NYTimes Blog: Teaching a Deaf Child Her Mother’s Tongue - Page 2

CSign · 05-17-2012, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrendelQ

Love TLC and recommend it so very highly! But placement is very hard to maintain -- even for a profoundly deaf child whose primary language was ASL, and it's currently in jeopardy -- because the school succeeds so well at teaching deaf students effectively. I've had to employ the "stay put" protective regulation, rejecting her IEP, which makes no one happy, but maintains placement "as is" to keep her there.

It's ridiculous.

CreatedNat · 05-17-2012, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

I think you're in a good place in terms of quality education for DHH students.

Colorado is one of few states that includes a "Communication Plan" (I'm pretty sure that's what they call it) for the students, so everyone is clear on methodology.

Most states don't take the time to lay it out like that.

Yes I remember being involved in my IEP when we first moved here, my parents were in shock that they didn't have to fight as hard for services here. I am very pleased to be living here, though I wish we were a tad closer to a school that offered wonderful services. I do want my girls to be able to attend the same school, but I know that depending on how well Ally does, and what services are provided, this may not be an option for her. Thankfully I have a bit of time before they even enter Preschool!

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrendelQ

Love TLC and recommend it so very highly! But placement is very hard to maintain -- even for a profoundly deaf child whose primary language was ASL, and it's currently in jeopardy -- because the school succeeds so well at teaching deaf students effectively. I've had to employ the "stay put" protective regulation, rejecting her IEP, which makes no one happy, but maintains placement "as is" to keep her there.

I am very happy that she has a school that is working out so well for her! And that you are a mom who knows how to fight for her daughter!!

CSign · 05-17-2012, 02:32 PM

CreatedNat- is your daughter receiving services through early intervention yet?

CreatedNat · 05-17-2012, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

CreatedNat- is your daughter receiving services through early intervention yet?

Yes. After fighting and fighting we were able to get the early intervention services we wanted and needed for miss Ally. She has sessions every other week in our home with a SLP, who is fluent in ASL. Our IFSP also has an ASL teacher coming in once a week to be sure my husband is learning, and along with the SLP is monitoring the girls (mostly ally) with their language development. The ASL teacher, although she is hearing, is wonderful! When they told me her name I was amazed, she was the interpreter I had when the girls were born! The SLP has agreed that Ally is getting no benifit from her aids, she doesn't babble like her sister, but makes odd sounds, though it is beautiful to see her babble with her hands, knowing that she can communicate like that. Her most recent sign, though I have not been able to see it, according to my bridegroom, is sister. She keeps looking around, singing sister sister, looking confused (Amaya and I are currently at childrens, but that is a thread in its own).

CSign · 05-17-2012, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CreatedNat

Yes. After fighting and fighting we were able to get the early intervention services we wanted and needed for miss Ally. She has sessions every other week in our home with a SLP, who is fluent in ASL. Our IFSP also has an ASL teacher coming in once a week to be sure my husband is learning, and along with the SLP is monitoring the girls (mostly ally) with their language development. The ASL teacher, although she is hearing, is wonderful! When they told me her name I was amazed, she was the interpreter I had when the girls were born! The SLP has agreed that Ally is getting no benifit from her aids, she doesn't babble like her sister, but makes odd sounds, though it is beautiful to see her babble with her hands, knowing that she can communicate like that. Her most recent sign, though I have not been able to see it, according to my bridegroom, is sister. She keeps looking around, singing sister sister, looking confused (Amaya and I are currently at childrens, but that is a thread in its own).

I'm happy to read that she is getting appropriate services, including someone teaching the family (your husband primarily?) ASL.

That's cute that she's signing "sister" and looking for her. I hope that Amaya is ok... As a parent, it's never fun when your child is in the hospital...

CreatedNat · 05-17-2012, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

I'm happy to read that she is getting appropriate services, including someone teaching the family (your husband primarily?) ASL.

That's cute that she's signing "sister" and looking for her. I hope that Amaya is ok... As a parent, it's never fun when your child is in the hospital...

