AJ

so mld4ds said
"heritage means you have to follow white society. you can not friendly chat with any colored people"

now i understand the origin of The Conferderate Battle Flag- The "Southern Cross"
let me give u a little briefing

The Confererate Battle Flag-the "southern cross"

this flag is often confused with the national flag
of confederacy, which is the Stars and Bars flag
the "southern cross" flag has a cross of st. andrew.
A large degree of the southern population back then was
scottish and irish ancestry, and thus familiar with st. andrew,
the patron saint of Scotland.

now the stars on the Southern Cross flag represent the eleven
states actually IN the confederacy, including kentucky
and missouri.

this is the flag that Robert E. Lee fought under.


this flag was born in September 1861 and died in april 1865

but unfortunately after that it was used by the Ku Klux Klan
and other racist hate groups. and thats why it has been
given such a bad reputation.

but now it is being turned into something positive.
Southern Pride. No im not a racist, no im not prejudice
but i am from the south, i have pride that im from the south.
and i want this flag to represent good and positive things, like it should
be now. instead of evil, hateful things like it had been subjected to in the past.

i understand there are STILL racist people out there who wave this flag with the intent
on the flag representing hate. and thats wrong and shouldnt be done.

in other countries our American Flag is burned and spit upon because they
see the american flag as being part of a hateful, racist prejudice country.
and they hate that flag with a passion. not everyone in america is racist,
or prejudice, but they still fly the american flag. why? because in the americans
eyes, that american flag does not stand for hate it stands for pride. and they are
proud to wave that flag. just like im proud to wave that souther cross flag. because
in my eyes it means pride not hate. and myself, and other people are trying to turn
a negative thing into a positive thing.



the flag on the left is used in hate
the flag on the right is used with pride.
and i think i am going to change the wording in my signature.

Attached Images

	hate copy.jpg (48.4 KB, 3 views)
	heritage.jpg (58.8 KB, 2 views)

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C.C.Sinned

Waiting for the first politicaly correct whiner to jump on the bandwagon of condeming the battle fag of the CSA...

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AJ

thank you sir.

C.C.Sinned

wait till you see the huge essay about this subject I have....

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Eve

finally, something we can agree on!

p.s. psssst AJ, you are missing the apostrophe in y'all

AJ

i cant wait Sinned

AJ

........so?

Eve

soooo, it's a Southern Thing! Where you place the apostrophe tells which part of the South you are from.

C.C.Sinned

The Confederate Battle Flag (CBF)
Know The Truth Before You Condemn It

PART 1 -

Many people today have a lack of historical knowledge concerning the Confederate Battle Flag (CBF), or as some call it, the Rebel Flag which is an improper term for it. A lot of people are offended by the CBF because they have been taught that it supports or represents racism/hatred. The CBF has Absolutely Nothing to do with racism or hate. To lie about History is a Crime against Humanity. The war was over money, freedom, governmental control...

History books, the media, the school systems, etc, abound in falsehoods and inaccuracies of Confederate and Southern history. Mainly, that the Confederate Battle Flag is a symbol that represents slavery, terror, crime and that it represents the KKK. BUT, this is far from the truth. Of all KKK meetings, actual photographs / films from past to present, KKK cable access talk shows, etc all PROUDLY boast as being an AMERICAN society. NOT a Southern or Confederate society. But AMERICAN. Along with that, over 95 percent of the flags they fly are of the United States Of America's "Stars and Stripes" flag. As well, in the height of the KKK movement, the largest segment was from the north in the 1920's. And the Grand Dragon was from the Federal stronghold of Indiana. A man by the name of David Stevenson. There were over 6 million members at this time!!!! This is plain and simple fact.These dispicable organizations such as the KKK and Aryans have taken a hallowed piece of history, and have plagued good Southern folks and the memories of fine Confederate Soldiers that fought under the flag with their perverse agenda.

IN NO WAY does the Confederate Flag represent hate or violence. Heritage groups such as the SCV (Sons of Confederate Veterans) battle daily the damage done to a proud nation by these hate groups. The SCV denounces all hate groups, and pridefully boast HERITAGE - NOT HATE.

The CBF was never a national flag of the Southern States, so how could it represent the Southern cause? It was a battleflag carried in war. There a were 3 different Confederate National flags that flew war. The reason that the Confederacy had 3 different national flags was that the 1st was too similar in battle to the "Stars & Stripes". Lot's of confusion due to the similarities. The second was also mistaken at times for a flag of surrender. The 3rd national flag was the final result and the adopted flag of the Confederacy. None of the South's National flags are at the center of controversy. And even more importantly never did the Confederate battle flag stand as a national symbol to fly over a slave nation.

