Should public school teachers go on strike?

**Reba** · 02-18-2011, 11:16 PM

What do you think of school teachers going on strike by calling in "sick"?

Madison schools, others closed amid call for demonstrations

Was Wednesday's 'sick out' by Madison teachers an illegal strike?

40% Of Madison Teachers Call In Sick To Join Austerity Protest At The Wisconsin State Building

The Wisconsin protests and the re-emergence of the American working class

Wisconsin Faces Progressive Insurrection- Wisconsin Teachers Protest- Wisconsin News | The Freedomist

What about the rhetoric the strikers use? "Kill the bill"--uh, oh, will some crazed maniac take that literally? What about the posters showing Wisconsin's governor being compared to Hitler and Mubarak? Is that OK?

What about teachers bringing high school students with them to the protest rallies? Did they have permission from the parents? Did they provide round-trip transportation for the kids? Did the kids realize that they were being used?

Shocking Vid: Wis. HS Students Admit Teachers Bringing Them to Protests but Don‘t Know Why They’re There | The Blaze

**Reba** · 02-18-2011, 11:22 PM

Should the Wisconsin governor follow Ronald Reagan's example with the air traffic controllers and fire all the striking teachers?

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 01:49 AM

I'm just posted my opinion from other thread.
Wisconsin lawmakers are missing in action

It is just same old political shit and Tea Party used "kill the bill" protest too, it is all about political. Speaking of call in sick and absent from school, it is normal for teacher to be on union strike so I don't have position to say if they are wrong or not so I believe that they have rights to voice their opinion and protest against governor about what is wrong with something, such as unions, out of control spending, tax increase, etc.

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Should the Wisconsin governor follow Ronald Reagan's example with the air traffic controllers and fire all the striking teachers?

No, I think governor need find something to resolve the situation with them, firing them is just too big and extreme so we do have teacher shortage issues.

I'm not sure about WI law, especially tenures and that why I said let Wisconsinites to handle with situation.

**Reba** · 02-19-2011, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxrac

I'm just posted my opinion from other thread.
Wisconsin lawmakers are missing in action

It is just same old political shit and Tea Party used "kill the bill" protest too, it is all about political.

If the Tea Party used "kill the bill" they were critcized by the liberals for their rhetoric. Are the liberals criticizing the teachers for their rhetoric?

Quote:

Speaking of call in sick and absent from school, it is normal for teacher to be on union strike so I don't have position to say if they are wrong or not so I believe that they have rights to voice their opinion and protest against governor about what is wrong with something, such as unions, out of control spending, tax increase, etc.

If teachers calling in sick to strike from school is considered "normal" then America's schools are in a heap of trouble.

**Reba** · 02-19-2011, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxrac

No, I think governor need find something to resolve the situation with them, firing them is just too big and extreme so we do have teacher shortage issues.

They could hire lots of former teachers and college graduates who are unemployed.

Quote:

I'm not sure about WI law, especially tenures and that why I said let Wisconsinites to handle with situation.

Yes, I agree. Wisconsin should handle it themselves. The President and other outsiders should stay out of it.

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

If the Tea Party used "kill the bill" they were critcized by the liberals for their rhetoric. Are the liberals criticizing the teachers for their rhetoric?

If teachers calling in sick to strike from school is considered "normal" then America's schools are in a heap of trouble.

No, it is all about political, Tea Party said KILL THE BILL and pro-union said KILL THE BILL, it is their voice their opinion against on bill. I don't care if both of them are criticized by liberal or conservative group.

Again, no, that's what I wasn't say, it isn't means about normal living so I means that is not uncommon for union workers to call in sick and join strike, including teachers.

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

They could hire lots of former teachers and college graduates who are unemployed.

Yes, I agree. Wisconsin should handle it themselves. The President and other outsiders should stay out of it.

Well, it will be still teacher shortage so fire all teachers are not option, if you want fire all of them then increase of class size and fewer teachers. It is better for governor to negotiate with unions.

Obama supported union protest because he's from IL, of course, strongly union state and same goes with WI.

