Father Held Daughter in Cellar for 24 Years - Page 4

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

Oh man..I forgot all about the story "Flowers in the Attic"..I thought something familiar hit me when I read the story. That was it...the book.

This man needs to be thrown in an alligator pit.

I bidded those book at Ebay. Still 13 hours go... Is it true story?

I search for DVD with subtitles but they don´t have subtitles on that DVD...

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 02:09 AM

That monster begged his lawyer for want to see his family... In prison, he received no visitors yet.

Do you really think his family would visit him in jail after what and how he did to Elisabeth for years?

I can image how 3 "upstair" children reacts after learn that monster is not their grandfather but their father which they thought he is such loving grandfather for years... and then plus learn that they have cellar siblings.

How do 6 children & their spouses reacts after learn what and how he did to their sister Elisabeth and plus father 7 children with her?

Elisabeth and all of her children will get new identity and start new life somewhere.

Those situtation got me cold...

sara1981 · 05-04-2008, 02:09 AM

i would agree with post,liebling

that monster would going jail for 15 years or mores! dues austrain laws

murders will stay in jail for 25 or 30 years between depends by laws whether in USA or countries.

rape will staying jail for 20 or less years depends austrain laws or USA whether in countries.

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

He's not sickly. He could easily live past 88 years old. What if he gets out? What creepy things will he do then?

Nobody will welcome him when he get out of prison.

Ozzie · 05-04-2008, 02:18 AM

Liebling ... Flowers in the Attic is purportedly based on a true story, and is written in the first person. But there are some reports saying it's not true.

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozzie

Liebling ... Flowers in the Attic is purportedly based on a true story, and is written in the first person. But there are some reports saying it's not true.

Yeah, that´s what I thought so after view and search about this... It seem to me that it´s only Roman (fictional) story... ?

That´s why I ask Shel90. I bidded that book for €1.00 from Ebay. 13 hours go... either it will be mine or not??? The book will tell either it´s true or roman story...

deafdyke · 05-04-2008, 02:32 AM

Flowers in the Attic is made up. Thank GOD. Although there have been cases of really psychotic people imprisoning people in their cellars. I'd say this is almost more akin to Buffalo Bill from Silence of the Lambs (remmy he kept the senator's daughter in a pit?) and the Genie feral child case.
I wish Elisabeth had told someone before hand.

Koala · 05-04-2008, 02:45 AM

From Liebling's post #92

Quote:

That monster begged his lawyer for want to see his family... In prison, he received no visitors yet.

How dare he begged his lawyer about want his family to see him. I hope nobody visit him in prison at all.

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Do you really think his family would visit him in jail after what and how he did to Elisabeth for years?

I hope not. They all prolly hate him now for what he did.

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I can image how 3 "upstair" children reacts after learn that monster is not their grandfather but their father which they thought he is such loving grandfather for years... and then plus learn that they have cellar siblings.

Maybe they may not know about it just yet about their grandfather is actually is their father until they are old enough to be told. If they were told about it, yes they would be very upset and confuse.

Quote:

How do 6 children & their spouses reacts after learn what and how he did to their sister Elisabeth and plus father 7 children with her?

I bet they are speechless to hear about it. They would hate their father now.

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Elisabeth and all of her children will get new identity and start new life somewhere.

Good...I hope they will have a nice place somewhere far away from that cold place they once lived in.

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Those situtation got me cold...

Yes me too, gives me goosebump reading all the news story.

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 03:11 AM

[quote]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koala

How dare he begged his lawyer about want his family to see him. I hope nobody visit him in prison at all.

I hope not. They all prolly hate him now for what he did.

I only know that Elisabeth said that she NEVER want to see that man ever again.

Rosemarie, Josef´s wife whom he married for over 51 years want her marriage over.

I don´t know anything about Josef´s & Rosemarie´s 6 children & their spouses and plus Elisabeth´s 6 children with Josef as well reacts. It seem to me that they hide from the scandal and don´t want to do anything with their father/in-law. I guess that they feel sick and don´t want to see Josepf´s face what and how he did to their sister/in law Elisabeth and plus shock to know who 3 "upstair" children´s father really is. They thought all the time that 3 children is their nephews/nieces but really is their siblings...