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AJ

lol oh yeah? never heard of that before.

i didn't put the apostrophe cuz i forgot it...and now im not going to put the apostrophe cuz u are making a bullshit weird deal about it.

C.C.Sinned

Part 2 -

The fact is that the United States "Stars & Stripes" flag flew over a slave nation for over 80 years. None of the flags of the Confederacy or Southern Nation ever flew over a slave ship. The South never even owned or operated any slave ships. Every slave brought to America was brought on northern ships under the Union's stars & stripes flag.Slavery was not the cause of the Civil War! Excessive taxes, states rights and lack of fair representation in the federal government led the Southern states to legally secede.

The South did not want war and tried to establish peaceful relations with the North. In the flurry of organizing a government and an army, one of Jefferson Davis's first acts was to dispatch three commissioners to Washington in an attempt to negotiate a settlement with the Union.

Leading them was the Confederate vice-president, Alexander Hamilton Stephens of GeorgiaSome Confederate leaders criticized slavery and believed blacks should be treated with respect and some Confederate leaders, including Jefferson Davis, were ready and willing to abolish slavery in order to preserve Southern independence. The Confederate constitution was very similar to the U.S. Constitution and in fact contained several improvements, and it also banned the overseas slave trade and permitted the entrance of free states into the Confederacy.

Over 65,000 Southern blacks were in the Confederate ranks. Nearly 180,000 Black Southerners, from Virginia alone, provided logistical support for the Confederate military. Black Southerners, slave and free, were servants, clerks, hospital orderlies, wagon drivers, and engineer labor forces, but were also chaplains, scouts, foragers, combat soldiers, and feared sharpshooters. They served willingly and they died in Union P.O.W. camps rather than take the Union oath of loyalty. There were more than 10,000 Native American soldiers. There were more than 5000 Hispanic Confederates. Nearly 3,500 Jewish Confederates. Foreigners from many countries served as officers and enlisted men.

Confederate General Robert E. Lee called slavery "a moral and political evil." Yet he concluded that black slaves were immeasurably better off here than in Africa, morally, socially and physically. Some free African Americans petitioned to be allowed to become slaves; this is because they were unable to support themselvesLincoln held many racist views and he did not start the war in order to free the slaves.

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AJ

C.C.Sinned

PART 3 -
President Abraham Lincoln was fervently making plans to send all freed slaves to the jungles of Central America once the war was over. Knowing that African society would never allow the slaves to return back to Africa, Lincoln also did not want the slaves in the US. He thought the jungles of Central America would be the best solution and conducive to the freed slaves best interest. The only thing that kept this from happening, was his assassination. I bet you were never taught that in school.

Lincoln's Emanciaption Proclamation only freed slaves in the South?? NOT the North! And even Delaware rejected the 13th Amendment and did not ratify it (free the slaves) until 1901!

The fact is large numbers of free African Americans owned black slaves; in fact, in numbers disproportionate to their representation in society at large. In 1860 only a small minority of whites owned slaves. According to the U.S. census report for that last year before the Civil War, there were nearly 27 million whites in the country. Some eight million of them lived in the slaveholding states.

Only a fraction of Southerners owned slaves. There were fewer than 385,000 individuals who owned slaves. Even if all slaveholders had been white, that would amount to only 1.4 percent of whites in the country (or 4.8 percent of southern whites owning one or more slaves).

Confederate General Stonewall Jackson sent off an envelope to his pastor. Expecting a battle report, the preacher discovered a contribution for his church's 'colored Sunday school,' which Jackson had forgotten to send the day of the battlePresident Abraham Lincoln quoted, "We didn't go into this war to put down slavery . . . and to act differently at this moment would, I have no doubt, not only weaken our cause, but smack of bad faith." When he was asked, "Why not let the South go in peace?" Licoln replied, "I can't let them go, Who would pay for the government?"

Confederate General Robert E. Lee quoted, "All the south has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved; and that the Government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." and "There are few, I believe, in this enlightened age, who will not acknowledge that slavery as an institution is a moral and political evil."The Civil War was not over slavery, and the Confederate Flag is NOT about hate, racism, terrorism or anything of that sort. The CBF is a flag that is flown today to represent southern heritage, to show our support, to be free and respected.

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AJ

Damn dude. to you.

how many more parts are there?

C.C.Sinned

END -

Yes, the KKK displays the CBF, but they also display the Christian Flag, does that mean that all Christians are racists? Absolutely Not. People that use the CBF as a symbol of hatred and racism is a disgrace and disrespectful.

