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Unread 02-23-2008, 04:32 AM   #1 (permalink)
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My kid doesn't sign back

Hi everyone,
I've asked people elsewhere this, but I thought I would here because I'll probably get better answers besides 'you're not trying hard enough!'

My daughter is 15 months old now, and she doesn't sign much. I've taught her sign for some time, but she doesn't respond back. In fact, when I sign to her, she looks away -- always has! We always watch "Mr Tumble" so she can at least see people signing (though this is Makaton, ugh).

How can I encourage my darling little brat () to sign more? Her speech is delayed (she can say "mam, dad, pop (also for food), ta, "ap" for up, no and yeah), but she can sign a few more words (for example, thank you, hungry, like, love, as well as the words I listed for speech) -- problem is, she chooses not to sign most of the time.

As well as me being HH, I miss conversation so it's a little frustrating for me.
I blame the mother, she almost never signs to her no matter how many times I ask her to sign more. In fact, when I sign to her she speaks back. I think it's ignorant.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 08:04 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Do you use your voice while signing to your daughter?
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Unread 02-23-2008, 08:11 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Do you use your voice while signing to your daughter?
Yeah, normally.
Think I should drop voice or keep it?
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Unread 02-23-2008, 08:13 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Yeah, normally.
Think I should drop voice or keep it?
That was the mistake I made with my daughter who is 10 years old now. I used both signing and voice with her and even today she still speaks back, not sign back. I wish I had kept both languages separate.

With my 2 year old son, I keep both languages separate. He didnt look at me at first when he was around a year old to 18 months...after that, he looks at anyone who is signing to him and he signs back. In fact, his ASL is much more fluent than his English. He signs like he is deaf.

My suggestion is to keep both languages separate. Up to you.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 08:22 AM   #5 (permalink)
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That was the mistake I made with my daughter who is 10 years old now. I used both signing and voice with her and even today she still speaks back, not sign back. I wish I had kept both languages separate.

With my 2 year old son, I keep both languages separate. He didnt look at me at first when he was around a year old to 18 months...after that, he looks at anyone who is signing to him and he signs back. In fact, his ASL is much more fluent than his English. He signs like he is deaf.

My suggestion is to keep both languages separate. Up to you.
Hmm. Maybe that's what I should do then.

I think I should drop it, too. Wife seems to think that if I drop my voice she won't understand what I'm saying. Apparently the "Baby Bop" club my wife has been to a few times, said you should never not use your voice because "it could damage their learning".
Arses to 'em, do you think so too?

However, I don't want to have my daughter so much better in BSL that her English suffers; got to find a decent balance. Mind you she should pick up spoken English in school shouldn't she? Everyone's been telling me to stop signing to her because her speaking is behind, but they can't seem to understand her speech is behind because she had an operation on her tongue (if she didn't have, she would have been mute).


Just curious, what is the ASL (and hopefully BSL) sign for "mute" and "quiet"?
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Unread 02-23-2008, 08:48 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Hmm. Maybe that's what I should do then.

I think I should drop it, too. Wife seems to think that if I drop my voice she won't understand what I'm saying. Apparently the "Baby Bop" club my wife has been to a few times, said you should never not use your voice because "it could damage their learning".
Arses to 'em, do you think so too?

However, I don't want to have my daughter so much better in BSL that her English suffers; got to find a decent balance. Mind you she should pick up spoken English in school shouldn't she? Everyone's been telling me to stop signing to her because her speaking is behind, but they can't seem to understand her speech is behind because she had an operation on her tongue (if she didn't have, she would have been mute).




Just curious, what is the ASL (and hopefully BSL) sign for "mute" and "quiet"?

Those people at your wife's Baby Bop are listening to old and outdated myths. It wont damage her learning nor her English will suffer if u drop your voice. My son just learned to count thru ASL without voice. He is learning the concept of numbers just fine.

Many CODAs learn ASL without voice during their first few years of their lives and many adult CODAs are very fluent in both languages.

U can go to ASLPRO.com to look for the signs for those two words. I suck at describing signs.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 09:00 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Thanks! I'll tell my wife about this.

I know that the myths are outdated myself but it's annoying when they try to force them from one group to another.

