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Unread 12-21-2013, 07:28 PM   #1
Reba
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Senate votes to cut military retirement pensions

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Senate GOP fails in final bid to block military pension cuts in budget bill
Published December 18

A final effort by Senate Republicans to halt cuts to pensions of military retirees failed late Tuesday, after Democrats blocked an amendment to the controversial budget bill.

The two-year budget agreement, which cleared a key test vote earlier in the day, was expected to get a final vote no later than Wednesday.

Ahead of the final vote, Sen. Jeff Sessions, R-Ala., tried unsuccessfully to use a parliamentary tactic to force a vote on the amendment, which he wrote to undo the cuts for military retirees.

A provision in the already House-passed bill would cut retirement benefits for military retirees by $6 billion over 10 years.

Sessions wanted to instead eliminate an estimated $4.2 billion in annual spending by reining in an IRS credit that illegal immigrants have claimed.

He and fellow senators argued the bill unfairly sticks veterans and other military retirees with the cost of new spending.

“It’s not correct, and it should not happen,” Sessions said on the floor.

"By blocking my amendment, they voted to cut pensions for wounded warriors," he said afterwards. "Senators in this chamber have many valid ideas for replacing these pension cuts, including my proposal to close the tax welfare loophole for illegal filers, and all deserved a fair and open hearing. But they were denied.”

Sessions’ office claimed the vote Tuesday to block the amendment was a vote to "cut military pensions instead of cutting welfare for illegal immigrants."

Senate Budget Committee Chairman Patty Murray, D-Wash.,who brokered the budget deal with House counterpart Rep. Paul Ryan, R-Wis., argued the GOP effort was really an attempt to kill the entire bill.

The Republican-led House passed the bill last week in an effort to avoid another stalemate leading to a potential government shutdown, like the one in October that polls showed was largely unpopular with voters.

The two-year budget deal would ease for two years some of the harshest cuts to agency budgets required under automatic spending curbs commonly known as sequestration. It would replace $45 billion in scheduled cuts for the 2014 budget year already underway, easing about half of the scheduled cuts.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Senate GOP fails in final bid to block military pension cuts in budget bill | Fox News
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Unread 12-21-2013, 09:49 PM   #2
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That's unfortunate and federal employee's pension got hammered down under budget bill too. My father's military pension was more generous than newer service members because the congress changed the military pension about decade ago.

I want to end the corporate welfare, that most I care about.
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:02 PM   #3
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To end corporate welfare effectively means no more Republican Party. They live and breath corporate welfare. They personify it. They live it. They are it. It is a Party of corruption so complete that it staggers the mind to try and wrap all the way around it.
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:10 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by goodonya View Post
To end corporate welfare effectively means no more Republican Party. They live and breath corporate welfare. They personify it. They live it. They are it. It is a Party of corruption so complete that it staggers the mind to try and wrap all the way around it.
I don't think so and I believe democrats support corporate welfare as well.

Libertarians oppose corporate welfare and they want defense to be strictly to our country and doesn't want intervene with other countries, oppose any government-run pensions, oppose welfare for low income families, abolish most or all of taxes, doesn't support anti-discrimination for Americans with disabilities.
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:24 PM   #5
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Disabled military retirees not exempt from pension cuts in budget deal | Fox News
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:32 PM   #6
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How can you not see what the Republican Party does. Do you not understand the relationship between what they do and who benefits the most?
I am against at least half of what each Party does but I easily see what Republican politics is really about. The superrich who own them are ripping this country off like a monstrous sucking cluster of parasites and you cannot see it?
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:48 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by goodonya View Post
How can you not see what the Republican Party does. Do you not understand the relationship between what they do and who benefits the most?
What do you think you saw in this vote? What do you think they do? I know that this vote does not benefit military retirees and disabled members.

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I am against at least half of what each Party does but I easily see what Republican politics is really about. The superrich who own them are ripping this country off like a monstrous sucking cluster of parasites and you cannot see it?
Members of all parties are rich, so what does that prove?

