L.A. riots: Good Samaritan remembers his scary truck-driver rescue

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Steinhauer

Well-Known Member
Black isn't a color. It is the absence of light. Gotta have light to make a color. But we aren't talking about a color wheel. We are talking about people and their racial ID.

Green isn't a racial ID, either.
I wasn't talking about racial ID, I was talking about color. You are the one throwing race into everything.

So, if I want to turn the lights off, all I gotta do is open a crayola box and pick up a black crayon?
 

kokonut

New Member
So? They are white African Americans. That is why there is a difference made between Blacks, and African Americans.
There are all kinds of African Americans but people use it exclusively to mean black. Kind of silly if you ask me.
 

Waterboy

New Member
I wasn't talking about racial ID, I was talking about color. You are the one throwing race into everything.

So, if I want to turn the lights off, all I gotta do is open a crayola box and pick up a black crayon?
What does the color wheel have to do with this discussion? Jiro was right. Focus.

I think your lights have been off a long time.:D
 

Waterboy

New Member
There are all kinds of African Americans but people use it exclusively to mean black. Kind of silly if you ask me.
No they don't. That is why Black is used. To distinquish between Black and white African Americans.

Maybe you use it to refer only to Blacks, but that doesn't mean everyone does. Especially not Black people. Just like you said. There are all kinds of African Americans. There are also all kinds of Black Americans. European, Jamaican, and so forth.
 

Steinhauer

Well-Known Member
No they don't. That is why Black is used. To distinquish between Black and white African Americans.

Maybe you use it to refer only to Blacks, but that doesn't mean everyone does. Especially not Black people. Just like you said. There are all kinds of African Americans. There are also all kinds of Black Americans. European, Jamaican, and so forth.
I just say Jamaican.

I leave color in the crayola box.
 

naisho

Forum Disorders M.D.,Ph.D
No they don't. That is why Black is used. To distinquish between Black and white African Americans.
The term 'black' underlies older-fashioned terminology. It started just as long ago as Asians used to be termed 'yellow' until it was no longer the accepted standard nowadays. Yellow was also not capitalized to place emphasis on Asians in the past either.
Also, take into account some blacks might not like being called blacks. It's not much more than a racial epithet, but it's accepted to some of them so that's why the usage has different impact to each individual.

The ideal way to intellectually identify them without stepping on toes are based on their ethnic backgrounds. IE; African-American, Ethiopian, Jamaican-American, Cuban of Salvador descent, etc.
 

kokonut

New Member
No they don't. That is why Black is used. To distinquish between Black and white African Americans.

Maybe you use it to refer only to Blacks, but that doesn't mean everyone does. Especially not Black people. Just like you said. There are all kinds of African Americans. There are also all kinds of Black Americans. European, Jamaican, and so forth.
Pretty silly to say "white African Americans." That was my point. And in general my point about the political correctness run amok using the term "African American" of which I've already illustrated using Teresa Heinz Kerry as an example.

Many are comfortable using the description as White or black.
 

Waterboy

New Member
Pretty silly to say "white African Americans." That was my point. And in general my point about the political correctness run amok using the term "African American" of which I've already illustrated using Teresa Heinz Kerry as an example.

Many are comfortable using the description as White or black.
Why would it be silly to say "white African Americans" if they are whites that came from Africa to America? Teresa Heinz is a white African American.

Not all African Americans are Black, and not all Blacks are African Americans.
 

kokonut

New Member
The term 'black' underlies older-fashioned terminology. It started just as long ago as asians used to be called 'yellow' until it was no longer the accepted standard nowadays. Yellow was not capitalized to place emphasis on Asians in the past either.
Also, take into account some blacks might not like being called blacks. It's not much more than a racial epithet, but it's accepted to some of them so that's why the usage has different impact to each individual.

The ideal way to intellectually identify them without stepping on toes are based on their ethnic backgrounds. IE; African-American, Ethiopian, Jamaican-American, Cuban of Salvador descent, etc.
The problem is that saying "African-American" doesn't wash because you can have people born "white" in African and become U.S. citizen, just like Teresa Heinz Kerry, who are technically "African American." I understand that there are about 80% blacks in Africa while 10% of them are white while the rest are of different ethnic groups. I'd say saying "African American" is becoming a misnomer nowadays to mean only black.
 

Foxrac

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The problem is that saying "African-American" doesn't wash because you can have people born "white" in African and become U.S. citizen, just like Teresa Heinz Kerry, who are technically "African American." I understand that there are about 80% blacks in Africa while 10% of them are white while the rest are of different ethnic groups. I'd say saying "African American" is becoming a misnomer nowadays to mean only black.
Northern Africa are see as Caucasian rather than African American.
 

Waterboy

New Member
The problem is that saying "African-American" doesn't wash because you can have people born "white" in African and become U.S. citizen, just like Teresa Heinz Kerry, who are technically "African American." I understand that there are about 80% blacks in Africa while 10% of them are white while the rest are of different ethnic groups. I'd say saying "African American" is becoming a misnomer nowadays to mean only black.
Right. So why would anyone just assume that African American means all Black people?
 

naisho

Forum Disorders M.D.,Ph.D
The problem is that saying "African-American" doesn't wash because you can have people born "white" in African and become U.S. citizen, just like Teresa Heinz Kerry, who are technically "African American." I understand that there are about 80% blacks in Africa while 10% of them are white while the rest are of different ethnic groups. I'd say saying "African American" is becoming a misnomer nowadays to mean only black.
That should be where the ethnic identity takes place. In the example with a white being born in Africa, you just go by their roots that identified their racial genetics. German, Irish, Jewish.
Of course, if the individual does not know their background, then it does make things complicated.

