the last great depression. It's really hard to know the full impact of a policy, law, or trend until it's run it's course. And even then you may not catch all the little things that happened because of it.

How can we trust what a political candidate is saying about the financial crisis when we cannot even begin to understand it?

warpedpink · 10-10-2011, 07:15 PM

Almost completly of the point but I went to Burning Man Decompression yesterday in San Francisco and my friend dressed up as the 99% Superhero!

**Beowulf** · 10-10-2011, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by posts from hell

i'm tired of these people... I ask them questions and they go "EDUCATE YOURSELF".... I then say, ok, what do I educate myself on.. "Go on the internet and research!"

bah, they're weak.

A lot of my close friends/family is going to occupy denver. I find it a waste of time.

I have been taught by a wise man that if you cannot explain something effectively and clearly, you do not know what you are talking about. Protests are different in the sense that only a few can clearly and effectively explain their positions and the reasons for them, while the rest follow them. However, protests are an effective way to get folk to start discussing the issues at hand. That is why I like them.

**TXgolfer** · 10-10-2011, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Link was to site map only. Please check.

Oops sorry

Two Occupy Portland supporters arrested for tagging | OregonLive.com

**Beowulf** · 10-10-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

Oops sorry

Two Occupy Portland supporters arrested for tagging | OregonLive.com

And? Deal with them with prejudice or extreme prejudice?

**TXgolfer** · 10-10-2011, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saywhatkid

Not everyone is a business tycoon that can weave through red tape. Being smart does not equal smart in everything. Some of the lowest IQ scoring folks I have met in my life can tear apart a car engine and reassemble it, something I could never do, but they would have no chance in the world of finance. We all have talents for certain things. Start their own business? Who pays for the failed business loans that float around? How many new companies stick in these difficult economic times?

Business loan? That's right up there with school loans....

If these college kids aren't smart enough to know you have to pay back your loans perhaps we should end school loans. Nothing weong with working your way through.

**saywhatkid** · 10-11-2011, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

Business loan? That's right up there with school loans....

If these college kids aren't smart enough to know you have to pay back your loans perhaps we should end school loans. Nothing weong with working your way through.

Just a FYI; as the Conservatives constantly remind the world, Obama has kept unemployment rates at levels unseen since the Depression.

Taking for granted that these students can find meaningful work to support their college years? Again with the assumption that going to college means they should all be financial wizards. Do you really think that anyone that has no job, no money saved, with a degree, can collect enough aluminum cans, sell enough Kirby vacuums, panhandle in front of freeway ramps, and flip hamburgers at a rate that allows them to start a business without a loan? Come on. Not everyone is Bill Gates.

rockin'robin · 10-11-2011, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saywhatkid

Not everyone is a business tycoon that can weave through red tape. Being smart does not equal smart in everything. Some of the lowest IQ scoring folks I have met in my life can tear apart a car engine and reassemble it, something I could never do, but they would have no chance in the world of finance. We all have talents for certain things. Start their own business? Who pays for the failed business loans that float around? How many new companies stick in these difficult economic times?

**Beowulf** · 10-11-2011, 11:23 AM

Capitalism has a very ugly side. Someone once told me that if I had any sense at all, I would buy something and sell it to the next person at a higher price. In essence, rip him off. I just cannot bring myself to do this, but Wall Street sure can. That is what the protest is about, more or less.

**sallylou** · 10-11-2011, 12:29 PM

Wirelessly posted (droid)

Calling college kids stupid is not only non-persuasive, it makes one look like a bitter old person. There is no reason to pit age groups against each other, and it's a sign of toxic leadership.
The point is that financial pros shouldn't be able to make obscene profits with fraudulent paper pushing schemes only to be bailed out by ordinary working people. It's like that Dilbert strip in which Catbert puts a bunch of diseased cattle in a group to sell them.

