The Origins of Homosexuality - Page 25

DeafCaroline · 11-22-2011, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheetah

Sunny, you make a really good point!

A few years ago a really good friend of mine had a baby and I nearly jumped out of my socks the first time I saw the baby. He was the ugliest baby I have ever seen. But, the first thing I signed to him was "Awww, he is so cute". The parents were beaming there was no way I was going to to say "ugly baby". heck no way!

As the baby grew, he always looked angry. Now he seems to be starting to fill in a bit better and just looks confused. He still has a ways to go, I'm secretly hoping his face changes a little more and he gets to an intellectual look. He is still young, so we will see.

Hahaha! I remember being so freaked out by a toddler I saw regularly at my son's daycare (they were the same age) - he kept making me think of morbidly obese tadpoles. He was truly unattractive.

Saw him again 12 years later (my son switched to his school three years ago) and he's grown up to be model/runway material. He's unbelievably gorgeous now.

DeafCaroline · 11-22-2011, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

Incorrect. Matthew 2:1-12. To worship the birth of Christ is to celebrate.

There's a difference between celebrating the birth of Christ vs celebrating the day he was born on.

The bible didn't say to worship the birthday of Christ is to celebrate.

**TWA** · 11-22-2011, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

Reminds me of an episode of Seinfeld...

Breathtaking.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWriteAlex

How do you know if it's any different for God? Where does the Bible talk about this?

That we are constrained to our bodies (this is debatable, according to some mystics) has nothing to do with free will.

I said "I think" and all a matter of my own opinion based on my own knowledge. Same as yours.

I believe having the constraints of our own bodies is what limits us. If we didn't have free will we'd certainly be a bunch of constrained human beings, never the need to make a conscious decision or choice! "Free will" doesn't mean without consequences, good or bad. The Bible is replete with those examples.

**deafskeptic** · 11-22-2011, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

Jesus was not born on Christmas day. In fact, many speculated he was born in the springtime.

When Christianity first started spreading throughout the Roman empire, it was somewhat blended with local pagan celebrations, such as the annual pagan winter festivals and feasts (tied in with winter breaks from agriculture, just like students' summer vacations were tied in with peak of agriculture season). December 25th would be just after the winter solstice happened - winter festivals were also tied in with solstices - the Winter Solstice would be December 21st.

Easter was named after a German pagan goddess of Spring - Esther. This is another example of combining local pagan customs with Christianity.

The bible itself makes zero references to celebrating Jesus' birthday.

If I recall correctly, the Roman holiday was called Saturnalia. I think you mean Ēostre instead of Esther.. but that's a small nitpick. Many Biblical scholars think the historical Jesus was likely born in May.

Journey · 11-22-2011, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

I said "I think" and all a matter of my own opinion based on my own knowledge. Same as yours.

I believe having the constraints of our own bodies is what limits us. If we didn't have free will we'd certainly be a bunch of constrained human beings, never the need to make a conscious decision or choice! "Free will" doesn't mean without consequences, good or bad. The Bible is replete with those examples.

I don't know about that ... Some days not having to make a conscious decision or choice would feel like total freedom to me!

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

There's a difference between celebrating the birth of Christ vs celebrating the day he was born on.

The bible didn't say to worship the birthday of Christ is to celebrate.

People rejoiced His birth, regardless when exactly He was born. You can pick any day of the year and still celebrate His birth because no one knows exactly what day He was born on. And so, December 25 happens to be that date to celebrate His birth.

Luke 1:11-14
Luke 2:8-14

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Journey

I don't know about that ... Some days not having to make a conscious decision or choice would feel like total freedom to me!

Ah, the couch potato days.

**Cheetah** · 11-22-2011, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

I said "I think" and all a matter of my own opinion based on my own knowledge. Same as yours.

I believe having the constraints of our own bodies is what limits us. If we didn't have free will we'd certainly be a bunch of constrained human beings, never the need to make a conscious decision or choice! "Free will" doesn't mean without consequences, good or bad. The Bible is replete with those examples.

You know, you can try adding fiber to your diet for that...

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheetah

You know, you can try adding fiber to your diet for that...

I think we all need it.

DeafCaroline · 11-22-2011, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

People rejoiced His birth, regardless when exactly He was born. You can pick any day of the year and still celebrate His birth because no one knows exactly what day He was born on. And so, December 25 happens to be that date to celebrate His birth.

