saywhatkid

It wasn't too bright of them to refuse to follow police order, as evidenced by the casualties.

It also wasn't too bright for the US to be engaged in a war they did not attempt to win; they just wanted to repel the North Vietnamese/Vietcong. Add 58,220 U.S. service members killed, a draft that forced young men to go into combat, and you can figure the rest. A good reason for those young draft-aged men to protest? I think so. Anyhow, I am not going to debate that war. It was beaten to a pulp in the late 1960's and most of the 1970's.

I do notice an alarming trend on your part; that you feel LEO using deadly force is a good thing almost every time it happens. We will not agree on that.

Please save the veiled insults for other posters. Thanks.

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Deafness

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jillio

How do you feel about the Marine that served 2 terms in Iraq laying in a hospital on a respirator because police hit him in the head with a tear gas cansiter? He was standing quietly inside the barricade. When people tried to come to his assistance, another tear gas canister was fired into them. How do you feel about all of that?

Peaceful? According to the video I saw on the news, the protesters were very peaceful until they were assaulted.

deafskeptic

I think I was 4 years old at the time.

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TWA

Here's the video:
Absolutely disturbing. The cops actually fired a flashbang into the small crowd that was gathering to help him. That was absolutely criminal behavior, and the officer(s) responsible for that should be debagded and prosecuted for assault. I don't care what he did. I don't care what happened before this. I don't care one ****ing iota about anything other than this moment, where an already-wounded man is attacked by the police. What is shown on this video is completely unacceptable, cowardly, and criminal behavior by a United States law enforcement agency.

I'd like to see what Tex has to say about this war veteran protester being treated in such a respectful manner by the police.

Reba

I was 19, so I remember.

TXgolfer

They are still investigating the cause of the "wound" But, even Vets have to follow police orders. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.....

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TWA

Suspect the protestor of wrongdoing on principle. The cops are innocent until proven guilty (even when the video is right in front of your eyes).

Nothing less than I would have expected from you. Sickening.

TXgolfer

I've seen tons of video of the incident. They were asked to leave twice and then warned. They had their chance to do as told. This doesn't happen when you obey the law

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Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

TWA

I'm glad the founding fathers didn't listen to people like you.

TXgolfer

Aaron Burr

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Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

saywhatkid

I had a draft card, and watched the lottery with a group of my buddies. Needless to say, we were glued to the TV. My age gave me the break I wanted. Missed the chance to be drafted by about 15 months. They were still debating the shape of the table for the cease-fire negotiations when my lottery was held, so there was the air of uncertainty. My number was somewhere in the mid 200's.

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TXgolfer

Sounds like you are the same age as my Dad. He barely missed too.

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Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

Reba

Hubby was #65, and he got picked. Lucky me.

sallylou

TXgolfer, you're saying that the vet is not really wounded? The poor guy is sedated pending possible neurosurgery. Your compassion is underwhelming. Stay classy!

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TXgolfer

Where did I say that? There are just differing reports on what hit him. But no I don't have alot of compassion for people who don't obey police orders.

__________________
Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. - Romans 12:21


Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

DeafCaroline

TXGolfer, did you ever watch Inside Job, finally? I started this thread to talk about how events in the past few years generated a now worldwide movement and you've done nothing but post about the few who've deviated from what the movement was supposed to be about. It's too bad that you just flat out refused to talk about the issues that started the whole movement and resort to calling people like that Iraq vet campers and flea-ridden hippies who have no lives.

This is the last time I will acknowledge any of your posts on this thread or elsewhere on AD.

TXgolfer

Sorry you feel that way but...

A) It's way more than a few and I think it's relevant to consider where the argument is coming from and how it is being made.

B) I disagree We have discussed the issues throughout the thread. Banks, foreclosures and student loans and so on

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Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

sallylou

Don't lie. It was this snarky passage:

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TXgolfer

Nothing snarky about it..... He definitely got hit with something by someone. The rest is under investigation

__________________
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Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

sallylou

TXgolfer, you're pathetic. I'm going to use my ignore feature.

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Steinhauer

Were they asked to leave?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1026563.html

BTW, I had dinner with my in-laws this evening. My grandmother in law is 87 years old, my grandfather in law is 92. I actually asked them if they remembered the protests at Kent and they both recalled it rather well, and in great detail.