**deafskeptic** · 10-11-2011, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallylou

Wirelessly posted (droid)

Calling college kids stupid is not only non-persuasive, it makes one look like a bitter old person. There is no reason to pit age groups against each other, and it's a sign of toxic leadership.
The point is that financial pros shouldn't be able to make obscene profits with fraudulent paper pushing schemes only to be bailed out by ordinary working people. It's like that Dilbert strip in which Catbert puts a bunch of diseased cattle in a group to sell them.

Exactly. We need to hold these people and those in power accountable. And that goes for those who have power over ordinary people ie bosses, politicans etc..

**saywhatkid** · 10-11-2011, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallylou

Wirelessly posted (droid)

Calling college kids stupid is not only non-persuasive, it makes one look like a bitter old person. There is no reason to pit age groups against each other, and it's a sign of toxic leadership.
The point is that financial pros shouldn't be able to make obscene profits with fraudulent paper pushing schemes only to be bailed out by ordinary working people. It's like that Dilbert strip in which Catbert puts a bunch of diseased cattle in a group to sell them.

Speaking of Dilbert....

**Reba** · 10-11-2011, 03:22 PM

Who pays for all the expenses of these "occupy" movements? That is, who pays for the extra police hours, the massive clean up of debris, the lost business, overflowing toilets, vandalism, etc.?

**saywhatkid** · 10-11-2011, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Who pays for all the expenses of these "occupy" movements? That is, who pays for the extra police hours, the massive clean up of debris, the lost business, overflowing toilets, vandalism, etc.?

The employed.

**TXgolfer** · 10-11-2011, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saywhatkid

Just a FYI; as the Conservatives constantly remind the world, Obama has kept unemployment rates at levels unseen since the Depression.

Taking for granted that these students can find meaningful work to support their college years? Again with the assumption that going to college means they should all be financial wizards. Do you really think that anyone that has no job, no money saved, with a degree, can collect enough aluminum cans, sell enough Kirby vacuums, panhandle in front of freeway ramps, and flip hamburgers at a rate that allows them to start a business without a loan? Come on. Not everyone is Bill Gates.

No doubt the unemployment rate is high. But, the point is it is not very high for college grads. There is a big gap.

You can start a service industry business for a few $. It's more about hard work than money.

**saywhatkid** · 10-11-2011, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

No doubt the unemployment rate is high. But, the point is it is not very high for college grads. There is a big gap.

You can start a service industry business for a few $. It's more about hard work than money.

Well, that might not seem so, but 7%, which you willingly admit is possible, even probable, makes things quite difficult.

Imagine trying to find a job, any job, with creditors calling, your mortgage nearing default, and nobody willing to give you an interview. That is the reality many people wake up to daily. I understand your reasoning, but there are many thousands of highly educated people that are in the situation I just described; people with degrees and many years of experience in their field.

Since you are basking in the fruits of your labors, you do not have to look for work. It seems a bit incredulous to expect everyone to attempt to start a business when times are tough. Easy for you to say, but it reeks of smugness. Sorry.

**TXgolfer** · 10-11-2011, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallylou

Wirelessly posted (droid)

Calling college kids stupid is not only non-persuasive, it makes one look like a bitter old person. There is no reason to pit age groups against each other, and it's a sign of toxic leadership.
The point is that financial pros shouldn't be able to make obscene profits with fraudulent paper pushing schemes only to be bailed out by ordinary working people. It's like that Dilbert strip in which Catbert puts a bunch of diseased cattle in a group to sell them.

The students keep saying they want "their" bailout. Nobody seems to acknowledge the fact that the banks paid their bailout money back....in most cases with interest. So the student got their bailout IMO when they got their school loans. But now they are complaining about having to pay off those loans.

Oh and nobody is calling all college kids stupid. Just the ones that think having to pay back your loans is unfair.

DeafCaroline · 10-11-2011, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Who pays for all the expenses of these "occupy" movements? That is, who pays for the extra police hours, the massive clean up of debris, the lost business, overflowing toilets, vandalism, etc.?

Most likely the taxpayers, of course, the same ones who bailed out the billionaires of Wall Street while their own homes got foreclosed on them.

