Is it ok to force deafies learn Oral while cant force hearing ppl learn ASL - Page 2

Deaf Images · 05-19-2006, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Audiofuzzy

As for learning oral and learning ASL - I believe it should be two way street, families with deaf peeps should absolutely learn alphabet and signing as best as they can.
The deaf peeps will have an additional tool - oralism, to communicate with those who hardly ever come upon deaf people out there.

Fuzzy

Oralism is a false facade for audism!

Deaf Images · 05-19-2006, 11:20 AM

Hey Sweetmind! I am on your side. Screw them!

Be bold and continue using that term - audism!

Smiles

Liebling:-))) · 05-19-2006, 11:23 AM

wow, please read this link.

http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.ph...744#post262744

Quote:

5.) No bashing, flaming or harassing other participants. Period.
Even though we support freedom of speech, show some respect, use common sense, and keep an open mind when participating in discussions.

Fragmenter · 05-19-2006, 11:34 AM

Where's the BAN smiley?

I can spout off insults to Sweetmind but I don't because I respect and follow the AD member rules. I don't know how she's still a member here when she insults oralism and the hearing people.

Roadrunner, we support you.

sr171soars · 05-19-2006, 11:49 AM

My, my, my...what tempers and indignation!

What part of RR's statement about "no bashing, no flames and no harassing" did you not understand?

RR said it succinctly and straight to the point and as a moderator he has the right to point this out. It has nothing to do with freedom of speech. There are stipulations (about what you can and can't do) that you agree to when joining AD and it specifically points out what RR warned against.

You can have your insular world that is a dead end. The rest of us are working on building better relationships.

rockdrummer · 05-19-2006, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetmind

First of all I like to say all moderators should be neutral and have no right to attack me for my freedom of speech with respect. After all you dont do anything about those people who namecalled, used bigotry remarks, and try to stop me from what I strongly believe in for Deaf children and forget those Deaf chlidren s "alternative" needs in my own true feelings. I m not going to keep my mouth shut forever as you want me to stop saying those "audism. AUDISM is NOT the term of being dirty or nasty or disrespectful words. And If it is not an "audist attitude" then what is it?

It is your issue not mine.. I should not have to stop because you said so. I feel like I am being treated like a child...dont say this or that..etc...That's even reminds of influences by audism people. You should be moderating others that need to be straightened up with their nasty attitudes and off the topics. It would be the "christian" thing to do.

And you are destroying his topic that is very good to ask the question. I agree with someone and add my true experiences it doesnt seem wrong for me to say. Sighs, my apologies to Casperman about this action that I have stated in my strength to tell the truth.

Other thing is that I do not want to say HEARING ITSELF that doesnt mean all of them are audism people if you mind.. I m only saying those audism people (that could be deaf or hearing) who have had done it for years and years up to today.

It hasnt been changing much, it seems like you don't even see the truth in Deaf community that I was involved with two jobs that relate to Deaf children/adults with or without multiple disabilities. They are having a very low self esteem or miserable for not having any communication with their parents in their home or at group homes. They are so lonely because they dont sign or know very very little signs. JEEZ! It doesnt have to be this way since they build this "barrier" to disabled people. They created an illusion that we disabled people are incapable to do anything, it s so ironic because hearing and deaf people happens to be incapable in some ways, too.

Thats why there is always ignorance and arrogance running through their blood. Of course,they are nowhere near as fully openminded as they claimed to be.

I want hearing people and whoever reading to know that doesnt mean I pointed at them if you mind.. I want them to see the reason why I said it many times.. I can see one of them who said he/she couldnt believe that the parents dont sign to their Deaf children. This is person who opened his/her eyes and realized it.. Thats how people learn from their mistakes or ignore our true struggles by audism people. It is hard for the kid who cannot hear or talk.

I am so grateful that I took my responsibility to have a good communication with my HEARING children in ASL because I do not want them to go through what I went through if you mind. Also I am so grateful hearing people with a positive attitude who were prepared to learn ASL before their båby is born. This baby is not deaf but hearing so tell me why the parents learn ASL? Why cant we deaf children have that too?

And also I am one woman team.

