Dual Citizenships

gnarlydorkette · 05-26-2005, 04:54 AM

MODS: Wasn't sure where this thread will belong, so move it to wherever you think is more suitable. :-)

Dual Citizenships: What is it? [Rich informations at http://www.richw.org/dualcit/ although this is more targeted for Canadian but nonetheless the general information is applicable to many countries]

Quote:

Brief overview on dual citizenship
In general, countries define citizenship based on one's descent, place of birth, marriage, and/or naturalization. That is, you might be a citizen of a given country for one or more of the following reasons: [list]You were born on territory belonging to, or claimed by, that country (often called ius soli, or sometimes jus soli -- Latin for "right of the soil").

One or both of your parents were citizens of that country (often called ius sanguinis or jus sanguinis -- Latin for "right of the blood").

You married a citizen of that country (though please note that the practice of granting immediate, automatic citizenship to a foreign spouse is far less prevalent today than it was decades ago).

You (or one or both of your parents) obtained that country's citizenship by going through a legal process of naturalization.

The exact details will, not surprisingly, depend on the laws of the country in question. For example, the US limits its application of ius sanguinis by requiring American parents to have lived for a certain period of time in the US before foreign-born children can be entitled to US citizenship by birth. Many countries (Switzerland is one example) do not confer citizenship via ius soli at all, and those which do generally make exceptions for children of foreign diplomats. Automatic citizenship via marriage is rare nowadays; more commonly, marriage may allow one spouse a "fast track" to immigration to the other spouse's country, but a period of non-citizen permanent residence would still be required before the immigrant spouse could obtain a new citizenship via naturalization.

Since there can be several ways to acquire a given country's citizenship, it is possible for someone to be considered a citizen under the laws of two (or more) countries at the same time. This is what is meant by dual (or multiple) citizenship.

Quote:

Countries usually frame their citizenship laws with little or no regard for the citizenship laws of other countries. In my son's case, for instance, the US does not care that Canada thinks he is a Canadian citizen, and Canada does not care that the US thinks he is a US citizen. Sometimes a country may seek to restrict dual citizenship by requiring one of its citizens born with some other citizenship to renounce (give up) the other citizenship upon reaching adulthood. Newly naturalized citizens may similarly be required to renounce their previous citizenship(s); the US has such a requirement, for example, but Canada does not. In some cases, a country will automatically revoke the citizenship of one of its citizens who acquires another country's citizenship by naturalization, even if no explicit renunciation was involved.

Quote:

As a general rule, dual citizens are not entitled to any sort of special treatment by their two countries of citizenship. Each country will usually consider the person as if he were a citizen of that country alone.

Quote:

On the other hand, dual citizenship can have distinct advantages. In particular, a person with dual citizenship has greater flexibility in his or her choice of where to live and work. Thus, it behooves anyone with dual or multiple citizenship -- or with the possibility of claiming such a status -- to investigate the pros and cons of the specific situation very carefully.

The reason I posted this thread is because I recently applied for Finnish citizenship since Finlandia has finally lifted its ban on dual citizenships which did force my mother to renounce her native country in order to move to Canada (then to America where my brother and I were born) upon her elope with a Scottish husband in 1967.

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.usp.fi/kaksois/indexuk.htm

Finland got a new Citizenship Law
Finland got a new Citizenship Law on 1 June 2003. The most important change is that dual (multiple) citizenship is now acceptable. Finnish citizens will no longer lose their Finnish citizenship when they assume another citizenship. Similarly, foreign nationals who are granted Finnish citizenship will not need to give up their present citizenship. Multiple citizenship covers cases if more than two citizenships are involved.

When my mother found out about this, she was so exultant-- she ran out and find the citizenships forms for my half-brother (whom is half-Finnish and half-Scottish) and I (Half-Finnish and Half-American). My brother and I are able to apply for Finnish citizenships on the grounds of "jus sanguinis". My mother is currently signing up to receive her original citizenship back.
MY husband C is glad for me-- now he can say "I'm married to a Finn wife!" because once my mother's Finnish-Canadian married friends came to visit us and the husband told C that his American son is marrying a Finnish woman which makes him prouder since his American son is touching back to the Finnish roots and declared: "There is nothing better than a Finnish wife!" while nudging his own wife. C replied, "Well A half-finn wife isn't bad neither!" and nudged me.