I will be surprise if one or some of Josef´s children visit and forgive him. If they does which mean is they accept his forgive to free their bitter and hurt. Maybe they can forgive him but they will NEVER forget it.

It seem to me that they don´t want to do anything with him anymore after what and how he did to them is betrayal and dirty.

Quote:

[color="Purple"]Maybe they may not know about it just yet about their grandfather is actually is their father until they are old enough to be told. If they were told about it, yes they would be very upset and confuse.

Unfortunlately no, they know thru scandal that their "Grandfather" is really their father and where their mother really is in cellar, not religion cult.

They and their mother Elisabeth & cellar siblings reunioned each other at hospitail last week. They did not went to school since those scandal. Nobody know what and how they reacts.

Quote:

I bet they are speechless to hear about it. They would hate their father now.

Yes we beleive, too.

We know thru TV and media that they seek therapy. The authorites and media respect their privacy. Teachers and their friends positive them and their behavior... and said that they are good and helpful students. Teacher cried and feel bad for them. Nobody knows either they would return to school again or move to start new life with new idendity with Elisabeth and cellar siblings?

It still is under investiage... it´s not over yet...

Quote:

Good...I hope they will have a nice place somewhere far away from that cold place they once lived in.

Yes, they deserve it but the scar will stay with them forever...

Quote:

Yes me too, gives me goosebump reading all the news story.

Yes, daily news and TV got me goosebump...

jillio · 05-04-2008, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

I really had no clue that BPD was basicly non violent/non criminal sociopathy. I always associate it with Girl, Interrupted.....and whatsherface really didn't seem THAT affected by it.
The more I read about this case, the more I'm sickened. HOW could Josef DO something like that? It just boggles the mind.

Well, if you watch the movie again, look at her self destructive behaviors and rebelliousness. It doesn't always result in criminal behavior, but usually results in an inability to understand that rules apply to all. She saw herself as an exception. Sociopathy is technically, an inability to comply with social norms. It varies in degree. And sociopathy isn't really a dx, just a symptom of various other disorders.

Miss-Delectable · 05-04-2008, 07:38 AM

Poor Kerstin. She never had a chance, didn't she?

I hope the Austrian authority will charge Josef with every crimes they can throw at him.

His eyes are creepy, I grant you that.

I hope Elizabeth and the kids will be given new names, location, and proper help in years to come.

jillio · 05-04-2008, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss-Delectable

Poor Kerstin. She never had a chance, didn't she?

I hope the Austrian authority will charge Josef with every crimes they can throw at him.

His eyes are creepy, I grant you that.

I hope Elizabeth and the kids will be given new names, location, and proper help in years to come.

Agreed. These children and their mother will be dealing with this for the rest of their lives. I sincerely hope that they are provided all the help they need to make it as easy as possible for them in the future. They have a rough road ahead of them.

deafskeptic · 05-04-2008, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

I really had no clue that BPD was basicly non violent/non criminal sociopathy. I always associate it with Girl, Interrupted.....and whatsherface really didn't seem THAT affected by it.
The more I read about this case, the more I'm sickened. HOW could Josef DO something like that? It just boggles the mind.

I know. I've tried to understand why people do things like that. Intellectually, I understand that such people have no real affection for other people or any ability to feel for others as we would. Emotionally, I do not understand such people at all.

Miss-Delectable · 05-04-2008, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafskeptic

I know. I've tried to understand why people do things like that. Intellectually, I understand that such people have no real affection for other people or any ability to feel for others as we would. Emotionally, I do not understand such people at all.

Well, I think it's better we don't try to understand them lest we damage our soul or lose a part of ourself from walking in their shoes.

Honestly, I don't know how psychologists who treats those sort of people can deal with it personally. It would be safe to assume they'd burn out quickly.

deafskeptic · 05-04-2008, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

Well, if you watch the movie again, look at her self destructive behaviors and rebelliousness. It doesn't always result in criminal behavior, but usually results in an inability to understand that rules apply to all. She saw herself as an exception. Sociopathy is technically, an inability to comply with social norms. It varies in degree. And sociopathy isn't really a dx, just a symptom of various other disorders.

Thanks for the clarification.

Some social worker thought I had BPD.

Someone who has worked with BPD said I clearly am not one. She said that many of them can be quite demanding and they've been known to wake up others in middle of the night, screaming at them while they're having a crisis.