**Reba** · 02-19-2011, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxrac

Well, it will be still teacher shortage so fire all teachers are not option, if you want fire all of them then increase of class size and fewer teachers.

Fire just the teachers who called in sick for the strike. Not all teachers did that.

There are lots of people looking for teaching jobs.

Quote:

Obama supported union protest because he's from IL, of course, strongly union state and same goes with WI.

As President, he should stay out of a state's business.

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Fire just the teachers who called in sick for the strike. Not all teachers did that.

There are lots of people looking for teaching jobs.

As President, he should stay out of a state's business.

Depends on state, in here, we have teacher shortage for decade right now and our governor is looking for solution to end the teacher shortage, that what Riley tried for years but won't work out. Not forgot about our state does have teacher unions and our new governor has no interest to interfere with unions but other conservative governor that lost from run-off election wants rid of teacher unions.

What you do want teachers to do if they disagree with state governor to rid of unions and how they can join protest/strike instead of call in sick?

Wisconsin is different because political is toss-up and Scott Walker isn't won by landslide but he won the simple majority instead. In Alabama, they are safe republican. You can see about political battle will be much stronger in Wisconsin.

**Beowulf** · 02-19-2011, 10:10 AM

I'd join the picket lines.

**Banjo** · 02-19-2011, 01:12 PM

What is the average teacher's salary in that particular state?

**Beowulf** · 02-19-2011, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

What is the average teacher's salary in that particular state?

Wisconsin Teaching Salaries | How Much Do Wisconsin Teachers Make?

**sallylou** · 02-19-2011, 04:56 PM

Probably not enough math and science teachers, especially highly qualified ones.

I would love for our teachers to get better pay and working conditions. Happy teachers make for happier kids.

**Foxrac** · 02-19-2011, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallylou

Probably not enough math and science teachers, especially highly qualified ones.

I would love for our teachers to get better pay and working conditions. Happy teachers make for happier kids.

Yup, I agree with you.

**TXgolfer** · 02-20-2011, 02:26 AM

Fire the one's that called in sick....no question

**Reba** · 02-20-2011, 07:09 AM

The teachers got caught on camera getting fake doctors' notes. On top of lying, that would be fraud. Good role models for the children. Not.

**Reba** · 02-24-2011, 07:04 PM

Is the teachers strike really about schools, education, children or maintaining the power of the union?

This is what the NEA's former general counsel, Bob Chanin, said:

"And that brings me to my final, and most important point. Which is why, at least in my opinion, NEA and its affiliates are such effective advocates. Despite what some among us would like to believe, it is not because of our creative ideas. It is not because of the merit of our positions. It is not because we care about children. And it is not because we have a vision of a great public school for every child. NEA and its affiliates are effective advocates because we have power. And we have power because there are more than 3.2 million people who are willing to pay us hundreds of millions of dollars in dues each year because they believe that we are the unions that can most effectively represent them, the unions that can protect their rights and advance their interests as education employees.

This is not to say that the concern of NEA and its affiliates with closing achievement gaps, reducing dropout rates, improving teacher quality, and the like are unimportant or inappropriate. To the contrary, these are the goals that guide the work we do. But they need not and must not be achieved at the expense of due process, employee rights, and collective bargaining. That simply is too high a price to pay!

When all is said and done, NEA and its affiliates must never lose sight of the fact that they are unions, and what unions do first and foremost is represent their members."

Retiring General Counsel’s Shocking Admission: The NEA Is a Union! | Cato @ Liberty

**shel90** · 02-24-2011, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Is the teachers strike really about schools, education, children or maintaining the power of the union?

This is what the NEA's former general counsel, Bob Chanin, said:

"And that brings me to my final, and most important point. Which is why, at least in my opinion, NEA and its affiliates are such effective advocates. Despite what some among us would like to believe, it is not because of our creative ideas. It is not because of the merit of our positions. It is not because we care about children. And it is not because we have a vision of a great public school for every child. NEA and its affiliates are effective advocates because we have power. And we have power because there are more than 3.2 million people who are willing to pay us hundreds of millions of dollars in dues each year because they believe that we are the unions that can most effectively represent them, the unions that can protect their rights and advance their interests as education employees.

