Beowulf

Sam Hamod, former advisor to the US State Department and an expert on the Middle East, and also former founder and editor of 3rd World News in Washington, Dc, had this to say about the bombings, in part:
"Having discussed ththe matter in detail with other experts on the Middle East, Christianity in Iraq and on Islam in Iraq, we have all concluded this is not the work of any Muslim group. There has never been any animosity between the Christian and Muslim communities in Iraq, in fact, THEY HAVE STOOD TOE TO TOE AGAINST THE AMERICAN OCCUPATION and they have resisted efforts by the Israeli ofice in Baghdad to become allied with Israel.......
(this) is just another attempt either by the American CIA or its operatives, or the Mossad of Israel, to paint Islam with terrorism and to split the Muslim and Christian communities in Irag..."

It is so sad that we listen to OUR "leaders" in order to keep hatred alive and well.

http:www.rense.com/general56/chris.htm

Deafness

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Reba

Sistani Condemns Attacks on Iraqi Christians

Monday, August 02, 2004
BAGHDAD, Iraq — Iraq's top Shiite Muslim cleric on Monday condemned as "hideous crimes" the coordinated bomb attacks on five churches in Baghdad and Mosul that killed at least seven people and marked the insurgency's first major attacks on Iraq's minority Christians....
...Muslim clerics condemned the violence and also offered condolences to Iraq's dwindling Christian community. Many Christians have already fled to neighboring Jordan and Syria to escape violence in the insurgency-wracked nation.
"This is a cowardly act and targets all Iraqis," Abdul Hadi al-Daraji, spokesman for radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, told Al-Jazeera television.
The more senior al-Sistani, based in the southern city of Najaf, said: "We assert the importance of respecting the rights of Christian civilians and other religious minorities and reaffirm their right to live in their home country Iraq in security and peace."
http://www.foxnews.com/printer_frien...127755,00.html

I am glad to see some Muslim leaders speak out against the attacks.

Reba

"Expert on the Middle East" Sam Hamod wouldn't have an "agenda" would he? Interesting how many of the causes and people he supports just happen to be anti-Semitic and/or anti-Israel. Hmmm....
http://www.counterpunch.com/hamod05092003.html
http://www.mediamonitors.net/samhamod1.html
http://www.peterhansen.com/snot.htm
http://www.aljazeerah.info/Opinion%2...am%20Hamod.htm
http://www.tamouz.com/hamod05242004.html
http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=1304

Read Hamod's editorial "“The Myth of Tiny, Little Israel: Zionist Tentacles Everywhere"; you will see how twisted his thinking is.
http://madison.indymedia.org/newswir...3233/index.php

When he was in Washington, he was Director of the Islamic Center. He might be a wee bit prejudiced in his "analysis", you think?

Beowulf

And your point is..?
I am aware of who he is.
He is NOT anti-semetic.

I checked out the links you provided, and I am in tears, practically. All of his discourses were well reasoned, though they may not be palatable to many folk, and I chuckle because no one has yet provided any rebuttal.
Colin Powell himself said that any criticism of the Israeli government does not make you antiSemetic, and though I will not go there, I am sharply critical of that gang of thugs and murderers.
You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about, Reba, let me say this as gently as possible, just as much as I have no clue why you think the way you do.
You post articles about alleged Muslim attacks on their own, yet ignore the reality of tens of thousands of Muslim deaths through our illegal and immoral invasion of Iraq and do not bother to post those, so I can get a general idea where you are coming from.
If you google for information, my, you must feel so frustrated because the information you get are not necessarily from Foxsnooze or its ilk. Any news that does not support Bush and his gang of murderous traitors are taboo to you, but not to me. Too bad.
Bias?
Hell yeah.

Reba

How can you read his writings and say he is not anti-Semitic? Just because he says he is not?

They are not well-reasoned, and most of his ideas are not even original. That anti-Jew, anti-Israel rhetoric has been around a loooooong time.

