coronamoz

Currently in the process of learning ASL, I wish to pose a question:

In terms of communicating succintly and clearly, in everything from computer talk to Signed poetry, which of the aforementioned is superior in your opinion. Or do you often assimilate all three into your own sort of dialect when communicating with friends, family, etc? thank you all.

Deafness

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rjr2006

According to your question, most of deaf people use ASL, because it is their language since they live together. However, I believe that SEE would be the most preferred sign language, because my parents wanted me to read/write well at the higher level from SEE, and it works. I am doing very well in English...

Tousi

I think a more precise answer is that ASL is the most PREVALENT and maybe the stronger politically, not necessarily the most superior. THAT would open up a can of worms!

Steve

ASL is a language. SEE is a code. PSE is generally ASL in English order.

Steve

Miss-Delectable

Ahh, I've been wondering what PSE is! Now I know. The terps usually use PSE when interpreting for me at Uni. I do use PSE, but depending on whom I talk with. Mainly, it's ASL or AUSLAN for me.

SEE is a no-no for me as it's so slow and therefore ugly when you see it signed in motion.

When I communicate online or whatnot, I use proper English as it's the only way you can connect with people properly, and not leave them baffled when you use your dialect of all three.

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kuifje75

I believe that ASL is a true language, and that SEE is only a tool to use when teaching English in the school. Outside school, SEE really should have no use. Who cares about proper word ending when you already set the time and space in ASL conversations. Once you say "yesterday," there is no need to add "-ed" and so forth. I have been studying Vietnamese language and it follows this pattern. The verb never changes, because the time or adverb sets the time and space of the sentence. Some people think that ASL is a primitive language, but I don't agree. It would be like calling Vietnamese a primitive language as well, just because it doesn't follow the same grammar rules of a control language, such as English.

rjr2006

SEE is also very important for the deaf, because they need to communicate with hearing people, especially in the employment and higher education.

According to Vampyrox's post about deaf people and their English skills at NTID:

Source: http://www.alldeaf.com/deaf-education/11378-does-asl-teach-english.html

NTID is the part of RIT, deaf people from ALL DEAF K-12 Schools don't receive enough English skills to prepare for higher education and jobs. The world uses ENGLISH as a common language, but they may not realize that, and if deaf people want to get good English and future, SEE, getting education from mainstreamed schools, and being around with hearing people, is the only way.

kuifje75

I disagree that using SEE is the only way to be around hearing people. It's like saying that the only way to be around French people is to speak French in English word order? It would make no sense, and the French person will think that you don't know the language. Either speak English or French, and the French person will understand you better. I read and write 3 languages fluently, and know better than to use English word order in either French or German.

Examples:
ENGLISH: Yesterday, I saw the new car.
FRENCH: Hier j'ai vu la voiture nouvelle. (Yesterday, I saw the car new.)
GERMAN: Gestern sah ich das neues Auto. (Yesterday saw I the new car.)
Vietnamese: Hom qua tôi thâ'y xe ôtô mới. (Yesterday I see car new.)

Does the English transliteration make sense? I think it's stupid to use SEE in everyday conversations, because it's like going through transliterated conversations. Only use it in school for English classes, that's all.

Tousi

I thought the basic question was which system is the superior?

Margie

Most deaf use ASL cause they hard time with English.
They teach SEE so they can learn to read and write.
I use ASL, I don't use English anymore, unless I have to.
When I do my interpreting I use ASL only.
Margie

Reba

IMO, none of the choices is "superior". I believe each plays an important role in different settings.

Askjo

ASL is Deaf's native language. PSL is intelluctual Deaf's native language, but they tend to the ASL mostly. SEE is hearing people's sign language toward the deaf. SEE is hard for the Deaf to understand the communication.

When hearing people are qualified interpreters, they use the middle between ASL and PSL.

ASL is more conceptual for the Deaf to understand rathar than the details.

I agree with Reba that there is no superior. Any thoughts?

