An interpreter’s question

Chase · 03-23-2008, 05:15 PM

I’m not an interpreter for the deaf, but in a very small way I help interpret rules for interpreters.

On Friday I got an e-mail from an interpreter for the deaf in a junior high school in a nearby town referred to me by our local college.

A teacher said in class that the spelling rule for “receive” was “I before e except after c with a whole lot of exceptions.” The interpreter couldn’t remember the actual rule, wanted to answer her client’s questions about it, but didn’t want to challenge the teacher.

I stayed neutral on the challenge and student support, and sent her this:

The ancient mnemonic poem is

I before e,
Except after c,
Unless "ei" says a,
As in neighbor and weigh.

It’s true. The only two exceptions are listed. It’s why their (THAYer) is spelled as it is and many others.

Some will bring up words such as “weird” as not being addressed by the poem, but they really are. The problem is we mispronounce those words. For instance, “weird” is a Scottish word meaning fate or destiny, once spelled "wyrd" and long pronounced WAYerd. I don’t live there, so I’d be guessing to say it is still is pronounced that way, but those are the facts of the case.

Bear · 03-23-2008, 05:21 PM

All I can say is Chase you lost me! Lol

Chase · 03-23-2008, 05:25 PM

Sorry about that. Tried to be as succinct, but all explanations aren't easy one-liners. The teacher who shortened the old poem made things difficult for her students.

Thought maybe some terps could use the info sometime.

Levonian · 03-23-2008, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bear

All I can say is Chase you lost me! Lol

Me too, but at least I think he's smarter than a 5th grader…

Matilda · 03-23-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bear

All I can say is Chase you lost me! Lol

Same here .... sorry, Chasie.

Chase · 03-23-2008, 06:02 PM

I'll try again.

Many are confused by spelling English words with ie and ei, such as believe, receive, and weight.

The poem tells how to figure each different spelling:

I before e, (you usually write i before e)

Except after c, (but if i comes after c, you write cei)

Unless "ei" says a,
As in neighbor and weigh. (but if the sound is "a" like in weigh [way] you write ei)

I didn't make up the poem; it's a forgotten oldie that helped kids spell in the old days . . . when it mattered, ha ha ha.

The alternative is to try to remember each different spelling word by sight, as phonics doesn't help with the problem.

Anyway, the interpreter said she understood. The main thing is will her poor, confused student?

***VamPyroX*** · 03-24-2008, 12:49 AM

I actually learned that phrase from watching a Charlie Brown episode on television years ago. Charlie Brown was involved in a spelling bee and he kept repeating "I before E except after C." That stuck in my head and I still never forget it.

Now, it's common sense for me.

Reba · 03-24-2008, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

I'll try again.

Many are confused by spelling English words with ie and ei, such as believe, receive, and weight.

The poem tells how to figure each different spelling:

I before e, (you usually write i before e)

Except after c, (but if i comes after c, you write cie)

Oops.

"Except after c," means it is spelled "cei", as in receive.

Reba · 03-24-2008, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

I'll try again.

Many are confused by spelling English words with ie and ei, such as believe, receive, and weight.

The poem tells how to figure each different spelling:

I before e, (you usually write i before e)

Except after c, (but if i comes after c, you write cie)

Unless "ei" says a,
As in neighbor and weigh. (but if the sound is "a" like in weigh [way] you write ei)

Similar to the poem that I learned as a kid:

I before e
Except after c,
Or when sounding like "a", as in "neighbor" or "weigh."

Chase · 03-24-2008, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Oops.

"Except after c," means it is spelled "cei", as in receive.

Many thanks, Reba. I went back and edited. Not to look smart, but in case someone copies to use the poem.

Reba · 03-24-2008, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

Many thanks, Reba. I went back and edited. Not to look smart, but in case someone copies to use the poem.

I only mentioned it because "ie"--"ei" is confusing enough, ha, ha.

jillio · 03-24-2008, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

I'll try again.

Many are confused by spelling English words with ie and ei, such as believe, receive, and weight.

The poem tells how to figure each different spelling:

I before e, (you usually write i before e)

Except after c, (but if i comes after c, you write cei)

Unless "ei" says a,
As in neighbor and weigh. (but if the sound is "a" like in weigh [way] you write ei)

I didn't make up the poem; it's a forgotten oldie that helped kids spell in the old days . . . when it mattered, ha ha ha.

The alternative is to try to remember each different spelling word by sight, as phonics doesn't help with the problem.