It s way too much overgeneralization of culturally egocentric hearing version. You were influeneced by audism. we all have a serious problem with ADA and our Deaf children that put them isolated or being separated from us Deaf people/Deaf community that seems it goes back to old days. You sit around and do nothing.. I cannot do it alone after all I m so sick of people s complaints about how they treat us deafies. So what can you do about it? I cannot do it alone and need to have more support to have our equal rights for all of us deafies. These Deaf children cannot even speak and they cant help it...They are smart. They shouldnt be left out and treated like failures due to no communication. That isnt fair! Also some Deaf children dont want to lipread because of the struggle no matter if they have devices...their choice...no more controlling! Deaf children have the right to use their hands and no one can stop them.

Thank you and, have a good life!
Sweetmind

I can see your point in that awareness will invoke change. I have said in other posts that I think the deaf community should have some leadership and a common goal. That goal IMO should be awareness and education about deaf issues. In order to succeed, that leadership has to be objective and open to all aspects of the deaf condition. Not just ASL, SE, HA, CI or oral but an openess to all including consideration for the psycological imipact that isolation has on a person. The leadership shouold promote education on all of these things and support freedom of choice as to which method an individual chooses. The goal is to reduce the audism through education and awareness. As far as parents making decisions for their children, I would imagine that this education and awareness would weigh into that. I agree that the medical community will be bias towards medical devices and technology and could sway a parents decision but general awareness will provide them more opportunities to factor in the deaf issues. I am not disagreeing with you Sweetmind, I'm just offering my take on this. As far as choosing words, as long as the discussion remains respectful you should be free to choose whatever word you like. I served this country for our freedoms. The last thing I want is someone trampling on my rights to freedom of speech.

Rose Immortal · 05-19-2006, 11:54 AM

AD is basically private property--Alex's website--and you are like guests in his home. The First Amendment doesn't really apply within the confines of somebody's home, nor does it apply in a forum, because both are private property and the government can't trample on the owner's right to control it. Alex can set whatever ground rules he wants and the mods have every right to enforce them whether or not you agree with them.

Example: if you grow up in a home where you don't take your shoes off when you enter, but you go over to the house of someone who DOES require everyone to take their shoes off, what do you do? You take off your shoes even if you think it's stupid. Same thing when it comes to following rules in a forum. Either you do it or if you think the rule is so stupid or improper that you won't compromise on it, you leave.

rockdrummer · 05-19-2006, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rose Immortal

AD is basically private property--Alex's website--and you are like guests in his home. The First Amendment doesn't really apply within the confines of somebody's home, nor does it apply in a forum, because both are private property and the government can't trample on the owner's right to control it. Alex can set whatever ground rules he wants and the mods have every right to enforce them whether or not you agree with them.

Example: if you grow up in a home where you don't take your shoes off when you enter, but you go over to the house of someone who DOES require everyone to take their shoes off, what do you do? You take off your shoes even if you think it's stupid. Same thing when it comes to following rules in a forum. Either you do it or if you think the rule is so stupid or improper that you won't compromise on it, you leave.

I'm sorry, but I don't agree that this is like someone's home... You are right in that the owners can set the rules. But in a true open forum you don't want to take away that openness. Otherwise you will lose membership to sites that allow for freedome of speach. IMO. Being disrespectful and threatening or harrassing others is a completly different issue. I am talking about the freedom to choose your words as long as you remain respectful to others. And if someone is lashing back at another for their not being respectful, then there should be consideration for that. After we are humans and our knee jerk response to insults would be to fire back. If you want a site that limits your freedoms and your ability to react as a human, then you really don't have an open forum.

Liebling:-))) · 05-19-2006, 12:22 PM

I hope my post make sense. Please answer if you agree to disagree with me...

Deaf parents send their deaf children to oral school because deaf parents expose their children with sign language.

Hearing parents send their deaf children to deaf school because deaf children need to learn where they come from and hearing parents need to learn sign and train their deaf children with speak sometimes.

If I have deaf children then I would send my deaf children to deaf school including speech therapy. I know what I'm saying because my hubby went to oral school. He told me that it's stress for him to consider teacher's lip all the time to "neglect" his education. If I want to learn something, it's easy for me to understand and learn quickly what my teacher sign to us.

The same school, my hubby went turn into deaf school. They are able sign now. The hearing parents of deaf children protest. We have separate school for deaf and hard of hearing here in Germany. It's parent's decision if they want oral school then put them to hard of hearing school.