I think I had a friend like that with BPD. Most are women but this person is a guy. We no longer speak to each other. I can see him doing that to others.

shel90 · 05-04-2008, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

I bidded those book at Ebay. Still 13 hours go... Is it true story?

I search for DVD with subtitles but they don´t have subtitles on that DVD...

I dont think it was based on a true story but we never know if people have locked their family members like that in the attic.

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 10:18 AM

Austria Worries About Tarnished Image After Incest Case

Quote:

Fears in Austria are growing about how the case of a man who locked his daughter in a cellar for 24 years and fathered seven children with her will impact the country's image. Police plan to revisit missing person cases.

Several hundred journalists from all over the world are currently camped out in Amstetten, the town in eastern Austria where 73-year-old Josef F. perpetrated his crimes.

Austria's tourist industry is worried about the fall-out from the case. Many international commentators have interpreted it as a sign of something being rotten in the state of Austria -- that the case is a reflection of the state of the national psyche.

The nightmare scenario is that the country of mountains and lakes, of Mozart, Haydn and the Habsburg monarchy, will now be seen as "the land of dungeons," as one foreign newspaper has called it.

History repeating itself?

Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: Part of the basement where F. incarcerated his daughter for almost 25 years

Part of the problem is that the case is not the first of its kind. In August 2006, 20-year-old Natascha Kampusch escaped her kidnapper after spending eight years locked up in a basement dungeon.

And there were others: a mother who locked her daughters in the house for years, and, in the 1990s, the case of Maria, a girl who was kept in a wooden box by her parents.

The press response has been harsh. Italy's La Stampa said perversion and serial killers are "naturally not exclusively Austrian but there they are tied up with waltzes, yodelers and cuckoo clocks." The paper wondered whether F.'s crimes were "uniquely Austrian."

Poland's Dziennik newspaper asked: "Why are such beasts born in Austria?" While the Swiss Tagesanzeiger looked for causes in the conservative, agricultural and "arch-Catholic" society of lower Austria where "words such as civil society and self-responsibility are still alien."

In Germany, a number of newspapers have drawn a parallel between the subterranean nature of these crimes and the country's tendency towards repression. For years, Austria depicted itself as the victim of the Nazi regime rather than a complicit accessory.

Some circles inside Austria share this opinion. According to Austrian writer Josef Haslinger, his country has a "fatal tradition" of "brushing things under the carpet." He told German radio that Austrians should not act as if the Amstetten incest case "has nothing to do with Austria, as if it could happen anywhere."

Heads of state defend country's honor
Bildunterschrift: Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: F.'s daughter is currently being cared for in a clinic

State representatives beg to differ. The vehement criticism of Austria has prompted an official response from the highest quarters. Austrian Chancellor Alfred Gusenbauer said in Vienna on Thursday, May 1, that citizens should not allow "the whole of Austria to be taken hostage by a single criminal, cruel perpetrator ... we have the reputation of our country to defend."

A day before, Austrian President Heinz Fischer also spoke up on behalf of the nation, saying in an interview that "there is nothing subtly Austrian about this case. The monstrousness that man is capable of can be revealed anywhere." This can be proven, he said, by looking at the "worldwide horror headlines of recent years."

Austria's leaders will be relieved to hear that some analysts believe the damage to the country's image will not be permanent.

Market researcher Wolfgang Bachmayer told the DPA news agency that the qualities normally associated with Austria -- tradition and coziness -- would eventually be restored in the public mind, while another market researcher, Karin Cwritila, said the Alpine country would win back its classic image as an "island of the blessed."

Austria Worries About Tarnished Image After Incest Case | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 02.05.2008

Accord TV News, some Austrians felt that world medias made an extreme over their country´s image. It shows that Austria is not alone but other countries as well...

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

I dont think it was based on a true story but we never know if people have locked their family members like that in the attic.

Yes, I know what you mean. It´s not just that Josef but other parents did the same to their children in different way... Read the article, I just provided to.

Liebling:-))) · 05-04-2008, 10:23 AM

[quote]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss-Delectable

Poor Kerstin. She never had a chance, didn't she?

Don´t say "never" yet. Yes the doctors have little hopes for her recovery and said that she has low chance to be alive.

Quote:

I hope the Austrian authority will charge Josef with every crimes they can throw at him.

