California Bill AB 2027

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Reba said:
It seems to me that the one sure way to NOT get hearing parents on board with a particular way of educating their deaf children is to bully and insult them with a superior air, while criticizing their choices and opinions.

Deaf educators and parents should be working as a team to get the best results for the children. How does all this I'm-a-professional vs. I'm-a-parent help the kids?

Also, who says that one particular "program" or method is best for each and every deaf child? Each child is an individual with different learning abilities and modes of learning (tactile vs. auditory vs. visual, etc.). The age which they became deaf, and to what degree is variable. There is no one-size-fits-all solution.

Creating a wall between "us" and "them" doesn't benefit anyone, much less the child who is treated as a bystander to all this bickering.
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I agree with you. I just wish that myth of using ASL is bad for a deaf child who is learning to speak would just go away.
 
A, I don't think anybody in here ever said that ASL is bad for a deaf/hh child who is learning to speak. Just that there are choices and decisions here made by the parents for their deaf/hh children on how to approach language development and mode of communication used.
 
whole auditory pathway argument <---- this is what I mean.
 
jillio said:
Kind of like when one member of CI circle notifies all the others to gather at AD and drown out the advocates for Bi-Bi education? :laugh2:

I am not an interpreter, nor have I ever claimed to be an interpreter. And I have many years worth of assurrances from the Deaf and the deaf that I indeed approach the entire subject from their perspective. In fact, I have been mistaken for deaf on more than one occasion based on nothing more than my ability to communicate correctly the deaf perspective.

FJ has quite a history around here. Something those that have been around awhile are aware of. Perhaps you don't know as much about things that have transpired as should prior to getting involved.
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What is my history? I have always said that I advocate for ASL for all kids with a hearing loss, from the start. What is wrong with that?
 
A said:
whole auditory pathway argument <---- this is what I mean.
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The auditory pathway thing just means that if you don't use them, they change and become used for visual information. So, I would advocate use of amplification, exposure to spoken language and aural rehab so they can remain auditory. You can have all those things AND ASL.
 
I still think the brain is capable to handle both. Beside I don't believe auditory pathway change into visual information. We are just seeing information like everyone else.
 
A said:
I still think the brain is capable to handle both. Beside I don't believe auditory pathway change into visual information. We are just seeing information like everyone else.
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That's old science. It is fact.
 
Reba said:
It seems to me that the one sure way to NOT get hearing parents on board with a particular way of educating their deaf children is to bully and insult them with a superior air, while criticizing their choices and opinions.

Deaf educators and parents should be working as a team to get the best results for the children. How does all this I'm-a-professional vs. I'm-a-parent help the kids?

Also, who says that one particular "program" or method is best for each and every deaf child? Each child is an individual with different learning abilities and modes of learning (tactile vs. auditory vs. visual, etc.). The age which they became deaf, and to what degree is variable. There is no one-size-fits-all solution.

Creating a wall between "us" and "them" doesn't benefit anyone, much less the child who is treated as a bystander to all this bickering.
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Maybe it is because some of us witnessed or personally experienced what happens to a deaf child who has been put in a restrictive educational setting for several years resulting in language delays, deficits or socio-emotional issues all because people want to believ that deaf children do not need ASL without fully understanding the implications. ASL is not a method of teaching..it is a language of deaf people. If deaf people had full access to communication and language via spoken language then sign languages would have never evolved.

We are advocating for the use of both for all deaf/hoh children so these risks would be as minimized as possible.
 
faire_jour said:
And, if you do not wish to use listening and spoken language, that isn't a bad thing.
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CODA kids are usually fluent in both if they are exposed to both... I've seen it with CODA distance relative of mine. She had both world.
 
A said:
CODA kids are usually fluent in both if they are exposed to both... I've seen it with CODA distance relative of mine. She had both world.
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Yes, but they do have to be exposed to both, just like deaf kids must be.
 
faire_jour said:
Yes, but they do have to be exposed to both, just like deaf kids must be.
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Right, I agree. What I am confused is that u seem to acccept the oral only environment for deaf children as well ?
 
shel90 said:
Right, I agree. What I am confused is that u seem to acccept the oral only environment for deaf children as well ?
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I think it depends on the child, the situation and the parent's choice. I want my child to know and use ASL, but it isn't my choice for all students. I do not believe that there is one way for all kids.
 
shel90 said:
Maybe it is because some of us witnessed or personally experienced what happens to a deaf child who has been put in a restrictive educational setting for several years resulting in language delays, deficits or socio-emotional issues all because people want to believ that deaf children do not need ASL without fully understanding the implications. ASL is not a method of teaching..it is a language of deaf people. If deaf people had full access to communication and language via spoken language then sign languages would have never evolved.

We are advocating for the use of both for all deaf/hoh children so these risks would be as minimized as possible.
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You can advocate if you want, fine by me. However, when parents make an informed decision regarding the educational direction and exposure to language and communication, we have to respect their decisions. Give them the information they need without coercion or pressure and let them decide.
 
kokonut said:
You can advocate if you want, fine by me. However, when parents make an informed decision regarding the educational direction and exposure to language and communication, we have to respect their decisions. Give them the information they need without coercion or pressure and let them decide.
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I wish it was happening around here. I wish I can say more without putting my job at risk but let's say many of us advocates are not being allowed in some certain places to contact parents of newly diagnosed deaf babies but other agencies are. That is what's making me angry. As of a result of this situation many deaf children get referred to programs that uses ASL afrter they have fell so far behind. It is just not acceptable to me. I guess it will continue to be an uphill battle and I hope this law will be passed around here as well.
 
faire_jour said:
I think it depends on the child, the situation and the parent's choice. I want my child to know and use ASL, but it isn't my choice for all students. I do not believe that there is one way for all kids.[/QUOTE]

That is what I am having a hard time understanding. ASL and English are both languages and they should be treated as equally. ASL shouldn't be treated as "one" approach to teaching because it is not.

Teaching approaches are CS, Visual Phonics, SEE, and Sim-Com. ASL is not part of it and neither is English.
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kokonut said:
You can advocate if you want, fine by me. However, when parents make an informed decision regarding the educational direction and exposure to language and communication, we have to respect their decisions. Give them the information they need without coercion or pressure and let them decide.
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Haha, it wouldn't even have to be an informed decision; it is still theirs to make, informed or not. :lol:
 
Tousi said:
Haha, it wouldn't even have to be an informed decision; it is still theirs to make, informed or not. :lol:
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Yea, but at least they can get all the info instead of just only from the medical community which is happening around here.
 
shel90 said:
That is what I am having a hard time understanding. ASL and English are both languages and they should be treated as equally. ASL shouldn't be treated as "one" approach to teaching because it is not.

Teaching approaches are CS, Visual Phonics, SEE, and Sim-Com. ASL is not part of it and neither is English.
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Right, English is a language and so is ASL. So one choice is English, one is ASL. There are different ways for a child to aquire English.
 
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