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Unread 10-23-2011, 09:52 PM   #121 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by deafdyke View Post
Not today no, but back then it was mainline. Now it's limited to very conservative fundalmentalist churches, as well as Christian Idneity style churches. Hard to believe but yes........
And has it occured to you that perhaps the specific anti gay scriptures may have been mistranslated? If I recall correctly, from what I've read a lot of the "homosexual" verses, are actually in reference to sex slaves or people who misused their sexuality for bad.
I am not sure where you are going with the mistranslation of homosexuality in the bible. It was pretty clear.

The definition of what a marriage is was also clear. There are no instructions for how a wedding ceremony is to be performed, but the definition of what a marriage actually is, is crystal clear.
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Unread 10-23-2011, 10:23 PM   #122 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Steinhauer View Post
I am not sure where you are going with the mistranslation of homosexuality in the bible. It was pretty clear.

The definition of what a marriage is was also clear. There are no instructions for how a wedding ceremony is to be performed, but the definition of what a marriage actually is, is crystal clear.
Then are you willing to support abolition of marriage as a legal term? Basically, taking the word "marriage" out of the law altogether, and replacing it with "civil union", then allowing anyone and everyone to get a civil union with all the rights of our current marriage, and leave "marriage" as an institution to the church?
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Unread 10-23-2011, 10:45 PM   #123 (permalink)
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Can anybody tell me why children have to be taken from gay families? For what reasons?
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Unread 10-23-2011, 11:39 PM   #124 (permalink)
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what about all the divorced people with kids getting married? Is that considered traditional family? People used to almost never get divorced. Now its like 50%

Also, doesnt the catholic church forbid remarriage after divorce? Maybe that should legislated too
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Unread 10-23-2011, 11:48 PM   #125 (permalink)
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Well, I read some stories about gay parents lost their children to foster/adoption systems because it is "bad influence" on children or something. I think that's sad...
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Unread 10-24-2011, 11:19 AM   #126 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Steinhauer View Post
However, in your case I can understand why you would want to intentionally misrepresent a religious doctrine.

Jesus never said anything about not working on Sabbath. He said plenty in regards to those with disabilities. He also said a marriage is between a man and a woman.

What I don't get is why anyone who is opposed to gay marriage is somehow turned into an arrogant, self serving, racist, inconsiderate prick?

Kind of like those who would misrepresent religious doctrine ....
What? You know nothing more about me then what you can read here (and the few other forums on which I post!

I -said- That I don't understand intolerance, one group for another group...

You may want to reared what you quoted...

You may also want to brush up on your bible study, (Sabbath-Jesus) - (Mark 2:23-27, Matthew 12:1-14; Luke 6:1-5) The stories are 'plucking grain on the Sabbath, and 'Good Works on the Sabbath'

Reba and I were having a polite (polite- something you must have missed, ya know no name calling etc) discussion. She and I had already established that Jesus 'came not to condemn the law, but to fulfill it' (Matthew 5:17) based on that we were working on -why- someone (a Christian) would or wouldn't take particular actions (voting a particular way in this case, being very vocal about said particular belief.)

When the scriptures I pointed to do not support that course of actions... of course with free will and all, it doesn't matter- (as neither one of us will change our minds) but really its supposed to be thought provoking.

And unless you can Heal or are doing good works for G-d's glory you shouldn't be working on the Sabbath...
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Unread 10-24-2011, 11:33 AM   #127 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by KarissaMann05 View Post
Can anybody tell me why children have to be taken from gay families? For what reasons?
There's no way to answer that question accurately without having the full story of what happened. Do you have links to the original stories?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 11:59 AM   #128 (permalink)
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Reba-

So far I have only found none, heres a link, and it was from biological grandparents to a gay couple and in the UK.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...-children.html

...

This was interesting, but not helpful for what we are looking for Sexual Orientation
http://wikis.lib.ncsu.edu/images/c/c...er_parents.pdf


Australasia allows it... Adoption in Australia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Didn't find the articles wanted...