Rose Immortal · 05-19-2006, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockdrummer

I'm sorry, but I don't agree that this is like someone's home... You are right in that the owners can set the rules. But in a true open forum you don't want to take away that openness. Otherwise you will lose membership to sites that allow for freedome of speach. IMO. Being disrespectful and threatening or harrassing others is a completly different issue. I am talking about the freedom to choose your words as long as you remain respectful to others. And if someone is lashing back at another for their not being respectful, then there should be consideration for that. After we are humans and our knee jerk response to insults would be to fire back. If you want a site that limits your freedoms and your ability to react as a human, then you really don't have an open forum.

And in that case there's the choice to go somewhere else. I'm not saying what policies I do and don't disagree with, but simply that the admin has the right to decide and it's the choice of a person posting to either deal with the rules or leave. I've left forums both for being too restrictive AND for being too open, but I recognized that it was my own value judgment and I had no right to tell the admin what to do, nor to insult or harass the posters who liked things the way they were. I have my ideas about how I like things, but I don't want to push them on anybody. If I do hit my limits, I just leave quietly.

rockdrummer · 05-19-2006, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rose Immortal

And in that case there's the choice to go somewhere else. I'm not saying what policies I do and don't disagree with, but simply that the admin has the right to decide and it's the choice of a person posting to either deal with the rules or leave. I've left forums both for being too restrictive AND for being too open, but I recognized that it was my own value judgment and I had no right to tell the admin what to do, nor to insult or harass the posters who liked things the way they were. I have my ideas about how I like things, but I don't want to push them on anybody. If I do hit my limits, I just leave quietly.

Agreed. I guess the point I was trying to make is that this is more like being on someones place of business and not necessarly their home. In a place of business the owner reserves the right to decide what is and what is not appropriate. And yes, if the members (or customers) don't like it, they have the choice to go elsewhere.

Audiofuzzy · 05-19-2006, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Oralism is a false facade for audism!

did you read everything else I wrote, horse with blinders on?

Fuzzy

Sweetmind · 05-19-2006, 04:09 PM

I find this is odd, I have been noticing we do have a huge problem with audism people and oral method rules that caused the problem for Deaf community you dont have any respect for Deaf chlidren s generation true identity and American Sign Language that we Deaf community fought so hard since Alexander G.Bell took over native sign language as evolved into American Sign Language that Laurent Clerc from France who was a First Deaf teacher that taught Native sign language and Signed English in a big time. He learned English langauge from Thomas Gallaudet who appointed him to be the first Deaf teacher in American School for the Deaf.
Now See they worked together to make the difference that is proven. I would love to tell the stories but you know the rest of it. Where are these Deaf teachers nowadays?? Not many!! Too much sticky political issues from this society.

Now it s proven that there is a very serious problem that still goes on and on and on since they only look at one side of orally speaking and spoken language that relates to SEE or CUED SPEECH or others that is the artificial languages as always. Why destroy our ASL from the start that works for us all. That is not necessary for Hearing people took over our Deaf Education that they have no knowledge of our Deafness/Deaf culture/ASL itself. They kept pushing us to have those devices so Can you see most of Deaf people dont hear everything? Can you see many Deaf children are lost without ASL? Can you see many Deaf people 's battle because of their perceptive of negative term Deaf.

"Deaf is no good" "ASL is no good" "Deaf cant cant cant" "Deaf must do what people want them to do in their hearing ways" So what is that all about? Dont you realize it works for Deaf children to gain their intellectual skills and social skills from the beginning of life? Give them a chance and be ourselves as a Deaf people.. Why cant we being ourselves from the start? it s always something that goes for hearing people before us Deaf people s need while it s our true language and Deaf languages from all over Deaf community in this Diversity World. We are not allowed to be deaf or show our hands, It is a real language. That works so well for us thats why we welcome hearing people to sign also with our gift of appreciation we are welcoming them with open arms and it is the opposite with the hearing community..we are only welcomed if we Speak or Hear. That, I feel, is very degrading and thoughtless. Why does it have to be that way...why cant this problem be solved? We are not accepted as we are to this day with both sides...why? I like both deaf and hearing, whom I always support to enter into the deaf community...deaf audist and hearing audists are fighting with us...why? they act like deaf people are inferior. Are you ashamed of yourself? Well I am NOT.

