Deaf people bashing ASL?

Daredevel7

Daredevel7

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Even though I was born deaf, I am somewhat new to the Deaf community. I have made a few deaf friends here and started going to Deaf coffee chats, etc. (Although, lately, I haven't been going.)

Recently, someone talked about deaf people (who are NOT raised orally) looking down on ASL here on AD. So I started asking around about what they think of ASL, SEE, etc. I was shocked to hear what they said. All of those people have been signing all their lives.

One person thought ASL was "dumb and backwards". She thought it was pointless to teach them a whole 'nother language when they can just teach them something very similar to English (SEE). Then you don't have to make them learn two different languages.

Two people didn't mind ASL, but thought ASL was for "low functioning" people. One of them starts off signing SEE (honestly, it seems to be more PSE to me) and if the "listener" doesn't understand, he reverts to ASL.

Another person likes ASL because it is "quick and easy" but hates the environment that ASL brings. He went to an ASL based school and hated the environment (the people, the teachers, etc).

Dang.... is this common?
 
:) welcome to the world where the outsiders muddle with people.

Now you see why there are so many problems.

Now, the biggest problem with that is education. Why is there English classes, and NO ASL classes for the deaf? Sure, there's ASL for hearing people but when a deaf student is present - they almost never are in the ASL classes.

They are not taught that ASL is just like any other language.
 
I took a deaf lady to a business lunch last weekend and she asked me not to sign. I did anyway. ;)
 
I am surprised by people who are part of the community that say ASL is no good. It has all the hallmarks of language, it expresses thoughts, feelings, and conceptual ideas. It evolves, is systematic, and complete (meaning all concepts within the community can be expressed by the language) It is a more adaptable and makes more sense than English.
Unlike English or Latin, or any number of spoken languages, even if ASL were to die out and become extinct, eventually someone would raise it again because of humanities pronounced tendencies to gesticulate and form concepts nonverbally.
I wonder if the tendency is directly connected to how people feel they are viewed when they use ASL? There aren't many people who want to be pitied or patronized.
 
S0rceress0 said:
I am surprised by people who are part of the community that say ASL is no good. It has all the hallmarks of language, it expresses thoughts, feelings, and conceptual ideas. It evolves, is systematic, and complete (meaning all concepts within the community can be expressed by the language) It is a more adaptable and makes more sense than English.
Unlike English or Latin, or any number of spoken languages, even if ASL were to die out and become extinct, eventually someone would raise it again because of humanities pronounced tendencies to gesticulate and form concepts nonverbally.
I wonder if the tendency is directly connected to how people feel they are viewed when they use ASL? There aren't many people who want to be pitied or patronized.
Click to expand...

Could I recommend the book, For Hearing People Only? It will cover a lot of the questions you are bringing up here.
 
Bottesini said:
Could I recommend the book, For Hearing People Only? It will cover a lot of the questions you are bringing up here.
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Thanks Bott, I recently tried to find this in a format I could read online or a PDF I could transfer to my Ebook reader. I have not had an answer from the website itself yet. :)
 
S0rceress0 said:
Thanks Bott, I recently tried to find this in a format I could read online or a PDF I could transfer to my Ebook reader. I have not had an answer from the website itself yet. :)
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Try something like Half.com, I found that textbooks are incredibly cheap there.
 
you got a point here.. I do see this very often and all over. You just can't win in a group and be friends with everyone.

Call it stereotyping, call it ignorance, call it a bliss, call it whatever you want but its true that a majority of the deaf/HOH people will sign the way they want due to educational background and region. If I were to drive every 2-4 hours from west to east, the changes in signs and attitudes will be prevalent. this seems to be more pronounced with ASL then SEE. I am often more criticized in my signing "accent" that seem like I sign more of SEE then ASL when I encounter deaf/HOH from other states then one I live in.

Bottom line here- I sign, I get my conversation across, but its never enough!!