This is not to say that the concern of NEA and its affiliates with closing achievement gaps, reducing dropout rates, improving teacher quality, and the like are unimportant or inappropriate. To the contrary, these are the goals that guide the work we do. But they need not and must not be achieved at the expense of due process, employee rights, and collective bargaining. That simply is too high a price to pay!

When all is said and done, NEA and its affiliates must never lose sight of the fact that they are unions, and what unions do first and foremost is represent their members."

Retiring General Counsel’s Shocking Admission: The NEA Is a Union! | Cato @ Liberty

Teachers are being forced to teach to pass tests. That is NOT creative teaching that many of us want to do. Enough is enough!

**sallylou** · 02-24-2011, 11:34 PM

When there is educational reform, no one listens to the teachers. It's crazy.

The testing is out of hand. People don't realize how much time is spent on teaching to the test. The only thing that testing has done is make some testing companies profitable. NLCB and a Bush's testing company? Coinkydink?

Daily Kos: NCLB, Bush, and the Testing Industry

**Reba** · 02-25-2011, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallylou

When there is educational reform, no one listens to the teachers. It's crazy.

The testing is out of hand. People don't realize how much time is spent on teaching to the test. The only thing that testing has done is make some testing companies profitable. NLCB and a Bush's testing company? Coinkydink?

Daily Kos: NCLB, Bush, and the Testing Industry

Since that was written seven years ago, has anyone done anything about all the testing? What has the Obama administration said or done about the testing? Has it been reformed since he became President?

LuciaDisturbed · 02-26-2011, 04:55 AM

Many of my old teachers from elementary, middle, and high schools in Milwaukee went to the protests in Madison. I support them 100%! They deserve better than what they were getting!

Tousi · 02-26-2011, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuciaDisturbed

Many of my old teachers from elementary, middle, and high schools in Milwaukee went to the protests in Madison. I support them 100%! They deserve better than what they were getting!

How do you know this? If I recall correctly, you hated the place and couldn't get out fast enough.

**sallylou** · 02-26-2011, 02:49 PM

Reba, no reform. My kids are being tested to death (especially the elementary school aged child). The teachers drill them because poor scores will affect them. It's enough to make any kid lose enthusiasm for learning. The only good thing to come out of testing is that science testing has put science back in the classroom. The state of science education in the U.S. is really bad.

dogmom · 02-28-2011, 08:58 AM

I hesitated to go in here because what I will write is something am sure everybody's read and so on - BUT I want to share my experience - I was THERE on SATURDAY and it was AMAZING! My mom is a longtime public schools and community activist, involved in civil rights struggles...for me it was part of our household growing up and it was how WE were Jewish....I remember going to picket lines with her as a young kid. I'm in WI and I went to stand with everyone there fighting for human rights.I decided to go on Friday night and registered online and went the next morning. I went with a bunch of teachers and staff and students from one of the schools, part of a caravan of 11 buses.
They had at least one terp that I saw.

100,000 people .... POWERFUL

THIS IS WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE

**Reba** · 02-28-2011, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogmom

I hesitated to go in here because what I will write is something am sure everybody's read and so on - BUT I want to share my experience - I was THERE on SATURDAY and it was AMAZING! My mom is a longtime public schools and community activist, involved in civil rights struggles...for me it was part of our household growing up and it was how WE were Jewish....I remember going to picket lines with her as a young kid. I'm in WI and I went to stand with everyone there fighting for human rights.

Which human rights were you fighting for in WI?

Quote:

I decided to go on Friday night and registered online and went the next morning. I went with a bunch of teachers and staff and students from one of the schools, part of a caravan of 11 buses.
They had at least one terp that I saw.

100,000 people .... POWERFUL

According to the state capital building janitors, 100,000 people make a powerful mountain of debris.

Quote:

THIS IS WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE

That's interesting except the USA and each state is a republic, not a democracy.