It has not solved any problems. Now you can see why many of us deafies couldnt hear everything with both devices. Why does it have to force/ conform children to be a Hearing person that has not solved the problem.

Dont you get it! Deaf community did give our gifted appreciation to share our true languages that nowadays hearing people and the innocent Deaf people are taking it and want to communicate with us all along that is two way of street after all I m seeing and showing the evidence of audism attitudes behaviors toward me, deafies, and Deaf (deaf/hearing) Leaders that has not being stopped. So I just dont understand this anymore. If they cannot handle themselves by being deaf then why do they have to be here in Deaf community if they dont like it. We did not hold them back after all. Is that something??

Now I am really happy to see more and more people learn ASL and wants to interact with the Deaf people of Deaf Community. That's a UNITY in a Diverse World. I know it s very hard on you after all I pointed that out that is not happy stories all the time. I dont feel guilty to tell the whole truth because I want ATTITUDE to change for the better if you let it happens. New generation people are seeing the truth and dont want to be the one of those Austim people that I am looking forward to it. That's all to it!

Audism people keep on destroying our Deaf children and people of Deaf community that we are still battling our equal rights. Everything turns out very destructive power over a very stupid reason to force us that you want us to do for your sakes not for our sakes. ADA doesnt apply for the Deaf people in many ways. Thats why I pointed that out that we Deaf people 's equal rights to have American Sign Language.

Thats the truth of our Deafness that will never be solved. That's it! It s too much complication or having so much conflict interest from hearing person's control and power that is very negative audism people. It needs to be stopped using their excuses/lies about us and our deafness to make $$$$$ that belongs to Deaf community. That's all to it.

Also, I m disappointed that all those terms of Deaf turned out the term of Hearing with any accessories/ necessities that turns me off. Hearing is not Deaf but we are the Deaf people of the Deaf community as always. Thats what I am seeing that they take take take and become rich that is not right to pretend they did for us, Deaf people. Thats belong to Deaf community that Deaf Inventors did in the past that make a big difference for today's that share with Hearing/Latened Deaf people.

I am so thankful to have Deaf community because we Deaf people want to be ourselves being deaf and use their hands to communicate anytime. It is still not acceptable of us being deaf that seems forever. It needs to be stop abuse that is old old news hasnt disappear yet. We want to prove that we can do it without depending on devices that will change the whole picture between Hearing and Deaf like Martha Vineyard. I believe that we are capable to speak as much as we can, in our choices, too

I think it s possible and will making the big difference. My point is that it s not necessary to change person for not who he/she is or have an Attitude toward Deaf people 's abilities.

If oralism were never exists, then it wont be a problem as I strongly believe because people are doing it for the money on purpose. Some people with a very positive attitude are educated for a good reason to help others to understand about us.

I thought we want to work together but we are not working for you and doing it for you. We Deaf people wants to work (with) you however we refused to work (for) you.

Thats what it s all about of having the Diverse World that all kinds of people can live in altogether. Deaf people are people, no matter what!

Think hard and Think twice. I want you to see what 's wrong with this picture nowadays.

Thank you!

Sweetmind

PS: I copied and edited it in here from my topic of Evidence of being deaf with HA.

Cloggy · 05-19-2006, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetmind

..................
It has not solved any problems. Now you can see why many of us deafies couldnt hear everything with both devices. Why does it have to force/ conform children to be a Hearing person that has not solved the problem.
...............

How many of you deafies have tried both devices.... I assume HA and CI.
Please Sweetmind... How many??

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetmind

..................
PS: I copied and edited it in here from my topic of Evidence of being deaf with HA.

Thank goodness.... I thought I had another Deja-Vu!!

gnulinuxman · 05-20-2006, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fragmenter

Where's the BAN smiley?

I can spout off insults to Sweetmind but I don't because I respect and follow the AD member rules. I don't know how she's still a member here when she insults oralism and the hearing people.

Roadrunner, we support you.

Then why have you spouted off insults to me?

But that is

here...

I just want to stay out of the flame war.

I do agree with Sweetmind and Deaf Images here, but I am staying out of the flaming.

How many times do I have to tell you guys that Sweetmind isn't against hearing people?! She doesn't hate us.

Sweetmind insults hearing people? Gee, I didn't know that, and I read all her posts.... Why don't I feel insulted by her?