**TXgolfer** · 10-11-2011, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saywhatkid

Well, that might not seem so, but 7%, which you willingly admit is possible, even probable, makes things quite difficult.

Imagine trying to find a job, any job, with creditors calling, your mortgage nearing default, and nobody willing to give you an interview. That is the reality many people wake up to daily. I understand your reasoning, but there are many thousands of highly educated people that are in the situation I just described; people with degrees and many years of experience in their field.

Since you are basking in the fruits of your labors, you do not have to look for work. It seems a bit incredulous to expect everyone to attempt to start a business when times are tough. Easy for you to say, but it reeks of smugness. Sorry.

Starting a business was one option. Working nights at Home Depot or Safeway while looking for a career during the day is an option too. Regardless....no one forced them to take out the loans.

**TXgolfer** · 10-11-2011, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

Most likely the taxpayers, of course, the same ones who bailed out the billionaires of Wall Street while their own homes got foreclosed on them.

Yup as usually the Taxpayers will have to pay for this childish behavior. At least the billionaires paid us back....

DeafCaroline · 10-11-2011, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

Yup as usually the Taxpayers will have to pay for this childish behavior. At least the billionaires paid us back....

There are still debts outstanding but ok. The issue here is that until Wall Street change how they do banking, financial crises will happen again and the economy will stagger and the citizens will suffer yet again in so many different ways. Occupy Wall Street is generating attention to the fact that the bankers have not changed their ways, that more regulation, responsibility and accountability is needed and until this happens, another financial crisis is looming on the horizon and the earth will continued to be pillaged and sucked dry of resources and destroying others, the most essential being fresh water, that we need to grow crops. They're getting the buzz going, they're making people ask questions about why this whole protest is happening, they are spreading awareness and education. As long as people think the Fed means the government and not the Federal Reserve, they are woefully uneducated on how their country nearly collapsed because of Wall Street type-A greedy bankers who have the audacity to have so little faith in loans being repaid that they would bet against them for profit.

If more people take the time to understand how all those repeals of the Glass-Steagal Act led to the collapse of 2008, they wouldn't be fussing over the garbage the protesters left behind in Central Park.

Steinhauer · 10-11-2011, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

There are still debts outstanding but ok. The issue here is that until Wall Street change how they do banking, financial crises will happen again and the economy will stagger and the citizens will suffer yet again in so many different ways. Occupy Wall Street is generating attention to the fact that the bankers have not changed their ways, that more regulation, responsibility and accountability is needed and until this happens, another financial crisis is looming on the horizon and the earth will continued to be pillaged and sucked dry of resources and destroying others, the most essential being fresh water, that we need to grow crops. They're getting the buzz going, they're making people ask questions about why this whole protest is happening, they are spreading awareness and education. As long as people think the Fed means the government and not the Federal Reserve, they are woefully uneducated on how their country nearly collapsed because of Wall Street type-A greedy bankers who have the audacity to have so little faith in loans being repaid that they would bet against them for profit.

If more people take the time to understand how all those repeals of the Glass-Steagal Act led to the collapse of 2008, they wouldn't be fussing over the garbage the protesters left behind in Central Park.

No - you are misguided in your efforts. It was the failed stimulus package and fruitless bailouts the current commander in chief handed out that caused this financial mess. not wall street - if you do not believe me, just ask VP Biden.

At leat the Tea party doesn't promote anarchy.

DeafCaroline · 10-11-2011, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steinhauer

No - you are misguided in your efforts. It was the failed stimulus package and fruitless bailouts the current commander in chief handed out that caused this financial mess. not wall street - if you do not believe me, just ask VP Biden.

uh...ok. Whatever you believe.

Steinhauer · 10-11-2011, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

uh...ok. Whatever you believe.

I believe facts - and no, the facts do not come to me after drinking the bong water. I do not smoke pot:

Joe Biden | Obama Economy | George W. Bush | The Daily Caller

Quote:

Vice President Joe Biden toldFlorida radio station WLRN on Thursday that voters should hold President Barack Obama, not former President George W. Bush, accountable for the poor state of America’s economy.