Luke 1:11-14
Luke 2:8-14

One is supposed to rejoice his birth all the time, not just one day out of the year. But I digress.

Buffalo · 11-22-2011, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

Well dang it. You better not take any medicines or have any surgical procedures that were perfected on animals. They have nothing to do with us.

I disagree with this post although I know that humans are mammals and thus part of animal kingdom.

According to "Sacred Cows and Golden Geese" by C. Ray Greek and Jean Swingle Greek, "...we learned that though cardiac-bypass surgery was practiced extensively on animals, when first tried on humans, the patients actually died. Penicillin kills guinea pigs and is not effective in rabbits."

Buffalo · 11-22-2011, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Do you pitch poop at passers-by like a baboon?

Do you eat out of the kitty litter box like a dog? Do you drink out of a toilet?

You (and me) probably would pitch poop at passerbys to make things more interesting if you are in a cage 24/7 and you are really bored.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

One is supposed to rejoice his birth all the time, not just one day out of the year. But I digress.

And people chose Dec 25, CHRISTmas day to come together and rejoice the birth.

Buffalo · 11-22-2011, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

Perhaps, but I wouldn't take offence to being called a dog when people like Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gacy, Ed Gein and many more have done much worse.

And dogs show more loyalty than humans.....

**Banjo** · 11-22-2011, 03:19 PM

Apparently some people aren't familiar with the history of how the church hijacked the Winter Solstice and renamed it to Christmas.

**Banjo** · 11-22-2011, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buffalo

And dogs show more loyalty than humans.....

Right, they are.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

Right, they are.

Dog attacks owner, children - Your Houston News: Kingwood

**TWA** · 11-22-2011, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

I said "I think" and all a matter of my own opinion based on my own knowledge. Same as yours.

I believe having the constraints of our own bodies is what limits us. If we didn't have free will we'd certainly be a bunch of constrained human beings, never the need to make a conscious decision or choice! "Free will" doesn't mean without consequences, good or bad. The Bible is replete with those examples.

I don't believe I made a statement as to whether I thought god had free will or not. It's not even a question I would try to answer, since there's no way to test a hypothesis on the subject. This is why I want to know: how do Christians and other religious people know what they know? The Bible is simply a book written by multiple sources, translated a thousand times, and (mis)interpreted a thousand times more.

My "opinion" that to have free will is not synonymous with having an unconstrained body can be easily tested using logical reasoning. Even a quadriplegic still retains an active mind and can make decisions that affect his or her being. Even if you take a prisoner, tie him down, force him to eat so he cannot starve himself, restrict his movement etc. etc. you still cannot take away his awareness of free will, and having awareness of free will is what makes it so. It's an ontological argument. You have free will if you can conceive of it. If you cannot, then you are not free. (Didn't you watch Terminator? Skynet. Hello?)

dogmom · 11-22-2011, 03:50 PM

that is sad, about the kid and father bitten in that article.
What most non-dog people miss though, is that the dog has been warning and warning for days or months, and the signals were either ignored or punished out.
Dog language in its natural state is very subtle and escalates either because the initial signals are not heeded, and/or due to things like poor socialization and poor breeding practices which result in dogs having improper temperaments for their breed.

Dogs are neither "loyal" or "dis-loyal" - they do what is reinforcing for them in the moment and if that happens to coincide with what the person wants, then they may be considered "loyal" to un-trained eye.

as far as the original intent/topic of the thread, some folks need to have a certain perspective for whatever reason they've designed.
I wasn't raised with any certain perspective and have been able to make my own choices.

DeafCaroline · 11-22-2011, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

And people chose Dec 25, CHRISTmas day to come together and rejoice the birth.

whatever. the bible says to rejoice the birth of Jesus - in other words, to rejoice his existence. Not his birthday and not on one day out of the year.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

Apparently some people aren't familiar with the history of how the church hijacked the Winter Solstice and renamed it to Christmas.

Actually, Christmas was made around winter solstice to increase the chances that it would be embraced. Hijacked?

For hundreds of years people used and choose Dec 25 to celebrate Christmas to mean one thing.