Yes, she is there to teach David (My Bridegroom), as well as his parents occasionally, ASL. She has been doing a wonderful job explaining the grammatical aspects to them, as well as not letting them slide as much when they sign things wrong (I apparently have been much too lenient with them).

and yes, David told me this morning that he has been trying to explain to a 6 month old that sister is with mommy at the hospital because sister is sick. My sweet princess is not understanding that... (but I do not expect her to as she is only 6 months old)... my poor Amaya doesn't even have the energy to eat on her own right now... and this is the scariest thing I have ever been through... not only am I separated from one of my children... but my other princess is so sick that it makes me physically hurt... I never knew seeing your child sick like this could cause physical pain...

deafdyke · 05-17-2012, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CreatedNat

Thank you for that clarification

. My parents, when I was younger looked into so many different schools for me, but none were what they had wanted. Ether they used only ASL and there was little to no actual Speech Therapy, or they were purely Oral, where there was no ASL allowed. This is what I fear for my daughter, that this will still be the same situation. I would not mind her going to a deaf school, but I also would like her to have high quality Speech training. This is something I am going to need to research in my search for a proper school for my princess. Are you still pleased with the bi-bi school for your daughter?

CreatedNat, actual schools or dhh programs? It's also kinda weird b/c until recently most sign using programs were TC, ,meaning they used both sign and speech. Although I do know that one complaint with hearing parents in in 80's and 90's is that TC may not have concentrated enough on speech skills.
My point is that, while there's not nessarily a Clarke style en masse exclusively in oral only set up at deaf schools, the auxilarially supports for HOH students are there, so that kids who want to develop speech and kids who NEED spoken language support can develop it. The reason it's not exclusive is that it now no longer takes a really long time for dhh kids to develop spoken language abilties, like they did in the old days.

deafdyke · 05-17-2012, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

Well it looks like it's a new year, and a new theme. Maybe you'll be interested in attending this year...

"October 25 - 26, 2012: "Apps to FMs: Expanding Opportunities through Technology",*The 33rd Annual Fall Conference on Mainstreaming Students with Hearing Loss, Sheraton Hotel, Springfield, MA."

Annual Mainstream Conference

Although there's a theme, there's always perheninal topics, and one of the perheninal topics is social-emotional issues.

CSign · 05-17-2012, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

Although there's a theme, there's always perheninal topics, and one of the perheninal topics is social-emotional issues.

It doesn't look like it...

"Clarke Mainstream Services is seeking workshop proposals that address our 2012 conference theme: Apps to FMs: Expanding Opportunities through Technology. In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize. For this year’s conference we are seeking proposals that will address current educational and hearing technologies and innovative strategies that foster and
insure the effective use of these technologies.

ALL proposal topics must fall into the categories of Hearing Technology or Classroom Technology to be considered."

http://www.clarkeschools.org/uploads..._Proposals.pdf

**Bottesini** · 05-17-2012, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

It doesn't look like it...

"Clarke Mainstream Services is seeking workshop proposals that address our 2012 conference theme: Apps to FMs: Expanding Opportunities through Technology. In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize. For this year’s conference we are seeking proposals that will address current educational and hearing technologies and innovative strategies that foster and
insure the effective use of these technologies.

ALL proposal topics must fall into the categories of Hearing Technology or Classroom Technology to be considered."
From your article:

Quote:

Clarke Mainstream Services is seeking workshop proposals that address our 2012 conference theme: Apps to FMs:
Expanding Opportunities through Technology. In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse
opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize. For this year’s conference we are seeking
proposals that will address current educational and hearing technologies and innovative strategies that foster and
insure the effective use of these technologies.

http://www.clarkeschools.org/uploads..._Proposals.pdf

So yes they are considering the social/emotional well being of the mainstreamed students.

Not that oral schools are really a blip on my radar, but be fair.