What do you think about dual citizenships??
A similar thread will be 'Gatsu's thread about Americans flocking to apply for Canadian citizenships when Bush was voted again for presidency.

Anybody here hold mutliple-citizenships or at least dual-citizenships??
My brother can hold up to three citizenships due to his Scottish father but I am not sure if Scotland recgonize dual/multiple citizenships.
America doesn't care what and how many citizenships you got when you come in-- as long you are legal in America. Some countries do (like Finlandia) care about which citizenships you intend to KEEP.

gnarlydorkette · 07-12-2005, 03:38 PM

Congrats to my mom who was born in Hameenlinna, Finland in 1946 and lost her Finnish citizenship when she migrated to Canada in 1966 (only age 20!)because Finland didn't accept any Finnish citizens living outside of Finland unless on a student or work visa. She applied for US citizenship with her Scottish husband and got accepted in 1967 and have been lived in San Diego ever since...
About two months ago, she applied for dual citizenship because Finland lifted their restrictions on citizenship in 2001... And....
She got accepted for the CITIZENSHIP! She is NOW Finnish again!

My brother got the Finnish citizenship as well! CONGRATULATIONS to Gavin!

Now next... me? I haven't heard anything.

My mother is worried but she said if my brother got accepted, it shouldn't be any difference for me. My brother and I were born on American soils... I hope they didn't hold up my application because I am Deaf.

They better not.

Meanwhile, hold your fingers

for me! I should hear very soon whether I am accepted to be Finnish or not.

deafclimber · 07-12-2005, 03:55 PM

congrat to ur family...

truthfully i know about dual citizenship stuffs and i am sorta afraid to share interesting stuffs in dual citzenship cuz i may be wrong to answer. heh.

my very good friend from vancover has it too. she said it was not easy to get it. she said she had fought with IRS for last few years. Finally IRS admitted that they made many mistakes so she got US citzenship.

out of my curiousity, how often do u go to finland since u may get finnish citzenship?

Opal · 07-12-2005, 05:46 PM

Oops I overlook this thread!

I am dual citizen - and hold two different passports currently - British by birth and Australian by marriage.

After living in Australia for 10 years, I decided to apply to become Australian because I want to share same nationalized as my three daughters, and plan to stay here forever.

If I left Australia for a holiday to visit oversea, I must apply for Re-Entry Visa every time before I leave Australia otherwise they will automatic cancel my permanent residence visa!!!! - One deaf American I know married to Australian man and thought her permanent residence visa is good enough to re-entry Australia unlimited times as she want but on her arrival, she was found not having Re-Entry Visa stamp on her American Passport, and she was held back at the Custom Hall and search all information, which date she first came to Australia, where she married him, etc etc. Terrrible time for her!!

Re-Entry visa is not cheap as the last time it cost me about AUS$110 and stayed in the long queue with all British People at the City!! What a horrible plan to start a holiday oversea!!!

Anyway gaining Australian Passport which mean I can leave here anytime and came here without any problem, as they treat me like one of their people here.

I arrived England showing my British Passport so they won't question me how long I want to stay there if I show them Australian Passport. Its easier to travel Europe with British Passport as it is member of European countries.

GalaxyAngel · 07-12-2005, 06:58 PM

Pretty Interesting information...

As for our family have not chance experience dual citzenship but not become "citzenship as condiser resident" Just for living temporary experience staying another place to live...

I was really wanna live in USA but isn't work it out for me and too much pain ass application and blah blah... so I thought I could stay canadian permantly that where I born there.. So Just for pleasure vacation would be great for us and use passport only.

gnarlydorkette · 07-12-2005, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafclimber

congrat to ur family...

truthfully i know about dual citizenship stuffs and i am sorta afraid to share interesting stuffs in dual citzenship cuz i may be wrong to answer. heh.

my very good friend from vancover has it too. she said it was not easy to get it. she said she had fought with IRS for last few years. Finally IRS admitted that they made many mistakes so she got US citzenship.

out of my curiousity, how often do u go to finland since u may get finnish citzenship?