Funny little history, a bit off tangent, George Washington gave us our biggest gift by crossing the Delaware River on Christmas day, a decision that decisively turned the direction of the Revolutionary war in our favor.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafCaroline

whatever. the bible says to rejoice the birth of Jesus - in other words, to rejoice his existence. Not his birthday and not on one day out of the year.

And people chose December 25 to rejoice His birth using the Nativity scene, the Wise men, etc.

And not the claim that Dec 25 is His birthday. We knew that already.

Sunshine · 11-22-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

Dog attacks owner, children - Your Houston News: Kingwood

Do you REALLY want us begin linking all news stories humans attacking other humans? Guarantee you outnumbered.

**Cheetah** · 11-22-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

And people chose December 25 to rejoice His birth using the Nativity scene, the Wise men, etc.

And not the claim that Dec 25 is His birthday. We knew that already.

We did? When was this discovered? There are some disputing there was a true Jesus, and some disputing that he was anything more than a man... You must have some pretty good history book with you there.

Edit: I think I am miss-reading your note.... Am I?

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWriteAlex

I don't believe I made a statement as to whether I thought god had free will or not. It's not even a question I would try to answer, since there's no way to test a hypothesis on the subject. This is why I want to know: how do Christians and other religious people know what they know? The Bible is simply a book written by multiple sources, translated a thousand times, and (mis)interpreted a thousand times more.

My "opinion" that to have free will is not synonymous with having an unconstrained body can be easily tested using logical reasoning. Even a quadriplegic still retains an active mind and can make decisions that affect his or her being. Even if you take a prisoner, tie him down, force him to eat so he cannot starve himself, restrict his movement etc. etc. you still cannot take away his awareness of free will, and having awareness of free will is what makes it so. It's an ontological argument. You have free will if you can conceive of it. If you cannot, then you are not free. (Didn't you watch Terminator? Skynet. Hello?)

I never said you made a statement.

What they know? It's about their faith. It's about testing the word of the Bible. The Bible is a historical document with eye-witness accounts, archelogical accounts that have been corroborated, etc.

As for your opinion on free will, fine. I have mine, you have yours. What more do you want?

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheetah

We did? When was this discovered? There are some disputing there was a true Jesus, and some disputing that he was anything more than a man... You must have some pretty good history book with you there.

Edit: I think I am miss-reading your note.... Am I?

Meaning we never could really pinpoint His birthdate. That's not important. I'm not sure why people are so hung up on an exact birth date. What's important is that He was born. He actually existed.

Sunshine · 11-22-2011, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

Meaning we never could really pinpoint His birthdate. That's not important. I'm not sure why people are so hung up on an exact birth date. What's important is that He was born. He actually existed.

In your opinion. Many people think he exist same Santa Claus, unicorns, Tooth Fairy.

kokonut · 11-22-2011, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunshine

Do you REALLY want us begin linking all news stories humans attacking other humans? Guarantee you outnumbered.

Go ahead, knock yourself out.

The premise was that dogs are more loyal than humans. Hard to quantify and qualify that statement since it's an open ended claim.

**Cheetah** · 11-22-2011, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kokonut

Meaning we never could really pinpoint His birthdate. That's not important. I'm not sure why people are so hung up on an exact birth date. What's important is that He was born. He actually existed.

you seem to talk about it a lot... thought it was important to you. I only know what you type in here. No mind reading going on here (at least not without your permission of course!).

11-22-2011, 03:19 PM	#736 (permalink)
Banjo Expelled Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 11,650	Apparently some people aren't familiar with the history of how the church hijacked the Winter Solstice and renamed it to Christmas. jillio, deafskeptic and Cheetah like this.

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11-22-2011, 03:50 PM	#740 (permalink)
dogmom Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 5,510	that is sad, about the kid and father bitten in that article. What most non-dog people miss though, is that the dog has been warning and warning for days or months, and the signals were either ignored or punished out. Dog language in its natural state is very subtle and escalates either because the initial signals are not heeded, and/or due to things like poor socialization and poor breeding practices which result in dogs having improper temperaments for their breed. Dogs are neither "loyal" or "dis-loyal" - they do what is reinforcing for them in the moment and if that happens to coincide with what the person wants, then they may be considered "loyal" to un-trained eye. as far as the original intent/topic of the thread, some folks need to have a certain perspective for whatever reason they've designed. I wasn't raised with any certain perspective and have been able to make my own choices.