Criticism is fine. Untrue attacks are beyond criticism.

Of whom are you referring?

Alleged? Are you blind to the mass graves? Do you not know about the recent bombings of Iraq's police stations?

Not illegal, not immoral. You need to check your facts.

Where would that be?

Not at all.

Any "news" that is not factual is "taboo". It seems to me, any news that does not support your hate for President Bush is "taboo" to you.

Beowulf

Lol, my post did not go over so well with you, now did it?
I admire the fire within you, Reba. Please do not think that I despise you, that I hate you, that I am disgusted with you, that I loathe you, that you make me recoil in horror, because that is not true.
It is also not true that Muslims are terrorists.
It is also true that Americans are not terrorists.
Both sides look into each others' eyes.
There are a couple billion Muslims in this world, and only a few hundred million Americans.
Can't we just get along?

Defee

You are right, Beowulf that not all Muslims are terrorists..
I know some Muslims and they are very nice and peaceful people.
It just that certain group of Muslims that are fanatical and are bent on
destroying America..you all know why.

__________________
Im not deaf, im just ignoring you!

Reba

It never entered my mind.

It is true that some Muslims are terrorists. Some Muslims support terrorists, some Muslims ignore terrorists. I never said that all Muslims are terrorists.

The Muslim terrorism movement attacks are not confined to only the United States. They are also kidnapping and killing people in the Phillipines, Spain, Israel, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Thailand, on ships at sea, etc.

Nesmuth

One of the founders to Orange County Deaf Advocacy Center is a muslim. He's never believed in violence.

Richard

Reba

Great!

Reba

More awful news about Muslim terrorists attacking school children. The situation at the Russian school is most terrible.
http://www.newsmax.com/scripts/print...3/100949.shtml

There is never any excuse, none, for hurting and killing children!

kuifje75

Nowhere in that article states that the terrorists were muslims.
They were probably Chencyan Separatists

Reba

Yes, Chechen terrorists are Muslim.

re: http://www.terrorismanswers.org/groups/chechens.html

"The Chechens are a largely Muslim ethnic group...."

"Are there links between Chechen groups and al-Qaeda?
Yes. Experts say there are reportedly several ties...."

Reba

Can you look at these pictures without your heart crying?

(To view the 143 pictures, click on "Slideshow: Terrorists Take Children Hostage, Troops End Standoff " link on the web page.)

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...school_seizure

kuifje75

Frankly, I'm tired of ppl making Muslims look bad just because of some extremists did. Get over it already, Reba. I already said I don't condone terrorism, but you can't make a whole group responsible for the activities of the extremists.

Besides, just because they happen to be Muslims does not mean that they use religion to wager a war against Russia. It's like if a large group of Americans were protestants and battled with England for independence, and then Americans would be called Protestant terrorists. Makes no sense.

Reba

I never said that "all" Muslims are bad. But too many people are hiding or ignoring the fact that Muslim terrorists are attacking innocent people.

Also, if you notice, I did not start this thread; I responded to the poll question that was posted.

If the Chechens truly were "freedom fighters" they would not use terrorism to fight a revolution. They are using terrorism because they hate Russian people. There is no strategic military reason to attack children at a school.

I am not making the Muslims "look bad" as you say. They do it to themselves when they allow (and encourage) the renegades to continue their terrorist ways.

http://www.mosnews.com/images/p/4015.shtml

LinuxGold

Look at Timothy McVeigh, is he a muslim?

Hmm...?

Reba

No. What's your point?

Tousi

Reba's right, read carefully....

LinuxGold

Thread Topic:

View Poll Results: Are the Muslims really Terrorists?

My Answer:

Look at Timothy McVeigh, is he a Muslim?

