Sorenson Video Phone Over HughesNet Gen4 or Exede Satellite Internet

ElDoradoSatellite

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Hello All,

We have a customer who cannot get standard, ground-based Internet (DSL, Cable, PTP Wireless, etc.) and he was interested in getting HughesNet Gen4 satellite Internet service if it could support a Sorenson Video Phone service he was considering purchasing.

In researching this subject, I came across this Forum and thought I would ask the Members here for any input you might share. I did find an older related topic here: http://www.alldeaf.com/showthread.php?t=108200 but the last post was well over one year ago. I thought that perhaps some Members might have had direct experience with this device over HughesNet Gen4 or Exede satellite Internet service since then.

Sorenson's official position is the their recommendation against using satellite was based on the older, lower-speed satellite Internet technologies (usually less than 1 Mbps down / 100 Kbps up). But the technician I spoke with there allowed that their service could work over newer satellite Internet technologies if the up and down speed was high enough. Gen4 advertises plans with up to 15 Mbps down and up to 2 Mbps up on their top plan. We've been seeing consistent speeds in our area on HughesNet's lower plans in the neighborhood of 10 Mbps down and 600 Kbps up. Latency (unavoidable over satellite) is around 6/10ths to 8/10ths of a second.

Have any Forum Members had any direct experience using Sorenson's Video Phone (or really anybody's similar products) over either HughesNet Gen4 or Exede satellite Internet service?

Thanks for your answers.

Best Regards,

Alan

Alan Thompson
Chief Technical Consultant
El Dorado Satellite
www.ElDoradoSatellite.com
 
Speed wasnt the primary issue, the primary issue is latency, even with blazing speed, satellite takes time to process the packets, the videophone used by Deaf is intensive real-time demand, meaning that with asl, the stream must be without any latency otherwise excessive freezes, I have seen enough as I used to work for Sorenson technical support. If they have solved the latency issues then its possible however no guarantees.
 
Its like driving on 100 miles road with 100mph speed limit, and there is red light in every intersections, how will the speeding going to get one arrive the destination in just an hour flat? 100mph is a speed, red light is latency.
 
Its like driving on 100 miles road with 100mph speed limit, and there is red light in every intersections, how will the speeding going to get one arrive the destination in just an hour flat? 100mph is a speed, red light is latency.
I totally get latency and it's effect on certain applications. But applications can be tuned to handle latency and also packet "jitter," another factor affecting service quality. For example, some VoIP applications work quite well over satellite Internet while others do not.

That's why I'm looking for input from any satellite Internet users who have direct experience with current products in the market. It doesn't have to be Sorenson.
 
Try run 3 or 4 VoIP application at same satelline line to see if u can get all of these calls same time and holding well? Videophone demands about 4 times more bandwidth than VoIP.
 
It happens over and over and over more often then I care to admit. I'm tired of explaining why there is choppy video, blurry, localized video when deaf try to use Sorenson, purple,zvrs, and convo on satellite internet. Look you will not have a happy customer after a awhile. Your best bet is to let them try it out for a month or more with no cancellation, termination fees.it will benefit both of you by being able to see for yourselves and document it.

Sent from my LG-LS980 using AllDeaf App mobile app
 
Appreciate that. Bandwidth is another issue.

We've tested Gen4 upload speeds on various systems and plans at anywhere from 600 Kbps to 1.8 mbps, and it does support streaming video. Sorenson's website is recommending 256 Kbps minimum.

Again, I'd sure like to hear from someone who's tried it on a Gen4 connection.
 
It happens over and over and over more often then I care to admit. I'm tired of explaining why there is choppy video, blurry, localized video when deaf try to use Sorenson, purple,zvrs, and convo on satellite internet. Look you will not have a happy customer after a awhile. Your best bet is to let them try it out for a month or more with no cancellation, termination fees.it will benefit both of you by being able to see for yourselves and document.
Agreed.

It wasn't clear to me... are you on a satellite Internet connection? If so, which one and what plan level? Thanks for your help.
 
