The difference in vocabulary

Greetings to all!

I have been reading over the posts in this board and this is a wonderful source of information.

Maybe someone here can give me some input or advice.

I am a hearing woman and recently starting dating a very very very wonderful man who is deaf (he can talk and read lips). When he met me, I already knew how to sign my alphabet from my childhood days but immediately starting learning to sign with his help and the many videos that are available on the internet. I still sign like a baby, but I've got about 100 words under my belt now

Here is the problem that I'm trying to figure out. I am a doctor and a writer, so my English is very rich, complex and uses a variety of vocabulary and follows a certain set of rules. I am learning that ASL has its very own set of rules/grammar syntax that are very different from English and this brings about mis-communication sometimes when I talk to the man that I am dating. I sign to him like I speak and form my sentences in English and he talks to me and forms his sentences like he signs in ASL and the translation is a bit off at times for both of us.

Any suggestions to make communication a bit easier?

Thanks!!!

With your rich complex language skills, it should be extremely easy for you to pick up a second language and develop fluency in ASL,

Yes, treat it as though you were learning any other language, such as Japanese or Russian; you'd have to learn those rules of grammar, too. If you were speaking French to someone you wouldn't form your sentences in English, right?

If you could take a live formal ASL class under a Deaf instructor it would probably be easier.

Thanks to all for the input!

So, is it your suggestion that in order for the relationship to survive that I am the one who has to be responsible for adapting to the ASL language/culture?

I guess sometimes you like to think that when two people are in a relationship that BOTH should try to meet each other halfway, but maybe for the success of the relationship...this is not one of those times.

HearingWomanDatingDeafMan said:

Thanks to all for the input!

So, is it your suggestion that in order for the relationship to survive that I am the one who has to be responsible for adapting to the ASL language/culture?

I guess sometimes you like to think that when two people are in a relationship that BOTH should try to meet each other halfway, but maybe for the success of the relationship...this is not one of those times.

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I don't think that what she saying...as you say when both in a relationship you meet each other half way
I am deaf but I come from hearing family i was born hearing 30yrs ago went deaf and took me long time to understand why deaf grammer syntax is why it is...when i write i use lots of unnecessary wording i no help it as i write in my langage...you will notice others will use fewer words and it can seem blunt and if you are deaf bluntness you need to be if you want live full life.
you seem nice person who wants to understand deaf ways but is he asking you to do that,I think Reb/Bot saying it always good to know another language but with sign language one sign can mean many different things depending the contex that where you having the problem...like everything it takes time

HearingWomanDatingDeafMan said:

Thanks to all for the input!

So, is it your suggestion that in order for the relationship to survive that I am the one who has to be responsible for adapting to the ASL language/culture?

I guess sometimes you like to think that when two people are in a relationship that BOTH should try to meet each other halfway, but maybe for the success of the relationship...this is not one of those times.

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If he's using oral speech and speechreading (lipreading), he's already done what he can do to meet you half way. Do you realize how much of a physical and mental strain that is? Speechreading has to be done in active mode always; there is no passive listening mode as there is with aural reception.

If you're feeling a bit of resentment now for having to adjust your communication methods, it might be good to clear the air about that now, before you get too deeply involved as a couple.

@caz12.... yes, the grammar is a bit off in our communication, like you said ASL is much more blunt. "Blue" is "Blue" for him, but for me "blue" might be cyan or periwinkle or turquoise or indigo or azure (as an example). Like you mentioned, for the deaf the grammar and syntax is much much different that how I use my English.

It is two people learning to communicate with each other.

@Reba, the burden of communicating does mostly fall on his shoulders since he can talk and read lips and I am just learning ASL but I think what I am asking is if you involve yourself with a hearing person who has a pretty good handle of the English language, shouldn't you also try to understand the grammar and syntax that they use?

I find myself trying to break my sentences into simple and blunt sentences like caz12 mentioned but when I do that alot of the meaning of what I am saying gets lost when I chop so much out.

Let me give you an example: recently I went out of town to teach a training seminar. During the course of the conversation with him about my travels and what I was going to do, he asked me "what are you talking about at the seminar" Now, the course I was teaching was showing a management team how to increase employee morale, employee retention and employee productivity. I had no way to communicate this to him and the words were not making sense to him with lip reading. So I went out of town, taught my class...came back and to this day he still has no clue what it is I did. I can not share with him certain things because I don't know HOW to say them to him, even through his ability to speak and lip read.

He understands that I talked to some managers of a company but everything after that is lost and I want to make sure he is included and understands everything I do. So I am thinking, it will take some effort on his part to learn more about how I use my English and some of the words I use. Yes or No???

Why can't you tell him exactly what you said, "I was showing a management team how to increase employee morale, employee retention and employee productivity." Do you assume he doesn't know those vocabulary words? If he can lip read, you can pretty much say anything and exactly what's in your mind. I wouldn't want hearing people to talk down to me simply because they are trying to hard to replace these words with something more simpler.

I don't know about him but for me, I expect the same level of communication.