My reason for my answer:

Timothy McVeigh might be a role model to those who are extremists that resulted into terrorist(s). Somebody can be a extreme Christian, killing abortionists, making Christian society to appear absurd, strict, over disciplined or various extreme reasons. It doesn't necessarily mean that Christians are really murders. Al-Quesdia is a specific extremist group that spawns terrorists based in their extreme belief in Muslim or similiar belief(s) where their own justification seems to be the authorative reason for murder. Someone who believes in their faith or religion exceedingly often became so delusional that they think that their actions will be justified in their own power. Therefore Muslims are not singled out as terrorists and that is a generalized statement. Someone with extreme influence, i.e. Timothy McVeigh, Osama Bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and various major figures are those who spawn terrorists, not just Muslims. Therefore, is Timothy McVeigh a Muslim? No, he is just one of those who influence people to turn into terrorists and not fearing death.

Reba

McVeigh and his supporters were a small extremist group who committed one heinous act that was strongly condemned by all mainstream Christians and Americans. The Muslim terrorists are many, many in number, they commit repeated acts of terrorism, they are supported by many, many other Muslim people, and are not condemned by large numbers of Muslims and their leaders. The Muslim acts of terrorism are not infrequent isolated incidents. They are frequent and widespread, and have a long history. There is international cooperation and involvement. They are supported by governments.

Just because people of other religions and beliefs sometimes commit terrorism doesn't negate the fact that most international terrorism now is part of an organized Muslim war of terror.

Again, I did not say that ALL Muslims are terrorists.

I did not say ALL terrorists are Muslims.

I do say that we cannot ignore the terrorist attacks by Muslims.

kuifje75

We should not ignore ANY crime of any kind. I can post articles of local robberies and murders on a continual basis, but it serves no point. We ALL already know what the terrorists do. Acting as if we are ignorant of the fact that terrorists exist and killing/injuring inocent victims, that's insulting our intelligence.

Tousi

*Sarcasm mode on* Well, hell, let's all go home and close up this shop and not discuss anything! *Sarcasm mode off* If you think you are above a given topic, then just turn up your nose at it and go on to a topic that inspires you. We don't need to have someone dictate to us what (within the parameters, of course) we should or should not discuss. Jeezz....

kuifje75

It would probably have been better served in a separate topic set up for terrorists. The topic here is "Are the muslims really terrorists?" Bringing all these news articles up here I believe serves no purpose but as a propganda tool to create more hatred against the muslims. We should unite together to stand against the terrorists, but not the Muslims.

Tousi

*Looking around* I don't see anyone here stupid enough to engender an increased hatred of Muslims; we know the context of out of which we are discussing the topic here, don't you?

Ashish Sachdeva

Most of the muslims are good in nature.But if any muslim becomes terrorist surely he doesnot have knoweldge of his own religion.They donot have their own brain.Firstly, we are all humanbeing.GOD made human. But we people divided ourselves in different religions,caste,races etc.In the past number of fights were fought only due to religions,caste etc.We should forget our religons that is secondary thing for us. We all are humanbeing and should think of betterment of world and mankind.

LinuxGold

It's true that Muslims didn't recieve criticism from their own; Muslims in other point of view. They share the common medium; they condenm the existance of Israel and its supporters. It's like most Christians are against abortion, internally they abhor abortionists, wishing that they wouldn't exist, but they also condemn taking them under our hands, killing them to justify Christian's reason. Morality comes first in Christian world, and I seriously doubt that Muslim share the same morality sense, standing out their opinion against terrorism. They probably are under some pressure by their own faith not to criticize the people of their own faith? Even government backing? I'm not saying that Muslims might have that point of view, but in absence of criticism, it seems like that way like Reba mentioned previously. Like in Arab nations, wives are kept silent in submission to their husbands, therefore the same in Muslims in their superiorities? I'm not sure on how they work, but it seems like that way.

LinuxGold

I do not see how he dictate us in what should not be discussed. His authorative refute seems to be powerful and directly to the point. He is just trying to show us different point of view, something that might be shocking and I realized his point.

Since Muslim didn't criticize terrorists actions in open, using any media possible, such as televised statements, magazines, working directly with government with major agreements t