**Foxrac** · 02-28-2011, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Which human rights were you fighting for in WI?

According to the state capital building janitors, 100,000 people make a powerful mountain of debris.

That's interesting except the USA and each state is a republic, not a democracy.

No, USA and rest of their states are republic and democracy because we have election to elect our representatives and president, in state, governor, representatives and senate. Republic is opposite to monarchy, not opposite to democracy.

USA and France are republic and democracy.

UK, Sweden and Japan are monarchy and democracy.

Saudi Arabia is monarchy with no democracy.

Egypt, North Korea and Cuba are republic with no democracy.

Check out the CIA Factbook if you are interested to check about government system in all countries.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...k/geos/us.html

**Reba** · 02-28-2011, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxrac

No, USA and rest of their states are republic and democracy because we have election to elect our representatives and president, in state, governor, representatives and senate. Republic is opposite to monarchy, not opposite to democracy....

Look for the word democracy in the Declaration of Independence, the U.S. Constitution, and even the Pledge to the Flag. No democracy, only republic.

**Foxrac** · 02-28-2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Look for the word democracy in the Declaration of Independence, the U.S. Constitution, and even the Pledge to the Flag. No democracy, only republic.

Not necessary, democracy is about election to elect the representatives, president, state legislative, governors, local government, etc.

Check CIA Factbook, if you disagree so I don't care, let move on.

**Beowulf** · 02-28-2011, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Look for the word democracy in the Declaration of Independence, the U.S. Constitution, and even the Pledge to the Flag. No democracy, only republic.

True, the USA is a republic governed by a representative democracy.

And did you guys know that the Nazi Salute was used when the Pledge of Allegiance first came out? And that the words "under God" were added in 1954? Interesting.

02-18-2011, 11:16 PM	#1 (permalink)
Reba Granny Terp Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 39,155	Should public school teachers go on strike? What do you think of school teachers going on strike by calling in "sick"? Madison schools, others closed amid call for demonstrations Was Wednesday's 'sick out' by Madison teachers an illegal strike? 40% Of Madison Teachers Call In Sick To Join Austerity Protest At The Wisconsin State Building The Wisconsin protests and the re-emergence of the American working class Wisconsin Faces Progressive Insurrection- Wisconsin Teachers Protest- Wisconsin News \| The Freedomist What about the rhetoric the strikers use? "Kill the bill"--uh, oh, will some crazed maniac take that literally? What about the posters showing Wisconsin's governor being compared to Hitler and Mubarak? Is that OK? What about teachers bringing high school students with them to the protest rallies? Did they have permission from the parents? Did they provide round-trip transportation for the kids? Did the kids realize that they were being used? Shocking Vid: Wis. HS Students Admit Teachers Bringing Them to Protests but Don‘t Know Why They’re There \| The Blaze __________________ Tell us the truth about Benghazi!

02-19-2011, 01:49 AM	#3 (permalink)
Foxrac Need Stormtroopers? Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Zaphias Posts: 32,521	I'm just posted my opinion from other thread. Wisconsin lawmakers are missing in action It is just same old political shit and Tea Party used "kill the bill" protest too, it is all about political. Speaking of call in sick and absent from school, it is normal for teacher to be on union strike so I don't have position to say if they are wrong or not so I believe that they have rights to voice their opinion and protest against governor about what is wrong with something, such as unions, out of control spending, tax increase, etc. __________________ In Moto We Trust

02-19-2011, 04:56 PM	#14 (permalink)
sallylou Potterhead and Janeite Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: My own private Idaho Posts: 6,653	Probably not enough math and science teachers, especially highly qualified ones. I would love for our teachers to get better pay and working conditions. Happy teachers make for happier kids. shel90 likes this. __________________

02-20-2011, 02:26 AM	#16 (permalink)
TXgolfer Dream Weaver Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Everywhere Posts: 17,636	Fire the one's that called in sick....no question __________________ Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. - Romans 12:21 Sometimes at night, I see their faces. I feel the traces they've left on my soul