**GrendelQ** · 05-17-2012, 09:35 PM

Seems to me that saying "In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize" is a far cry from "Heck, even a lot of the superstars have major social emotional issues....it's a VERY big issue at the Clarke School Mainstream conferences."

**Bottesini** · 05-17-2012, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrendelQ

Seems to me that saying "In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize" is a far cry from "Heck, even a lot of the superstars have major social emotional issues....it's a VERY big issue at the Clarke School Mainstream conferences."

Well the quote CSign put up

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke
Although there's a theme, there's always perheninal topics, and one of the perheninal topics is social-emotional issues

is not what you just said there...

CSign · 05-17-2012, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

Nat, there are exceptions, andit's good that your experiance was so positive but overall kids start struggling around 4th grade, both academicly and socially.
It's very common and very universal, with both oral and Signing kids alike.
The reason why Clarke's dorm programs lasted so long, wasn't b/c a lot of parents were sending their little kids off to live in the dorms, but b/c until recently a lot of kids started struggling and transferred there for middle school.
A sucessful mainstream experiance tends to have to have the right ingreidants to be 100% sucessfull, and unfortunatly those ingrediants aren't always available at every single mainstream school. Heck, even a lot of the superstars have major social emotional issues....it's a VERY big issue at the Clarke School Mainstream conferences.

Bott- this was page one... All I'm really trying to say is that it doesn't seem
To be as big of a focus as DD believes...

**Bottesini** · 05-17-2012, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

Bott- this was page one... All I'm really trying to say is that it doesn't seem
To be as big of a focus as DD believes...

Oh, I see. I wasn't actually following that whole thing.

Cloggy · 05-18-2012, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

Oh give me a break! "........!

Break granted.
.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frisky Feline

technology does not give you 100 pecent as smooth. Same deal for the cell phone.

You didnt anser the quetion..!
.

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

Oh GAWD. Even with the best hearing aid, a HOH kid is still HOH......

this isn't the discussion.. Why do yo keep bringing that up?
.

Quote:

Originally Posted by flip

This is proof that people actually belive companies when they say "what we got this year is so much better than the stuff from last year".

did you have a look at the old hearing aids....
.

Quote:

Originally Posted by flip

This is for some strange reasons not mentioned in this "good and interesting" article. Read some recent papes showing that hoh and oral deaf people generally speak slower than hearing people can do, and also have a slower internal voice, affecting their thinking abilities. Old news, but worth to mention, too.

Interesting... Can you post a link to the article?
.

purplewowies · 05-18-2012, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CreatedNat

This is what I fear for my daughter, that this will still be the same situation. I would not mind her going to a deaf school, but I also would like her to have high quality Speech training.

I felt the need to mention this. I'm pretty sure the bi-bi state school here works (or worked, I'm not sure if the recent outreach legislation will change that) with an oral school in the area for speech services.

At the very least, even though I'm spending my entire next year of college doing a practicum and taking classes at ISD, I have to commute to that oral school for the class I have on speech development in the fall.

deafdyke · 05-18-2012, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

It doesn't look like it...

"Clarke Mainstream Services is seeking workshop proposals that address our 2012 conference theme: Apps to FMs: Expanding Opportunities through Technology. In today’s world technology has opened new and diverse opportunities for students with hearing loss to communicate, learn and socialize. For this year’s conference we are seeking proposals that will address current educational and hearing technologies and innovative strategies that foster and
insure the effective use of these technologies.

ALL proposal topics must fall into the categories of Hearing Technology or Classroom Technology to be considered."

http://www.clarkeschools.org/uploads..._Proposals.pdf

Do you see the complete listing? They always, and I mean ALWAYS have quite a few lectures on social-emotional issues, along with the other favorites like New Technology etc...etc.....just b/c there's a theme, it doesn't mean that the whole conference is about that.

deafdyke · 05-18-2012, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Bott- this was page one... All I'm really trying to say is that it doesn't seem
To be as big of a focus as DD believes

Not the exclusive issue, but it IS quite a popular topic.....AND you do hear parents and the TODs talking about it...

deafdyke · 05-18-2012, 08:50 PM

Quote:

this isn't the discussion.. Why do yo keep bringing that up?