I'm not on any sat network but I can tell you that I had several customers call me on a sat network. They were wild blue, huges, and couple others not coming to my mind at the moment. I always had a firewall issue or complaint that video was blurry and they blamed the video phones. The problem is, it uses video compression and its not ideal for any network since the deaf uses Sign language and it involves a great deal of movement on the screen causing the video be compressed as much it can with the upload stream. The buffering is never enough and its too live. The down stream video Decompression just cannot handle the latency. I'm sorry, there is nothing you can do unless you can provide the matrix on both customer end and satellite end to have Huge amount of self correction memory buffering hardware, but you and I know it doesn't exist at residential level.

Sent from my LG-LS980 using AllDeaf App mobile app
 
Thanks for that. I appreciate the input.

We may see if we can set up a test with our office system and see what happens. If it works, at both ends, I'll be sure to come back here and report.
 
Same thing here, got calls from customers using satellite dish, video freezes every approximately 10 seconds, very annoying.

Even though "Video streaming supported" is mentioned, it is NOT clearly whether it is meant for canned video or real time video. I would agree that its video stream because many of programs like Netflix, they download and canned before showing the video, usually takes a minute or two before the video starts, that is to compensate for latency issues though satellite, it is impossible to compensate anything with real time video.

I'm not on any sat network but I can tell you that I had several customers call me on a sat network. They were wild blue, huges, and couple others not coming to my mind at the moment. I always had a firewall issue or complaint that video was blurry and they blamed the video phones. The problem is, it uses video compression and its not ideal for any network since the deaf uses Sign language and it involves a great deal of movement on the screen causing the video be compressed as much it can with the upload stream. The buffering is never enough and its too live. The down stream video Decompression just cannot handle the latency. I'm sorry, there is nothing you can do unless you can provide the matrix on both customer end and satellite end to have Huge amount of self correction memory buffering hardware, but you and I know it doesn't exist at residential level.

Sent from my LG-LS980 using AllDeaf App mobile app
 
Thanks for that. I appreciate the input.

We may see if we can set up a test with our office system and see what happens. If it works, at both ends, I'll be sure to come back here and report.

I doubt it if you can get the Sorenson n touch for testing purposes. It's specifically given to those whose are deaf and hard of hearing and signs. Basically you have to be certified deaf to get those videophones. However, if you have a deaf person working for your company, and as long the person is still gainfully employed, you would be able to do your testing, modifying, etc.hint hint.

Sent from my LG-LS980 using AllDeaf App mobile app
 
I doubt it if you can get the Sorenson n touch for testing purposes. It's specifically given to those whose are deaf and hard of hearing and signs. Basically you have to be certified deaf to get those videophones. However, if you have a deaf person working for your company, and as long the person is still gainfully employed, you would be able to do your testing, modifying, etc.hint hint.
I assume our client fits the bill?
 
Like what diehardbiker said, latency is the main culprit of using Video Phone on Satellite not the speed.

But with that new Exede (I think they also brought out Wild Blue) we been seeing result with Deaf people using video phone on Exede with moderate success.

We have about 4 Deaf homes using video phone on Exede and it seem working out for them since they cannot get any other type of internet service in the area.

But some of the complaints are that Exede does have some issues during cloudy days or around after 5pm in the evening when people come home from work which mean heavier traffic to the satellite.

I can't say that using Exede will be successful but it seem to have better results over the other satellite providers. I do not promote or market for Exede in any form only what I seen when servicing video phones.

.
 
I assume our client fits the bill?

does your client work for you? in the same building as you? I will not play devil advocate when it comes to VP's (videophones), but there are times where

I take it seriously when it comes to elgbility for obtaining VP's.

hiring a disabled person helps the companies in many ways.


First off, we can be loyal as long you are to us and not be disgruntled over time like most poeple do.
second, we can perceive things better in a different view when we can voice it.
third, tax incentives.
Eligible Access Expenditures include expenditures for:

Removing barriers that prevent a business from being accessible to or usable by individuals with disabilities;
Providing qualified interpreters or other effective methods of making audio materials available to individuals with hearing impairments;
Providing qualified readers, taped texts, and other methods of making visual materials available to individuals with visual impairments;
Acquiring or modifying equipment or devices for individuals with disabilities.
Federal Tax Incentives

Employing people with disabilities will qualify you for various tax credits from the federal government. Click on these links to learn more about which credits you may be eligible for.