It was a protest that got out of hand and wasn't even close to being what a "normal, rational, sane" person would consider to be "peaceful".

Now, my grandfather in law is a D-Day veteran as well as Korea. He is a retired Navy Officer and served more than two years in combat zones. Is his "opinion" of any greater value than your championed Iraqi veteran that refused to leave when asked?


http://www.marines.mil/news/publicat...20CH%201-4.pdf

As a member of the armed forces, wouldn't this Iraqi soldier have been inclined to uphold the law?

TXgolfer

Sorry you feel that way. I am not sure why you would have a problem with them investigating.....The first report was rubber bullets.

Attached Images

433190207.jpg (55.6 KB, 11 views)

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Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. - Romans 12:21


Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

Cowpuppy

as I said before.... the cold is around the corner.... just wait it out and they will mostly go home. Hence no need for police overreactions. sometimes you just have to let people have their say. and they go home.
my two cents is wall street types and banks have to much lobbying power in politics. deregulations led to housing fiasco. and other ripoff leeways such as credit card overpayments and bleeding people any which way.. bring on the winter. point has been made.

Steinhauer

It was just a "peaceful" gathering:


Iraq war vet injured during Oakland protests - Yahoo! News


1) They were ordered to leave

2) They threw objects at law enforcement officers

I do not want these people even having jobs if they cannot respect the law and authority. They belong in jail.

Steinhauer

Here is the difference we have. I do not think that it is wise to break the law. I believe LEO's have every right to use the appropriate force to uphold the law. Now, "approriate use of force" may be where we disagree.

I am not stupid by any means, and I do know that there are LEO's that use inappropriate force and abuse their role - but guess what? They broke the law, and the law applies to everybody .... even protesters who flagrantly think it is their right to violate the law and violate the peace and order that is established for everyone.

When there is a mob of protesters, the protesters adopt what is called a "mob mentality". That is why LEO's use riot gear - for their protection - not the mob's. Once the mob has been ordered to leave, the law abiders will leave - what is left, are the law breakers - and guess what? Police can use the appropriate force to evict them.

No veiled insult on my part.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herd_behavior

Steinhauer

Just to add what I stated above.

I have a profound respect for Law Enforcement Officers. They put themselves at risk every single day for very little pay. When it is a soldier that was injured because he was part of a mob that was asked to leave, and he refused, it makes headlines everywhere.

But what about the LEO's that were injured? Ever hear of them?

Some people may criticize the US LEO's for having guns, using brute force to uphold the law, etc. and will compare them to the UK:

26 London police officers injured in rioting - Yahoo! News

Now, of course, "tourist guide" bobbies would get injured in a situation like that.

In the U.S. the LEO's sue protesters that injure officers.

Daredevel7

All this talk makes me wonder...

What makes a protest "work"? Of the previous protests that actually caused a positive change, did the group obey the police orders? Did they arrive in the morning, hold up signs quietly until the time they had to leave for the day?

I don't know much about the history of protests (not talking about general movements, but EXACTLY what the protesting groups did), but I would think that if a protest group came to an area and was nice and peaceful and didn't bother anyone else, they wouldn't make much of an impact. If they do, please let me know which protests did that. So that I can educate myself on it.

If I were a top guy of a corp or the government or whoever they are protesting against, why would I care what they do, as long whatever they do don't affect me? I mean... a group of people in a grassy area near my property holding up signs everyday wouldn't bother me. I would just keep doing whatever I was doing. I'd just make fun of them (like how a certain poster does.) "omgwtfbbq, did you see what Flea Party did? Someone got caught peeing on a cop car. He didn't realize it because he was too drunk. lolzzzzz"

I would think there needs to be an "annoying" factor (something that actually AFFECTS others) to push people to make a change.

Steinhauer

The right to protest does not give the right to riot ..... period.

Daredevel7

I agree, and I'm not saying that they should cause anything that could potentially harm others, but.... what DID they do back then? They did simply obeyed orders? They did just show up peacefully and left when asked?

That worked?

jillio

Thanks for searching out the video. I find this incident very disturbing, which is why I brought up Kent State. Such an apt comparison.