Last edited by FireTiger; 10-24-2011 at 12:00 PM. Reason: words backwards...
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Unread 10-24-2011, 12:22 PM   #129 (permalink)
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Reba-

So far I have only found none, heres a link, and it was from biological grandparents to a gay couple and in the UK.

Grandparents' anguish at losing gay couple adoption children - Telegraph
In this case, as far as I can follow it, the straight, birth grandparents had their own grandchildren taken from their custody by force, and given to a gay couple for adoption.

Quote:
...Didn't find the articles wanted...
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Unread 10-24-2011, 04:23 PM   #130 (permalink)
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In this case, as far as I can follow it, the straight, birth grandparents had their own grandchildren taken from their custody by force, and given to a gay couple for adoption.
That's what it looks like. That's the main hit I got when I searched. Apparently if the grandparents tech anti-gay the grandparents lose visitation. That's a another miscarriage of justice... *sigh*

Still haven't found any documentation so far where it's listed as the 'reason for removal' so it's either not making news or it's not happening...

I have seen listed:

gross neglect
drug and paraphernalia possession
failure to thrive
abuse

but no mention of sexual orientation of the person/s losing custody on the forms.... not hat it -can't- happen, but it apparently can't be listed as such.

Last edited by FireTiger; 10-24-2011 at 04:25 PM. Reason: mistyped...
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Unread 10-24-2011, 07:51 PM   #131 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Steinhauer View Post
I am not sure where you are going with the mistranslation of homosexuality in the bible. It was pretty clear.

The definition of what a marriage is was also clear. There are no instructions for how a wedding ceremony is to be performed, but the definition of what a marriage actually is, is crystal clear.
Which cites? There are a lot of cites.....Check out this link if you're interested: Detailed introduction to the Bible and homosexuality: Part 1
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Unread 10-24-2011, 08:13 PM   #132 (permalink)
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Which cites? There are a lot of cites.....Check out this link if you're interested: Detailed introduction to the Bible and homosexuality: Part 1
I would say simply 2 Timothy 4:3......
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Unread 10-24-2011, 08:29 PM   #133 (permalink)
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Why is it that every single discussion of same sex marraige turns into a religious symposium? This is not a religious issue, it is a legal issue. The last I checked, marriage licenses were issued by the state.

Got a religious objection to homosexuality? Fine. Don't get involved in a same sex relationship. There. Problem solved.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 08:43 PM   #134 (permalink)
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Why is it that every single discussion of same sex marraige turns into a religious symposium? This is not a religious issue, it is a legal issue. The last I checked, marriage licenses were issued by the state.

Got a religious objection to homosexuality? Fine. Don't get involved in a same sex relationship. There. Problem solved.
We all have the same right to vote on the type of country we live in and raise kids in. *shrug*

As a legal issue, not sure why anyone feels the need to have their "love" licensed by the state.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 08:57 PM   #135 (permalink)
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Because that license confers important legal rights. Inheritance, the right to make medical decisions in case of incapacity, etc. It's not fair to exclude same sex couples from those rights. There have been instances in which a partner has become incapacitated and the family of origin swoops in and excludes the other partner. That's not right. You'd think that people would have more compassion for a person whose partner is dying, but some people do not consider gay people worthy of compassion. It's really a reflection on the humanity of those people.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:00 PM   #136 (permalink)
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I agree with what everybody here put...

in the West or U.S., people have generally been socialized to believe a myth of a certain behavior pattern, and especially in religious terms. People may not have thought of any other way or seen something besides what they're used to. So they have all biases and misperceptions.
This is the first post to bring religion into the thread. So religion was brought in a PRO gay marriage poster.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:03 PM   #137 (permalink)
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Because that license confers important legal rights. Inheritance, the right to make medical decisions in case of incapacity, etc. It's not fair to exclude same sex couples from those rights. There have been instances in which a partner has become incapacitated and the family of origin swoops in and excludes the other partner. That's not right. You'd think that people would have more compassion for a person whose partner is dying, but some people do not consider gay people worthy of compassion. It's really a reflection on the humanity of those people.
We've covered this many times before....there are other ways to make that happen.

