Teresh

Timothy McVeigh blew up the Federal Building in Oklahoma City, but does that mean Catholics are terrorists?

The KKK bombed the 16th Street Baptist Church, but does that mean Christians are terrorists?

Alex Odeh was killed by the Jewish Defense League, but does that mean Jews are terrorists?

Eric Robert Rudolph has bombed things all over the place in the South, but does that mean Christians are terrorists?

Deafness

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Beowulf

Terrorists have been killed by terrorists. Does that make terrorists Muslim?
It boggles the mind to think of how many people would have the knee-jerk reaction of saying Yes.

Reba

The Muslims who commit terrorist acts are terrorists.

The Muslims who support them (with money, hiding places, editorials, training, etc.) are terrorists.

The Muslims who speak out against the terrorists are NOT terrorists.

There are just too many of the first two groups, and not enough of the last group.

Reba

According to the Muslims, Allah wants all Jews killed or enslaved. Do you think Jews and Christians worship THAT god?

Beowulf

Whoa, whoaaa, girlie, that is according to the mainstream media, and it is totally false.
Get a gander of this source:
http://www.submission.org/islam/hate.html

web730

Yes, I can help to clear this confusion up. Muslims don't worship the same God as Jews and Christians do.

Here is a link the best I can find to give you simple difference between the Muslims and Christains.

Jews do believe in same God as Christians do .. only that Jews don't believe in Jesus the Messiah.

Just a medium page (not long but good one) it can help you understand the differences between Muslims and Christains/Jews clearly.

It's at:

http://www.ericbarger.com/mus-chrs.htm

MorriganTait

http://www.beliefnet.com/story/136/s...58_1.html#cont

"The Qur’an identifies Allah as none other than the God to whom Abraham offered “submission” (‘islam) in the episode Jews and Christians know so well from Genesis 22, the story of the binding of Isaac. As the paradigmatic Muslim or “submitter,” Abraham then made the original, paradigmatic pilgrimage to Mecca, Muslims believe, accompanied by the very son, Ishmael, whom Allah had rescued so dramatically."

Now, Muslims call him Allah, and they certainly worship quite differently than I do as a Christian, and again, quite differently as my Jewish friends do, but the fact remains that these three religions sprung from the self same singular God concept coloquially referred to as "the God of Abraham". If the God I worship IS God, well, then so is the God Jews and Muslims worship because it's the same event from which all three faiths developed, and he is regarded as that central diety of the story of Abraham.

MorriganTait

In the Qu'ran, Abraham and Isaac are spelled Ibrahim and Ishaq. I am still looking for a specific Qu'ranic reference to the story we recognize from the Bible.

Teresh

You have a way of finding sources that suit your views, but not actually reading what you post. The argument on the page you linked to has to be one of the most pitiful arguments I've ever read. It's entirely dependent on the misconception that Muslims view Muhammed the way that Christians view Yeshua, something that is simply not true. When the fundamental part of the argument is incorrect, the entire argument is incorrect.

If you're going to say that Muslims do not worship the same God because they call God by a different name or because they worship in a different way, then that's the same as saying that Jews don't worship the same God because temple is not the same as a church, they don't believe Yeshua was the messiah, and God's name is YHWH. Unless you're going to make that argument (and you're not, from what I can see), you're wrong, and that's all there is to it. I suggest only posting to threads where you will actually know what you're talking about.

Endymion

Just thought I'd chip in -- the personal name for God as revealed in the Tanakh is YHVH. Someone I used to know corrected me on that long ago.

If I remember right, as well, there is no "W" sound in Hebrew. This tears down the whole "Yahweh" thing.

Teresh

You are correct, I'm just using the romanisation (however incorrect it may be) most of the people here are familiar with.

Heath

I find it disturbing that the muslims and the jews do not believe in Jesus Christ....

Jesus Christ in the Quran is called The Prophet Isa

Jesus Christ in the Jewish Torah is called Yeshua

yet, they both reject Jesus Christ as God and The Ulimate Healer.

Mohammend or Allah never healed no Deaf boy.

Jewish God of Israel did heal people in the Torah but not so specific and clearly like in the KJV New Testament with Yeshua ( Jesus Christ ) healing the Deaf boy.

Something to think about....

Romans 10:9 (King James Version Holy Bible )

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

ayala920

You are right that the Jews called Jesus Yeshua (along with some other names). It's pretty commonly accepted that Jesus was a real person who walked the Earth- Jews believe that. Jews just don't believe he was the messiah, unless they're messianic jews, which I don't consider real Jews anyway, but I digress.