I want to learn ASL quite quickly, because my sis-in-law is going to adopt a Deaf kid (sometime soon) and I want to be able to chat to the kid whenever that time is, but obviously I won't get much practice here in England. I need more Deaf online friends, I guess. I've tried going in camfrog but I don't have camfrog pro.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 09:11 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Thanks! I'll tell my wife about this.

I know that the myths are outdated myself but it's annoying when they try to force them from one group to another.

I want to learn ASL quite quickly, because my sis-in-law is going to adopt a Deaf kid (sometime soon) and I want to be able to chat to the kid whenever that time is, but obviously I won't get much practice here in England. I need more Deaf online friends, I guess. I've tried going in camfrog but I don't have camfrog pro.
Wow! That must be so exciting with the adoption! I would love to adopt a deaf child myself. Maybe someday.

Good luck!
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Unread 02-23-2008, 10:42 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Wow my son learn very little sign language when he was a tolddler and didnt pick up english so the doctor order him to go to early intervention and it help alot and he was picking up really fast. So most of the time we speak. Sometimes I used sign language so I could understand what he was staying. I wish he sign more to me so I may one day lose my hearing completely.

Do what Shel90 said and I agree with her.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 12:19 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Wow! That must be so exciting with the adoption! I would love to adopt a deaf child myself. Maybe someday.

Good luck!
I think it'll be great when they do. They're both really good parents and their signing is pretty decent too.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 12:20 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Wow my son learn very little sign language when he was a tolddler and didnt pick up english so the doctor order him to go to early intervention and it help alot and he was picking up really fast. So most of the time we speak. Sometimes I used sign language so I could understand what he was staying. I wish he sign more to me so I may one day lose my hearing completely.

Do what Shel90 said and I agree with her.
I have a similar problem. I am partially deaf and I don't know if I will go permanently Deaf. My wife and I both know Sign Language but we speak when we sign (though I sign more than my wife). I'm probably going to drop the voice, or use it less often.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 12:24 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by InnocentOdion View Post
Thanks! I'll tell my wife about this.

I know that the myths are outdated myself but it's annoying when they try to force them from one group to another.

I want to learn ASL quite quickly, because my sis-in-law is going to adopt a Deaf kid (sometime soon) and I want to be able to chat to the kid whenever that time is, but obviously I won't get much practice here in England. I need more Deaf online friends, I guess. I've tried going in camfrog but I don't have camfrog pro.

How your in law do that find adopt a deaf kid or baby? bec I want adopt a deaf boy!
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Unread 02-23-2008, 02:04 PM   #13 (permalink)
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How your in law do that find adopt a deaf kid or baby? bec I want adopt a deaf boy!
Actually, I have absolutely no idea! I'm sure there are some places, websites, or adopt agencies which will accommodate.
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Unread 02-23-2008, 06:41 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Well dhh kids tend not to be too popular b/c they are special needs. Unfortunatly, the babies who get adopted easily are all white. Special needs or other minority babies have a much much harder time being adopted.
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Unread 02-24-2008, 08:48 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Remember - receptive skills usually develop before expressive skills... and every child has his/her own timeline. The most important thing is she is getting ONGOING language input.
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Unread 04-05-2008, 06:02 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Thumbs up

I have almost never voice with my son, now age 7. He signs very fluently and can understand my Deaf friends also.

I also think it's mistake to voice with child if you want them to learn sign language. It will NOT hurt their speech or their English. Our son reads at 5th grade level!

What you can do to get your baby or toddler used to it, is to just do "game" with her/him. Say "for one hour today we are both not going to use our voice and sign only". At first it's a little tough, but then after the third or fourth time your baby gets more fluent and doens't mind to turn off voice.

Also this improves their receptive skills. And you can voice with them 23 other hours the day. :-)

Then when they get older preschool, you can say, ok for 2 hours, no voice today. Whoever wins, will get new toy or icecream, whatever the gift!

This is what several of my Deaf and HOH friends did. Also try take kids to Deaf clubs during the day.

Get Deaf baby sitter who will not voice.

Hope this will help! But don't give up, because it's never too late!
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Unread 04-05-2008, 06:05 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I have almost never voice with my son, now age 7. He signs very fluently and can understand my Deaf friends also.

I also think it's mistake to voice with child if you want them to learn sign language. It will NOT hurt their speech or their English. Our son reads at 5th grade level!