**sallylou** · 10-11-2011, 08:53 PM

TXGolfer, the banks have not paid back the money. I don't know where you're getting that. If you've got some evidence of that, I'd love to see it. Your smug attitude only lessens your credibility.

As I mentioned earlier, the bailout money also went to foreign banks and American corporations. Hardly within the purview of the Federal Reserve.

DeafCaroline · 10-11-2011, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steinhauer

I believe facts - and no, the facts do not come to me after drinking the bong water. I do not smoke pot:

Joe Biden | Obama Economy | George W. Bush | The Daily Caller

Nobody drinks the bong water, it's foul and stinks like hell.

Let's see the rest of the article: "Even though fifty-some percent of the American people think that the economy tanked because of the last administration, that’s not relevant,” Biden stressed. “What’s relevant is we’re in charge. And right now we are the ones in charge and it’s gotten better, but it hasn’t gotten good enough.”

It's clear he's saying blame is not the answer, what's relevant is current government dealing with the economy as it is today and the citizens have the right to hold the current government accountable for dealing with that. In no way did he say Obama was responsible for the financial mess and in fact, he said the economy has gotten better.

I would love for you to post any links of Biden saying Obama's bailouts is responsible for the current financial mess.

10-10-2011, 12:17 AM	#62 (permalink)
TXgolfer Dream Weaver Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Everywhere Posts: 17,605	More lovely people http://oregonlive.com/advorg/pm_3233...tguid=3CKG6bub __________________ Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. - Romans 12:21 Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

10-10-2011, 07:15 PM	#66 (permalink)
warpedpink Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: California Bay Area Posts: 832	Almost completly of the point but I went to Burning Man Decompression yesterday in San Francisco and my friend dressed up as the 99% Superhero! __________________

10-11-2011, 11:23 AM	#73 (permalink)
Beowulf Premium Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 10,515	Capitalism has a very ugly side. Someone once told me that if I had any sense at all, I would buy something and sell it to the next person at a higher price. In essence, rip him off. I just cannot bring myself to do this, but Wall Street sure can. That is what the protest is about, more or less. __________________ .

10-11-2011, 12:29 PM	#74 (permalink)
sallylou Potterhead and Janeite Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: My own private Idaho Posts: 6,653	Wirelessly posted (droid) Calling college kids stupid is not only non-persuasive, it makes one look like a bitter old person. There is no reason to pit age groups against each other, and it's a sign of toxic leadership. The point is that financial pros shouldn't be able to make obscene profits with fraudulent paper pushing schemes only to be bailed out by ordinary working people. It's like that Dilbert strip in which Catbert puts a bunch of diseased cattle in a group to sell them. deafskeptic likes this. __________________

10-11-2011, 08:53 PM	#89 (permalink)
sallylou Potterhead and Janeite Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: My own private Idaho Posts: 6,653	TXGolfer, the banks have not paid back the money. I don't know where you're getting that. If you've got some evidence of that, I'd love to see it. Your smug attitude only lessens your credibility. As I mentioned earlier, the bailout money also went to foreign banks and American corporations. Hardly within the purview of the Federal Reserve. __________________

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10-10-2011, 01:36 PM	#65 (permalink)
Cheetah Cheetah Consulting-Closed Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 2,694	The global financial picture is so incredibly complex it's probably impossible for any one person fully understand. Every time I think about it I realize there are more pressure points than I previously considered. Heck, we are still analyzing the financial picture from the last great depression. It's really hard to know the full impact of a policy, law, or trend until it's run it's course. And even then you may not catch all the little things that happened because of it. How can we trust what a political candidate is saying about the financial crisis when we cannot even begin to understand it?

10-11-2011, 03:22 PM	#77 (permalink)
Reba Granny Terp Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 39,130	Who pays for all the expenses of these "occupy" movements? That is, who pays for the extra police hours, the massive clean up of debris, the lost business, overflowing toilets, vandalism, etc.?

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