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Old 04-20-2008, 07:44 AM   #61 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by deafdyke View Post
loml,
actually what I meant is that Cued Speech is more of a visual Hooked on Phonics approach. I didn't mean that CS and the VP system were the same.
I still don't understand how it teaches syntax and grammer.
It doesn't. Nor does it convey concept.

While VP and CS may be different systems, (just as SEE1 and SEE2 are different systems, but both are still MCEs with the same goal), they still have as their intent the same goal. To make visual the phonetic components of spoken language.
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Old 04-20-2008, 12:20 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by deafdyke View Post
loml,
actually what I meant is that Cued Speech is more of a visual Hooked on Phonics approach. I didn't mean that CS and the VP system were the same.
I still don't understand how it teaches syntax and grammer.
deafdyke - I really want to provide you an answer. Would you please explain to me, with regard to the content of my post # 52 , where I lost answering the question.

Thanks.
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-20-2008, 02:50 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loml View Post
Cloggy - Thanks for the zipped file. May I copy and distribute?
Of course... you want more?
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:00 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DragonYoga View Post
.........veryone - Jillio NEVER said Sign is the only viable option. She is asking for hard, concrete proof that she can't argue.
..........
Funny....
I was asking for some articles / papers that show some negative aspects of Cued Speech..

It is still very quite from her side of the bubble.... guess it's not possible to find anything, so the only way to dismiss CS is to reject any information...

Way to go !!
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:04 PM   #65 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by owen06 View Post
......... what Cloggy was so kind to provide to you was not a comprehensive list.....
The list is limited to english, dutch and Norwegian papers and articles....

Imagine looking through Spanish, French, Swiss, and many other languages....
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:43 PM   #66 (permalink)
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The list is limited to english, dutch and Norwegian papers and articles....

Imagine looking through Spanish, French, Swiss, and many other languages....
Yes, imagine. Maybe you could actually find some research there.
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:46 PM   #67 (permalink)
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Of course... you want more?
You got more? Because what you posted previously is useless. Refer back to post #32.
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Old 04-20-2008, 03:49 PM   #68 (permalink)
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Funny....
I was asking for some articles / papers that show some negative aspects of Cued Speech..

It is still very quite from her side of the bubble.... guess it's not possible to find anything, so the only way to dismiss CS is to reject any information...

Way to go !!
As I have stated previously, the question is not whether it has negative effects, although if it serves to delay language, as in an oral only nevironment, then of course there is a negative. The question is, whether it has been supported through empirical evidence to be beneficial.
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Old 04-20-2008, 05:45 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Cloggy View Post
Of course... you want more?

cloggy - Absolutely, if it not too much trouble. I am always happy to include research from Europe!
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-20-2008, 06:43 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by loml View Post
DragonYoda - Wouldn't it be wonderful to see all research meet the needs of all imagined/needed parameters! Perhaps you can/should discuss your envisioned research with the Board of Directors of your program that you are currently enrolled in.

Keep us posted!


I'll take it up with the Department of Deaf Education this week, if I can get ahold of them. It's Finals Week, so it will be difficult. I will post whatever they say, verbatim, including any research they know of.
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Old 04-20-2008, 06:56 PM   #71 (permalink)
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I'll take it up with the Department of Deaf Education this week, if I can get ahold of them. It's Finals Week, so it will be difficult. I will post whatever they say, verbatim, including any research they know of.
DragonYoda - Thank you.
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-20-2008, 07:05 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by loml View Post
DragonYoda - Thank you.
slight correction - however hilarious I think it is - it's dragonyoGa not yoDa.
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Old 04-20-2008, 07:07 PM   #73 (permalink)
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slight correction - however hilarious I think it is - it's dragonyoGa not yoDa.
So much for the infallibility of a visual representation of an oral language!
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Old 04-20-2008, 07:14 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DragonYoga View Post
slight correction - however hilarious I think it is - it's dragonyoGa not yoDa.

My apologies!
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-21-2008, 04:12 AM   #75 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jillio View Post
You got more? Because what you posted previously is useless. Refer back to post #32.
Interesting, your urge to reply on any post... even those not directed to you...
You can't help it I guess...
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Old 04-21-2008, 10:36 AM   #76 (permalink)
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Interesting, your urge to reply on any post... even those not directed to you...
You can't help it I guess...
Hmmmm....pot calling the kettle black?
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Old 04-24-2008, 09:18 AM   #77 (permalink)
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deafdyke - I really want to provide you an answer. Would you please explain to me, with regard to the content of my post # 52 , where I lost answering the question.