What you can do to get your baby or toddler used to it, is to just do "game" with her/him. Say "for one hour today we are both not going to use our voice and sign only". At first it's a little tough, but then after the third or fourth time your baby gets more fluent and doens't mind to turn off voice.

Also this improves their receptive skills. And you can voice with them 23 other hours the day. :-)

Then when they get older preschool, you can say, ok for 2 hours, no voice today. Whoever wins, will get new toy or icecream, whatever the gift!

This is what several of my Deaf and HOH friends did. Also try take kids to Deaf clubs during the day.

Get Deaf baby sitter who will not voice.

Hope this will help! But don't give up, because it's never too late!
Good advice!


My son goes to a Deaf sitter..he is so fluent in ASL but when he is home, he switches to spoken English with my hearing hubby. At 2 years old, not being exposed to speech all day hasnt hurted him.
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Unread 04-05-2008, 07:08 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Shel, he sounds so cute!
He signs with you, though?

If your husband also play the 'hour-off-voice" game, then your son will get used to signing with your husband also.

It only takes an hour a day.

P.S. I want to adopt another Deaf child also!
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Unread 04-05-2008, 07:12 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Shel, he sounds so cute!
He signs with you, though?

If your husband also play the 'hour-off-voice" game, then your son will get used to signing with your husband also.

It only takes an hour a day.

P.S. I want to adopt another Deaf child also!
My husband, himself, could also use the hour "voice-off" game cuz his receptive skills are so poor. I usually have to voice while signing with him. He cant understand me if I dont use my voice just like I cant understand him if he uses his voice only without signing.

My son does switch to ASL and spoken English with me cuz I have good oral skills also (I was raised oral-only )

I would rather just use more ASL at home.
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Unread 04-05-2008, 09:37 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Ha cute. However if its ASL that you really want at home, only you can make it happen.

Let your husband know it's very important to you that he improves with signing and can understand you no matter if you voice or not. Maybe go to Deaf chats together. .

And you can also ask your husband to do the hour game with both you and your son. It's way more fun when it's a total family thing!
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Unread 04-05-2008, 10:01 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I have almost never voice with my son, now age 7. He signs very fluently and can understand my Deaf friends also.

I also think it's mistake to voice with child if you want them to learn sign language. It will NOT hurt their speech or their English. Our son reads at 5th grade level!

What you can do to get your baby or toddler used to it, is to just do "game" with her/him. Say "for one hour today we are both not going to use our voice and sign only". At first it's a little tough, but then after the third or fourth time your baby gets more fluent and doens't mind to turn off voice.

Also this improves their receptive skills. And you can voice with them 23 other hours the day. :-)

Then when they get older preschool, you can say, ok for 2 hours, no voice today. Whoever wins, will get new toy or icecream, whatever the gift!

This is what several of my Deaf and HOH friends did. Also try take kids to Deaf clubs during the day.

Get Deaf baby sitter who will not voice.

Hope this will help! But don't give up, because it's never too late!
I agree with you completely. I always tried to keep the languages separate for my son, and as a consequence, he developed fluency in both ASL and English. He also has amazing code switching abilities. I also made a conscientous effort to expose him to fluently signing Deaf adults from the time he was a toddler, and I know that it was a huge benefit for him not just linguistically, but socially and psychologically, as well.
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Unread 04-06-2008, 05:28 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Did anyone ever answer the real question as to how do you deal with your child ignoring your sign language when you are trying to sign to him? I am usually quite frustrated. I still refuse to use my voice but then I become like banging on things or stomping or tapping him repeatedly to make him look at me. I don't know why he is refusing or how can I communicate with him without my voice if he is refusing to acknowledge me? I guess I have also tried just walking away from him and I am the mommy so eventually he will need me and need to communicate with me? feels pretty harsh to do that though.
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Unread 04-07-2008, 12:52 AM   #23 (permalink)
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CTerry, yes I believe there are answers on this real question in the above posts that others have contributed.

I tell you one way not to 'deal' with your non-signing child is to use or show frustration!

Babies pick up on this like crazy. It's how they get to know you in the beginning. When they pick up on your frustration and related to signing, they will associate those negative feelings with signing.

Does your baby ALWAYS refuse to look at you? Or only when you sign? Do they refuse to look at you only if you sign?

Try to figure out the situations when they refuse to look at you or when they refuse to sign back.

Are they:

Tired?
Hungry?
Distracted?
Bad mood?