Why should the military retirees suffer?
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Unread 12-21-2013, 10:57 PM   #8
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House Introduces Bill to Prevent Military Pension Cuts | Washington Free Beacon

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A bill introduced on Thursday in the House of Representatives would remove pension cuts to military retirees in the budget agreement passed this week and offset the fiscal difference by closing of a loophole that allows illegal immigrants to receive tax credits.

Reps. Mike Fitzpatrick (R., Pa.) and Martha Roby (R., Ala.) introduced H.R. 3788 to replace a controversial provision in the bipartisan budget deal that hits military retirees with a 1 percent decrease in their annual cost-of-living adjustment (COLA) but left civilian federal retirees untouched.
It looks like Fitzpatrick's bill probably won't be easy path in senate because it take a hard on illegal immigrants and democrats got support from latino voters.

The simple bill to restore the pension for disabled veterans without compromise may have a better chance to pass.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 12:55 AM   #9
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I'm wondering what else was in it. That's usually what happens. Somebody proposes a bill or amendment for one thing, but they tack on all kinds of nastiness onto it, and they when it doesn't pass because of all the crap that's in it they cry "they don't want the one thing"!!!
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Unread 12-22-2013, 08:51 AM   #10
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I wonder how many in the Senate are veterans.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 10:10 AM   #11
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I wonder how many in the Senate are veterans.
I doubt that this have any senators running to get food stamps.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 10:19 AM   #12
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I doubt that this have any senators running to get food stamps.
Or recruiting Marines.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 11:28 AM   #13
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We absolutely must protect the rich from paying higher taxes by giving up a portion of our pensions.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 11:55 AM   #14
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If the bill is passed, I think more people won't join the military once they hear about its cuts on retirees/disabled benefits. It will look bad on Congress. Right?
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Unread 12-22-2013, 12:21 PM   #15
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We absolutely must protect the rich from paying higher taxes by giving up a portion of our pensions.
Is that a joke?
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Unread 12-22-2013, 12:33 PM   #16
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If the bill is passed, I think more people won't join the military once they hear about its cuts on retirees/disabled benefits. It will look bad on Congress. Right?
Not really, military pension has been cut or reformed over time, to make less generous, but more people want to join the military.

The change in pension only affect newer veterans, not retired veterans like Reba and her husband, and my father.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 12:36 PM   #17
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Not really, military pension has been cut or reformed over time, to make less generous, but more people want to join the military.

The change in pension only affect newer veterans, not retired veterans like Reba and her husband, and my father.
Question; how long does one have to be active before retiring?
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Unread 12-22-2013, 12:43 PM   #18
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Question; how long does one have to be active before retiring?
20 years to qualify for military pension benefit.

but disabled veterans get severance pay if they are less than 20 years.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 01:26 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Foxrac View Post
20 years to qualify for military pension benefit.

but disabled veterans get severance pay if they are less than 20 years.


So we have three benefits for the military service members?

Veterans' benefits for those who were active for less than 20 years
Retirement benefits for those who retired after 20 years of service
Disabled benefits for those who became disabled while on active

One co-worker told me that if he died while on active, his life insurance (that is available for military service members only) would cover it, not the government. He had to buy the insurance. I said WTF?

Last edited by CrazyPaul; 12-22-2013 at 02:05 PM.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 01:50 PM   #20
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If the bill is passed, I think more people won't join the military once they hear about its cuts on retirees/disabled benefits. It will look bad on Congress. Right?
Possibly. It will certainly make careers in the military look less desirable.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 01:53 PM   #21
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Not really, military pension has been cut or reformed over time, to make less generous, but more people want to join the military.