My prior post was about all marriages BTW. Although I am "engaged" now we have no intention of doing it "legally"
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:05 PM   #138 (permalink)
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You ignorant slut! lol

BTW, what are you trying to avoid? Why not make it legal?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:12 PM   #139 (permalink)
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We all have the same right to vote on the type of country we live in and raise kids in. *shrug*

As a legal issue, not sure why anyone feels the need to have their "love" licensed by the state.
So, you approve of Sharia Law, then?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:13 PM   #140 (permalink)
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You ignorant slut! lol

BTW, what are you trying to avoid? Why not make it legal?
It's our form of protest/living by what we say. Hell she has way more than I do.... Have I been conned?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:15 PM   #141 (permalink)
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Because that license confers important legal rights. Inheritance, the right to make medical decisions in case of incapacity, etc. It's not fair to exclude same sex couples from those rights. There have been instances in which a partner has become incapacitated and the family of origin swoops in and excludes the other partner. That's not right. You'd think that people would have more compassion for a person whose partner is dying, but some people do not consider gay people worthy of compassion. It's really a reflection on the humanity of those people.
Exactly. I agree, it does confer important legal rights. The key word being" legal". Religion is used to make decisions regarding your own behavior. If you have religious objections to drinking, then don't drink. If you have religious objections to cutting your hair, then don't get a hair cut. But that is as far as your religious objections go. They do not extend to all of society. They stop at your nose.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:17 PM   #142 (permalink)
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So, you approve of Sharia Law, then?
What I believe is pretty clear in the post you quoted. I don't see the majority of America voting to adopt Sharia Law any time soon.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:17 PM   #143 (permalink)
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Possibly!

I'm confused why you would say engaged, though. Isn't there another way to describe two adults in a relationship? Girlfriend obviously sounds too juvenile. Maybe she's your hot mama?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:18 PM   #144 (permalink)
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Exactly. I agree, it does confer important legal rights. The key word being" legal". Religion is used to make decisions regarding your own behavior. If you have religious objections to drinking, then don't drink. If you have religious objections to cutting your hair, then don't get a hair cut. But that is as far as your religious objections go. They do not extend to all of society. They stop at your nose.
I saw something on FB about that...lemme find it and see if I can post it here.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:22 PM   #145 (permalink)
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Possibly!

I'm confused why you would say engaged, though. Isn't there another way to describe two adults in a relationship? Girlfriend obviously sounds too juvenile. Maybe she's your hot mama?
Oh there will still be a wedding even (we both like cake and parties with a live band) and rings.... Just no court document.

She is the news reporter I mentioned months ago..... which explains why I will be spending much of the winter in dreary old D.C. Luckily she is done after Feb. and it's back to TX/CA/NM
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:28 PM   #146 (permalink)
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It was something about

Dont like gay marriage, dont marry someone the same sex.

Dont like alcohol, dont drink!

Dont like sex, dont do it.


something with a long list of all the "sins" that religious people complain of and try to make them illegal for society.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:29 PM   #147 (permalink)
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A fake wedding? Wow! Are you going to tell people that? If you have a formal ceremony, you're probably legally married in a common law marriage state. Might want to check that out.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:34 PM   #148 (permalink)
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A fake wedding? Wow! Are you going to tell people that? If you have a formal ceremony, you're probably legally married in a common law marriage state. Might want to check that out.
Possibly/Probably..... But at least we didn't seek the license and that is the point. We don't see a need in seeking the government's blessing. We don't consider it a fake wedding of course. We see it as being married in the Church's eyes.

On the guests, of course. We are hoping it will start/continue a trend.
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:38 PM   #149 (permalink)
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What I believe is pretty clear in the post you quoted. I don't see the majority of America voting to adopt Sharia Law any time soon.
Then why would you defend a religious argument for legality? Or do you truly not see the connection?
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Unread 10-24-2011, 09:39 PM   #150 (permalink)
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A fake wedding? Wow! Are you going to tell people that? If you have a formal ceremony, you're probably legally married in a common law marriage state. Might want to check that out.
huh? Are you referring to me?
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