Just last month, I did fly out to Finland so that was my third time. I am sure I will visit Finland more often now since I have developed a close relationship with my family. My mother didn't visit Finland after she immigranted to North America until she returned with her son (my brother) who was 7 years old. (from '66 until '81, she hadn't seen her homeland!). My mother started to visit more-- I think she had been to Finland 8 times now since we do have money to fly international. That was what blocked my mom before because she was a single mother, twice divorced woman whom was straddled with two children and trying to obtain a college degree so she can become a nurse. Now she has two kids out of her nest and she is living comfortably enough to buy us a flight ticket (my husband came as well) to Finland. :-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamara

I arrived England showing my British Passport so they won't question me how long I want to stay there if I show them Australian Passport. Its easier to travel Europe with British Passport as it is member of European countries.

Yes-- that will make my life easier! My husband got an evil eye from the Finnish passport desk because he got a brand new passport and he had to be screened and everything before they put a stamp on his passport. Poor him! They saw my name which is obviously Finnish and just stamped right away. :-)

deafclimber · 07-15-2005, 09:43 AM

gnarly - that is interesting. thanks...

gnarlydorkette · 07-19-2005, 11:02 PM

I got the Finnish citizenship.

And no, I am not moving to Finland. I can live in US and hold a foreign citizenship. Having a citizenship doesn't require residence (in most cases) in the country. You have seen Americans living outside of US. Why are they still Americans? Because it is OK for them to keep their US passport and citizenship and live outside of US.

I just want to clarify this because there were three people today asking the same quesion: "Oh my god, YOU ARE MOVING TO FINLAND??"
As if! I love Finland but there is nothing like San Diego, my home sweet home.

I guess people didn't realize that you can get citizenship of a country if one or both of your parents are born citizens there... It is not necessary to be BORN or LIVE in that country for a LONG to be naturalized.

Shiva · 07-19-2005, 11:10 PM

well my mother recently moved to canada from texas few years ago and married to her hubby (canada native). my mother had to applied for canada's citizenship and finally she got approved and I am sure she got both america and canada citizenship now.

Nancy · 07-19-2005, 11:34 PM

My great-grandfather came from Nassau, Bahamas which used to be a British colony.

He came over to the USA around the teens or the 1920s and became a US citizen (there is a copy of his naturalization citizenship paper) here.

He was a white guy who was obviously from the British descent....I never knew him since he died before I was born, but my mother did.

Since I was told he's full blooded English, he had this English accent and has a dry sense of humor like a lot of them over there has (he hardly smiles, but he did joke with my mother and her siblings when they were little).

Ok, my great-grandmother (his wife) was ALSO full blooded English, but the difference is that her parents were probably from England; she smiled alot than he did; and she was born in Miami, FL.

Even though she had 100% British blood, she was a US citizen.

His last name was Eldon, and her maiden name was Hall....both British surnames..
So I guess my grandmother (their daughter) is also 100% English, but she was also born in FL. That means my grandma could've had a British citizenship just like her dad did?

Anyway, congrats Gnarly on your Finnish citizenship.

07-12-2005, 03:38 PM	#2 (permalink)
gnarlydorkette is leaving for good. Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sunny Diego in Califunny Posts: 1,764	Yay Mom! Congrats to my mom who was born in Hameenlinna, Finland in 1946 and lost her Finnish citizenship when she migrated to Canada in 1966 (only age 20!)because Finland didn't accept any Finnish citizens living outside of Finland unless on a student or work visa. She applied for US citizenship with her Scottish husband and got accepted in 1967 and have been lived in San Diego ever since... About two months ago, she applied for dual citizenship because Finland lifted their restrictions on citizenship in 2001... And.... She got accepted for the CITIZENSHIP! She is NOW Finnish again! My brother got the Finnish citizenship as well! CONGRATULATIONS to Gavin! Now next... me? I haven't heard anything. My mother is worried but she said if my brother got accepted, it shouldn't be any difference for me. My brother and I were born on American soils... I hope they didn't hold up my application because I am Deaf. They better not. Meanwhile, hold your fingers for me! I should hear very soon whether I am accepted to be Finnish or not.

07-12-2005, 03:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
deafclimber :: is a dirt dirty ? :: Join Date: May 2003 Location: hotlanta Posts: 3,568	congrat to ur family... truthfully i know about dual citizenship stuffs and i am sorta afraid to share interesting stuffs in dual citzenship cuz i may be wrong to answer. heh. my very good friend from vancover has it too. she said it was not easy to get it. she said she had fought with IRS for last few years. Finally IRS admitted that they made many mistakes so she got US citzenship. out of my curiousity, how often do u go to finland since u may get finnish citzenship? __________________ Feel free to PM me if you have any question about Windows Mobile or AT&T Mobiliy's TAPs.