The change in pension only affect newer veterans, not retired veterans like Reba and her husband, and my father.
It affects veterans under 62 years old. I'm 62 but TCS is 61. Most veterans who are medically retired from disabilities resulting from the war on terror are under age 62, so it will affect them unless a change is accepted on the bill.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 02:06 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Foxrac View Post
20 years to qualify for military pension benefit.

but disabled veterans get severance pay if they are less than 20 years.
If an active duty member retires after 20 years they get the lowest percentage pension. It is increased in increments up to 30 years. They can stay in longer than 30 years but the percentage of pension won't increase. That pension is taxed.

Medically retired veterans with less than 20 years service don't get a severance pay but get retirement pensions. I'm not sure of the formula for calculating the amount. Depending on the type of disability, an equivalent percentage of the retirement pension is not taxed.

Medically discharged veterans get a one-time transition pay out (maybe that's what you meant by severance pay). They don't get a monthly pension.

The difference between the medical categories requires going before lengthy involved medical boards for determination.

Also, for people who are reservists at the time they retire, they don't start collecting their pensions until age 60.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 02:21 PM   #23
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...One co-worker told me that if he died while on active, his life insurance (that is available for military service members only) would cover it, not the government. He had to buy the insurance. I said WTF?
That is SGLI (Servicemembers Group Life Insurance). It was created for military members because regular insurance companies wouldn't cover them due to the risk of combat.

The coverage and rates are reasonable.

Quote:
Coverage
SGLI coverage is available in $50,000 increments up to the maximum of $400,000. Covered members receive 120 days of free coverage from their date of separation. Coverage can be extended for up to two years if the Servicemember is totally disabled at separation. Part-time coverage is also provided to Reserve members who do not qualify for full-time coverage (members covered part-time do not receive 120 days of free coverage).

If you are totally disabled at the time of separation (unable to work), you can apply for the SGLI Disability Extension, which provides free coverage for up to two years from the date of separation. At the end of the extension period, you automatically become eligible for VGLI, subject to premium payments.

Cost/Rates
If you have SGLI coverage, you pay a monthly premium that is automatically deducted from your base pay. The current basic SGLI premium rate is 6.5 cents per $1,000 of insurance. The premium includes an additional $1.00 per month for Traumatic Injury Protection coverage (TSGLI).
Servicemembers Group Life Insurance (SGLI) - Life Insurance
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Unread 12-22-2013, 02:59 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by goodonya View Post
To end corporate welfare effectively means no more Republican Party. They live and breath corporate welfare. They personify it. They live it. They are it. It is a Party of corruption so complete that it staggers the mind to try and wrap all the way around it.
From CBS news 2010:
"While the economy has generally faltered over the past two years, congressional members actually saw their collective personal wealth increase by more than 16 percent between 2008 and 2009, according to the study, which analyzed financial disclosure data released earlier this year.

As many as 55 members had an average calculated wealth of $10 million or more in 2009, according to the Center.

According to the Center's estimates, the wealthiest member of Congress is Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.), whose holdings exceed $303.5 million. Rep Jane Harman (D-Calif.) is close behind with $293.4 million, and Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) rounds out the top three at $238.8 million.

Members of Congress are only required to report their wealth and liabilities in broad ranges, so the Center calculated each member's average estimated wealth by determining the minimum and maximum value of their assets. Additionally, federal financial disclosures don't require members of Congress to report certain assets such as personal residences.

The list of Congress' wealthiest members is bipartisan. In the House, five Democrats and five Republicans make up the 10 wealthiest members, while in the Senate, six Democrats and four Republicans make up the top 10.

The median wealth of a House member in 2009 stood at $765,010, while the median wealth for a senator in 2009 was nearly $2.38 million.

Members of the House and Senate made investments last year in a number of companies that have a strong presence on Capitol Hill, spending large sums on lobbying efforts and political donations. The most popular company among members of Congress, CRP found, was General Electric, in which 82 current members invested. The second most popular company was Bank of America, which 63 members invested in."

President Obama hired Jeffery Immelt (General Electric Chairman) to head the post of President’s Council on Jobs and Competitiveness.