Fragmenter · 05-20-2006, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnulinuxman

Then why have you spouted off insults to me?

They were personal insults

Roadrunner and I have already discussed about that and I will refrain from hurting your fweelings from now on

Sweetmind · 05-20-2006, 10:32 AM

I have to say Casperman is not a ASL extremist because he knows the truth and of being openmind by him and his Deaf family / relatives. I respect him and his families all the way.

Thanks!

Sweetmind

Oceanbreeze · 05-20-2006, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetmind

I have to say Casperman is not a ASL extremist because he knows the truth and openminded by him and his Deaf family / relatives. I respect him all the way.

That's good of him. However, extremes at either end isn't good for society. As a hearing person, I have to say I totally disagree with you, Sweetmind. Not only are you wrong, but you're offensive as well. Not only to me, but I'm sure to others. I've already stated this elsewhere, but I would absolutely do my very best to make a deaf person feel comfortable around me. This includes learning ASL if I have to. However, I also feel it's only fair that a deaf person do what's necessary to make *me* feel comfortable around them as well. It's a two-way street. How can we ever forge a common ground if we're always at extremes? It'll never work.

Sweetmind · 05-20-2006, 11:33 AM

I once called ASL extremists or ASL PROS by audism people / Deaf activist /NESMUTH if you mind. I am far from it since I m actually deaf oralist for years and years..

NOW I m called myself Deaf and use my hands that you couldnt handle it. I quit wearing HA because hearing community doesnt accept me completely after all I worked so hard to learn how to speak however, I COULDNT HEAR everything if you mind.

Oceanbreeze, you are hearing and dont get it. I know what I am talking about since I was dealing with that stages from HOH to Deaf. Thanks!

THANK YOU!

Sweetmind

SxyPorkie · 05-20-2006, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GalaxyAngel

~Thanks!

COOL CAT... I love this pix of cat flipping LOL... I thought it is real cute...

SxyPorkie

gnulinuxman · 05-20-2006, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetmind

I once called ASL extremists or ASL PROS by audism people / Deaf activist /NESMUTH if you mind. I am far from it since I m actually deaf oralist for years and years..

NOW I m called myself Deaf and use my hands that you couldnt handle it. I quit wearing HA because hearing community doesnt accept me completely after all I worked so hard to learn how to speak however, I COULDNT HEAR everything if you mind.

Oceanbreeze, you are hearing and dont get it. I know what I am talking about since I was dealing with that stages from HOH to Deaf. Thanks!

THANK YOU!

Sweetmind

See guys? She's not against oralism! She's just saying it's so much harder than signing.

Audiofuzzy · 05-20-2006, 04:31 PM

Quote:

See guys? She's not against oralism! She's just saying it's so much harder than signing.

That would be fine except she does that by calling anyone who dare to suppose that oralism can be a good thing - an AUDIST!!!!
where is the logic ???

Fuzzy

Rose Immortal · 05-20-2006, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Audiofuzzy

That would be fine except she does that by calling anyone who dare to suppose that oralism can be a good thing - an AUDIST!!!!
where is the logic ???

Fuzzy

That and automatically casting hearing people as evil or stupid. That gets old fast.

SB_GB_4ever · 05-20-2006, 07:19 PM

05-19-2006, 11:20 AM	#32 (permalink)
Deaf Images STAMP OUT AUDISM! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: in a town that has a pull tab Posts: 173 Blog Entries: 1	Sweetmind: I am on your side - screw them! Hey Sweetmind! I am on your side. Screw them! Be bold and continue using that term - audism! Smiles

05-19-2006, 11:34 AM	#34 (permalink)
Fragmenter wannabe redneck Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 823	Where's the BAN smiley? I can spout off insults to Sweetmind but I don't because I respect and follow the AD member rules. I don't know how she's still a member here when she insults oralism and the hearing people. Roadrunner, we support you. __________________ Please don't feed the Trolls. They are for your viewing entertainment only. Thank you.

