Buffalo

Still, a Deaf child needs explanation on certain things. I remember that someone got upset and told the deaf person that he should know better but no one explained it to him. I can't remember what it was but apparently it is something that the kids can overheard and learn from that.

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“The problem is not that the (deaf) students do not hear. The problem is that the hearing world does not listen. “- Rev Jesse L. Jackson ( American Civil Rights Activist, Minister)

Deafness

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Lighthouse77

sign up for dish network and they will give you a DVR to record shows you love.

Hear Again

I can't afford dish TV and cannot use DVR. (I'm totally blind.)

In a later post, I said that I saw the re-run.

Hear Again

When it comes to oral communication, I agree with you, but I was referring to socially learned behaviors.

Having said that, a blind or deafblind child still requires more explanation in general since there are a myriad of behaviors that need to be learned due to their inability to see.

Furthermore, a blind or deafblind child will require further explanation in their teens and young adulthood years about proper dress, peer pressure, learning how to apply make-up, shopping independently, learning how to use a mail reader, money management as well as a variety of other behaviors.

Hear Again

How dare I, Aleser? I was expressing MY opinion. If you happen to disagree with it, be my guest.

By the way, I was specifically talking about blind children -- not children with autism.

If you feel offended by my post, I'm sorry, but that's the way I feel.

As a person who was born totally blind, I have a right to raise my Deaf, blind or deafblind child (should I have one) any way I see fit.

Since I find blindisms and utterances to be inappropriate forms of behavior, I will correct them and do not care if you or others have a problem with that.

Besides, it's MY child and I have a right to raise MY child however I wish.

Hear Again

Awww, thank you Jamie for your kind words about my mother. <hugs> I owe so much to her. She never allowed me to get away with "acting blind" or exhibiting blindisms and because of that, I earn more respect from those who are sighted-hearing because they see me as someone who is just like them and not someone to be pitied.

My mother passed away in December 2004, but I still miss her dearly and always will.

I would love to come to France someday!

dreama

I agree. I think that communication is the important thing here. Getting all 3 triplets to communicate together using sign language should be the priority. Getting them more help should also be a priority.

I rock sometimes. Do you think I should be stopped too?

I think that disabled people should be judged on their own terms. Not terms put forth by the hearing sighted world.

My mom also tried to make me as 'normal' as possible. I think my parents were misguided. I don't blame them at all. At the same time if they had concentrated on important matters such as communication via visual rather then auditary methods, that would have been much better then making my already invisible disablilites (asperger, mild deafness, thyroid deficency, and petitit mal epilepsy) more invisible then they already were.

I don't think they expected too much. I just think that they expected the wrong kinds of things. It would have been much better to have been a fluent anglo french speaker/signer using signing and cued speach with freaky behavior accepted.

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I speak for those who cannot speak for themselves.
http://www.fightfoca.com/

deafdyke

I really think that they should move to Mass or New England so that they could go to Perkins School for the Blind. Yes, I know about how Perkins isn't a hotbed of potential Ivy League grads, but on they other hand they could offer so much more then a mainstream school that could just offer half assed services.

dreama

That would be a good idea. They need more constant training then they are getting at any rate. Helen Keller and Laura Bradman got a lot more. It seems while we've made vast improvements tecnology wise, manpower and comitment are definately lacking.

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I speak for those who cannot speak for themselves.
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Hear Again

What we need are more universities and colleges who provide training in becoming an intervenor/SSP for the deafblind. That's severely lacking. The only 2 states who have such a program are Texas and Massachussetts.

Hear Again

I couldn't agree with you more. Any blindness training at a school for the blind is better than what is provided in a mainstreamed environment. Public schools aren't equipped to deal with the multiple needs of a deafblind child.

Hear Again

I rock sometimes. Do you think I should be stopped too?

If you were my child, yes.

Since you're not, you can rock all you want.

As for myself, I'm glad my mother forced me to stop my blindisms.

Hear Again

I think that disabled people should be judged on their own terms. Not terms put forth by the hearing sighted world.

I disagree. When a child "acts blind or deaf," it portrays them in a negative light. I want my child to be seen as normal as possible. I don't want the sighted-hearing world to pity my child because of the way they act. Communication needs can always be addressed in addition to blindisms. It doesn't take long to correct negative behaviors. I no longer remember how my mother punished me for rocking and poking my eyes, but whatever she did, it worked and I'm thankful it did.

Bottesini

My parents also trained me away from flapping, rocking, and screaming and of course I am glad they did.

I also want to be seen in as positive a light as possible. And I have had an autistic diagnosis from a young age.

If you can stop autistic behaviours, of course you should.

Anybody who thinks they should keep them is just an attention seeker in my opinion.

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Hear Again

Now that I think about it, I've seen children with autism on TV and none that I recall were rocking back and forth. All of them acted just like any other child with the exception of having some hyperactivity issues.

Aleser

Not all people with autism stim, and not all autistics that do stim do it the same way- I know someone who beatboxes. For those that do, in whatever way, it's not a 24/7 event- when someone is excited, upset, overstimulated, or on the flip side UNDER-stimulated and seeking arousal, would be examples of times that stimming generally happens.

Essentially, people with autism that do stim generally do it as a form of self-regulation- either to reduce or react to some sort of overload, or to -create- some sort of positive 'feeling' if hypo-sensitive.

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"She thinks... she can make people do what she wants or needs, what is right, by the sheer force of her own talent, not by forcing them... she can teach them and persuade them... that they'll catch it from her. This is still faith in their rationality, in the omnipotence of reason. The mistake? Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them."