That is simple. Because you and other oral only parents seem to WRONGLY equate good oral skills and usage of HAs and CIs as being able to assimulate into the hearing world. You misunderstand some acess as free and complete access. Wait til middle school/high school or even upper elemetary.....You'll see....
.

Cloggy · 05-19-2012, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

That is simple. Because you and other oral only parents seem to WRONGLY equate good oral skills and usage of HAs and CIs as being able to assimulate into the hearing world. You misunderstand some acess as free and complete access. Wait til middle school/high school or even upper elemetary.....You'll see....
.

You know a lot about me... and my daughter....

... and you haven't listened to parents that have children with CI... in middle scholl. In high school....
... Have you ever "listened" to Rick48, GrendelQ, CSign and others.?... Apearently not... You just take your assumptions and dump them....

CSign · 05-19-2012, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafdyke

That is simple. Because you and other oral only parents seem to WRONGLY equate good oral skills and usage of HAs and CIs as being able to assimulate into the hearing world. You misunderstand some acess as free and complete access. Wait til middle school/high school or even upper elemetary.....You'll see....
.

No, we are all very well aware of the fact that they miss things. Beyond that, those threats about "you'll see" that you post all over the forum are not productive. Most parents who post here take a very active role in the education of their children, and would address needs as they came up. We wouldn't "wait and see"... We wouldn't let our children fall behind or experience challenges without finding a way to address the issues.

Edit to add: For sake of clarity, I am not an "oral only" parent for those reading this who aren't regulars on the forum.

Jane B. · 05-19-2012, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

No, we are all very well aware of the fact that they miss things. Beyond that, those threats about "you'll see" that you post all over the forum are not productive. Most parents who post here take a very active role in the education of their children, and would address needs as they came up. We wouldn't "wait and see"... We wouldn't let our children fall behind or experience challenges without finding a way to address the issues.

I have been wanting to say this for awhile but have never been sure just where to do so. I have decided to just go ahead and do it.

I think that some of our members with the least hearing forget that the hearing population does not get everything either. I run with a hearing crowd even though my left ear is gone and my right is profound. I notice them saying what at times or a puzzled look that is makes it obvious to all that it is time to repeat. This happens most often in a group, especially in a restaurant or where there is a similar crowd.

CSign · 05-19-2012, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jane B.

I have been wanting to say this for awhile but have never been sure just where to do so. I have decided to just go ahead and do it.

I think that some of our members with the least hearing forget that the hearing population does not get everything either. I run with a hearing crowd even though my left ear is gone and my right is profound. I notice them saying what at times or a puzzled look that is makes it obvious to all that it is time to repeat. This happens most often in a group, especially in a restaurant or where there is a similar crowd.

Yes, you are absolutely correct.

**Jiro** · 05-19-2012, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

No, we are all very well aware of the fact that they miss things. Beyond that, those threats about "you'll see" that you post all over the forum are not productive. Most parents who post here take a very active role in the education of their children, and would address needs as they came up. We wouldn't "wait and see"... We wouldn't let our children fall behind or experience challenges without finding a way to address the issues.

Edit to add: For sake of clarity, I am not an "oral only" parent for those reading this who aren't regulars on the forum.

hence... a "you'll see" comment from deafdyke because it's same ole' approach for past few decades. she wasn't implying that you're not doing anything.

Cloggy · 05-19-2012, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiro

hence... a "you'll see" comment from deafdyke because it's same ole' approach for past few decades. she wasn't implying that you're not doing anything.

Ahh! Really?

**Jiro** · 05-19-2012, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cloggy

Ahh! Really?

yes I'm so sweet

CSign · 05-19-2012, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiro

yes I'm so sweet

The sweetest

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05-17-2012, 02:32 PM	#33 (permalink)
CSign Registered User Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Best Coast, USA Posts: 3,216	CreatedNat- is your daughter receiving services through early intervention yet?