(I am deaf by the way)

reb right it is physical strain...i get migrains if lip read to much proberly how it is for him then miss a lot and feel like giving up often do...you say you got rich sense of language think it through.e.g why would he need use metaphors similes clichés euphonisms all he wants to do understand in the least complicated way and quick

I did say exactly that and I followed it up with a text message so he could see what I was saying but there was still a lack in understanding of what I said.

So my thinking was just like I look up signs that I am unfamiliar with... he should say "hmm...she used a word that I can not lip read and am not familiar with, maybe I should try to find out what she means."

When he inquired about my trip after I got home, he stayed clear of the class I taught and simply asked how was the weather, what did you eat, how was the flight... but nothing to make us have to try to figure out how to communicate about the class

I have no desire to speak to him simply (or like a baby) because he is a very intelligent man. It's just that our vocabularies are different and I just want to make sure he understands me.

i think you need have contact with other deaf...i understand perfectly why he said what he did and why he no said what you wanted..All his life people HAVE expect him to do what you expected... remember you thinking as a hearing woman he not, so on what subject did you want to talk to him about ask him...i stated one sign can have many different meanings his need for many different words not the same as yours that don't mean he don't understand them...he also may feel comfortable with you and don't feel he needs to do this..
what you say 'hmmm..she used word i don't lip read' that could offend many deaf people..i can not see what you wanted of him he asked you the basic stuff people ask when away .just tell him what you expected him to do and say he not mind reader

HearingWomanDatingDeafMan said:

Let me give you an example: recently I went out of town to teach a training seminar. During the course of the conversation with him about my travels and what I was going to do, he asked me "what are you talking about at the seminar" Now, the course I was teaching was showing a management team how to increase employee morale, employee retention and employee productivity. I had no way to communicate this to him

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There are specific ASL signs for everything you just said you can't communicate.

By this I mean it isn't even something you would fingerspell.

So even though you can't see it, obviously a lot of the communication problem is on your end.

HearingWomanDatingDeafMan said:

I am a doctor and a writer, so my English is very rich, complex and uses a variety of vocabulary and follows a certain set of rules.

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Initial thought when reading this was you have a inflated opinion of yourself. Reading your following posts just reinforces this opinion. Others may feel differently, but I think the communication issue is more you than him.

Exactly what I was trying to say...without actually saying it...

Finally...the picture is getting more clearer to me....Late deafie here...and not totally fluent with ASL...so of course many words that I fingerspelled perhaps would had no meaning...or no understanding to a Deafie....am I right?....

I too, had a lot of miscommunication with those who were totally deaf....

Again, I thank you all for your input. It was never my intention to offend anyone. If I have come across as "full of myself" that was not the message that I was trying to convey but I will take the opportunity to take a look at myself and grow to be a better person if this is the case. No one is perfect and each of us has the opportunity every day we wake up to work at being better people.

@rockin robin, I think that you have said it better than I have. He has been deaf since he was 4 years old. And we are having alot of mis-communication that I am trying to work on because I like this man very much.

But I think what I am getting from all of this is that I am the one, who will have to make the communication work... which means making my thoughts/language more blunt.

HearingWomanDatingDeafMan said:

Again, I thank you all for your input. It was never my intention to offend anyone. If I have come across as "full of myself" that was not the message that I was trying to convey but I will take the opportunity to take a look at myself and grow to be a better person if this is the case. No one is perfect and each of us has the opportunity every day we wake up to work at being better people.

@rockin robin, I think that you have said it better than I have. He has been deaf since he was 4 years old. And we are having alot of mis-communication that I am trying to work on because I like this man very much.

But I think what I am getting from all of this is that I am the one, who will have to make the communication work... which means making my thoughts/language more blunt.

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Honestly, you did not give me that impression....Communication is so important to both parties to make it work....Good Luck to you...hope it all works out.

rockin'robin said:

Finally...the picture is getting more clearer to me....Late deafie here...and not totally fluent with ASL...so of course many words that I fingerspelled perhaps would had no meaning...or no understanding to a Deafie....am I right?....

I too, had a lot of miscommunication with those who were totally deaf....

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You want to explain that? I don't see it. I communicate with the hearing people all the time and they talk to me like they talk to other people.

How's that many words you fingerspell is lost to a deaf person?

I haven't talked to a deaf person or used ASL in ages so perhaps I'm out of touch here. When I say in ages, I mean in years.

I'm curious.

If you had to explain what you taught at the conference to someone from another country, and outside of your profession, how would you do it?

Also, it doesn't hurt to have visual aids. If you have a website or brochures describing the conference, for example, you can use them to give context to what you did.

One more point:

Not everything we do in life is fascinating to everyone else, be they hearing or deaf.

@Reba.... if I would have to explain to someone from another country what I do...I have found that Google translator is my best friend when speaking to people who use other languages Now if I had to explain it to someone who was hearing and speaks English, I would say exactly what I said...how I said it, and it is always understood.

I do have a website and I have shown him that. It works to help him understand some things but not all.

Also, I get your message about not everything being fascinating to all (smile) and I would think this is the case here if it just that he does not show a repeat pattern when we are misunderstanding each other. He will always say "Let's change the subject"...but for the long term that is not good in any relationship. You can't just keep changing the subject, you have to both make efforts to understand each other.