Hear Again

Regardless of why they do it, this behavior should be stopped. If I had a child with autism who acted this way, I would redirect their behavior to something positive. A child does not need to stimulate themselves in this way. Their attention can be redirected to other activities. Saying that a child with autism should be allowed to do these things just because they're autistic is like telling a Deaf child they can scream just because they can't hear or I can feel every object I come across with my hands just because I'm blind. That's ridiculous.

Aleser

By that standard, most people with autism -can- physically talk. Should they be 'redirected' from using adaptive forms of communication because it is, indeed, something that makes the general public think we're stupid?

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"She thinks... she can make people do what she wants or needs, what is right, by the sheer force of her own talent, not by forcing them... she can teach them and persuade them... that they'll catch it from her. This is still faith in their rationality, in the omnipotence of reason. The mistake? Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them."

faire_jour

I think it is a very similar perspective to the idea that deaf kids should learn to speak so that they "blend in" to the hearing world. I think it is surprising.

If I'm off base Hear Again, let me know.

Hear Again

There's a difference between allowing a Deaf child to make utterances because they can't hear and wanting them to speak so they have a wider variety of communication options.

You're teaching Miss Kat to speak, aren't you faire_jour? If so, why?

Aren't you also planning to place her in an oral classroom soon? If so, why?

Why not allow her to fully communicate in ASL and be educated in an ASL-only environment?

If you want her to speak and thrive in an oral-only classroom environment, are you doing this to help her conform to the hearing world?

faire_jour

I don't want it for conformity, but for options, like you said.

I just want to hear about your opinion. I don't mean to offend or say that you are wrong.

Hear Again

I shared my opinion. I said that if I had a blind, Deaf or deafblind child that I would immediately address any behaviors which make them look different from the rest of society.

For example, I was born totally blind. I was taught from an early age to look in the direction of the person I'm speaking to. It would be easy for my parents to say, "Why should Hear Again do that? She can't see."

Long story short, that's wrong and is using my blindness as an excuse. There's absolutely no reason why I can't learn to face the proper direction when I'm being spoken to instead of laying my head down on the table, swinging my head from side to side, rocking, eye poking or staring at bright lights on the ceiling (for those who have light perception).

There's nothing wrong with expecting a blind, Deaf or deafblind child to behave as normally as possible. It's no different than implanting a child. You implant them to give them more opportunities. I'm doing the same by teaching my child (when I have one) appropriate behaviors in order to increase their opportunities in life.

If an employer sees a blind teenager or adult rocking back and forth, swinging their head from side to side and/or eye poking, how professional does that look? Compare that to a blind teenager or adult who sits up straight and looks in the direction of the person who is interviewing them. Who do you think will be hired?

dreama

As a child my mother DID attempt that too. In fact she put a lot of effort into it.

It made me a miserable child, that's all.
I have a feeling it wouldn't work for Zoe or Emma either.

I don't agree with making a child as NORMAL as possible. What's so great about being normal anyway.

A parent should focus on teaching a child to be as independant as they can. Give them a long cane, teach them sign language, braille, daily living skills, etc etc...

Just curious, how would you have handled a blind kid who clicks their fingers or makes noises to assist them in ecco location?

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dreama

Come to think of it, it did have an affect although I still rock. But sometimes when I tell people I am autistic they don't believe me. So errasing all outside signs of my disability may have worked, but I wish they had focused on other things more important then my outward apearance.

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dreama

That's true.

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dreama

Maybe you should learn more about autism?

No it isn't. When I travel with my long cane I stop now and again to feel my environment so I know where I am. If my hand feels a tree, I like to examine it. You're saying a blind person shouldn't be alowed to touch their environment at all, that to me IS redicoulous because how can you possibly be mobile if you aren't alowed to explore your environment. How can you truely benifit from beautiful objects in your path.

If I had a blind child, I would actively encourage them to explore their environment to the max.

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dreama

Who the parents or other autistic person who disagrees with you? because I attract enough attention as a deafblind person thanks very much. I don't need to attract more.

I get about independantly with 5 disabilites. So what if I rock sometimes. It's no big deal. I accept myself and I have apsolutely no interest in being normal.

I don't know how severely affected you are by your autism but there are degrees of autism. Some Autistics really can't help the way they behave, and some might not want to either. Why should they get themselves major stressed though trying to keep up a 'normal' apearance and not sim which helps calm themselves down.

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Bottesini

I will tell you how severely. I got the diagnosis as a young child fifty years ago when it was not applied to every minor eccentricity.

I had a lot of behaviour modification and a lot of very hard work by my parents.

Thanks to much hard work I managed to marry, have children, and enjoy an adult life of independence and self sufficiency.

I also got an upgraded diagnosis of Asperger syndrome, and I credit a lot to my parents for working with me and not leaving me in the depths.

In other words, I started life as a classic Kanner autistic and overcame.

You won't ever meet anyone who know more or at one time was affected more than me.

People who play with the diagnosis and got someone to pass them with Asperger's new diagnosis as an adult will never know and can just enjoy how cool it makes them feel as it seems fashiionalbe now.

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dreama

So what your saying is that parents with more severely affected Autistics aren't trying hard enough?

Why do you want people to think you are severely affected by autism?

I didn't even realise it was fasionable to be autistic?

__________________
I speak for those who cannot speak for themselves.
http://www.fightfoca.com/

Bottesini

My point is I overcame it and I have contempt for people who use it to excuse their behaviour.

And I should point out you asked me, and I told you.

I don't know why you are always talking about how you enjoy your disabilities. :scratch:

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