Business Tax Credits and Deductions for Employment of People with Disabilities

Provides an overview on the tax incentives available to help employers cover accommodation costs for employees and/or customers with disabilities, making their businesses accessible for everyone.

Facts About Disability-Related Tax Provisions

Supplies information on the Internal Revenue Service's disability-related provisions of particular interest to businesses as well as people with disabilities.

Tax Incentives for Providing Business Accessibility
Details tax incentives available to help small businesses cover the cost of accommodations for employees with disabilities and to make their places of business accessible.

Tax Incentives Packet on the Americans with Disabilities ActDownload Adobe Reader to read this link content

Covers how to take advantage of the tax credit and deduction available for complying with the ADA.
 
Like what diehardbiker said, latency is the main culprit of using Video Phone on Satellite not the speed.

But with that new Exede (I think they also brought out Wild Blue) we been seeing result with Deaf people using video phone on Exede with moderate success.

We have about 4 Deaf homes using video phone on Exede and it seem working out for them since they cannot get any other type of internet service in the area.

But some of the complaints are that Exede does have some issues during cloudy days or around after 5pm in the evening when people come home from work which mean heavier traffic to the satellite.

I can't say that using Exede will be successful but it seem to have better results over the other satellite providers. I do not promote or market for Exede in any form only what I seen when servicing video phones.
Thanks for that. That's what I was looking for - some experience from actual satellite Internet users. The afternoon slowdown issues seem to dog every Satellite Internet provider. It's a shared service so the number of concurrent users will affect overall speeds but I'm surprised it's pushing Exede users below the limit (probably the outbound speed).
 
does your client work for you? in the same building as you? I will not play devil advocate when it comes to VP's (videophones), but there are times where

I take it seriously when it comes to elgbility for obtaining VP's. hiring a disabled person helps the companies in many ways.

First off, we can be loyal as long you are to us and not be disgruntled over time like most poeple do. second, we can perceive things better in a different view when we can voice it.
third, tax incentives.
I totally get this and support it, and certainly everyone we hire is judged solely on their ability to do the job.

In this situation, we have a deaf client who's not looking for a job. He's just looking to get Internet that will support video phone capability. If we're able to do a trial for him it's because Sorenson is willing to get him a device, not us. We'll supply the Internet connection gratis. I called Sorenson a couple of times and left messages with the rep. I did not receive a reply.
 
I totally get this and support it, and certainly everyone we hire is judged solely on their ability to do the job.

In this situation, we have a deaf client who's not looking for a job. He's just looking to get Internet that will support video phone capability. If we're able to do a trial for him it's because Sorenson is willing to get him a device, not us. We'll supply the Internet connection gratis. I called Sorenson a couple of times and left messages with the rep. I did not receive a reply.

Sorenson will work with him and you to get his video phone set up.

What you will need to do is arrange a time and day for Sorenson to meet him when they set up the Satellite dish to try it out. It not easy to synchronize the day and time to meet but doable.

If you just called them recently then wait until Monday since it is a Thanksgiving weekend. If you don't hear back by Monday afternoon, call them back again to follow up.


.
 
This was about a month ago when I called a couple of times and left messages for their area Sales Rep. The client's sister also called him, apparently with no response.

I decided I'd try to nail down compatibility info first before trying again.
 
As I learn more about this technology, more questions come to mind. I may not have many customers for this but I would like to understand the technology nonetheless.

RadioMan and TechBill, do you work for Sorenson or other companies as VRS Interpreters, or were these calls you mentioned between you and other friends of acquaintances who were using a satellite connection?

Do these systems also connect directly between two users, or are all the calls always routed through a VRS service interpreter?

I assume many users use Skype Video, or other types of Peer to Peer Video services instead?
 
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