Yes, I want to make sure that monster NEVER get out of jail.

Quote:

His eyes are creepy, I grant you that.

Exactly

Quote:

I hope Elizabeth and the kids will be given new names, location, and proper help in years to come.

I already said in previous post that they will have their new intendity and start new life somewhere.

***VamPyroX*** · 05-04-2008, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

How's that? My hearing brother started torturing animals when he was 5. How, at 5 was he made to have a predepostion to sociopath behaviors?

At the age of 5, children still haven't developed the full sense of what's right or wrong. If they're enjoying something that they shouldn't enjoy, then they need to be taught why it's wrong or bad.

Bad behavior is usually caused by nuture, not nature. (nature = being born with it; nuture = being raised with it)

Pinky678 · 05-04-2008, 12:45 PM

That's stupid of father!!! He is so sicko! He need to stay in the prison in rest of life! I feeling bad for daughter. This is so disgusted!

jillio · 05-04-2008, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafskeptic

Thanks for the clarification.

Some social worker thought I had BPD.

Someone who has worked with BPD said I clearly am not one. She said that many of them can be quite demanding and they've been known to wake up others in middle of the night, screaming at them while they're having a crisis.

I think I had a friend like that with BPD. Most are women but this person is a guy. We no longer speak to each other. I can see him doing that to others.

I certainly haven't seen anything from you that would lead me to suspect BPD! You are correct...they are quite demanding. The world revolves around them, you know. Very needy people. Men are infrequently diagnosed with BPD, but it isn't unheard of. I can certainly understand why you avoid your friend with the symptoms, but am sure that the reason he attributes to the dissolution is that you are at fault and he is but a poor victim.

05-04-2008, 02:09 AM	#92 (permalink)
Liebling:-))) me in Springfield, IL '07 Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 22,429	Update That monster begged his lawyer for want to see his family... In prison, he received no visitors yet. Do you really think his family would visit him in jail after what and how he did to Elisabeth for years? I can image how 3 "upstair" children reacts after learn that monster is not their grandfather but their father which they thought he is such loving grandfather for years... and then plus learn that they have cellar siblings. How do 6 children & their spouses reacts after learn what and how he did to their sister Elisabeth and plus father 7 children with her? Elisabeth and all of her children will get new identity and start new life somewhere. Those situtation got me cold... __________________ sniffing you

05-04-2008, 02:09 AM	#93 (permalink)
sara1981 Batista's Fans Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: North Little Rock,Ar Posts: 2,380	i would agree with post,liebling that monster would going jail for 15 years or mores! dues austrain laws murders will stay in jail for 25 or 30 years between depends by laws whether in USA or countries. rape will staying jail for 20 or less years depends austrain laws or USA whether in countries. __________________

05-04-2008, 07:38 AM	#101 (permalink)
Miss-Delectable Capt Tony Nelson, Jeannie Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: No.1 Shopping Capital in Australia Posts: 7,623	Poor Kerstin. She never had a chance, didn't she? I hope the Austrian authority will charge Josef with every crimes they can throw at him. His eyes are creepy, I grant you that. I hope Elizabeth and the kids will be given new names, location, and proper help in years to come. __________________

05-04-2008, 12:45 PM	#111 (permalink)
Pinky678 Pretty in Pink Bride! Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Middle of nowhere in Great Lakes Posts: 643	That's stupid of father!!! He is so sicko! He need to stay in the prison in rest of life! I feeling bad for daughter. This is so disgusted! __________________ "Your lips are moving but all I hear is blah, blah, blah!" "You can talk but I probably won't listen"

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05-04-2008, 02:18 AM	#95 (permalink)
Ozzie "The reason I smile" Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 951	Liebling ... Flowers in the Attic is purportedly based on a true story, and is written in the first person. But there are some reports saying it's not true.

05-04-2008, 02:32 AM	#97 (permalink)
deafdyke So NOT a Princess! Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ROOOARRRR!!!, that's where! Posts: 6,093	Flowers in the Attic is made up. Thank GOD. Although there have been cases of really psychotic people imprisoning people in their cellars. I'd say this is almost more akin to Buffalo Bill from Silence of the Lambs (remmy he kept the senator's daughter in a pit?) and the Genie feral child case. I wish Elisabeth had told someone before hand.