02-24-2011, 07:04 PM	#18 (permalink)
Reba Granny Terp Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 39,155	Is the teachers strike really about schools, education, children or maintaining the power of the union? This is what the NEA's former general counsel, Bob Chanin, said: "And that brings me to my final, and most important point. Which is why, at least in my opinion, NEA and its affiliates are such effective advocates. Despite what some among us would like to believe, it is not because of our creative ideas. It is not because of the merit of our positions. It is not because we care about children. And it is not because we have a vision of a great public school for every child. NEA and its affiliates are effective advocates because we have power. And we have power because there are more than 3.2 million people who are willing to pay us hundreds of millions of dollars in dues each year because they believe that we are the unions that can most effectively represent them, the unions that can protect their rights and advance their interests as education employees. This is not to say that the concern of NEA and its affiliates with closing achievement gaps, reducing dropout rates, improving teacher quality, and the like are unimportant or inappropriate. To the contrary, these are the goals that guide the work we do. But they need not and must not be achieved at the expense of due process, employee rights, and collective bargaining. That simply is too high a price to pay! When all is said and done, NEA and its affiliates must never lose sight of the fact that they are unions, and what unions do first and foremost is represent their members." Retiring General Counsel’s Shocking Admission: The NEA Is a Union! \| Cato @ Liberty __________________ Tell us the truth about Benghazi!

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02-18-2011, 11:22 PM	#2 (permalink)
Reba Granny Terp Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 39,155	Should the Wisconsin governor follow Ronald Reagan's example with the air traffic controllers and fire all the striking teachers?

02-19-2011, 10:10 AM	#11 (permalink)
Beowulf Premium Member Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 10,515	I'd join the picket lines.

02-19-2011, 01:12 PM	#12 (permalink)
Banjo Expelled Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 11,650	What is the average teacher's salary in that particular state?

02-20-2011, 07:09 AM	#17 (permalink)
Reba Granny Terp Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 39,155	The teachers got caught on camera getting fake doctors' notes. On top of lying, that would be fraud. Good role models for the children. Not.

02-24-2011, 11:34 PM	#20 (permalink)
sallylou Potterhead and Janeite Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: My own private Idaho Posts: 6,653	When there is educational reform, no one listens to the teachers. It's crazy. The testing is out of hand. People don't realize how much time is spent on teaching to the test. The only thing that testing has done is make some testing companies profitable. NLCB and a Bush's testing company? Coinkydink? Daily Kos: NCLB, Bush, and the Testing Industry __________________

02-26-2011, 04:55 AM	#22 (permalink)
LuciaDisturbed Registered User Join Date: May 2006 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 7,733	Many of my old teachers from elementary, middle, and high schools in Milwaukee went to the protests in Madison. I support them 100%! They deserve better than what they were getting! __________________ "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - Philosopher George Santayana. Implanted left ear 10/11/06, activated 10/16/06 - Nucleus Freedom My own CI experience, my views on CI and ASL and Deaf Culture and Society DeviantArt

02-26-2011, 02:49 PM	#24 (permalink)
sallylou Potterhead and Janeite Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: My own private Idaho Posts: 6,653	Reba, no reform. My kids are being tested to death (especially the elementary school aged child). The teachers drill them because poor scores will affect them. It's enough to make any kid lose enthusiasm for learning. The only good thing to come out of testing is that science testing has put science back in the classroom. The state of science education in the U.S. is really bad. __________________

02-28-2011, 08:58 AM	#25 (permalink)
dogmom Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 5,472	I hesitated to go in here because what I will write is something am sure everybody's read and so on - BUT I want to share my experience - I was THERE on SATURDAY and it was AMAZING! My mom is a longtime public schools and community activist, involved in civil rights struggles...for me it was part of our household growing up and it was how WE were Jewish....I remember going to picket lines with her as a young kid. I'm in WI and I went to stand with everyone there fighting for human rights.I decided to go on Friday night and registered online and went the next morning. I went with a bunch of teachers and staff and students from one of the schools, part of a caravan of 11 buses. They had at least one terp that I saw. 100,000 people .... POWERFUL THIS IS WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE Foxrac, shel90 and TheOracle like this.

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