07-12-2005, 05:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
Opal ~~~~~ Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 3,752 Blog Entries: 1	Oops I overlook this thread! I am dual citizen - and hold two different passports currently - British by birth and Australian by marriage. After living in Australia for 10 years, I decided to apply to become Australian because I want to share same nationalized as my three daughters, and plan to stay here forever. If I left Australia for a holiday to visit oversea, I must apply for Re-Entry Visa every time before I leave Australia otherwise they will automatic cancel my permanent residence visa!!!! - One deaf American I know married to Australian man and thought her permanent residence visa is good enough to re-entry Australia unlimited times as she want but on her arrival, she was found not having Re-Entry Visa stamp on her American Passport, and she was held back at the Custom Hall and search all information, which date she first came to Australia, where she married him, etc etc. Terrrible time for her!! Re-Entry visa is not cheap as the last time it cost me about AUS$110 and stayed in the long queue with all British People at the City!! What a horrible plan to start a holiday oversea!!! Anyway gaining Australian Passport which mean I can leave here anytime and came here without any problem, as they treat me like one of their people here. I arrived England showing my British Passport so they won't question me how long I want to stay there if I show them Australian Passport. Its easier to travel Europe with British Passport as it is member of European countries. __________________ (\ (\ (=' x') (,('')('')

07-12-2005, 06:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
GalaxyAngel That's me! Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Alberta,Canada Posts: 13,542	Pretty Interesting information... As for our family have not chance experience dual citzenship but not become "citzenship as condiser resident" Just for living temporary experience staying another place to live... I was really wanna live in USA but isn't work it out for me and too much pain ass application and blah blah... so I thought I could stay canadian permantly that where I born there.. So Just for pleasure vacation would be great for us and use passport only. __________________ Parent's proud our children.

07-15-2005, 09:43 AM	#7 (permalink)
deafclimber :: is a dirt dirty ? :: Join Date: May 2003 Location: hotlanta Posts: 3,568	gnarly - that is interesting. thanks... __________________ Feel free to PM me if you have any question about Windows Mobile or AT&T Mobiliy's TAPs.

Today
Deafness	Sponsored Links __________________ This advertising will not be shown in this way to registered members. Register your free account today and become a member on AllDeaf.com

07-19-2005, 11:02 PM	#8 (permalink)
gnarlydorkette is leaving for good. Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sunny Diego in Califunny Posts: 1,764	I got the Finnish citizenship. And no, I am not moving to Finland. I can live in US and hold a foreign citizenship. Having a citizenship doesn't require residence (in most cases) in the country. You have seen Americans living outside of US. Why are they still Americans? Because it is OK for them to keep their US passport and citizenship and live outside of US. I just want to clarify this because there were three people today asking the same quesion: "Oh my god, YOU ARE MOVING TO FINLAND??" As if! I love Finland but there is nothing like San Diego, my home sweet home. I guess people didn't realize that you can get citizenship of a country if one or both of your parents are born citizens there... It is not necessary to be BORN or LIVE in that country for a LONG to be naturalized.

07-19-2005, 11:10 PM	#9 (permalink)
Shiva Anime fan.... Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 757	well my mother recently moved to canada from texas few years ago and married to her hubby (canada native). my mother had to applied for canada's citizenship and finally she got approved and I am sure she got both america and canada citizenship now.

07-19-2005, 11:34 PM	#10 (permalink)
Nancy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Central FL Posts: 2,289	My great-grandfather came from Nassau, Bahamas which used to be a British colony. He came over to the USA around the teens or the 1920s and became a US citizen (there is a copy of his naturalization citizenship paper) here. He was a white guy who was obviously from the British descent....I never knew him since he died before I was born, but my mother did. Since I was told he's full blooded English, he had this English accent and has a dry sense of humor like a lot of them over there has (he hardly smiles, but he did joke with my mother and her siblings when they were little). Ok, my great-grandmother (his wife) was ALSO full blooded English, but the difference is that her parents were probably from England; she smiled alot than he did; and she was born in Miami, FL. Even though she had 100% British blood, she was a US citizen. His last name was Eldon, and her maiden name was Hall....both British surnames.. So I guess my grandmother (their daughter) is also 100% English, but she was also born in FL. That means my grandma could've had a British citizenship just like her dad did? Anyway, congrats Gnarly on your Finnish citizenship.

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