Anyway, the interpreter said she understood. The main thing is will her poor, confused student?

You have clarified why Cued Speech has not been found toconsistently help with issues like literacy and spelling. The phonetics of the English language are far too inconsistent!

kimpossible · 03-28-2008, 12:25 AM

you can remember some of the exceptions by this phrase: "Neither leisured foreigner seized the weird heights." (except "leisured" has an "ay" sound so you might as well exclude the word altogether. the word "financier" is also exempt.)

also i think the "weird" spelling has something to do with shakespeare?

edit: apparently there's another phrase "the sheik traded his caffeine for counterfeit protein"

deafskeptic · 03-28-2008, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VamPyroX

I actually learned that phrase from watching a Charlie Brown episode on television years ago. Charlie Brown was involved in a spelling bee and he kept repeating "I before E except after C." That stuck in my head and I still never forget it.

Now, it's common sense for me.

That's how I learned it too except that I learned it from reading from one of the Peanuts comic books that my parents bought for my sister. I used to be quite a Peanuts fan. When I was growing up, most programs weren't captioned.

deafskeptic · 03-28-2008, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

You have clarified why Cued Speech has not been found toconsistently help with issues like literacy and spelling. The phonetics of the English language are far too inconsistent!

Heh.. Bernard Shaw was famous for complaining about the phonetics of the English language. Oh, I agree with him.

03-23-2008, 05:15 PM	#1 (permalink)
Chase Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,316	An interpreter’s question I’m not an interpreter for the deaf, but in a very small way I help interpret rules for interpreters. On Friday I got an e-mail from an interpreter for the deaf in a junior high school in a nearby town referred to me by our local college. A teacher said in class that the spelling rule for “receive” was “I before e except after c with a whole lot of exceptions.” The interpreter couldn’t remember the actual rule, wanted to answer her client’s questions about it, but didn’t want to challenge the teacher. I stayed neutral on the challenge and student support, and sent her this: The ancient mnemonic poem is I before e, Except after c, Unless "ei" says a, As in neighbor and weigh. It’s true. The only two exceptions are listed. It’s why their (THAYer) is spelled as it is and many others. Some will bring up words such as “weird” as not being addressed by the poem, but they really are. The problem is we mispronounce those words. For instance, “weird” is a Scottish word meaning fate or destiny, once spelled "wyrd" and long pronounced WAYerd. I don’t live there, so I’d be guessing to say it is still is pronounced that way, but those are the facts of the case.

03-23-2008, 05:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
Bear Out Of Hibernation Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,023	All I can say is Chase you lost me! Lol __________________ http://bears-city.myminicity.com/

03-23-2008, 06:02 PM	#6 (permalink)
Chase Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,316	I'll try again. Many are confused by spelling English words with ie and ei, such as believe, receive, and weight. The poem tells how to figure each different spelling: I before e, (you usually write i before e) Except after c, (but if i comes after c, you write cei) Unless "ei" says a, As in neighbor and weigh. (but if the sound is "a" like in weigh [way] you write ei) I didn't make up the poem; it's a forgotten oldie that helped kids spell in the old days . . . when it mattered, ha ha ha. The alternative is to try to remember each different spelling word by sight, as phonics doesn't help with the problem. Anyway, the interpreter said she understood. The main thing is will her poor, confused student? Last edited by Chase; 03-24-2008 at 12:32 PM.

03-24-2008, 12:49 AM	#7 (permalink)
*VamPyroX* bloody phreak from hell Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Hell Posts: 26,599	I actually learned that phrase from watching a Charlie Brown episode on television years ago. Charlie Brown was involved in a spelling bee and he kept repeating "I before E except after C." That stuck in my head and I still never forget it. Now, it's common sense for me. __________________ Check out my city... CLICK HERE! (If you already visited yesterday, visit again today!)

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03-23-2008, 05:25 PM	#3 (permalink)
Chase Premium Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,316	Sorry about that. Tried to be as succinct, but all explanations aren't easy one-liners. The teacher who shortened the old poem made things difficult for her students. Thought maybe some terps could use the info sometime.

03-28-2008, 12:25 AM	#13 (permalink)
kimpossible Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: British Columbia Posts: 165	you can remember some of the exceptions by this phrase: "Neither leisured foreigner seized the weird heights." (except "leisured" has an "ay" sound so you might as well exclude the word altogether. the word "financier" is also exempt.) also i think the "weird" spelling has something to do with shakespeare? edit: apparently there's another phrase "the sheik traded his caffeine for counterfeit protein"