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~Ayala~


"Most English-speaking people...will admit that cellar door is 'beautiful', especially if dissociated from its sense (and from its spelling). More beautiful than, say, sky, and far more beautiful than beautiful. Well then, in Welsh for me cellar doors are extraordinarily frequent, and moving to the higher dimension, the words in which there is pleasure in the contemplation of the association of form and sense are abundant."

Heath

Hi Ayala, Have you been to Israel, The Holy Land? I would like to go someday and see where Jesus Christ healed the Deaf boy and see all of Israel. I would like to see all the Christian Jewish and Muslim religious sites. I especially would love to visit the Biblical museum in Israel, I think in Jerusalem. That would be something to see.

Teresh

The Torah makes no mention of Yeshua.

Not everyone is Christian, get it into your head.

Muhammed was a prophet, nothing more. According to the Qur'an and Muslim tradition, he was tasked with delivering the final revelation to the world (the Qur'an) and nothing else.

Still, I'm beginning to see why you are a diehard Christian: You think that if you are enough of a zealot and hate enough people different from yourself that God will make you hearing. Sorry, but that's not going to happen. If it does, though, call me and I'll have to reconsider my opinion of Christianity.

ayala920

Wel... Kind of. Modern Hebrew doesn't have the "w" sound. Really, there's no "right" or "wrong pronounciation of YHVH (or YHWH, depending on who you ask), since technically we're not supposed to speak the name. So, instead, it's translated to Adonai, which is the name of G-d when praying, or HaShem, the name of G-d in normal conversation.

It's really rather complicated, but I'm too lazy to go into it all.

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~Ayala~


"Most English-speaking people...will admit that cellar door is 'beautiful', especially if dissociated from its sense (and from its spelling). More beautiful than, say, sky, and far more beautiful than beautiful. Well then, in Welsh for me cellar doors are extraordinarily frequent, and moving to the higher dimension, the words in which there is pleasure in the contemplation of the association of form and sense are abundant."

ayala920

I, too would like to visit Israel, but for very different reasons, I suspect.

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~Ayala~


"Most English-speaking people...will admit that cellar door is 'beautiful', especially if dissociated from its sense (and from its spelling). More beautiful than, say, sky, and far more beautiful than beautiful. Well then, in Welsh for me cellar doors are extraordinarily frequent, and moving to the higher dimension, the words in which there is pleasure in the contemplation of the association of form and sense are abundant."

Heath

Your name Ayala suggests to me that you are jewish correct? I am a Protestant Christian. I know Israel has a program for jewish people to make aliyah?

ayala920

Let's just say I'm conflicted.

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~Ayala~


"Most English-speaking people...will admit that cellar door is 'beautiful', especially if dissociated from its sense (and from its spelling). More beautiful than, say, sky, and far more beautiful than beautiful. Well then, in Welsh for me cellar doors are extraordinarily frequent, and moving to the higher dimension, the words in which there is pleasure in the contemplation of the association of form and sense are abundant."

Heath

Okay....That is understandable. Let's leave it at that.

MorriganTait

Found an interesting site about why Jews don't believe in Jesus: http://ohr.edu/ask_db/ask_main.php?id_number=2637#Q1.A

mattmgolf

I disagree that muslims are terrorists. Remember that question. Not all of them are. Terrorists and insurgents are just crazy people. I mean capitalism is the best policy in the world. Why cant they just try it. Of course it will take time to reform its government to capitalism. They'll be happier. BUT we all have different ideas, beliefs, opinions, etc. Its getting complicated to me right now so I'll just shut up and worry about my life

Rose Immortal

WHEW, I'm amazed to see the explosion that blew up over what I thought would be a simple question to prove or disprove.

Gonna keep reading and see what's said about this...just please keep away from each other's throats, OK? That doesn't help with learning.

ayala920

Just out of curiosity, how were you expecting us to prove or disprove this?

__________________
~Ayala~


"Most English-speaking people...will admit that cellar door is 'beautiful', especially if dissociated from its sense (and from its spelling). More beautiful than, say, sky, and far more beautiful than beautiful. Well then, in Welsh for me cellar doors are extraordinarily frequent, and moving to the higher dimension, the words in which there is pleasure in the contemplation of the association of form and sense are abundant."

Rose Immortal

I was thinking there were readily-available references from the Qur'an, Torah, and Bible that would make it very apparent one way or the other...stuff like stories almost totally idea-for-idea the same. Or a lack thereof. One way or the other, I was kinda thinking there'd be primary-source stuff available.

MorriganTait

Well, Genesis 22 which describes the Abraham and Isaac sotry appears in both the Bible AND the Torah, because the Torah is wholey contain in the Bible. The specific story may appear in the Qu'ran but I don't know enough about how the language is used to find it there...yet. Though I did find 100's of references to Ibrahim and Ishaq in the Qu'ran.

web730