05-19-2006, 12:22 PM	#39 (permalink)
Liebling:-))) My 3 darling princesses Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 27,059	I hope my post make sense. Please answer if you agree to disagree with me... Deaf parents send their deaf children to oral school because deaf parents expose their children with sign language. Hearing parents send their deaf children to deaf school because deaf children need to learn where they come from and hearing parents need to learn sign and train their deaf children with speak sometimes. If I have deaf children then I would send my deaf children to deaf school including speech therapy. I know what I'm saying because my hubby went to oral school. He told me that it's stress for him to consider teacher's lip all the time to "neglect" his education. If I want to learn something, it's easy for me to understand and learn quickly what my teacher sign to us. The same school, my hubby went turn into deaf school. They are able sign now. The hearing parents of deaf children protest. We have separate school for deaf and hard of hearing here in Germany. It's parent's decision if they want oral school then put them to hard of hearing school. __________________

05-19-2006, 04:09 PM	#43 (permalink)
Sweetmind Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 788	The concept of Deaf Community... I find this is odd, I have been noticing we do have a huge problem with audism people and oral method rules that caused the problem for Deaf community you dont have any respect for Deaf chlidren s generation true identity and American Sign Language that we Deaf community fought so hard since Alexander G.Bell took over native sign language as evolved into American Sign Language that Laurent Clerc from France who was a First Deaf teacher that taught Native sign language and Signed English in a big time. He learned English langauge from Thomas Gallaudet who appointed him to be the first Deaf teacher in American School for the Deaf. Now See they worked together to make the difference that is proven. I would love to tell the stories but you know the rest of it. Where are these Deaf teachers nowadays?? Not many!! Too much sticky political issues from this society. Now it s proven that there is a very serious problem that still goes on and on and on since they only look at one side of orally speaking and spoken language that relates to SEE or CUED SPEECH or others that is the artificial languages as always. Why destroy our ASL from the start that works for us all. That is not necessary for Hearing people took over our Deaf Education that they have no knowledge of our Deafness/Deaf culture/ASL itself. They kept pushing us to have those devices so Can you see most of Deaf people dont hear everything? Can you see many Deaf children are lost without ASL? Can you see many Deaf people 's battle because of their perceptive of negative term Deaf. "Deaf is no good" "ASL is no good" "Deaf cant cant cant" "Deaf must do what people want them to do in their hearing ways" So what is that all about? Dont you realize it works for Deaf children to gain their intellectual skills and social skills from the beginning of life? Give them a chance and be ourselves as a Deaf people.. Why cant we being ourselves from the start? it s always something that goes for hearing people before us Deaf people s need while it s our true language and Deaf languages from all over Deaf community in this Diversity World. We are not allowed to be deaf or show our hands, It is a real language. That works so well for us thats why we welcome hearing people to sign also with our gift of appreciation we are welcoming them with open arms and it is the opposite with the hearing community..we are only welcomed if we Speak or Hear. That, I feel, is very degrading and thoughtless. Why does it have to be that way...why cant this problem be solved? We are not accepted as we are to this day with both sides...why? I like both deaf and hearing, whom I always support to enter into the deaf community...deaf audist and hearing audists are fighting with us...why? they act like deaf people are inferior. Are you ashamed of yourself? Well I am NOT. It has not solved any problems. Now you can see why many of us deafies couldnt hear everything with both devices. Why does it have to force/ conform children to be a Hearing person that has not solved the problem. Dont you get it! Deaf community did give our gifted appreciation to share our true languages that nowadays hearing people and the innocent Deaf people are taking it and want to communicate with us all along that is two way of street after all I m seeing and showing the evidence of audism attitudes behaviors toward me, deafies, and Deaf (deaf/hearing) Leaders that has not being stopped. So I just dont understand this anymore. If they cannot handle themselves by being deaf then why do they have to be here in Deaf community if they dont like it. We did not hold them back after all. Is that something?? Now I am really happy to see more and more people learn ASL and wants to interact with the Deaf people of Deaf Community. That's a UNITY in a Diverse World. I know it s very hard on you after all I pointed that out that is not happy stories all the time. I dont feel guilty to tell the whole truth because I want ATTITUDE to change for the better if you let it happens. New generation people are seeing the truth and dont want to be the one of those Austim people that I am looking forward to it. That's all to it! Audism people keep on destroying our Deaf children and people of Deaf community that we are still battling our equal rights. Everything turns out very destructive power over a very stupid reason to force us that you want us to do for your sakes not for our sakes. ADA doesnt apply for the Deaf people in many ways. Thats why I pointed that out that we Deaf people 's equal rights to have American Sign Language. Thats the truth of our Deafness that will never be solved. That's it! It s too much complication or having so much conflict interest from hearing person's control and power that is very negative audism people. It needs to be stopped using their excuses/lies about us and our deafness to make $$$$$ that belongs to Deaf community. That's all to it. Also, I m disappointed that all those terms of Deaf turned out the term of Hearing with any accessories/ necessities that turns me off. Hearing is not Deaf but we are the Deaf people of the Deaf community as always. Thats what I am seeing that they take take take and become rich that is not right to pretend they did for us, Deaf people. Thats belong to Deaf community that Deaf Inventors did in the past that make a big difference for today's that share with Hearing/Latened Deaf people. I am so thankful to have Deaf community because we Deaf people want to be ourselves being deaf and use their hands to communicate anytime. It is still not acceptable of us being deaf that seems forever. It needs to be stop abuse that is old old news hasnt disappear yet. We want to prove that we can do it without depending on devices that will change the whole picture between Hearing and Deaf like Martha Vineyard. I believe that we are capable to speak as much as we can, in our choices, too I think it s possible and will making the big difference. My point is that it s not necessary to change person for not who he/she is or have an Attitude toward Deaf people 's abilities. If oralism were never exists, then it wont be a problem as I strongly believe because people are doing it for the money on purpose. Some people with a very positive attitude are educated for a good reason to help others to understand about us. I thought we want to work together but we are not working for you and doing it for you. We Deaf people wants to work (with) you however we refused to work (for) you. Thats what it s all about of having the Diverse World that all kinds of people can live in altogether. Deaf people are people, no matter what! Think hard and Think twice. I want you to see what 's wrong with this picture nowadays. Thank you! Sweetmind PS: I copied and edited it in here from my topic of Evidence of being deaf with HA. __________________ "Tell the mothers I said, "Don't try to change your child; you are the adult, you bear the burden of change" - Harlan Lane