Lavender

ASL is for dumb deaf, LOL!!! I'm only joking. Anyway, hmm.. a lot of deaf ppl like asl only talking to deaf friends but for hoh likes Total Communication I think this is one superior even use this for public school becuz of very advance accurately English Language

Steve

TC is a philosophy. It's not a language (ASL/English) or even a code (SEE).
TC only means adjust communication style for each student's specific needs. TC is only used in schools and does not prepare a student for adult life.

Steve

Reba

The other problem is TC is often confused with simultaneous communication (sim-com). The terms are not interchangeable. Talking and signing at the same time is not Total Communication; it is more like "tangled" communication.

deafdyke

Not for me!!!! I remmy going to Big River and totally understanding 100% what was said, rather then only understanding a small percentage of what was said!

signer16

From what I'm learned, Total communication is when people sign PSE and speak English at the same time. Simultaneous communication is when one is signing ASL and speaking English at the same time, which is EXTREMELY difficult.
In Big River the signs and words didn't match word for word. The hearing actors, who signed for themselves, were signing pure ASL and voicing English at the same time, but this was after WEEKS of practicing a SCRIPT. I don't think it is ever possible to communicate in both languages with that kind of accuracy. Even CODA's, and deafies with very strong English can't do this.

sara1981

what is PSE?

im learning as ASL when i was little girls at ages 5 years old my parents taking me to learning ASL and my parents not good sign languages NEITHER! but im good sign languages!

but i never been taught as BSL (British Sign Languages) im wishes i would learn that BSL but im raise in American that why!

i read World deaf magazine that Princess Diana taught sign language to deaf children but she spelling lots im wishes i would use that book of British Sign Languages!

Sara Boyce

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Brian

sara1981 - PSE is short name for Pidgin Sign(ed) English. I believe PSE uses some ASL signs but in English form.

HiBluE01

I use ASL with deaf people, my mom and my brother,

HiBluE01

diehardbiker

ASL is still SUPERIOR, and even thouse who think signs SEE usually follows ASL rules and not even know it! I have seen plenty, enuff said.

shel90

As far as in the education environment goes, here is my take:

I see SEE useful as a teaching tool when teaching reading and writing but for learning new concepts, ASL is the language to use.

I use between ASL and PSE..I couldnt sign SEE in a conversation even if I tried. I only use it when modeling English to my students. I explain to my students that what I am about to sign is SEE so they will be aware of the differences. So far, it is working.

For those students who have a poor language foundation, they wouldnt be able to have any use for SEE so they need ASL to build their language foundation first.

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~Shel~

SkullChick

I sign PSE because I like this one the best I know how to sign SEE, and ASL but I don't really like the idea of ASL being taught as first language to children because in the most case it screw their english grammar and concepts up badly. So start them with PSE or SEE and teach them ASL later in life but keep them on learning, writing and reading so they stay on track and still write right I've seen it happen way too often that they could write pretty good and suddenly they transferred to deaf school and their writing and reading skill suddenly changed and sucked because its written in ASL grammar its frustrating to see it happens. So I think PSE is the way to go till someone's mature and intelligent enough to understand its way you sign not the way you write it to learn ASL.
Just my opinion.

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shel90

As a teacher, I see and was taught the complete opposite. Those who have a strong language foundation with ASL or spoken English are able to master written English. In my 5 years of teaching, I already see the differences. One boy who is in 1st grade is reading at 2nd grade level and he is from a deaf family who uses strong ASL at home.

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deafbajagal

I agree with Shel 110%. As a teacher, this is exactly what I've come to realize.

jillio

Exactly. A strong foundation in ASL actually increases the ability to transfer those skills into learning English as an L2 language.

deafskeptic

Although I am not a TOD, I agree with shel, deafbajagal and Jillio on this one.

I remember half of my AP English/history class at MSSD came from Deaf families and this included a deaf korean who was adopted by a PA Deaf family. I think only 2 prelinguals (I think) in that class came from hearing familes and the rest became deaf after age 3.

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