I will not allow someone to take the Confederate Battle Flag away from me, I stand on the truth and try my best to preserve it. If you do not take a stand for your rights, you will not have any rights. That is why America is the way she is today. Our rights are being taken away because everyone is sitting back and allowing it. That is why I respect the Southern Confederate Soldiers and the Confederate Battle Flag. They stood up and said We will not allow the Government to take our money and freedom away from us without putting up a fight. 620,000 people lost their lives during the Civil War of 1861-1865. There are African Americans today that know the truth behind the CBF and display, wear, and fly the CBF with honor. There are also Black men in the "Sons of the Confederate Veterans" organization. I encourage you to look further into this subject. This is just a fraction of the information to try to summarize things.
It's Not Racial... It's Heritage, Not Hate

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C.C.Sinned

http://www.dixiecom.com/blackneo.htm
http://confederatezone.50megs.com/custom.html
http://confederatezone.50megs.com/photo4.html
http://www.coax.net/people/lwf/cwappoma.htm
http://www.usgennet.org/usa/mo/count...is/blackcs.htm
It's Disgusting that such a important part of American history.
Is viewed in an ILL way because of this SCUM -

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apathrev

Say what you will to defend the flag or your ancestors. My AP US History teacher put it like this. "You can say heritage not hate all you want, but your heritage is hate." And when you refer to the KKK, are you referring to the original group that started in the 1870s or the 1920s revival group that is the same group still around today?

C.C.Sinned

How is my heritage hate? We (my family) never even owned slaves. The KKK was never part Confederate States of America.

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apathrev

I never said that the KKK was your heritage. The flag was fought under by soldiers whose idea of states rights included the right to enslave a race of human beings that were believed to be inferior and less than human.

C.C.Sinned

You are grouping everyone together. That is not why most of the soliders fought. Read the essay again...
The part about the CSA consitution...

Read -

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Cookie Monster

You do not have to own slaves to be portrayed as "evil", you just need to spew words to be portrayed as "evil". Even evil can be found in a businessperson wearing a three piece suit.

I googled up about the Confederate flags and you can find information in this link along with the different Confederate flags.

"A Southern View of History"

CCSinned mentioned about the KKK and the CSA,

Argument #1 "Since the Ku Klux Klan fly the Confederate flag, it has become a symbol of hatred, racism and intolerance. We cannot let our state or school or community, etc. project an image of racism by flying a Confederate battle flag or something that contains the Confederate battle flag."

"First, many in the Ku Klux Klan (KKK) do not fly the Confederate battle flag. In fact, only a small number actually use a Confederate flag. However, we are told that KKK bylaws require the U.S. flag and the Christian flag to be present at every event. Most people are not aware that the largest KKK membership is in the North and it has been that way since the early 1900s." link

Mookie

That's correct.

AJ, give me a break.

C.C. Sinned, U.S. did not have any law to ban the slaves until Civil War Era. I bet your family (not owners in 1900th century) enjoyed to watch the slave masters whipping on the back of the African slaves....

C.C.Sinned

Just because there were not any laws banning it until that time. Don't mean it would have not have ended if the war was never fought in the first place. Again in a simple words - THE WAR WAS NOT FOUGHT OVER SLAVES...

Nope. My family was nowhere around slave owners...

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Mookie

Interesting, how do you know? I bet your granddaddies did not tell you whole truth...

I simply asked you if your granddaddies probably witnessed the abuse system in the South...

C.C.Sinned

Nope not going to work. I know all about my family. I researched it for years. They were not any where near it.
Read this link -
Black Confederate Heritage

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apathrev

And even though slavery was ended by the Emancipation Proclamation in 1863, not a single slave was freed in the South until 1865, after the war.

Eve

CCSinned, remember who you are arguing with.....

According to mld's theory, we should also condemn the American flag http://www.scv674.org/SH-8.htm *singing*O, I wish I was in the land of cotton
Old times there are not forgotten
Look away! Look away!
Look away! Dixie Land.

In Dixie Land where I was born in
Early on one frosty mornin'
Look away! Look away!
Look away! Dixie Land.

Chorus:
O, I wish I was in Dixie!
Hooray! Hooray!
In Dixie Land I'll take my stand
To live and die in Dixie
Away, away,
Away down south in Dixie!

apathrev

CC, in response to your claim of blacks fighting in the Confederate Army, yes they did fight in the Confederate Army. Some were forced, some were willing. Those that were willing were under the impression that they would earn their freedom if they fought.

Again, you're right it was not a war over slavery. It was a war over the right to have slavery.

AJ

as i said before.

the Southern Cross, which i will be calling it from now on, was associated with some negative things. and im putting it in a positive light, in a positive way.

and yes,unfortunatley, it was used be the KKK look it up.
and yeah, there's a good chance that my ancestors were slave owners and if thats true, thats disgusting. cuz thats certainly not how i feel. and i dont share those views. and there's nothing i can do to change the past...i can only change the future

C.C.Sinned

Civil War & the end of Slavery in Western Florida

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