05-20-2006, 10:32 AM	#47 (permalink)
Sweetmind Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 788	I have to say Casperman is not a ASL extremist because he knows the truth and of being openmind by him and his Deaf family / relatives. I respect him and his families all the way. Thanks! Sweetmind __________________ "Tell the mothers I said, "Don't try to change your child; you are the adult, you bear the burden of change" - Harlan Lane

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05-19-2006, 11:49 AM	#35 (permalink)
sr171soars Cyborg since March '05 Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 2,376	My, my, my...what tempers and indignation! What part of RR's statement about "no bashing, no flames and no harassing" did you not understand? RR said it succinctly and straight to the point and as a moderator he has the right to point this out. It has nothing to do with freedom of speech. There are stipulations (about what you can and can't do) that you agree to when joining AD and it specifically points out what RR warned against. You can have your insular world that is a dead end. The rest of us are working on building better relationships.

05-19-2006, 11:54 AM	#37 (permalink)
Rose Immortal Telepathic Spirit Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,254	AD is basically private property--Alex's website--and you are like guests in his home. The First Amendment doesn't really apply within the confines of somebody's home, nor does it apply in a forum, because both are private property and the government can't trample on the owner's right to control it. Alex can set whatever ground rules he wants and the mods have every right to enforce them whether or not you agree with them. Example: if you grow up in a home where you don't take your shoes off when you enter, but you go over to the house of someone who DOES require everyone to take their shoes off, what do you do? You take off your shoes even if you think it's stupid. Same thing when it comes to following rules in a forum. Either you do it or if you think the rule is so stupid or improper that you won't compromise on it, you leave.

05-20-2006, 11:33 AM	#49 (permalink)
Sweetmind Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 788	I once called ASL extremists or ASL PROS by audism people / Deaf activist /NESMUTH if you mind. I am far from it since I m actually deaf oralist for years and years.. NOW I m called myself Deaf and use my hands that you couldnt handle it. I quit wearing HA because hearing community doesnt accept me completely after all I worked so hard to learn how to speak however, I COULDNT HEAR everything if you mind. Oceanbreeze, you are hearing and dont get it. I know what I am talking about since I was dealing with that stages from HOH to Deaf. Thanks! THANK YOU! Sweetmind __________________ "Tell the mothers I said, "Don't try to change your child; you are the adult, you bear the burden of change" - Harlan Lane

05-20-2006, 07:19 PM	#54 (permalink)
SB_GB_4ever Howdy yall! Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 83