The whole point should be to correctly identify them without stepping on toes. But I'd rather hope that they would not be offended by the usage by the time it gets that serious.
 

kokonut

New Member
Why would it be silly to say "white African Americans" if they are whites that came from Africa to America? Teresa Heinz is a white African American.

Not all African Americans are Black, and not all Blacks are African Americans.
If they want to add a color to the term "African American" to lessen the confusion then be my guest. Saying "African American" is to assume black and the term is reserved only for black people. What's next, "Yellow African American"? (see Naisho's response).
 

kokonut

New Member
That should be where the ethnic identity takes place. In the example with a white being born in Africa, you just go by their roots that identified their racial genetics. German, Irish, Jewish.
Of course, if the individual does not know their background, then it does make things complicated.

The whole point should be to correctly identify them without stepping on toes. But I'd rather hope that they would not be offended by the usage by the time it gets that serious.
"African American" is an automatic de facto term to mean black which, again, is a misnomer because you can have "white African American." Imagine if somebody said that publicly in the United States to describe him/herself ethnic description you'd have people up in arms for using that term. And we can probably guess which group would.
 

naisho

Forum Disorders M.D.,Ph.D
"African American" is an automatic de facto term to mean black which, again, is a misnomer because you can have "white African American." Imagine if somebody said that publicly in the United States to describe him/herself ethnic description you'd have people up in arms for using that term. And we can probably guess which group would.
I agree in that "African American" is an automatic misnomer in itself, it should just be reserved for those who truly associate themselves as African with no selection of their native location, but this is just my opinion.

I would not call someone African American unless that's how they identified as. I'd still stick with their ethnic roots. If I know someone is Jamaican, Ethiopian, Cuban, Congolese, etc. I would use this first before resorting to African American or not say it at all.
 

Waterboy

New Member
The term 'black' underlies older-fashioned terminology. It started just as long ago as Asians used to be termed 'yellow' until it was no longer the accepted standard nowadays. Yellow was also not capitalized to place emphasis on Asians in the past either.
Also, take into account some blacks might not like being called blacks. It's not much more than a racial epithet, but it's accepted to some of them so that's why the usage has different impact to each individual.

The ideal way to intellectually identify them without stepping on toes are based on their ethnic backgrounds. IE; African-American, Ethiopian, Jamaican-American, Cuban of Salvador descent, etc.
Post 27 indicates that most Black Americans do not find the term "Black" to be insulting, and use it to refer to themselves. It is a term that they themselves came up with as a racial identity. Whites assigned them terms such as "negroe" or "coloreds". Those were derogatory terms. That is why "Black" started being used by the race. To assign a label of pride in their race instead of relying on the terms the whites used to refer to them.

I don't think, but I could be wrong, that Asians ever decided to refer to themself as "yellow". I think that was the Caucasion population that came up with that term, just like "negroe" and "colored".

That is the difference.
 

Waterboy

New Member
"African American" is an automatic de facto term to mean black which, again, is a misnomer because you can have "white African American." Imagine if somebody said that publicly in the United States to describe him/herself ethnic description you'd have people up in arms for using that term. And we can probably guess which group would.
Maybe where you come from it is defacto. Not where I come from.
 

naisho

Forum Disorders M.D.,Ph.D
Post 27 indicates that most Black Americans do not find the term "Black" to be insulting, and use it to refer to themselves. It is a term that they themselves came up with as a racial identity. Whites assigned them terms such as "negroe" or "coloreds". Those were derogatory terms. That is why "Black" started being used by the race. To assign a label of pride in their race instead of relying on the terms the whites used to refer to them.

I don't think, but I could be wrong, that Asians ever decided to refer to themself as "yellow". I think that was the Caucasion population that came up with that term, just like "negroe" and "colored".

That is the difference.
And that, is also what I wrote.
it's accepted to some of them so that's why the usage has different impact to each individual.
Yellow and black were terms that came out long ago, likely stipulated by the people living in America at that time. When you look at both groups that dislike being called 'black' or 'yellow', they both dislike it for the same reasons.
 

Waterboy

New Member
I agree in that "African American" is an automatic misnomer in itself, it should just be reserved for those who truly associate themselves as African with no selection of their native location, but this is just my opinion.

I would not call someone African American unless that's how they identified as. I'd still stick with their ethnic roots. If I know someone is Jamaican, Ethiopian, Cuban, Congolese, etc. I would use this first before resorting to African American or not say it at all.
And there are many Blacks in America that are so far removed from their ethnic origins that they just prefer to be known as Black. European Blacks that have been here for generations, for instance. They are still not a part of American white culture, and they live within the Black culture, but they don't see the need to call themselves European Black Americans because they are generations away from that identity. They are just Black Americans as a racial and a cultural group.
 
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