I know what Daredevel7 is feeling. :grouphug:
 
S0rceress0 said:
I am surprised by people who are part of the community that say ASL is no good. It has all the hallmarks of language, it expresses thoughts, feelings, and conceptual ideas. It evolves, is systematic, and complete (meaning all concepts within the community can be expressed by the language) It is a more adaptable and makes more sense than English.
Unlike English or Latin, or any number of spoken languages, even if ASL were to die out and become extinct, eventually someone would raise it again because of humanities pronounced tendencies to gesticulate and form concepts nonverbally.
I wonder if the tendency is directly connected to how people feel they are viewed when they use ASL? There aren't many people who want to be pitied or patronized.
Click to expand...
See, the difference is - you are educated in it. Many deaf people arent.
 
posts from hell said:
Now, the biggest problem with that is education. Why is there English classes, and NO ASL classes for the deaf? Sure, there's ASL for hearing people but when a deaf student is present - they almost never are in the ASL classes.

They are not taught that ASL is just like any other language.
Click to expand...
They will be soon:
The Learning Center for the Deaf in Framingham is part of a Clerc Center coalition that will design new standards for the teaching of American Sign Language.
 
I'm puzzled by this thread. Most of you know from my previous posts that I'm active in the large deaf community in MN. I cannot think of a single time that I've encountered a deaf person bashing ASL. Not even once. Hmm.
 
AlleyCat said:
I'm puzzled by this thread. Most of you know from my previous posts that I'm active in the large deaf community in MN. I cannot think of a single time that I've encountered a deaf person bashing ASL. Not even once. Hmm.
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Richard Roehm
 
AlleyCat said:
I'm puzzled by this thread. Most of you know from my previous posts that I'm active in the large deaf community in MN. I cannot think of a single time that I've encountered a deaf person bashing ASL. Not even once. Hmm.
Click to expand...

SilenceGold
 
posts from hell said:
So your little one as of now is getting no formal education about ASL?
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It's an ASL-based school. She's getting a formal education IN ASL, not about it. They don't currently have a class subject called "ASL" in the PreK or K curriculum. But then, there's no English or Math at that level either :) . ASL is the primary language of nearly every, if not every child at the school.

As you said, ASL is not being formally taught nationwide as are other languages. But Gallaudet's Clerc Center and the consortium, including TLC, is working to change that.
 
AlleyCat said:
I'm puzzled by this thread. Most of you know from my previous posts that I'm active in the large deaf community in MN. I cannot think of a single time that I've encountered a deaf person bashing ASL. Not even once. Hmm.
Click to expand...

The people I mentioned in the OP did not bash ASL until I asked. That's why I was shocked. Ever asked anyone what they thought about ASL vs SEE vs whatever?
 
Daredevel7 said:
The people I mentioned in the OP did not bash ASL until I asked. That's why I was shocked. Ever asked anyone what they thought about ASL vs SEE vs whatever?
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Umm, yeah, I made that mistake here on this forum. Didn't realize SEE was a bad word until then :) .
 
Daredevel7 said:
The people I mentioned in the OP did not bash ASL until I asked. That's why I was shocked. Ever asked anyone what they thought about ASL vs SEE vs whatever?
Click to expand...

Yup. I take the pleasure of opening the curtains to the light for some people, and watching them grow from a seedling.
 
AlleyCat said:
Ok, I get your points. I take what I read here by those people with a grain of salt, somewhat. I was talking about real-life encounters with deaf people -- in that I haven't ever met someone personally that bashes ASL.
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:) The seedling I was talking about... Theres one I had in mind when I typed that up - one of my closest friends... First met him, dude was SEE hardcore, and told me that ASL was worthless. I still remember the drive down Arapahoe, him shaking his head just before Jalinos pizza then I explain to him how concepts worked in ASL - planting the seed there. I remember feeling good about it. Now it's all hands off and LOOK OUT bro!
 
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