But punishing them in any way is not going to reinforce their signing skills.

As long as they are safe, they don't really have to look at you if they don't want. They will look when they are ready to communicate. It can never be forced. But if you walk away from him or her because they do that to you, then they will never learn.

They need to see the positive reinforcement through an adult role model. But seeing other children signing, and other Deaf is always good for them as well.

I know a few Deaf friends that once they started including their kids at Deaf events, their kids realized that just because Mommy/Daddy are Deaf and they can get away with not signing well with them, that it doesn't work for all Deaf. This motivated them to learn more.

Try signing when he's hungry. He has to look at you to get that info, right?

I bet he'd look at your quickly if he saw a piece of pizza in your hands or some ice cream!

What about motivational signs? Signs for favorite books, movies, friends, animals, foods, etc.

What about when reading bedtime story and using signs?

You have to have faith in yourself and your signs, or your baby won't either. I'm not saying that you don't, but babies pick up on our non-verbal cues in amazing ways.

Try going their way sometimes.

Hope this answers the 'real' question!
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Unread 04-07-2008, 01:02 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Did anyone ever answer the real question as to how do you deal with your child ignoring your sign language when you are trying to sign to him? I am usually quite frustrated. I still refuse to use my voice but then I become like banging on things or stomping or tapping him repeatedly to make him look at me. I don't know why he is refusing or how can I communicate with him without my voice if he is refusing to acknowledge me? I guess I have also tried just walking away from him and I am the mommy so eventually he will need me and need to communicate with me? feels pretty harsh to do that though.
LOL, when I would be discipling my deaf son with sign, he would quite often, as a toddler and young child, simply close his eyes so he didn't have to see what I was saying to him! Very annoying and frustrating! Hearing kids do the same thing is different ways. They also can "tune out" what they don't want to hear. It just looks like they are listening, when actually, it is going in one ear and out the other without stopping in their little brains. Deaf kids just have more obvious ways of ignoring us. The same wouldhold true for a hearing kid ignoring the visual language of a deaf parent. It is a natural and normal thing for kids to tune out what they don't want to hear or see. Annoying for parents, to be sure, but very normal.
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Unread 04-15-2008, 05:11 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Many CODAs learn ASL without voice during their first few years of their lives and many adult CODAs are very fluent in both languages.


I find that I am so bad with this . I start in ASL structure and finsh in Speak and English structure of sentence. I prefer to Sign with my family and Deaf friends
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Unread 04-16-2008, 02:44 AM   #26 (permalink)
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On a plus note, my daughter's been signing (a little more) recently!
Yesterday she finished eating, looked me in the eye and signed "drink". I gave her the drink and she signed "thank you".
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Unread 04-16-2008, 03:30 AM   #27 (permalink)
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I signed to my both boys since they were babies. I do not change for them but myself and my hubby's.

My hubby is an oral with GSL (German Sign Language). He voiced with sign to them and I voiced (on/off) with sign to them... We want them know what we are.

They sign very well like Deaf and can understand both world between hearies and deafies.

I questioned my boys out of curiously. My oldest son prefer me to sign with voice to him but my youngest son prefer me to sign without voice to him but they have no problem to accept what we are which is a great.
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Unread 04-16-2008, 07:18 PM   #28 (permalink)
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On a plus note, my daughter's been signing (a little more) recently!
Yesterday she finished eating, looked me in the eye and signed "drink". I gave her the drink and she signed "thank you".

Hey congrats! That's wonderful news!
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Unread 04-20-2008, 09:36 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Thanks
If only my mum stopped trying to encourage me to stop signing. Haha. She's scared because she thinks she won't talk. People think they know better. Oh well, she'll see in time.
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Unread 04-23-2008, 04:44 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Did anyone ever answer the real question as to how do you deal with your child ignoring your sign language when you are trying to sign to him? I am usually quite frustrated. I still refuse to use my voice but then I become like banging on things or stomping or tapping him repeatedly to make him look at me. I don't know why he is refusing or how can I communicate with him without my voice if he is refusing to acknowledge me? I guess I have also tried just walking away from him and I am the mommy so eventually he will need me and need to communicate with me? feels pretty harsh to do that though.
My deaf son used to close his eyes when I was correcting him in sign. Used to drive me crazy! I just learned to out wait him, LOL.
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