From Forbes.com: "his company (GE) invests some of its resources abroad and, despite worldwide profits of $14.2 billion, paid no taxes in 2010." "GE is a major player in several industries that President Obama has been promoting as part of his administration’s cocksure embrace of industrial policy."

Tim Carney reports in the DC Examiner: First, there’s the policy overlap: Obama wants cap-and-trade, GE wants cap-and-trade. Obama subsidizes embryonic stem-cell research, GE launches an embryonic stem-cell business. Obama calls for rail subsidies, GE hires Linda Daschle [wife of former South Dakota Senator and Obama confidante Tom Dachle] (D-SD) as a rail lobbyist. Obama gives a speeeh, GE employee Chris Matthews feels a thrill up his leg. I could go on. Look at any major Obama policy initiative — healthcare reform, climate-change regulation, embryonic stem-cell research, infrastructure stimulus, electrical transmission smart-grids — and you’ll find GE has set up shop, angling for a way to pocket government handouts, gain business through mandates, or profit from government regulation."

I could list hundreds of like stories on either side. So your statements make no logical sense to me. The government is equally corrupt.
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Unread 12-22-2013, 05:54 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by TinCanSailor View Post
From CBS news 2010:
"While the economy has generally faltered over the past two years, congressional members actually saw their collective personal wealth increase by more than 16 percent between 2008 and 2009, according to the study, which analyzed financial disclosure data released earlier this year.

As many as 55 members had an average calculated wealth of $10 million or more in 2009, according to the Center.

According to the Center's estimates, the wealthiest member of Congress is Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.), whose holdings exceed $303.5 million. Rep Jane Harman (D-Calif.) is close behind with $293.4 million, and Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) rounds out the top three at $238.8 million.

Members of Congress are only required to report their wealth and liabilities in broad ranges, so the Center calculated each member's average estimated wealth by determining the minimum and maximum value of their assets. Additionally, federal financial disclosures don't require members of Congress to report certain assets such as personal residences.

The list of Congress' wealthiest members is bipartisan. In the House, five Democrats and five Republicans make up the 10 wealthiest members, while in the Senate, six Democrats and four Republicans make up the top 10.

The median wealth of a House member in 2009 stood at $765,010, while the median wealth for a senator in 2009 was nearly $2.38 million.

Members of the House and Senate made investments last year in a number of companies that have a strong presence on Capitol Hill, spending large sums on lobbying efforts and political donations. The most popular company among members of Congress, CRP found, was General Electric, in which 82 current members invested. The second most popular company was Bank of America, which 63 members invested in."

President Obama hired Jeffery Immelt (General Electric Chairman) to head the post of President’s Council on Jobs and Competitiveness.

From Forbes.com: "his company (GE) invests some of its resources abroad and, despite worldwide profits of $14.2 billion, paid no taxes in 2010." "GE is a major player in several industries that President Obama has been promoting as part of his administration’s cocksure embrace of industrial policy."

Tim Carney reports in the DC Examiner: First, there’s the policy overlap: Obama wants cap-and-trade, GE wants cap-and-trade. Obama subsidizes embryonic stem-cell research, GE launches an embryonic stem-cell business. Obama calls for rail subsidies, GE hires Linda Daschle [wife of former South Dakota Senator and Obama confidante Tom Dachle] (D-SD) as a rail lobbyist. Obama gives a speeeh, GE employee Chris Matthews feels a thrill up his leg. I could go on. Look at any major Obama policy initiative — healthcare reform, climate-change regulation, embryonic stem-cell research, infrastructure stimulus, electrical transmission smart-grids — and you’ll find GE has set up shop, angling for a way to pocket government handouts, gain business through mandates, or profit from government regulation."

I could list hundreds of like stories on either side. So your statements make no logical sense to me. The government is equally corrupt.
In bold, as non-conservative, you are not alone and I don't find his statement is logical sense.
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