Thanks.

deafdyke - Still hoping that you will answer this.
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-24-2008, 12:35 PM   #78 (permalink)
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WOW!!! What was the topic of this thread again??
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Old 04-26-2008, 08:01 PM   #79 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DragonYoga
Quote:
If Jillio is asking for proof, FIND the type of research she is asking for, WITH American academic criteria - that is what she is asking for, NOT articles, summaries, etc.


I have always been led to believe that a longitudal study was over the course of YEARS, with a large pool of participants who meet certain criteria.

Since I'm in the middle of Final Exams at my college, I really don't have the time to find it, but if you can find it for me meeting this criteria:

Over the course of at least 5 years
Participants young prelingually Deaf and/or deafened soon after birth
At least 100 students in this study (more would be better)

The question I want this study to answer is: Does CS help with reading literacy better than any other modes of communication?

If you guys can find that for me, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!

Originally Posted by loml
Quote:
DragonYoda - Wouldn't it be wonderful to see all research meet the needs of all imagined/needed parameters! Perhaps you can/should discuss your envisioned research with the Board of Directors of your program that you are currently enrolled in.

Keep us posted!
Originally Posted by DragonYoga
Quote:
I'll take it up with the Department of Deaf Education this week, if I can get ahold of them. It's Finals Week, so it will be difficult. I will post whatever they say, verbatim, including any research they know of.

DragonYoga - Any developments on your end about this?

Thanks.
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-27-2008, 02:42 PM   #80 (permalink)
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You know.....I just thought of something. Cued Speech is basicly Visual Phonetics. How does phonetics teach syntax, grammar etc? People who learn another language as their second languag, don't nessarily have issues with pronounication etc.....it's more the syntax and grammar.
Originally post by loml
Quote:
deafdyke - Firstly CS is not basically Visual Phonics.

For example, cueing with an infant: all the phonemes are received visually and depending on the level of hearing loss auditorally.

Let me provide for you the linguistic definition of phoneme, from: phoneme - Definitions from Dictionary.com


Quote:
pho·neme/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[foh-neem] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –noun Linguistics.
any of a small set of units, usually about 20 to 60 in number, and different for each language, considered to be the basic distinctive units of speech sound by which morphemes, words, and sentences are represented. They are arrived at for any given language by determining which differences in sound function to indicate a difference in meaning, so that in English the difference in sound and meaning between pit and bit is taken to indicate the existence of different labial phonemes, while the difference in sound between the unaspirated p of spun and the aspirated p of pun, since it is never the only distinguishing feature between two different words, is not taken as ground for setting up two different p phonemes in English.


The person who is cueing provides the phonemes of spoken language, (using English as the example through out this post), as a stream of sound rhythmically, using the syntax and grammar of English.

For example:

"Are you enjoying you weather today?"

I would cue to you the phonemes of those exact words in that exact order, even raising my eyebrows. Cueing is done with prosody (stress and intonation) and expression.

I am not a neuroscientist and cannot explain to you the precise pathways or science involved, BUT, for a person who is profoundly deaf and they are receiving phonemes of English via CS, in conjunction with the mouth shapes, this information is processed in the auditory "cortex" of the brain. People who are deaf, and have been raised consistently with an accurate model of phoneme cues for communication, language and literacy develop "inner voices". This has been described to me, (in discussion with adults, with profound hearing loss, who have used cueing as their primary familial communication) when asked for clarification of what exactly this means for them, simply as "hearing the words”. I find this absolutely amazing!


Does this explanation answer you question:
Quote:
How does phonetics teach syntax, grammar etc?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deafdyke
loml,
actually what I meant is that Cued Speech is more of a visual Hooked on Phonics approach. I didn't mean that CS and the VP system were the same.
I still don't understand how it teaches syntax and grammer.



Originally posted by loml
Quote:
deafdyke - I really want to provide you an answer. Would you please explain to me, with regard to the content of my post # 52 , where I lost answering the question.

Thanks.
deafdyke - What are you comments on this please. We can discuss in p.m. if you wish. Thank cue.
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....Cued Speech has substantial data showing that it enables deaf children to attain competency in English at the level of hearing students grade by grade. I know of no other system that enables this to happen.... As more and more young deaf persons achieve academically because of this system, deaf leaders will need to re-examine their options.
- Dr. Edward C. Merrill, Jr. past president of Gallaudet
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Old 04-27-2008, 09:02 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DragonYoga



Originally Posted by loml

Originally Posted by DragonYoga


DragonYoga - Any developments on your end about this?

Thanks.

Nope. She never answered. None of the faculty is there now, it's summer vacation. I'm hoping to swing by her office Monday next week and see if she's there. That's when summer classes begin.
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